Tips for the 2nd form......anyone??

[S.Teebas]

Well after just under 4 years on SLT im being taught CK. My school is pretty traditional i guess you could say (no gradings, uniforms etc..) So this new form is something big for me~!
Anyway, i was wonding if anyone can offer some advise or tips for the 2nd form...
I would appreciate anything, especially from the more 'Experienced' WC guys here like Watchman, old jong etc...

[Watchman]

S.Teebas,

Now that you're moving along into Chum Kiu (congrats!) one of the biggest things to concentrate on in the beginning is getting your upper and lower body linked together.

Yiu Ma (your "waist power") is the most heavily emphasized aspect of Chum Kiu, as it builds on the power you have already developed in your hands. If you imagine two trangles while in your stance - one with the base at your shoulders and the point drawn down to about mid thigh, and the other with the base at your ankles with the point drawn up to your solar plexus - you can use the imaginary "diamond" crass hatch area around your hips where the triangles intercept and overlap as a reference point for your stance shifting and footwork.

You begin your movement with your Yiu Ma and everything will link together - adding power to your hands.

Also, really pay attention to staying sunk properly while shifting or stepping, as you lose any potential power you may have when you "stand up" to move. This was a major problem I used to have in my Chum Kiu, and my sifu used to comment that I looked like one of those bobbing jack-in-the-box toys when I moved. :rolleyes: :D

[old jong]

What could I add to Watchman's excellent comment?...He said it all! I may say not to see CK as new techniques but as a more advanced way to do what you already learned and practiced in SLT.
In CK,you will discover a new level of comprehension in your wing chun.Enjoy!...And good luck! ;)

[Dragonhand]

I gotta ask, why it took you so long to learn the first form?

[Sharky]

All i have to say is congratulations!

I'm a bit surprised it took your sifu 4 years before he felt it time for you to move on, but i'm sure he knows what's going down. You did say he was very traditional.

Good luck - your wing chun should progress nicely now :)

Edd

My anus is superior™

[Martial Joe]

You should get it down good before you start going at full power...I dont always go at full power...

http://www.stopstart.fsnet.co.uk/smilie/lolup.gif IXIJoe KaveyIXIhttp://www.stopstart.fsnet.co.uk/smilie/lolup.gif

[EmptyCup]

Watchman, your posts never fail to impress me...if only people were as helpful and open about knowledge as you instead of hiding behind cryptic nonsense in this forum :)

Teebas, your profile is hilarious :)
Chum Kiu, as Watchman said, trains your stances and footwork, so pay attention to the angles and proper alignment throughout. Also, there are alot of bong saus in the form and some are used differently than others...

Make sure your bongs are correctly aligned and that the angles are correct...also make sure you use "tan ging" with each bong...don't just lift it up but use Wing Chun's spring power

That's my little bit...hope that helps, but your sifu will be able to show you in more detail

[Watchman]

What? My posts aren't cryptic?! I need to try harder. ;)

[benny]

dont worry ive been doing vt for 3 1/2 yrs 6 days a week and im up the the first stepping bit in chum kiu. when i went to hong kong people that had been there less then me were nearly finished the dummy. but if your slt is better all the advanced stuff wont help. slt is the pure techniques and the rest are advanced. but in ving tsun advance means there are more ways to go wrong or you have already stuffed up as you should have used slt. i was chisaoing people and just using slt(except lap) and it works the best.
oh i have one tip when moveing the waist move forward.
see ya
traditional way rules :D

[dzu]

Chum Kiu can be translated as "Sinking the Bridge" or "Seeking the Bridge" depending upon what lineage you are from and how the chinese characters are interpretted.

The meanings themselves give you a clue as to what you should aspire to when learning and practicing the form: either breaking the opponent's structure and/or establishing contact. Some of the things trained include but are not limited to:

1) Face the centerline with your 3 dan tien at head, chest and pelvis. This will help you maintain structural alignment when stepping or shifting throughout the movement.

2) Chum Kiu teachs you to coordinate your entire body so that when you shift, you don't just shift in place like a spinning top but you shift into the opponent's center of gravity, like a millstone grinding wheat.

3) Stepping coordinates the hands and feet so that when the motion is complete, everything is in alignment. When you step, you are not rooted, but when you finish stepping you should be.

4) You learn how to change to face the centerline in whereas in SNT everything was in front of you.

5) THe basis for all the kicks are introduced with Chum Kiu. Also, all the tools for chi gerk are also found here, depending upon how your lineage does the kicking sections.

6) Bong sau is emphasized as a transition movement at different heights. Also, the changing of intention from Bong Sau to Lan sau is trained here.

7) Some of the chin na/kum na is hidden in the form.

regards,

Dzu

[JiuKaiMan]

4 years?
That is considered traditional in Wing Chun? My Wing Chun Sigung, said his teacher taught him in Hong Kong the entire system in 3 years. After 3 years he was out teaching his own students.

There was me, that is Alex, and my three droogs, that is Pete, Georgie, and Dim, Dim being really dim, and we sat in the Korova Milkbar making up our rassoodocks.........

[Scott]

Great work =P

"Life is hard, but so am I." -- The Eels.

[S.Teebas]

Hey everyone, thanks for all the great replys. (read them all!)

The main focus of the responces seems to be on how long ive trained SLT. So to put your curisoty to rest i will explain. I trained in 2 schools. The first wing chun school was focused on self-defence, so we practiced escapes from bear hugs, head locks, chain kicking, punching, stringing combos together, chi sau..etc... This school was what i think could be classed as a very technique orientated school. Later on (say..a few years) you would move on and learn the real wing chun. My instructors told me to forget everything i had learnt cause now i was getting the real stuff. I wasnt happy/interested about having to "prove myself" to school that i was 'worthy or whatever to get this when after a little research, i discovered that i could get the real stuff..no strings attached.

This school seems to train more an idea...and keeps building on it. So the SLT i knew at that last school was basically usless...except for the fact that i could remember what it looks like! Im not ungrateful for what i learnt there..the guys i trained with were good friends of mine (and still are), but the school was business focused. So i moved on.

This new school is more internal and it takes a bit longer to fully understand it. So i had to re learn SNT. The results speak for it's self (ive noticed the improvement 500%) Besides i like to take a bit longer in each stage of training to fully grasp what sifu is getting at. Im not in any real rush to become 'Grandmaster" or whatever...i prefer the knowledge that i can actually do what i think i can do!

On my little 'quest' to find a new school i did encounter some schools that taught students (one had been there for only 7 months) and he had learnt SNT, CK, BG, and wooden dummy! I'd rather quality over quanity any day. :rolleyes:


S.Teebas

[anerlich]

Watchman and Dzu gave you good answers.

Only thing I would add is that the translation "searching for the bridge" can be interpreted not only as bridging the gap between opponent and self, but also bridging the gap between the hand techniques and footwork. Once you learn the movement sequence, concentrate on moving the body as a unit, generating power from the hips and spine.

Angles are very important - a common mistake is to turn too far from the front in the bon sao and not extending it forward enough, but pushing or twisting to the side.

As for speed, I recommend you practise:

slow for precision
medium speed for flow
fast for, well, speed

so as to cover all bases.

Remember to manage your energy, everyone in my school seems to go through a phase of explosive breathing with vocalisation and using as much power as possible, though our teacher NEVER does this.

Remember real power comes from optimum tension/relaxation rather than maximum tension. RELAX.