Oso's post

[BeiTangLang]

Oso
Shining on the Funk

Registered: Dec 1969
Location: Asheville NC USA
Posts: 3142


***
this may be a stupid question...
but, i've just realized that I've assumed that 'tong long/tang lang' meant 'praying mantis'.

Is that a verbatim translation or does tong long mean something else???

tia


__________________
******************************
|_e_e_e_e_e_e_e_e_q._e_e_e_e________________
G ------------------------------------------------
D ------------------------------------------------
A --3--3--1--1-----------------------0--1--2-----
E --------------3--3--2--2--1-----1--------------
>___________________________r_______________


*****************************
http://www.weebl.jolt.co.uk/quest.htm

[MantisifuFW]

Oso,

As many here know, my skills in Chinese are marginal but here goes:

The character used in Tanglang, "Tang" means Mantis. The character "Lang" used in Tanglang is particular to Mantis. There is a similar character for Cicada "Lang" that can also mean Mantis. So unlike many words in Chinese that have many meaning, these are used almost exclusively to describe the insect.

If someone has other information I too would like to hear it.

Hope it helps,

Steve Cottrell

[MantisCool]

Hi!

Tang Lang means mantis. There is a phrase using the word Tang. It is Tang Bi Dang Ju (che). Literally means Mantis arm blocking the cart. It means the person is trying to block something beyond his ability! How can a small mantis block a cart!

The other usage of Lang is found in zhang lang. meaning ****roach.

The think there is nothing similar to Tang Lang in cicada. The chinese word for cicada is "chan"

[German Bai Lung]

I´m not sure about this, but maybe someone could confirm or not:

I think in classical chinese there was often just one character/word with one meaning. Also the character for Mantis was just Tang.

In modern chinese there are more and more words with two just slightly different meanings to specify one word: tang lang for mantis!

Another example: in classical chinese just "li" was used for carp! In modern chinese they use the word for fish (yu) also! Now carp is called: li-yu!

[MantisifuFW]

Mantiscool,

Exactly right on Chan. Sorry, I was looking at a dictionary and was just in a hurry!

Steve Cottrell

[Oso]

thanks for bumping this out here, i thought it might be appropriate for the terminology thread but i guess not.



ok, so 'tang' is mantis and 'lang' seems to have something to do with bugs in general???

cool enough, thanks all.

[MantisCool]

Hi! Jochen

The one word usage is normally used in phrases where everyone understood to keep the words short. Its actual wording it is still written in full.

In chinese word, one can usually understand what it is by just looking at the left half of the character. In the case of carp the left half shows the character yu (fish). Therefore, if someone wrote the word 'Li' others would instantly know it is a carp! If the left half is written in animal character then the word li would become a fox!

One word usually shows the family and 2 words would shows the correct specie.

Hi! Oso

From what i know, lang is used for mantis and ****roach only.

Someone correct me where I am wrong. My chinese is also limited.

[ninjaboy]

re: å®å¥Œ�

sorry guys, this is the best i could do for the size of the characters, maybe someone could post a bigger, better visual to help with the explanation... i attached a file as well, i hope it works out....the characters "tang" and "lang" are the 3rd and 4th from the left in the attachment.

my plan is this: i want to try to parallel English to Chinese in some ways...

anyway,

tang lang quan (pinyin translation) is made of 3 characters. u can break up the understanding of the individual characters further yet. yes, "tang lang" does mean the fantastic bug we all adore, but WHY these characters mean this is also interesting... to me, anyway : )

as mantiscool mentioned, "tang" and "lang" are both characters made of 2 components - a left side and a right side. you will see that the left side of both characters are the same...they mean 'insect'. it gives the character context for the reader to understand.

the right side of the characters are different. the right side of the characters are still pronounced "tang lang" whether they have the left side (insect) beside them or not, they just don't have any meaning because of the different individual meanings.

but this is where the cool connection between english and chinese happens...(posssibly, i'm open to correction).

"tang" without the character for "insect" to it's left can mean "hall" or "a large room with a specific purpose" and and "lang" (also without the character for "insect" to it's left ) can mean "man" or have something to do with a respected male individual.

maybe the idea it is called "praying mantis" in english and "tang lang" in chinese are the same reason. in english we say it is praying because of the way it it looks between feeding frenzies, arms folded in front, patient and still, as if praying.

chinese has a very poetic way about it and it wouldn't surprise me if "tang" and "lang were originally connected to mean "praying insect" because of the association between "a hall with a specific purpose" (tang) and "respected male individual" (lang) to have an overtone of a man in a church/temple in prayer or praying so as to conjure an image when talking about which insect.....priest-like, so to speak.....praying mantis/praying insect....that kind of thing.

whew...that was longer than i intended......i am also open to correction...

neil

[Oso]

nice, Neil. Thanks. If I would have asked the right question to start with I guess it would have been about the etymology of the characters.

[ninjaboy]

thanks matt. i hope all is well in your neck of the woods....and thanks for not saying "ninjas suck" to ninjaboy...lol...btw, china rocks! i think i'm a lifer....

neil

[Oso]

ninjas suck

:p

edit: **let's keep it**

and, I just realized something:

with all this talk of testing each other and crap like that I want to say that it just might be possible that ninjaboy and I are a couple of the few here, not of the same line, who have met and touched hands in a friendly manner.

He was in NC and drove 2 hours one way to meet up with me here in Asheville and we talked and showed forms for a while and then sparred lightly for a bit.

hope you don't mind me bringing that up, neil.

[ninjaboy]

not at all matt, i only wish we had more time to get some other ideas going! maybe another time, yes? glad to see you've hooked up with the ponglai folks and are having a good time with it!

take care!

neil