In two years....

[Meat Shake]

How have your views on MA changed in the past 2 years?

What significant techniques/concepts/theory/history/teacher/fellow practitioners have you learned/met ?
Ill give my answers in a minute... Just trying to get some decent conversation going, so please dont derail this thread for at least a page or two.
Thanks,
Meat Shake

Edit: for all of you lazy fockers, just answer 1 or 2 of the above.
;)

[rubthebuddha]

i've noticed greater similarities between styles -- those who have stuff that works, and those who don't. the shape of the hand or the angle of the knee aren't as important as the concepts and applications. good logic is good logic, regardless of which country it comes from.

haven't learned too many more techniques -- just far better application of the ones i have. i'd rather have five things that are broad in use than a hundred things narrow in use.

concepts and theory are the same -- i just understand the ones i know and train -- like centerline, flanking, positioning and footwork -- far better.

lau ka sun (carson lau, wing tsun master from hong kong that moved to toronto recently) and master toddy (muay thai -- came up from vegas for a seminar). i've met scott sonnon, but i haven't taken any of his classes yet.

[David Jamieson]

In the last 3 years I've realized that traditional and modern can compliment each other in a lot of ways.

I've learned that it is not so hard to extrapolate from form and teach just techniques without all the esoteric stuff attached and to get them to work in alive training.

I've learned to not look down on any martial training from wherever it is coming.

I've learned how to string combonation techniques together to create forms that not only look good but train the techs efficiently and effectively.

I've learned that you should try before you buy.

I've learned that just because I can't successfully pull of a tech does not mean it is useless, it just means I can't use it yet.

I've learned that I can kick ass pretty good still. :p

[Judge Pen]

I've learned that there's only so many ways to punch and kick.

I've learned that there's good and bad in all so-called styles of martial arts.

I've noticed that the people talking the most are usually doing the least.

I've learned why lineage is (and isn't) important to the style one trains in.

I've learned that internet discussions prove nothing.

I've learned how my fighting theories have changed with age and perspective.

I really think that it's neat that all the good martial arts and martial artists that I've had the opportunity to see I can always draw a parallel or a connection to the stuff my teacher has taught me.

[Meat Shake]

First and foremost, I realized that more forms does not = better fighter. Id rolleyes right here, but its the honest truth. When I started SD, I really did equate the 2 as such. In all fairness however, this was my fault for thinking this way, and not the fault of SD.
I should importantly add also, that Ive learned that there are talented fighters from every style, regardless of general representation.
...
Then, after amassing quite a few forms, kirk beat the cr@p out of me. :) We can just call it a big nasty reality check. I learned that to learn how to fight, thats what you have to do. Equate doing forms of anything without doing the real thing, then try to do the real thing one day. The guy who has been doing the real thing all along is going to be better than you are. ;)

A really interesting concept I recently learned and have been playing with, is that if you kick someone in the knee a few times, they will kick you back. May seem silly to some, but not when you want to catch their kick, and if you kick their knee, you already know where they will most likely try and kick you. :)

Glad as hell I met kirk and gene. Great guys to train with. Met a few good folks from the forum, but didnt have much time to chill and no time to train with them.

My general flow has improved by leaps and bounds, along with my reaction time, and my reactions themselves. Im finally starting to really ingraine some techniques into my muscle memory, turning them to habitual action instead of thought.

As far as history goes, I have learned a lot about a lot of styles and a lot of masters, etc... That would take a whole nother thread. :D

Thanks for the replies thus far.

[Meat Shake]

"I really think that it's neat that all the good martial arts and martial artists that I've had the opportunity to see I can always draw a parallel or a connection to the stuff my teacher has taught me."

Yup. Good basics are good basics, and as 7* said on another thread some time ago, good basics should transcend stylistic boundaries.

[Judge Pen]

"First and foremost, I realized that more forms does not = better fighter. Id rolleyes right here, but its the honest truth. When I started SD, I really did equate the 2 as such. In all fairness however, this was my fault for thinking this way, and not the fault of SD.
I should importantly add also, that Ive learned that there are talented fighters from every style, regardless of general representation."


It may not be SD's fault, but I think a lot of SD people do equate forms to fighting ability and that's sad. As many forms as I know I never saw it that way. I like forms, but I only practice a few because I like the feel, flow, and beauty of a form. I fight because I want to know how to fight. I guess I've seen enough guys with great form that couldn't fight their way out of a paper bag to think the two are connected.

Not that I think forms are worthless. I use techniques from my forms that work for me, but I also practice forms, like chain whip or kwan do, just for fun.

Good thread.

[Water Dragon]

My views haven't really changed, but my expression of them has. I think maybe I'm starting to mature, or at least grow up a little. I still believe in what I believe, but I don't feel the need to 'convert' everyone anymore.

Do your thing, have fun, that's what it's all about.

Oh yeah, and MeatShake, you're welcome.

[WinterPalm]

Over the past two years I've been fortunate to study with the current Sifu I have and to learn some very valuable lessons. I've definately learned that the repetition and ingrainment of technique is very important, and this includes form. For fighting I've learned, and I'm still just a beginner, that one must be very prepared to actually fight, this sounds silly, but I've sparred a friend with no training and it is interesting to test your kung fu against an opponent whos body you do not know and cannot predict. That being said, I find with continous sparring in the class that I am not necessarily beating my partner, but beating myself and overcoming fears, flaws, and allusions to what I can do and not. As well my Sifu has generally focused on character building and the spiritual aspect as far as practicing general good will and being an honest person. I'd say that for all I've learned, which is so little in the big picture, it is who I've become that I appreciate the most about the study of Kung Fu.:)

[IronFist]

I've realized that MMA is the way to go if you want to be able to fight.

[Becca]

1- I have learned that good form is only useless in sparring if you don't try to incorporate it into your fighting repritoiur prior to trying to use it.

2- I have learned how to do high jumps and spin jumps without throwing anything out of whack.

3- I now firmly believe the BS between TCMA, MMA, and JMA is just that: BS. The only real differences are in the focus and some times the thoery behind the body mechanics. But almost never in the body mechanics themselves.

3a- By focus, I mean how one style seems to point spar were another goes all out full contact, while yet another does it only a bit. And yet another may not dedicte class time to it but expects the student to work this skill on thier own or seek a private class if they want more instruction.

3b- I was also referring to how one Sifu may focus more on stand up, while another of the same liniage may focus on forms, weapons, gound work, ect...

4- I have learned that shadow boxing only makes you feel like an idiot if you're just going threw the motions. When seriously trying to envision an opponant, you forget to feel silly and end up with some good training time.;)

5- Shadow boxing helps develop intensity in every aspect of your training, not just in sparring.

[whitelotusfist]

Since i started kung fu (about 4 years) my thoughts have changed considerably. When i started i though that it would make me untouchable and that i would learn secrets that would make me a great fighter. Since then i have realised that
A. Nobody can "make" you a good martial artist, you have to be prepared to put in the work yourself.
B. anyone can get there ass whooped by anyone else , trained or untrained.
C. All styles have something to offer and it is the individual and not the art that is important.
D. there is no such thing as in invincible martial artist.
E. If you want to be a good fighter you have to fight (or at least spar as realistically as possible)
F. In a fight you will get hit and so it is important to know what this feels like.
G. when i started all i wanted was a bunch of cool forms that looked impressive. I have now realised that you can spend a lifetime studying and perfecting the combat applications in one form and am not so keen to "collect" forms that i dont fully understand.

All in all i think that i have a more realistic outlook on combat and it has made me want to avoid violence if possible.
Perhaps in another 4 years i may be able to kill by magical chi balls, until then ill keep training ;)
Cheers
WLF

[Mr Punch]

I've learned that there's not much to fighting, some people can anyway, and I'm pretty sure I'm one of those.

Through this I've learned that I'm actually quite good, that years of hard work and fun are continuing to pay off, but that also I have a lifetime of learning to do.

Through this, I've learned that I wanted to take my physical expression a different (harder) way while I'm still young enough.

I've learned that a lot of skills and principles do cross over, even from supposedly fantastical arts into a pressure tested situation.

I've learned that most petty this works that works, this art works that art works arguments can easily be solved by hard practise but that the answers were usually what used to be called common sense.

I've learned that I've lost the path I thought I wanted to follow, but I still think I'll get it back again sometime.

I've learnt that I can't put on any ****ing weight... so I have to decide whether to do any weight training (which I find the most boring pastime on the planet!) :D

And finally I've learned that though the neck is made of of many many bones, there are some ways it just ain't supposed to bend! :D

I've discovered these things through my training partners and some very hard teachers who worked a lot harder than me.

I've also learned that however much MA have shaped my ways of thinking in the last 15 years, I'm still a hobbyist.

[SevenStar]

I've learned a few things, however my views haven't changed at all. I've been fighting, training to fight and helping people train to fight. Although I've had respect for fighting and fighters since I first started, I adopted an even greater respect since I've been helping other fighters train. The hard work that they put in in order to make themselves the best that the possibly can is truly commendable.

I've also been assistant coaching in muay thai and in a kids judo class. This has taught me a few things, the primary one being patience. When it comes to striking, I'm somewhat of a natural. I learn things really quickly. I've been teaching people that learn REALLY slow, and it's like "I didn't have to go through all this when I learned it" It's helping me to think through the art more, as I have to break the techniques down and find the best possible way to teach a particular person. Then, I have to break it down a different way for the next person, who learns differently.

With the kids, I'm learning that you are in a sense, their parent. They are looking to you for guiadance and such - It's quite the responsibility. There's one particular 11 year old girl who is constantly asking me to help her with her throws, asking for advice on combinations, etc. It's gotten to the point where when we go to a shiai, she doesn't even want to warm up with any of the other coaches - she wants to warm up with me, have me go over her techniquess with her, critique her after a match, etc. like I am her own personal coach.

Lastly and most importantly, I've learned that chicks dig thai boxing shorts.

[rogue]

7*, I had one of those kids and it's be the best compliment I could get. I was helping with some kids and one always ended up with me. His dad said that his son told him that I was the only adult that actually taught him karate. To teach him to hit I let him hit me so he could get his range and hit correctly. To teach him tai sabaki I threw full speed punches but pulled them, but he got used to seeing real strikes and moved. I taught him the few tricks for helping in a fight that I know. The school owner was worried that I was being rough on him because I corrected him alot, but he did well sparring. Most adults just played with him until he moved onto the next adult and they could get back to their training.

I'd guess what I've learned in 2 years is it's important to teach those with less experience than me the way I'd want to have been trained when I was starting out.

I've also learned that karate isn't rocket science, there are no secrets just things that I don't know and an arts usability is directly linked to how it's trained.

[Mr Punch]

Good posts Rogue, Seven

I miss teaching kids, but I don't miss the responsibility! I know what you mean about the full-speed punching thing with the kids too, Rogue, and as you said the way you train has a direct bearing on its usability.

[Scythefall]

In the last two years, I stopped "making up my mind" about things. I had a lot of preconceived notions about this "style" or that "system." Mostly based on what little I had seen and what others had told me. I've talked to people from Southern schools, Northern schools, Wing Chun, competition Muay Thai schools and I have to say, I see more similiarities than ever and I'm mindful of the differences.

I dropped the notion that Chinese Shaolin is model wushu when I got to see Shi DeCheng and Shi Xingwei rock out a demo. These are great kung fu masters and the Shaolin monks really are something special. I signed up at Shi Xingwei's school soon after. I now take from two different schools. An American Shaolin school and Chinese Shaolin school. Training methods are different, but I'd have to say that the forms are not all that different.

I think Shi Xingwei said it best when he said:

"In order to learn Shaolin Kung Fu, no matter who is your teacher, you should be diligent and persistent. You need a lot of practice everywhere and every time, no matter it is in the intensive heat of summer or severe cold of winter. Only through these hardships could you reap the benefits of hard work and sense the charms of Shaolin Kung Fu."

It's all about training hard, no matter if you practice Shaolin, Muay Thai, Karate, TKD, or anything else in the world.

[Gangsterfist]

I have just recently come to a conclusion about fighting.

There is no long range fighting

There is no trapping range fighting

There is no clench fighting

There is no grappling

There is no ground fighting

There is only fighting.

No matter what range you are in, you are still fighting. You don't need certain styles to be a good at one thing. You don't need to take muay thai and bjj to be good on your feet and on the ground. Fighting is fighting no matter what position you are in. Train all aspects of it, and build attributes for everything. Sensitivity will always help in all situations. Physical attributes will always help. Learning how to relax the body (but not like a wet noodle) will always help.

There are some things that are universal in all systems (TCMA, MMA, modern, and traditional) and they are idosynchracies in each system as well. I think some poeple lose sight of what some martial arts are truely about. They platoue in their training and want to cross train to fill that gap and learn a new style, or improve their ground game, etc. That is not necessarily needed. Hard work, and hard training is needed. Stick with your system, and stick with your goals.

The first time I sparred a BJJ guy I got beat up. The second time the BJJ guy had a lot harder time because I learned to deal with it. I did not cross train in BJJ, I did not cross train in any grappling/ground fighting art. I just trained hard and learned to deal with it. I am not saying cross training is bad, I am saying that its not always needed to be a good fighter. How you train is what makes you a good fighter.

I have realized this recently when touching hands with a lot of different people at a MA seminar.

As far as the mindset goes, I have learned to drop ego. That is a big step and makes your training so much better. I also don't bother with people's limbs too much anymore. I just see a torso and a head when I spar. I have learned when I get tossed around its okay. Get back up and try again. When I get taken down to the ground go with the flow, don't try to fight it with force. Also, touching hands and working out with other people is the best experience you can get. Also, make friends with other martial artists its more beneficial than making enemies with them.

[The Willow Sword]

I have learned that what i have learned was that i learned absolutely nothing.

and in this i have gained all the knowledge i will ever need at this point when it comes to martial arts.
does this mean that i am a master? no not at all(this is a term which people call other people) so i do not call myself one nor does anyone else. i will always be a student of this path i walk.

in two years alot has happened,,,i shed the ignorance and blindness of being a part of something that never was what i wanted,,,,i have also lost much in the way of money and status to be right back where i began before i got in to all that mess.
i have travelled across the world to places seldom seen by westerners(i refer to my finland trip and my month tour of england and ireland).


i guess the real big lesson of the past two years is that no matter how good it seems or how good they sound and how nice they smile at you and how it seems that you have been made welcome and are appreciated for the things you have done and self sacrificed,,there is ALWAYS a hidden agenda behind the false faces of the world and not all those agendas are positive ones. in learning that lesson i am alot wiser now to the bullsh!t than i was two years ago. so in that i thank those who inadvertly taught me these important lessons about people and loyalty.

Peace,,,TWS

[joedoe]

In the last 2 years I have learned that I don't know as much about fighting as I thought I did.

I have learned that I need to find out more about other arts and touch hands with practitioners of other arts more.

I have learned that sometimes things that seem impossible are achievable, and often have a logical explanation.

I have learned that some things that look easy are in fact very hard to do and don't have a logical explanation.