Is Shaolin-Do for real?

[MasterKiller]

I'm a PS3 man. Sorry.

Besides, the Browns stink on Madden.

They have an 83 rating. X-box does live updates of team stats.
Sorry about your PS3. I hope 20 fps is working well for you.;)

[Lokhopkuen]

Why the question mark LOK? You must be feeling frisky or the guys on the other thread are making you p!ssy!
Glad to hear from ya,
BQ

Just forking around, how you been BQ?:D:p

[Judge Pen]

They have an 83 rating. X-box does live updates of team stats.
Sorry about your PS3. I hope 20 fps is working well for you.;)

I thought it was 30fps....

I prefer the NCAA Football game myself. I hadn't played Madden in months. I've never been an online player either so I wouldn't know how to compare the online services. Don't you have to pay to use X-box's online service?

The real reason(s) I bought a PS3 were: I can't stand Microsoft, I loved my PS2 and I wanted to get a blu-ray player also.

Did you plop down the extra 199 for the HD-DVD add on MK? :p

[BM2]

I certanly hope that everyone will forgive me for going off topic with this... What did y'all think of the Family Guy movie spoof of Star Wars ?

[MasterKiller]

I thought it was 30fps....

I prefer the NCAA Football game myself. I hadn't played Madden in months. I've never been an online player either so I wouldn't know how to compare the online services. Don't you have to pay to use X-box's online service?

The real reason(s) I bought a PS3 were: I can't stand Microsoft, I loved my PS2 and I wanted to get a blu-ray player also.

Did you plop down the extra 199 for the HD-DVD add on MK? :p

I got it for x-mas, along with the 1-year online subscription. It's only $50/year, so I will probably keep it up, especially since Call of Duty 3 online is like crack.

I didn't get the HD player. Blu-Ray is winning that fight, and I'm just waiting for the price to drop a little.

The cool thing about the x-box live is that you can download HD movies, tv shows, UFC fights, etc... You can also buy games and download them directly to the hard drive.

They also have add-ons to games (new uniforms and stadiums for Madden), maps, extra race cars...that don't come with the retail version of the game.

Very cool.

I know the PS3 advertises high-frame rates, but everything I've read says it lags down to about 20FPS in larger environments.

[Judge Pen]

I got it for x-mas, along with the 1-year online subscription. It's only $50/year, so I will probably keep it up, especially since Call of Duty 3 online is like crack.

I didn't get the HD player. Blu-Ray is winning that fight, and I'm just waiting for the price to drop a little.

The cool thing about the x-box live is that you can download HD movies, tv shows, UFC fights, etc... You can also buy games and download them directly to the hard drive.

They also have add-ons to games (new uniforms and stadiums for Madden), maps, extra race cars...that don't come with the retail version of the game.

Very cool.

I know the PS3 advertises high-frame rates, but everything I've read says it lags down to about 20FPS in larger environments.


I got the blu-ray and game system in one. And the online is free (if I ever care about that) but you can download add-ons, games etc. the same as the x-box. Don't know about the tv shows yet, I just got online recently for the first time on it.

[themeecer]

Muahahaha ... I am back!

It seems like the same old arguments are being fought. I am glad I stepped away for a while. Maybe I am a little older and wiser now, but I doubt it. :)

I don't have the energy to go through the past 2+ years of posts that have been added to this argument, but I bet you all had fun.

[Yao Sing]

I bet you don't need to go through the past 2 years of posts to know the contents of the argument. I don't think anything has changed in all that time, it just goes round and round.

[humbleman]

I bet you don't need to go through the past 2 years of posts to know the contents of the argument. I don't think anything has changed in all that time, it just goes round and round.

...try he's singlehandedly exterminating the middle class:mad:

[tattooedmonk]

This goes out to all you southern boys ( JP, KC etc.) in Tennesse and surrounding areas who were affected by the tornados. My thoughts and prayers are with you, hope you are all doing well. Take care.

[Judge Pen]

This goes out to all you southern boys ( JP, KC etc.) in Tennesse and surrounding areas who were affected by the tornados. My thoughts and prayers are with you, hope you are all doing well. Take care.

Thanks. Fortunately, it didn't affect our (me and KC) part of the state, but there's a lot of people that were affected. In Nashville there was a two year old that was thrown 150 yards by the wind and was unharmed (other than a few scratches and bruises). Amazing.

[godzillakungfu]

Glad to here you are all right. I was worried about the people out there also.

[arinathos.valin]

So has there been any word from Mas Judt on 'the real roots of SD"? I saw the post a while ago about the Kuntao martial arts of Indonesia... was wondering if he had made any headway regarding those somewhat cryptic posts he made...

[Golden Tiger]

So has there been any word from Mas Judt on 'the real roots of SD"? I saw the post a while ago about the Kuntao martial arts of Indonesia... was wondering if he had made any headway regarding those somewhat cryptic posts he made...


I offered but have yet to hear a peep...:(

[kwaichang]

Application for Permission to Date My Daughter
NOTE: This application will be incomplete and rejected unless accompanied by a complete financial statement, job history, lineage, and current medical report from your doctor.

NAME_____________________________________DATE OF BIRTH_____________

HEIGHT___________ WEIGHT____________ IQ__________ GPA_____________
SOCIAL SECURITY #_________________ DRIVERS LICENSE #________________

BOY SCOUT RANK AND BADGES__________________________________________

HOME ADDRESS_______________________ CITY/STATE___________ ZIP______

Do you have parents? ___Yes ___No
Is one male and the other female? ___Yes ___No
If No, explain: __________________________________________________ ___________

Number of years they have been married ______________________________

If less than your age, explain
__________________________________________________ __________________

__________________________________________________ ____ ______________

ACCESSORIES SECTION:

A. Do you own or have access to a van? __Yes __No

B. A truck with oversized tires? __Yes __No

C. A waterbed? __Yes __No

D. A pickup with a mattress in the back? __Yes __No

E. A tattoo? __Yes __No

F. Do you have an earring, nose ring, __Yes __No
pierced tongue, pierced cheek or a belly button ring?

(IF YOU ANSWERED 'YES' TO ANY OF THE ABOVE, DISCONTINUE APPLICATION AND LEAVE PREMISES IMMEDIATELY. I SUGGEST RUNNING.)


ESSAY SECTION:

In 50 words or less, what does 'LATE' mean to you?

__________________________________________________ ____________

__________________________________________________ ____________

In 50 words or less, what does 'DON'T TOUCH MY DAUGHTER' mean to you?

__________________________________________________ ____________

__________________________________________________ ____________

In 50 words or less, what does 'ABSTINENCE' mean to you?

__________________________________________________ ____________

__________________________________________________ ____________


REFERENCES SECTION:
Church you attend __________________________________________________ _

How often you attend ________________________________________________

When would be the best time to interview your:

father? _____________

mother? _____________

pastor/priest ? _____________


SHORT-ANSWER SECTION:

Answer by filling in the blank. Please answer freely, all answers are confidential.

A: If I were shot, the last place I would want to be shot would be:

__________________________________________________ ____________

B: If I were beaten, the last bone I would want broken is my:

__________________________________________________ ____________

C: A woman's place is in the:

__________________________________________________ ____________

D: The one thing I hope this application does not ask me about is:

__________________________________________________ ____________

E. What do you want to do with your life ? ___________________________

__________________________________________________ ____________

__________________________________________________ ____________

F. When I meet a girl, the thing I always notice about her first is:

__________________________________________________ ____________

G. What is the current going rate of a hotel room? __________________

I SWEAR THAT ALL INFORMATION SUPPLIED ABOVE IS TRUE AND CORRECT TO THE BEST OF MY KNOWLEDGE UNDER PENALTY OF DEATH, DISMEMBERMENT, NATIVE AMERICAN ANT TORTURE, CRUCIFIXION, ELECTROCUTION, CHINESE WATER TORTURE, & RED HOT POKERS.


__________________________________________________ _______
Applicant's Signature (that means sign your name, moron!)


_______________________________ ________________________________
Mother's Signature Father's Signature

_______________________________ ________________________________
Pastor/Priest/Rabbi State Representative/Congressman

Thank you for your interest, and it had better be genuine and non-sexual.

You will be contacted in writing if you are approved. Please do not try to call or write. If your application is rejected, you will be notified by two gentleman wearing white ties carrying violin cases.
(you might watch your back)

To prepare yourself, start studying Daddy's Rules for Dating ....
Daddy's Rules for Dating
1. If you pull into my driveway and honk you'd better be delivering a package, because you're sure not picking anything up.
2. You do not touch my daughter in front of me. You may glance at her, so long as you do not peer at anything below her neck. If you cannot keep your eyes or hands off of my daughter's body, I will remove them.
3. I'm sure you've been told that in today's world, sex without utilizing a 'Barrier method' of some kind can kill you. Let me elaborate, when it comes to sex, I am the barrier, and I will kill you.
4. The following places are not appropriate for a date with my daughter: Places where there are beds, sofas, or anything softer than a wooden stool. Places where there is darkness. Places where there is dancing, holding hands, or happiness. Places where the ambient temperature is warm enough to induce my daughter to wear shorts, tank tops , midriff T-shirts, or anything other than overalls, a sweater, and a goose down parka - zipped up to her throat. Movies with a strong romantic or sexual themes are to be avoided; movies which feature chain saws are okay. Hockey games are okay. Old folks homes are better.
5. Do not lie to me. I may appear to be a potbellied, balding, aged, dimwitted has-been. But on issues relating to my daughter, I am the all-knowing, merciless god of your universe. If I ask you where you are going and with whom, you have one chance to tell me the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. I have a shotgun, a shovel, and five acres behind the house. Do not trifle with me.
6. Be afraid. Be very afraid. It takes very little for me to mistake the sound of your car for a chopper coming in over a rice paddy near Hanoi. When my Agent Orange starts acting up, the voices in my head frequently tell me to clean the guns.

feel free to print and use, I will hhahahahahahahahah KC:mad:

[sean_stonehart]

AH it's even easier for me... I'll just look them in the eye kinda like I'm sizing up a steak to grill & tell them how I've gone to jail for less than them. I figure if I'm cleaning one of my weapons (CMA or Western) to emphasize their discovery of worth has dropped below the value of an Italian Lira... they'll get the point.

Regardless of the fact I've never seen a jail except for A&E, Discovery, TLC & NatGeo...

Also to back me up my step-daughter's dad had said he'll be there with me cleaning said instruments of destruction but to drive his point home... he'll stand up. He's 6'4" & +/- 350 Lbs... and a chiropractor

[BlueTravesty]

I'm having a baby girl (well, technically my wife is the one having her) this summer, so this is information I need to read up on.

Hopefully I can get back into MA pretty soon and study up for the next 18 years. I'd love to show my daughter's first boyfriend how a kimura works, ya know, just to make sure he understands.

[arinathos.valin]

KC, I've copied it and saved it to my computer. I'm going to be needing that in 10 years...

[sanjuro_ronin]

Application for Permission to Date My Daughter
NOTE: This application will be incomplete and rejected unless accompanied by a complete financial statement, job history, lineage, and current medical report from your doctor.

NAME_____________________________________DATE OF BIRTH_____________

HEIGHT___________ WEIGHT____________ IQ__________ GPA_____________
SOCIAL SECURITY #_________________ DRIVERS LICENSE #________________

BOY SCOUT RANK AND BADGES__________________________________________

HOME ADDRESS_______________________ CITY/STATE___________ ZIP______

Do you have parents? ___Yes ___No
Is one male and the other female? ___Yes ___No
If No, explain: __________________________________________________ ___________

Number of years they have been married ______________________________

If less than your age, explain
__________________________________________________ __________________

__________________________________________________ ____ ______________

ACCESSORIES SECTION:

A. Do you own or have access to a van? __Yes __No

B. A truck with oversized tires? __Yes __No

C. A waterbed? __Yes __No

D. A pickup with a mattress in the back? __Yes __No

E. A tattoo? __Yes __No

F. Do you have an earring, nose ring, __Yes __No
pierced tongue, pierced cheek or a belly button ring?

(IF YOU ANSWERED 'YES' TO ANY OF THE ABOVE, DISCONTINUE APPLICATION AND LEAVE PREMISES IMMEDIATELY. I SUGGEST RUNNING.)


ESSAY SECTION:

In 50 words or less, what does 'LATE' mean to you?

__________________________________________________ ____________

__________________________________________________ ____________

In 50 words or less, what does 'DON'T TOUCH MY DAUGHTER' mean to you?

__________________________________________________ ____________

__________________________________________________ ____________

In 50 words or less, what does 'ABSTINENCE' mean to you?

__________________________________________________ ____________

__________________________________________________ ____________


REFERENCES SECTION:
Church you attend __________________________________________________ _

How often you attend ________________________________________________

When would be the best time to interview your:

father? _____________

mother? _____________

pastor/priest ? _____________


SHORT-ANSWER SECTION:

Answer by filling in the blank. Please answer freely, all answers are confidential.

A: If I were shot, the last place I would want to be shot would be:

__________________________________________________ ____________

B: If I were beaten, the last bone I would want broken is my:

__________________________________________________ ____________

C: A woman's place is in the:

__________________________________________________ ____________

D: The one thing I hope this application does not ask me about is:

__________________________________________________ ____________

E. What do you want to do with your life ? ___________________________

__________________________________________________ ____________

__________________________________________________ ____________

F. When I meet a girl, the thing I always notice about her first is:

__________________________________________________ ____________

G. What is the current going rate of a hotel room? __________________

I SWEAR THAT ALL INFORMATION SUPPLIED ABOVE IS TRUE AND CORRECT TO THE BEST OF MY KNOWLEDGE UNDER PENALTY OF DEATH, DISMEMBERMENT, NATIVE AMERICAN ANT TORTURE, CRUCIFIXION, ELECTROCUTION, CHINESE WATER TORTURE, & RED HOT POKERS.


__________________________________________________ _______
Applicant's Signature (that means sign your name, moron!)


_______________________________ ________________________________
Mother's Signature Father's Signature

_______________________________ ________________________________
Pastor/Priest/Rabbi State Representative/Congressman

Thank you for your interest, and it had better be genuine and non-sexual.

You will be contacted in writing if you are approved. Please do not try to call or write. If your application is rejected, you will be notified by two gentleman wearing white ties carrying violin cases.
(you might watch your back)

To prepare yourself, start studying Daddy's Rules for Dating ....
Daddy's Rules for Dating
1. If you pull into my driveway and honk you'd better be delivering a package, because you're sure not picking anything up.
2. You do not touch my daughter in front of me. You may glance at her, so long as you do not peer at anything below her neck. If you cannot keep your eyes or hands off of my daughter's body, I will remove them.
3. I'm sure you've been told that in today's world, sex without utilizing a 'Barrier method' of some kind can kill you. Let me elaborate, when it comes to sex, I am the barrier, and I will kill you.
4. The following places are not appropriate for a date with my daughter: Places where there are beds, sofas, or anything softer than a wooden stool. Places where there is darkness. Places where there is dancing, holding hands, or happiness. Places where the ambient temperature is warm enough to induce my daughter to wear shorts, tank tops , midriff T-shirts, or anything other than overalls, a sweater, and a goose down parka - zipped up to her throat. Movies with a strong romantic or sexual themes are to be avoided; movies which feature chain saws are okay. Hockey games are okay. Old folks homes are better.
5. Do not lie to me. I may appear to be a potbellied, balding, aged, dimwitted has-been. But on issues relating to my daughter, I am the all-knowing, merciless god of your universe. If I ask you where you are going and with whom, you have one chance to tell me the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. I have a shotgun, a shovel, and five acres behind the house. Do not trifle with me.
6. Be afraid. Be very afraid. It takes very little for me to mistake the sound of your car for a chopper coming in over a rice paddy near Hanoi. When my Agent Orange starts acting up, the voices in my head frequently tell me to clean the guns.

feel free to print and use, I will hhahahahahahahahah KC:mad:

You rock dude !

[Baqualin]

Thanks KC I will share that with my girlfriend....she has 2 girls....who are going to be a handful....sorry I didn't have more time to visit with you Sat.....next time try to make my class....I would appreciate your input.
See you in March.
BQ

[Judge Pen]

I'm having a baby girl (well, technically my wife is the one having her) this summer, so this is information I need to read up on.

Hopefully I can get back into MA pretty soon and study up for the next 18 years. I'd love to show my daughter's first boyfriend how a kimura works, ya know, just to make sure he understands.

I understand totally. It is my new motivation to keep training.

[Flaca]

I have telescoping nunchucks by the door already, and my 2 big dogs do a good job when anyone rings the bell. My son suggested a shotgun (I'm a single mom). Fortuneately, my 13year old daughter attends a girls high school, but ya never know! She also shows a shocking amount of sense (I didn't at that age...).
:eek:

[BentMonk]

My 14 year old girl has no plans on dating seriously until after college. She knows girls her age who are sexually active, and thinks them reckless. I hope this doesn't change. If it does, she knows enough techniques to be certain that if "no" doesn't mean "no", she can break the jerk in various places rather quickly. Her 8 year old sister is following in her footsteps, and is into MA a lot more than her big sister. :D
I'm still printing that application though. :D

[Mas Judt]

So has there been any word from Mas Judt on 'the real roots of SD"? I saw the post a while ago about the Kuntao martial arts of Indonesia... was wondering if he had made any headway regarding those somewhat cryptic posts he made...

sorry, my time is limited and it is like nailing jelly to a tree digging up what I'm looking for.

[arinathos.valin]

Nail harder, Mas... I'm interested in what you dig up!

(Although if it's nailing jelly to a tree, would that be 'nail softer'? 'Nail more gently'? I dunno...)

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

SD= Soup Sandwich.

[Yao Sing]

Um, Soup Sandwich is SS not SD. Maybe Soup Dujour?

[Leto]

I like soup, and sandwiches. A soup sandwich must be good, right?

[BlueTravesty]

Someone once told me about a shop in Orlando, somewhere on Colonial or thereabouts that sells "soup buns" and "soup dumplings." They sound really good (basically a bun or dumpling with soup inside.) Might have to look around next time I decide to brave I-4.

[MasterKiller]

Anyone else catch the Kuntaw article in the latest issue where they claim the term Kuntaw may come from the Indonesian phrase for Kung Fu Do?

[cjurakpt]

Um, Soup Sandwich is SS not SD. Maybe Soup Dujour?

actually, I've called my dog "SD" for a while now - short for Stupid Dog; lately though, sometimes I've been calling him Shaolin Dog...

[cjurakpt]

Anyone else catch the Kuntaw article in the latest issue where they claim the term Kuntaw may come from the Indonesian phrase for Kung Fu Do?

"kun taw" or "kun tao" is, as far as I am aware, a variation on the Cantonese term "kyuhn douh" which simply means "fist way"...

[lkfmdc]

"kun taw" or "kun tao" is, as far as I am aware, a variation on the Cantonese term "kyuhn douh" which simply means "fist way"...

this is 100% correct

it is just "Kyuhn" (Kun) = fist
"Douh" (Tao) = way

[MasterKiller]

this is 100% correct

it is just "Kyuhn" (Kun) = fist
"Douh" (Tao) = way

The article says the chinese characters are Kung Fu Do, which in Indonesian sounds like Kuntaw.
I just thought it might tie into the whole Shaolin-Do thing.

[bodhi warrior]

I was talking to my instructor a few weeks ago and we were talking about how things used to be back in the 70's. And there were a few things that were very surprising.
But first alittle background on my instructor and myself. He started in the early 70's at the U of K sin the karate club and I started in 1984. He has continually taught since the late 70's and I have been off and on due to work.
Back in the 70's things were different. Sin The didn't care about money he just loved to teach. Conditioning and sparring were more important than forms. He wanted to weed people out he made classes hard and if you didn't come back, oh well.
For the first roughly 14 years there wasn't alot of forms. You had the current material up through brown belt, and from brown to black you had everything except the cranes, birds, connecting fist, five dir. fist palm, and one of the bo forms. That's 9 forms! And from 1st black to 2nd black there were only 5 forms. Tai chi and pakua were two of them, dont remember the other three.
In my opinion this is when you had people that were very good. Because they were well conditioned and focused on a few forms. It was like this for around 14 years. But then sin the and the senior students wanted to start keeping people longer and that is why they added the 9 forms to brown belt in the early 80's. I think he had some of this material already just waiting for enough people to have the coditionioning to do more advanced stuff like 8 drunken immortals. I really dont think he had much past this though. But I guess he realized to make more money he needed more forms, and now you have SD of today. People trying to learn too much stuff and not being able to use or perform it well.
In my opinion sin the should have stayed with the core material and not added chen or snake pa kua,etc which obviously he didn't learn first hand. Any of the old timers have opinions?

[brucereiter]

bhodi tree,

i did not start until 1997 so i am not a old timer but i do share the same opinion.

[shadowlin]

I don't share that opinion, but I share the spirit of it.
I think he should have approached things more scientific.

That's all I want to say about that. Most of what you said is very true, though, historically speaking.

edit - except I cannot verify or deny that line about GMS learning firsthand. I tend to disagree, but I err on the side of optimism.

[kwaichang]

It is often the case to have to proove yourself prior to being taught something. All you have said is speculation. i have a list comprised in the early 80's that lists many forms taught now such as Hsing Ie the 8 Immortals etc. You hint to the concept that GMT taught more just to make money. So What why shouldnt he make money does your teacher charge for classes ? Non the less the list was out way prior to the stuff being taught just to let you know where the system was headed. Doesnt change the fact that we SD teach it and as far as being

Quote" and now you have SD of today. People trying to learn too much stuff and not being able to use or perform it well.
I can use and perform it well enough and I know many who can. KC

[bodhi warrior]

I agree hsing I and 8 drunks were taught in the 80's. But why did he wait so long? In the 70's he didn't care how many students stayed. But when money became an issue and he needed more students he had to give them what they wanted.
Yes my instructor does charge a fee. But that's for classes throughout the week working and correcting mistakes. Sin the teaches 2 or 3 seminars and can make as much as my instructor clears in a year! And sin just runs through the form. No correction. But this is just my experience.

[kwaichang]

1st everything we write here is speculation.
2. I know GMT thinks highly of what he teaches us.
3. I wont and feel no one would just teach anyone what they know if they havent earned it.
4. Also if you look at the web site he is teaching the Leopards again for those who didnt get to take it that is review for some.
Also those who dont train wont retain so those who do reap the benefits. KC

[bodhi warrior]

I agree practice will lead to retention. I know 4 mantis's and 4 black tigers and all the internal stuff plus some other forms. I practice everyday at least an hour and its very difficult to practice everything as much as I think is needed. It would be impossible for me to practice everything up to 5th black, and do it justice. I also practice everything up to blackbelt also.
Since we're speculating why do you think sin the taught the 8 drunks before the blacktigers or hua fist etc when it is now higher ranked material?
Also the fact that he has to get forms from notes and songs indicates to me if he did know them he can't say he's a master of them now.
I personally think master hiang has stayed pretty true to his art by keeping the curriculum pretty much intact, with some additions. And he still teaches classes.
I just worry our art is becoming watered down by having too much.

[BM2]

[QUOTE=bodhi warrior;843657]
Since we're speculating why do you think sin the taught the 8 drunks before the blacktigers or hua fist etc when it is now higher ranked material?


The Hua and Black Tiger's were taught before the Drunken Immortals. The Drunken Immortals followed the post training and only three were taught at the Sports Center.


The only thing that was required was one form for each of the Brown Belt levels. Golden Tiger, sai and broadsword. The additional forms were to increase the time it took to black and that was required after 1984. It also was required to have a white stripe running the length of the belt in the middle if you were a brown belt before the age of 16. You were not considered a brown belt but a Jr brown belt. And if you were able to do your forms for black and passed, you could not wear a black gi until age 16 and were also a Junior Black belt with a white stripe like a skunk, down the middle of the belt.
People also frequently failed belt tests but he didn't require you to pay and test again under black level. He would tell the names of who passed, then he named the ones that didn't and told them to pick up their belts at the door and give it to their instructor. He would tell them why they failed and to tell their instructor why. When their instructor felt that the student corrected where they failed, they could wear the new belt.
It seems as if the health part is being pushed more than it used to be.

[Judge Pen]

Yes my instructor does charge a fee. But that's for classes throughout the week working and correcting mistakes. Sin the teaches 2 or 3 seminars and can make as much as my instructor clears in a year! And sin just runs through the form. No correction. But this is just my experience.

In my experience, GMT does teach the form rather quickly in a seminar without correction, but I know that he spends several days teaching that same form to my teachers with training and application. Prior to the form part of the insturction, my teachers usually put us through some of that training as a warm up before GMT starts telling the story or the form and doing the instruction. Then for several weeks after the form we are expected to review the notes and the DVD of the form and our teachers will have review classes where corrections are offered. But that's just my experience.

I worry about our art getting watered down too much too. I think that too many people have too many forms in too short of a period of time, so I understand what you are saying bodhi warrior. But I know KC and know how hard the man trains and he does keep a good handle on all of his material, so whether our art is too watered down by a number of forms depends on the individual and their training ethic. I can't do most of my forms justis, but that's just me and my limitations. Mentally, I can do about 70% of what I've been taught, and the rest of the material I would have to go back to my notes and video to work it up. I can live with that seeing I've been in the art for 19 years now.

[kwaichang]

It is hard to keep every thing fresh but that is also part of the challenge. I have aschedule it is hard to follow but I try so even if I do 50% of the conditioning stuff and 70% of the MA stuff I am doing OK KC:)

[Baqualin]

bhodi tree,

i did not start until 1997 so i am not a old timer but i do share the same opinion.

Then you wouldn't have been able to specialize like you have.;)

[Baqualin]

I agree hsing I and 8 drunks were taught in the 80's. But why did he wait so long? In the 70's he didn't care how many students stayed. But when money became an issue and he needed more students he had to give them what they wanted.
Yes my instructor does charge a fee. But that's for classes throughout the week working and correcting mistakes. Sin the teaches 2 or 3 seminars and can make as much as my instructor clears in a year! And sin just runs through the form. No correction. But this is just my experience.

All the high end CMA's do these same seminars......at least we have our teachers like JP stated, to work with long after the seminar is over.....here the seminar material is worked on every week.
BQ

[Baqualin]

I was talking to my instructor a few weeks ago and we were talking about how things used to be back in the 70's. And there were a few things that were very surprising.
But first alittle background on my instructor and myself. He started in the early 70's at the U of K sin the karate club and I started in 1984. He has continually taught since the late 70's and I have been off and on due to work.
Back in the 70's things were different. Sin The didn't care about money he just loved to teach. Conditioning and sparring were more important than forms. He wanted to weed people out he made classes hard and if you didn't come back, oh well.
For the first roughly 14 years there wasn't alot of forms. You had the current material up through brown belt, and from brown to black you had everything except the cranes, birds, connecting fist, five dir. fist palm, and one of the bo forms. That's 9 forms! And from 1st black to 2nd black there were only 5 forms. Tai chi and pakua were two of them, dont remember the other three.
In my opinion this is when you had people that were very good. Because they were well conditioned and focused on a few forms. It was like this for around 14 years. But then sin the and the senior students wanted to start keeping people longer and that is why they added the 9 forms to brown belt in the early 80's. I think he had some of this material already just waiting for enough people to have the coditionioning to do more advanced stuff like 8 drunken immortals. I really dont think he had much past this though. But I guess he realized to make more money he needed more forms, and now you have SD of today. People trying to learn too much stuff and not being able to use or perform it well.
In my opinion sin the should have stayed with the core material and not added chen or snake pa kua,etc which obviously he didn't learn first hand. Any of the old timers have opinions?

I was there.....74 UK club and I agree with most of what you say, especially about to much material, but for one I'm glad he has taught the Internal forms...I have been able to specialize in that area now....I no longer practice any external forms and at my age I don't intend to.
BQ

[Baqualin]

I don't share that opinion, but I share the spirit of it.
I think he should have approached things more scientific.

That's all I want to say about that. Most of what you said is very true, though, historically speaking.

edit - except I cannot verify or deny that line about GMS learning firsthand. I tend to disagree, but I err on the side of optimism.

Hey Shadowlin....how the h#ll are you........M says hello to you & your wife...we hope all is well.:)
BQ

[Citong Shifu]

I came across these on youtube. I dont know if they have been posted with earlier discussions, but here they are.

Shaolin Do "Golden Leopard" (Sr. Master Garry Grooms) (http://www.youtbube.com/watch?v=MOi63m2nwbM&feature=related)

Shaolin Do "Student/s Interviews" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4uob5H9XCKs&feature-related)

Shaolin Do "Interview with Sin The" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9xcly0coJw&feature=related)


There are actually several more clips of SD & Garry Grooms on youtube. I judt didnt have time to post them all.

[mkriii]

is that shaolin golden shower.....LOL?

[brucereiter]

I came across these on youtube. I dont know if they have been posted with earlier discussions, but here they are.

Shaolin Do "Golden Leopard" (Sr. Master Garry Grooms) (http://www.youtbube.com/watch?v=MOi63m2nwbM&feature=related)

Shaolin Do "Student/s Interviews" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4uob5H9XCKs&feature-related)

Shaolin Do "Interview with Sin The" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9xcly0coJw&feature=related)


There are actually several more clips of SD & Garry Grooms on youtube. I judt didnt have time to post them all.

hi ...

here is the link to my teachers youtube channel there are about a dozen clips
http://www.youtube.com/user/srmastergarygrooms

here is a link to my youtube channel ...
http://www.youtube.com/user/brucereiter

"shaolin legends" youtube channel.
http://www.youtube.com/user/shaolinlegends

these are the ones i would prefer to discuss. if you have any questions please ask.

[Shaolin Wookie]

In my experience, GMT does teach the form rather quickly in a seminar without correction, but I know that he spends several days teaching that same form to my teachers with training and application. Prior to the form part of the insturction, my teachers usually put us through some of that training as a warm up before GMT starts telling the story or the form and doing the instruction. Then for several weeks after the form we are expected to review the notes and the DVD of the form and our teachers will have review classes where corrections are offered. But that's just my experience.

I worry about our art getting watered down too much too. I think that too many people have too many forms in too short of a period of time, so I understand what you are saying bodhi warrior. But I know KC and know how hard the man trains and he does keep a good handle on all of his material, so whether our art is too watered down by a number of forms depends on the individual and their training ethic. I can't do most of my forms justis, but that's just me and my limitations. Mentally, I can do about 70% of what I've been taught, and the rest of the material I would have to go back to my notes and video to work it up. I can live with that seeing I've been in the art for 19 years now.


I just feel it's best to do whatever you have to in order to pass a test. Cramming isn't out of order. For the rest, train what you like and specialize in your favorites. I'd rather be good at six of my favorite forms than equally crappy at all twenty.....LOL.....just pick a major, unless you want to be a general education major (and wind up with a little depth in this or that, and everything in general, but nothing in depth).
It's not out of order to let some forms fall by the wayside....and even though I try not to let them do that, it happens a little here and there. The best forms are generally the festival ones, but they're also the hardest. Most people let them deteriorate, so there's not always a great pool of experience even from senior students. So they become your own.

I don't know what the memory issues are with material. I don't generally forget a form, but here and there I might add a different punch or kick, or a slightly wrong combination....but who cares as long as I punch and kick hard? Yeah, you fix it eventually, but it doesn't really matter in the long run....;)

Still, most forms build on others. It's always the same motions (those of your short forms, dressed up with different moods/animal characteristics) and stances. You just do them in a different order, from different angles, with different hand forms, with different combinations....but it's always the same basic motion, so it's generally not that hard to remember. If you really enjoy a style, like I enjoy the cranes, you'll develop a different way of approaching those sets. I don't punch the same when I do the crane as when I do a tiger form. But then, that's a difference that comes with familiarity rather than generaliation. I haven't done my sai form in forever, but I could go outside and do it with 1-2 reps review. But then, I could do the kwan dao no problem. I don't like the sais, but I love the kwan dao. I can live with that.

If I make in "A" in my favorite forms, I don't really care if I get a "C" on the ones I think are pointless and dull. But I know they help round out my education, and do me some general good. Kind of like cough medicine.

[Shaolin Wookie]

But I guess he realized to make more money he needed more forms, and now you have SD of today. People trying to learn too much stuff and not being able to use or perform it well.


LOL....if you think Shaolin-Do is bad, I wonder what you'd think of the notoriously "impecunious":rolleyes: Shaolin.....:D......we're saints compared to those monks....LOL

[Shaolin Wookie]

They're teaching the 1st road of the ground monkey in ATL in a couple of weeks. I know it's supposed to be killer on the abs. Any difficult techniques or moves I should practice to prepare for it?

[Judge Pen]

They're teaching the 1st road of the ground monkey in ATL in a couple of weeks. I know it's supposed to be killer on the abs. Any difficult techniques or moves I should practice to prepare for it?

Naw, its not that bad if you're keeping up on your classes and basic excercises. But maybe I'm spoiled doing hua and drunken immoratals 90% of the time now. It's a neat little form. You can do a kip up and and shoot through without an issue, right?

[kwaichang]

Oh no I have a cold ,,, ahahahahahahbulchit, xcuuuuuseme I had to sneeze KC

[kwaichang]

Haha just joking Judge KC

[shadowlin]

Hey Shadowlin....how the h#ll are you........M says hello to you & your wife...we hope all is well.:)
BQ

Hey BQ. I'll call you.

I wish Master Grooms had not posted Golden Leopard on Youtube.
Nothing is deemed sacred anymore.

[bakxierboxer]

.... road.... ground monkey....

Indonesians ARE known to be a thrifty lot.... possibly more so than the AmerInds who (I've heard suggested) like to economize with their use of road-kill coyotes (and what-not)....

As for the road-kill/ground-monkey, I've heard that a couple of packages of hamburger buns and your choice of condiments will suffice.

[mkriii]

Hey BQ. I'll call you.

I wish Master Grooms had not posted Golden Leopard on Youtube.
Nothing is deemed sacred anymore.

You mean Golden Shower :D

I'm back.....did you all miss me?

[TrollTerminator]

You mean Golden Shower :D

I'm back.....did you all miss me?

I see, not only are you a racist, your a pervert too:rolleyes:

[mkriii]

ok i'm going to ask this anyways even thouigh i shouldn't humor you......why am i a rascist? what have i said to indicate that?

[BoulderDawg]

It's been forever since I posted here but I talked with a friend yesterday who's still in the program at CSC in Denver. She said there has been talk that the schools are in financial trouble......it a shame really. From what I can see they have a hard time adapting and changing to the times.

[Citong Shifu]

ROFL (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOi63m2nwbM)

Nice foundation.

Awesome job, that was amazing. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwLrwRefi-c&feature=related)

No concept of basic dao technique. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWfUBipuzXk&feature=related)

I didn't care for the drunken set :eek:. He was way too garbled with his movements and lacked the essence of zui quan. His flexibility was very good, but nothing uncommon within the cma. Good effort though. The dao set, I would have to agree. There were alot of dao characteristics missing from the set. Alot of the movements were meaningless or without spirit as well. Once again, good effort on the practitionrers part....

Just my observation, "NO" SD pun intended. Both guys had good effort.

CS

[arinathos.valin]

For the last two posters...

What are the characteristics you're looking for that would mark a good dao set?
In other words, what's the performance lacking that you would put in?

[brucereiter]

I didn't care for the drunken set :eek:. He was way too garbled with his movements and lacked the essence of zui quan. His flexibility was very good, but nothing uncommon within the cma.
CS

hi c.s.

i really do not know much about drunken kung fu since i do not practice it but i would ask:
what is this "essence"?
is it not a personal expression?
do the following clips have the "essence" you are speaking of?
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=W5XpUPbBmBc&feature=related
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=NGZ_XHeUrJc
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=2OVsrZDtVHQ
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=I5wmhTB9yKw&feature=related
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=TkIBLOmqk4k
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=QWr4q6MMmD4&feature=related

[brucereiter]

The dao set, I would have to agree. There were alot of dao characteristics missing from the set. Alot of the movements were meaningless or without spirit as well. Once again, good effort on the practitionrers part....

CS

hi c.s.

ok ... i can say this about my teacher and i think most ma teachers alive right now. he has no real world sword fighting experience against another armed "enemey, he has never been in a battle with live swords. :-)

what is a example of a meaningless movement in the dao clip?

[Citong Shifu]

hi c.s.

i really do not know much about drunken kung fu since i do not practice it but i would ask:
what is this "essence"?
is it not a personal expression?
do the following clips have the "essence" you are speaking of?
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=W5XpUPbBmBc&feature=related
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=NGZ_XHeUrJc
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=2OVsrZDtVHQ
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=I5wmhTB9yKw&feature=related
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=TkIBLOmqk4k
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=QWr4q6MMmD4&feature=related

Bruce, These are really fine examples of the wushu flare drunken boxing, but are more Chinese opera versions mixed with modern tumbling techniques... Drunken boxing makes use of a variety of postures and footwork, as you already know. However, the drunken appearance of the movements are really false and should be executed with stability and power, not as if you really stumble or twist, etc. Every drunken movement executed is done soley on "purpose". Thus giving the appearance of being drunk when not, but in complete control allowing the techniques to be used effectively in combat. Anything else is just a dance or a good cardio workout...

This is purely my point of view from my training in said style. If one cannot fight effectively with this set, then its not being done correctly. Also, alot of drunken style is awesome for total body conditioning, on all levels. No matter what, done correct or incorrect, one will definitely get the conditioning aspects...

Sorry, the essence. Well the essence is really seen and is different for everyone and the way they move. But, overall zui quan essence is always seen or should be; the appearance of being drunk while not appearing to be drunk. (?) Make sense? Although my movement appears to be drunken like, all movements are executed on purpose with purpose, everytime... Well, that enough on that. I spent many hours and lots of $ training these principles, lol... Let me tell you, I didnt understand the contradictions at first either..

Take Care.
CS

[Citong Shifu]

hi c.s.

ok ... i can say this about my teacher and i think most ma teachers alive right now. he has no real world sword fighting experience against another armed "enemey, he has never been in a battle with live swords. :-)

what is a example of a meaningless movement in the dao clip?

Although training sword against sword is an awesome way to really learn your weapon, there is one main factor that will dictate how your weapon is used no mater what and that is the way you train it and its principles... I dont know your teacher or his training, so I cant really say what is or isn't...

Take care
CS

[Citong Shifu]

For the last two posters...

What are the characteristics you're looking for that would mark a good dao set?
In other words, what's the performance lacking that you would put in?

If I was judging this set traditionally, I would judge the spirit and intent of each and every movement, which this set lacked. Also, the principle execution of dao techniques; dao characteristics are that of the tiger, every movement is executed with the utmost speed, power, & intent (chopping, thrusting, slicing, etc). Footwork should be quick, but stable allowing every movement to be fully executed or expressed before moving to the next...

This practitioner did a good job. However, he didnt display the principles of the dao and focused on speed overall.... Remember, this is my take. He may not even really like the dao form, know what I mean...


CS

[Judge Pen]

If I was judging this set traditionally, I would judge the spirit and intent of each and every movement, which this set lacked. Also, the principle execution of dao techniques; dao characteristics are that of the tiger, every movement is executed with the utmost speed, power, & intent (chopping, thrusting, slicing, etc). Footwork should be quick, but stable allowing every movement to be fully executed or expressed before moving to the next...

This practitioner did a good job. However, he didnt display the principles of the dao and focused on speed overall.... Remember, this is my take. He may not even really like the dao form, know what I mean...


CS

Are you saying that when he executed a cut, slicke, thrust, etc. it didn't look like the martial intent (i.e. the intent to cut through something with that swing) was present--that the intent was sacrificed (apparently) for speed.

Was this a performance issue or an issue with the form (even if it was performed by someone who displayed the intent behind the form properly)? Or is there a problem with the structure of the form itself?

[Judge Pen]

Bruce, These are really fine examples of the wushu flare drunken boxing, but are more Chinese opera versions mixed with modern tumbling techniques... Drunken boxing makes use of a variety of postures and footwork, as you already know. However, the drunken appearance of the movements are really false and should be executed with stability and power, not as if you really stumble or twist, etc. Every drunken movement executed is done soley on "purpose". Thus giving the appearance of being drunk when not, but in complete control allowing the techniques to be used effectively in combat. Anything else is just a dance or a good cardio workout...

This is purely my point of view from my training in said style. If one cannot fight effectively with this set, then its not being done correctly. Also, alot of drunken style is awesome for total body conditioning, on all levels. No matter what, done correct or incorrect, one will definitely get the conditioning aspects...

Sorry, the essence. Well the essence is really seen and is different for everyone and the way they move. But, overall zui quan essence is always seen or should be; the appearance of being drunk while not appearing to be drunk. (?) Make sense? Although my movement appears to be drunken like, all movements are executed on purpose with purpose, everytime... Well, that enough on that. I spent many hours and lots of $ training these principles, lol... Let me tell you, I didnt understand the contradictions at first either..

Take Care.
CS

Again, is your criticism more of the performance or the structure of the form? I take it you are equally unimpressed with the essence of the "opera style" drunk boxing's essence as they show movement for performance and conditioning as opposed to martial purpose? Any examples (youtube or otherwise) where we could actually see the flavor that you are referencing and compare it to Bruce's clips?

[BM2]

If I was judging this set traditionally, I would judge the spirit and intent of each and every movement, which this set lacked. Also, the principle execution of dao techniques ...


CS


This is going off on another tangent and in no way should it be taken as criticism of CS's critique and is not targeted to him for a response but for those who read this reply and understand that it is directed at ourselves.
What is the intent of practicing swimming on dry land? Of criticism of some one's style of dry swimming and understanding of dry land swimming?

[tattooedmonk]

Again, is your criticism more of the performance or the structure of the form? I take it you are equally unimpressed with the essence of the "opera style" drunk boxing's essence as they show movement for performance and conditioning as opposed to martial purpose? Any examples (youtube or otherwise) where we could actually see the flavor that you are referencing and compare it to Bruce's clips?It is the performance. There is nothing wrong with the form. He has not known this form for very long. You can tell.

[Citong Shifu]

Are you saying that when he executed a cut, slicke, thrust, etc. it didn't look like the martial intent (i.e. the intent to cut through something with that swing) was present--that the intent was sacrificed (apparently) for speed.

Was this a performance issue or an issue with the form (even if it was performed by someone who displayed the intent behind the form properly)? Or is there a problem with the structure of the form itself?

JP, From the video, it was both. I did see a few movements that displayed most of the elements, but all in all, I didnt get the feeling of his intent when executing this sets. His movements didnt appear to be strong/powerful just fast with a show of power here and there.

CS

[Golden Tiger]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iLD1lUfyG20&feature=related

Whats your take on this version?

I enjoy reading the different analysis of these examples when done in a constructive way.

[Citong Shifu]

Again, is your criticism more of the performance or the structure of the form? I take it you are equally unimpressed with the essence of the "opera style" drunk boxing's essence as they show movement for performance and conditioning as opposed to martial purpose? Any examples (youtube or otherwise) where we could actually see the flavor that you are referencing and compare it to Bruce's clips?

JP, of course, its both. Performance was there, but wasn't. The structure was not solid either. Furthermore, I'm not trying to belittle the practitioners. I'm only looking at these sets from my understanding. I haven't come across a good youtube video of drunken yet. The opera version and wushu performances are nice to watch and show various aspects of cma conditioning. I'm just not a fan of said routines....

P.S. Traditional Drunken forms aren't executed while watching the ground 90% of the time.... Even though when one is encircling and lower body twisting, one should appear to be looking away (down) but actually looking at his would be attacker... Just an axample.... Drunken movements are very deceptive and almost are never what they appear to be... Those wishing to build good body strength and conditioning can do so with the many opera or wushu versions as well. One doesn't have to train the traditional sets to achieve great conditioning... Main thing is have fun with it, if nothing else. Just thought I would point out a few things that most people in the drunken style dont really work on due to the performance aspects....

All I can say is, if you guys who knows this set would try practicing with more purposeful movements done soley on purpose with the drunken principles, you will find it moves and feels alot differently then when learned or previously practiced...

Take it for what its worth, I do....

CS

[tattooedmonk]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iLD1lUfyG20&feature=related

Whats your take on this version?

I enjoy reading the different analysis of these examples when done in a constructive way.but lacks the CMA flair.:p:rolleyes::D:eek::cool:

[Citong Shifu]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iLD1lUfyG20&feature=related

Whats your take on this version?

I enjoy reading the different analysis of these examples when done in a constructive way.

GT, once again, great effort by the practitioner. But, it also appeared to be somewhat walked through. Dont you agree? The very first movement when steppting to left gung bu (dao cutting behind) and then forward, no power, etc.... Throughout the form pretty much no dao prowess. However, he did execute most of the stances and postures really well, but appeared not to be stable.

I'm taking into account that he like the other two (zui quan and dao #1) are black belts with many years of practice, so I'm looking at aspects that should be present in the cma advanced levels... Know what I mean. Cma advanced levels and up should display their understanding through their movements and shouldn't have to be explained (while performing kung fu sets, drills, etc.). This is what I've been taught, so I tend to somewhat really critical when I should be more understanding.

Now that I have a new digital video camera, I'm going to be making up a little demo clip with portions of forms and whatever. I'll make sure I'll post here for you guys as well and you guys can have a go at me :D, lol.... Til then, peace through martial arts.

Take care.
CS

[Citong Shifu]

P.S. - To the SD guys/gals, I consider all of you kungfu brohers/sisters regardless of style, etc. So, please dont feel as though I'm trying to bash or whatever. Just trying to open with everyone. For what its worth...

CS

[kwaichang]

I have to agree with everything you have said regarding the drunken sets and Green Dragon form. I was told exactly what you have said by my teacher regarding Drunken sets. Though you are appearing drunk you should be stable etc. As far as the Green dragon BS form I trained Iaido and Kendo for a number of years and as I see it the intent is lacking . KC

[kwaichang]

Happy Birth day Gene from KC:)

[brucereiter]

citong ... thanks for your respectful observations.

[Citong Shifu]

citong ... thanks for your respectful observations.

SDC, just my opinion/s, lol... I understand that I'm a very technical person, which doesn't fly with alot of people, well most, lol.... However, I have been trying to tone it down some and let little things slide a bit, but then the little things turn into big things, etc... Of course, most people don't really care about the detail, etc, which in turns causes a stink. Anywho, glad to be able to discuss cma technique principles without everyone getting bent... No pun intended bent monk :D.

Take care.
CS

[Citong Shifu]

I have to agree with everything you have said regarding the drunken sets and Green Dragon form. I was told exactly what you have said by my teacher regarding Drunken sets. Though you are appearing drunk you should be stable etc. As far as the Green dragon BS form I trained Iaido and Kendo for a number of years and as I see it the intent is lacking . KC


KC, The performers made a great effort while performing their sets, well two of them, one really looked as though he was walking throuh the form. Nonetheless, everyone must start with effort. Effort leads to the set/s characteristics (principles), which leads to intent or purposeful movement, etc. Thats a really short analysis, but it gets the point across, lol... I enjoy discussing cma principles, but then again, thats the meat and gray of our training...

Take care.
CS

[Citong Shifu]

citong ... thanks for your respectful observations.

Hey Bruce, was you performing one of the sets I commented on? If so, I wasn't trying to bash anyone, just commenting on how I perform these sets and why....

As Always, Best Wishes.
CS

[brucereiter]

Hey Bruce, was you performing one of the sets I commented on? If so, I wasn't trying to bash anyone, just commenting on how I perform these sets and why....

As Always, Best Wishes.
CS

hi cs,

i did not hear bashing from you. i heard your opinions which in many ways are different than mine but i hope the reason most people post is to hear other peoples opinions take what you feel is good and ignore the rest.

my clips can be seen at the youtube channel linked below. i am a "internal martial arts student" and have not learned and have no interest in learning the drunken styles.

the tai chi broad sword form you commented on is my teacher.
i think he presented the dao well.

the drunken form with the tall guy (6' 6") in the gym is a student who i have done some training with in the past. he was a student in atlanta but moved out of country a few years ago. this has nothing to do with the drunken form but he is a fantastic fighter and helped me along the way to learn how to apply the concepts of various forms.

[Judge Pen]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iLD1lUfyG20&feature=related

Whats your take on this version?

I enjoy reading the different analysis of these examples when done in a constructive way.

I thought his performance was very clean and nice. I agree with CS, that he could have had more "umph" behind the technique. I don't see where he wasn't "stable". That criticism was lost on me.

[Golden Tiger]

I thought his performance was very clean and nice. I agree with CS, that he could have had more "umph" behind the technique. I don't see where he wasn't "stable". That criticism was lost on me.


I can sort of see what CS refered to. I think the lack of displayed "stability" comes from training with a demo grade sword. Meaning, I have noticed how I look when I run through one of our sword forms using a light sword vs when I use a combat steel one. Since the former is so lite, the moves can be done a bit easier. Now when I use the later, for conditioning mainly, I have to be firmly planted or the weight of the sword will control me instead of the other way around.

I think that might be what CS is getting at.

[Judge Pen]

I can sort of see what CS refered to. I think the lack of displayed "stability" comes from training with a demo grade sword. Meaning, I have noticed how I look when I run through one of our sword forms using a light sword vs when I use a combat steel one. Since the former is so lite, the moves can be done a bit easier. Now when I use the later, for conditioning mainly, I have to be firmly planted or the weight of the sword will control me instead of the other way around.

I think that might be what CS is getting at.

That's why I practice with "live" weapons. I understand the principle of unsing heavier weapons than practical for training, but I don't think you should go lighter than practical.

[doug maverick]

well you use heavier weapons, as a way of sorta "weight train" its meant to help build your strengh like using a 20lbs guan do, or a ten pound proud swords. not only that when you use light weapon you move really fast.

[MasterKiller]

That's why I practice with "live" weapons. I understand the principle of unsing heavier weapons than practical for training, but I don't think you should go lighter than practical.

Live weapons have a cutting edge. You using these?

[Judge Pen]

Live weapons have a cutting edge. You using these?

Yes. That's why I used that smaller horse cutter for the kwan dao form I put up a couple of years ago. It has a 1050 carbon steel blade that could cut down a tree. Weapons with an edge on them tend to be middle weight in my experience. My broad sword and my straight sword have live edges. My spear has a live point to it (but I haven't sharpened the edges yet). My chain-whip is a heavy weight whip. I even have double hook swords that have a live edge, but those scare me a bit too much. :eek:

[BentMonk]

I appreciate JP's enthusiasm, but I know that I am a klutz that is fond of his appendages. :D My weapons aren't edged, but they're not light either. Using heavy weapons has helped strengthen my balance. Weapons are also just plain fun.

[MasterKiller]

It's good JP already has one child. I fear for the safety of his nutsack.

[Judge Pen]

It's good JP already has one child. I fear for the safety of his nutsack.

Iron balls chi gung.

Serioulsy, a live weapon is great for concentration and keeping with the spirit of the weapon. If I have no experience with the weapon, then I'll use a dull edge or other safety precautions (such as padding the end of the chain whip) but once I get familiar with the weapon, I start looking for a live edged version.

So far, I've not had any real injuries. The chain whip caused some nasty bumps and bruises though. Kind of like the rope dart photos you posted a couple of years ago MK.

[tattooedmonk]

What is the order of the animals in the SD 8 Animal Bagua???

[kwaichang]

Phoenix dragon bear tiger snake monkey horse eagle KC

[kungfujunky]

kc is that set in stone? when i learned it was :

Phoenix dragon bear tiger horse snake monkey eagle.

i am waiting on BQ for the tape of gmt doing it so i know i have it down right but i was under the impression there was no set pattern

[Golden Tiger]

Phoenix dragon bear tiger snake monkey horse eagle KC

That is the order that Master Sin taught it out the first time. But as with all the other forms, when one circle ends, you can do which ever one you wish or if you want to get very technical, you can apply the level I-IV training of classical and mix and match them.:cool:

[tattooedmonk]

Did you ever find out the exact story about the 3 birds?? I know they are supposed to be from Emei/ Omei Shan Shaolin but that is all that is told about them.

[tattooedmonk]

kc is that set in stone? when i learned it was :

Phoenix dragon bear tiger horse snake monkey eagle.

i am waiting on BQ for the tape of gmt doing it so i know i have it down right but i was under the impression there was no set pattern
This is the way I remember it as well. GT is right ,you can change it up .

Thanks again.;)

[Golden Tiger]

Did you ever find out the exact story about the 3 birds?? I know they are supposed to be from Emei/ Omei Shan Shaolin but that is all that is told about them.

No, thats about all the info I have on them also. That they were part of an "original " set that others were derived from.

I will be seeing Master Sin in a couple of weeks and I will try to remember to ask for additional background on them.

[Shaolin Wookie]

My mestre put up a documentary.

Sweet stuff. You can catch your boy here at 1:40 in, doing a front sweep (the only white dude, and bald / wearin' white pants). LOL....and doin' it sloppy. Must've been tired--hardest workouts ever.....

The kid at 1:30 is sick; he's just absolutely sick. He makes me feel like a 90 y.o. hack...LOL...

Unfortunately, you don't get to see Mestre Robson doin' cool stuff. Then again, they filmed the entire thing during our class sessions, so you only get to see the basics. But he's the real deal...plays the music, plays the game, built like a Mack Truck.

[bakxierboxer]

My mestre put up a documentary.

Sweet stuff. You can catch your boy here at 1:40 in, doing a front sweep (the only white dude, and bald / wearin' white pants). LOL....and doin' it sloppy. Must've been tired--hardest workouts ever.....

The kid at 1:30 is sick; he's just absolutely sick. He makes me feel like a 90 y.o. hack...LOL...

Unfortunately, you don't get to see Mestre Robson doin' cool stuff. Then again, they filmed the entire thing during our class sessions, so you only get to see the basics. But he's the real deal...plays the music, plays the game, built like a Mack Truck.

It'd help if you put the link in there......

[MasterKiller]

i'm new here and don't feel like reading hundreds of pages on this thread. What is Shaolin-Do?

stfu, n00b

[lkfmdc]

stfu, n00b

next he'll post

"I'm new here and don't know what 'stfu n00b' means" :D

[brucereiter]

stfu, n00b

lol :cool::D:eek::confused:

[Baqualin]

Phoenix dragon bear tiger snake monkey horse eagle KC

Correct!!
fjduighrui

[Shaolin Wookie]

My mestre put up a documentary.

Sweet stuff. You can catch your boy here at 1:40 in, doing a front sweep (the only white dude, and bald / wearin' white pants). LOL....and doin' it sloppy. Must've been tired--hardest workouts ever.....

The kid at 1:30 is sick; he's just absolutely sick. He makes me feel like a 90 y.o. hack...LOL...

Unfortunately, you don't get to see Mestre Robson doin' cool stuff. Then again, they filmed the entire thing during our class sessions, so you only get to see the basics. But he's the real deal...plays the music, plays the game, built like a Mack Truck.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zN_mI1tGnK4

LOL...forgot the link the first time.

[Shaolin Wookie]

Some of the senior students....and mestres associated with the school. Mestre Robson comes out at 1:40.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EgKQGXqEGWU

[Golden Tiger]

Some of the senior students....and mestres associated with the school. Mestre Robson comes out at 1:40.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EgKQGXqEGWU


aka..... "You've been served!" :D

J/k very talented indeed

[Shaolin Wookie]

aka..... "You've been served!" :D

J/k very talented indeed

LOL.........

"Dance, sucka! You got nuthin' on me! Why don't you dance, sucka!"

[kwaichang]

Have to agree it looked like moderate gymnastics to me. And yes I have seen Capoeira KC

[Shaolin Wookie]

LOL....that's part of capoeira, dude. The batizado is a yearly event that initates people into capoeira. You'll see beginners and mestres, and they all play on the stage. Of course, it's best when you see two mestres go at it, but there are different elements of the batizado. What you must be looking for is the roda, where you square off with someone inside a circle.

This part of the show was just showing off gymnastics stuff.

"moderate gymnastics"......LOL, had me laughing.

[kwaichang]

I have seen and know owners of a gymnastic studio whos daughter made the national team and was going Olympic. She was a great gymnast , yes they on the clip were moderate meaning middle not good and not bad. KC

[kwaichang]

HEY MAYBE THEY CAN MAKE A MOVIE GYMKATA II TEEHEE kc

[Judge Pen]

HEY MAYBE THEY CAN MAKE A MOVIE GYMKATA II TEEHEE kc

Gymkata ROCKED!!! :D

[Shaolin Wookie]

I have seen and know owners of a gymnastic studio whos daughter made the national team and was going Olympic. She was a great gymnast , yes they on the clip were moderate meaning middle not good and not bad. KC

In other words, you've seen your friend's daughter square off with a rival team, duck a lightning-quick crescent kick aimed at her head, quickly pop onto her hands, throw three kicks upside down, spin off onto one hand, drop down into a negativa, throw a front sweep, and then cap it off with double front tornado kick, all while keeping to the beat of the berimbau?

I think not....LOL....

(Not saying gymnastics suck, just that they're about as innovative as wushu:p)

Parana e, beeyatchies....:D

[kwaichang]

She is also a black belt in martial arts and her father was a world kickboxing champion and US champion. But I didnt see what you described on the clip either so you are right I didnt see that. KC

[Shaolin Wookie]

LOL....KC, no offense man, but you're a real tool.

[Judge Pen]

LOL....KC, no offense man, but you're a real tool.

I thought so at first too, but he is a really good guy when you get to know him. It's hard to gauge personalities on an internet forum.

[Baqualin]

I thought so at first too, but he is a really good guy when you get to know him. It's hard to gauge personalities on an internet forum.

JP I must agree with you again.......KC just likes to aggravate.
BQ

[kwaichang]

Just call it like I see it thats all BTW do I aggravate you BQ do I huh Do I ?? I think not / Besides a tool is something used to fix something else thanks man KC
BTW why do all of you guys always say LOL then are derogatory toward that person LOL means Lots of Love right????

[BM2]

While we all will disagree at some point, it shouldn't make us disagreeable.
I think that JP has wanted to go 1bad65 on someone's counsel before, he has to demostrate restraint if he wants to work.
I don't care much for Shaolin Wookie because of the way he posts, look at his signature. When he called KC a tool it was like calling the kettle black. I'm fairly certain that he feels the same about me and chances are he is correct:o

[MasterKiller]

Just call it like I see it thats all BTW do I aggravate you BQ do I huh Do I ?? I think not / Besides a tool is something used to fix something else thanks man KC
BTW why do all of you guys always say LOL then are derogatory toward that person LOL means Lots of Love right????

laugh out loud, bro.

[kwaichang]

Thanks JP. But I truly think SW means Lots of LOve I dont care what you guys say. I can feel the good vibes from him. KC:)

[Baqualin]

Just call it like I see it thats all BTW do I aggravate you BQ do I huh Do I ?? I think not / Besides a tool is something used to fix something else thanks man KC
BTW why do all of you guys always say LOL then are derogatory toward that person LOL means Lots of Love right????

You can't aggravate me, I know how nice of a person you really are.:D
BQ

[BM2]

Thanks JP. But I truly think SW means Lots of LOve I dont care what you guys say. I can feel the good vibes from him. KC:)

Im pickin up good vibrations
SW is giving me excitations
Im pickin up good vibrations
(oom bop bop good vibrations)
SW is giving me excitations
(oom bop bop excitations)
Good good good good vibrations
(oom bop bop)
SW is giving me excitations
(oom bop bop excitations)
Good good good good vibrations
(oom bop bop)
SW is giving me excitations
(oom bop bop excitations)


With apologizes to the Beach Boys

[Shaolin Wookie]

I don't care much for Shaolin Wookie because of the way he posts, look at his signature. When he called KC a tool it was like calling the kettle black. I'm fairly certain that he feels the same about me and chances are he is correct:o

Wait, who are you? I'm not sure that I've ever seen you post here before. :confused:

[Shaolin Wookie]

Thanks JP. But I truly think SW means Lots of LOve I dont care what you guys say. I can feel the good vibes from him. KC:)

LOL.....I've got nothing against you. I just think you should change your name to K(f)C.

Can't say that doesn't go for all of us. After all, we're all doing a variety of Kentucky Fried Shaolin.

[Baqualin]

LOL.....I've got nothing against you. I just think you should change your name to K(f)C.

Can't say that doesn't go for all of us. After all, we're all doing a variety of Kentucky Fried Shaolin.

Amen to that Bro.......keep being a tool Wook....you make me laugh.:D
BQ

[kwaichang]

Was just reading a book describing the higher Martial level of Zen in Martial arts. It states to not dwell on one technique or you will miss the Way/Tao. Anyway it made me think about all the Forms we learn all of which have merit and are a way to an end as they say. With that in mind I feel what we are doing by not clinging to one way but many ways are in keeping with the higher ideals of Shaolin. If I train in many methods though I may not catch completely the Nuances at first eventually I will and by learning more then I am in keeping with the duality of Chan / Zen. I am therefore doing something in keeping with the Shaolin that are of old. So to not cling to one method but embracing many we in SD are coming closer to being what we aspire to be "MORE SHAOLIN LIKE". So if you want to call us KfC that is OK because without the 11 herbs and spices the KfC would not exist much like the awsome art of Shaolin Do. KC
BTW Shaolin Wookie if you do not respect and like what you do then might i suggest you do something else.??

[BM2]

[QUOTE=kwaichang;847378] So if you want to call us KfC that is OK because without the 11 herbs and spices the KfC would not exist QUOTE]

Just read this today. It was only a matter of time till they nailed the Colonel.

DRIGGS, Idaho — Perhaps they should have called her Mary Jane.

A surprise birthday party for Dawn Wells, the actress who played Mary Ann on "Gilligan's Island," ended with a nearly three-hour tour of the Teton County sheriff's office and jail when the 69-year-old was caught with marijuana in her vehicle while driving home.

[Mas Judt]

If I train in many methods though I may not catch completely the Nuances at first eventually I will and by learning more then I am in keeping with the duality of Chan / Zen. I am therefore doing something in keeping with the Shaolin that are of old.

Made me spit my 2003 Coppola claret out. THis is the funniest thing I've read in ages. 'the duality of zen?!?'

Dude, you are a rock star comedian.

[kwaichang]

Sorry Mas Man I was just quoteing from the book forgot the " " KC

[Mas Judt]

Hah! I thought you were trying to be funny in a very clever way in the context of this whole thread.

[Judge Pen]

I'm a cynic. If I don't see it I don't believe it. As far as outlandish claims, I've heard a few whoppers about other teachers as well; what's your point? You live in a glass house my friend. How are the push-ups over the burning incense coming?

[Lamassu]

He has no point JP, he never did. He's just trying to get a rise out of you. Notice he says the same crap over and over and over again. The miserable b@st@rd still thinks "drinking the cool aid" is still funny and makes him cool. The sad thing for this loser is that all the martial artists who post here and are from so called 'respectable' schools, thinks he's full of sh!t too.

mkriii - laying the smack down on you used to be fun, now it's just sad. Let it go man.

[TrollTerminator]

All that matters is that I amuse my self.

That's because your the only one amused by you.
I know who you are.....I know what you do......I know where you live & even your phone #.

Don't fear the night.......fear what hunts at night.:cool:
TT

[kungfujunky]

All that matters is that I amuse my self.

your instructor would be so proud


:confused:

[kwaichang]

I will be up on the 29th how bout you beat my a$$ " Yo Go For It" You wuss. KC

[Judge Pen]

The push ups are coming along quite nicely. It's making me tough. Every time the inscence touches my stomack I think of beating your sorry butt. It motivates me. How do ya like them apples Fred? Your a LARPer!!!!!!

*yawn*

what the hell is a stomack? Good to see your edumacation at work.

[BentMonk]

All that matters is that I amuse my self.

No wonder your posts are lame...you're typing with one hand!:eek:

[Shaolin Wookie]

BTW Shaolin Wookie if you do not respect and like what you do then might i suggest you do something else.??

Haha......I'll chalk up our differences to age and geography. Clearly, we don't share the same sense of humor. At ease, solider. I like what I do, and I cross train for kicks. :rolleyes: (rolling eyes refer to the horrible pun).

[Shaolin Wookie]

The push ups are coming along quite nicely. It's making me tough. Every time the inscence touches my stomack I think of beating your sorry butt. It motivates me. How do ya like them apples Fred? Your a LARPer!!!!!!

Lol....he gets off on dipping his nipples in hot wax. Better to be a LARPer than a DIPPER.......:D

Don't be a LAR-Playa Hata, young Mortal Kombat III.

[Shaolin Wookie]

All that matters is that I abuse my self.

Ahhhh! The visions! [pokes out eyes]



Oh no! They're still there!!!:eek:

[Baqualin]

No wonder your posts are lame...you're typing with one hand!:eek:

NICE!!!!!!!:D

[mkriii]

Judge, are you an English teacher? Apparentely you are sense you feel the need to check my spelling.

[Citong Shifu]

*yawn*

what the hell is a stomack? Good to see your edumacation at work.

Our tax dollars at work, lol... :D

[mkriii]

Good morning my SD friends. How are you all doing this fine morning. GM Sin said that you didn't have to dring cool aid today, you may drink orange juice instead. He said that orange juice will make you be able to do the wonderous feats that he has accomplished. So drink up kiddies. So has is your all's training coming along? Learn any new deadly and rare techniques? Have you learned the Golden Shower form yet or is it the Golden Centipede, I forget. Any how, hope your day will be as joyous as mine. Take care SD friends.

[arinathos.valin]

Before JP points it out, mkriii, you spelled "apparently" wrong...

Maybe you do need an english teacher...

[mkriii]

Oh thanks for pointing that out to me. I'm sure Judge will appreciate that too. I actually thought htis was a martial art forum though not an on line English class. But thanks anyways for the spelling check. I'll come to you next time if I'm having trouble with spelling a word. Bye the way I purposely misspelled some words in this post to give you and Judge something to look for. Let me know when you find the mistakes. Take care :D

[Judge Pen]

Judge, are you an English teacher? Apparentely you are sense you feel the need to check my spelling. Nope. Normally I'd pass it off as a simple typo, but the content of your posts also reveals that you're an idiot. :p

[MasterKiller]

http://cdn-www.cracked.com/articleimages/wong/moran.jpg

[mkriii]

Nope. Normally I'd pass it off as a simple typo, but the content of your posts also reveals that you're an idiot. :p


Is that the best you can come up with......."I'm an idiot"? Come on, be more creative than that. If anyone is an idiot it is you for taking up for SD. You know what Barnum & Bailey said.....There's a sucker born every minute. You just keep drinking your cool aid and thinking you are the SH** and one day when you'll need to call apon that knowledge you learned in SD and you'll probably get your arse whoooped because it no good and unpracticle. You only need look at the cover of GM Sin's book and you'll see that its a joke. He's standing in a crane stance wearing tennis shoes.....New Balance tennis shoes at that, not even a good brand of shoes. And he's got his arm spread in what appears to be an ATTEMPT to look like crane wings. His wordrobe kind of takes away from the look that I think that he was trying for. It look like a joke. I almost busted out laughing.

[kungfujunky]

again your instructor must be so proud. no matter what fun you may think you are having you are a disrespectful tactless internet punk.

you have questioned and labeled and insulted just about everyone here with your drivel and yet have never had the sack to man up and cross hands. what better way to value what someone knows than to fight them?

reminds me of the line in the second Matrix movie. "you don't really know someone until you fight them" (or something close to that)

it is your incessant childishness that makes me wonder if you even train in what you say you do. i find it exceedingly hard to believe any sensei/teacher/instructor/master would condone the behavior you exhibit on here.

you are a stain to the art you practice and should be ashamed of yourself.

[tattooedmonk]

No wonder your posts are lame...you're typing with one hand!:eek: TOO FUNNY!!:D

[DPL]

Go away for a few months and everything stays pretty much exactly the same.

mkriiiiiiiiiii,
Yew arr sew kewl, wit yore clevur speling triks an wittily banterisms. Awl rasist bassturds kan ownly aspeyre two bee mor lik ewe. Maybee whin yoo finaly grad... grad... git owt uv joonior hi skool, yew kin starrt yer on kult sense ewe arr sew fassinated bye thim.

Doofus.

[Golden Tiger]

In all honesty Mark, your silly posts are just that...silly. Its one thing to throw out a slam here and there, everyone does it and some of them are quite clever. But yours...they seem to be mindless rambling. I seriously wonder if you even know what the reference to being a kool-aid (not cool aid mind you) really means? No originality, no wit, no substance.

And to read that you are an instructor, that leads me to think that you are more than likely not able to teach very well either.

You seem to have a distain for SD and Master Sin but you are one of the few on here with the unique chance to put your money where your mouth is. You live in Lexington, know where the gym is and could easily stop by and prove to all how your martial arts and intelect are superior.

BQ has repeatedly invited you over to workout, cross hands or just discuss the differences between the reality of SD and your perception of SD and yet you never seem to make it over. KC has on many ocassions invited you to meet and compare notes so to speak. Heck, I would even goes as far as stopping by some Saturday morning or anytime after the regular classes and have a very friendly and coridal exchange of techniques and information. I know both BQ and KC very well and they are both very nice, stand-up gentlemen who would gladly work out with you to see your implied short comings of SD. They are not making "net challenges or vieled threats. As for myself, I have trained at onetime or another with a student of just about every style out there and have always shown respect for them and what there training can bring to the table and perhaps improve mine.

So, there you have it. Put up or shut up. At the very least, look up "sarcasm" and learn to do it with a little better pazazz....:rolleyes:

[sean_stonehart]

MKIII ... you really are a tool. Plain & simple.

I have my points of contention with SD, but at least they have relevence. I've at least touched hands with SD people when I was in SD, after I left SD & still now. Skills are skills. You're mouth boxing *and badly* with invitations for both friendly & maybe not so from several different SD people. Man up or take the ***** seat.

You're spouting off just to watch your fingers go. You're more caught up in SD than most people in SD, y'know.

Seriously... you're a tool with this.

[Shaolin Wookie]

Judge, are you an English teacher? Apparentely you are sense you feel the need to check my spelling.

Two more sentences, two more grammar mistakes. JP's the lawyer. I'm the English man.;)

[Shaolin Wookie]

Is that the best you can come up with......."I'm an idiot"? Come on, be more creative than that. If anyone is an idiot it is you for taking up for SD. You know what Barnum & Bailey said.....There's a sucker born every minute. You just keep drinking your cool aid and thinking you are the SH** and one day when you'll need to call apon that knowledge you learned in SD and you'll probably get your arse whoooped because it no good and unpracticle. You only need look at the cover of GM Sin's book and you'll see that its a joke. He's standing in a crane stance wearing tennis shoes.....New Balance tennis shoes at that, not even a good brand of shoes. And he's got his arm spread in what appears to be an ATTEMPT to look like crane wings. His wordrobe kind of takes away from the look that I think that he was trying for. It look like a joke. I almost busted out laughing.


Owe yah? Well I was passing bye you're dojo the other day, and I saw you're sensesay parctissing like a hobo with some guy wareing an Speed-0, and he were all like: "Look at me! I'm a pritty little girl!" and then he did like a bach-flip with a triple-gainer and a side budderfligh twist, but he didint stick the landing. Then the uther persin in the dojo padded him on the but and was like "Did you ever si that movie Stick It?" Then you're sensesay were like to saying: "Yeah, its only like totallie like the bestest movie since in forever!" Thin the guy in the Speed0 sayd some thing like: "Id like to Stick You!" And then they went into the bach room and watched Stick It and made out for like an hower.

Amateur.....it weren't even a regulation Speed-Oh. More like Slow-Oh!

Hwarararawra!

He thin started for to do the preying mantis, and he was totallie like a catorpiller rather then a mantiss. So I called the extraminator and had him eradicallated.

Hwarararawra!

Hold on. I have to for to go drink my Drain-Oh like my dauchtor told for me to do. Bet your wishing you was me!

Hwarararawra!

[Judge Pen]

MRKiii, it says something when non-SD people are calling you out too. Several people on these forums have issues with SD but they can at least speak coherently about the issues. All you do is act like an immature little kid. I think you were, what 13, when you trained in SD? From your posts it seems you never grew out of that 13 year old mindset.

Keep thinking I couldn't defend myself. That's fine with me--I want people to underestimate me. It seems that you do.

[kwaichang]

HEEEEEEEERS Johnnie, Mkriii how bout it man this what 5 times you wont even respond to my posts what you CHICKEN ????? I guess so. Sorry guys he just wont put up and definately wont shut up so there you are. KC:confused:

[tattooedmonk]

MRKiii, it says something when non-SD people are calling you out too. Several people on these forums have issues with SD but they can at least speak coherently about the issues. All you do is act like an immature little kid. I think you were, what 13, when you trained in SD? From your posts it seems you never grew out of that 13 year old mindset.

Keep thinking I couldn't defend myself. That's fine with me--I want people to underestimate me. It seems that you do.BURN!!!!:D

[Shaolin Wookie]

Hey guys, I watched this vid again:

http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=6004254

Are you guys sure this "ground dragon" isn't Dog Boxing. I mentioned once that the Chinese refer to Dog Boxing as "Earth Dragon" Boxing, and from what I've seen of Dog Boxing, this fits the bill. The sweeps, the suicide kicks, etc....

Does anyone know the pinyin for the form?

(And when it the style might come to ATL?:D)

[BlueTravesty]

Good morning my SD friends. How are you all doing this fine morning. GM Sin said that you didn't have to dring cool aid today, you may drink orange juice instead. He said that orange juice will make you be able to do the wonderous feats that he has accomplished. So drink up kiddies. So has is your all's training coming along? Learn any new deadly and rare techniques? Have you learned the Golden Shower form yet or is it the Golden Centipede, I forget. Any how, hope your day will be as joyous as mine. Take care SD friends.

Is anyone else mildly disturbed that this fellow has trouble with "drink" and "sense/since" but spells Golden Shower correctly with grace and aplomb? Anyone?

[shadowlin]

Hey guys, I watched this vid again:

http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=6004254

Are you guys sure this "ground dragon" isn't Dog Boxing. I mentioned once that the Chinese refer to Dog Boxing as "Earth Dragon" Boxing, and from what I've seen of Dog Boxing, this fits the bill. The sweeps, the suicide kicks, etc....

Does anyone know the pinyin for the form?

(And when it the style might come to ATL?:D)

Joe is a ****ing beast. You can quote me on that.

Fantastic. Also, the music for that form was very interesting, and creative. Not Back in Black or TNT... thank God.

[Shaolin Wookie]

Joe is a ****ing beast. You can quote me on that.

Fantastic. Also, the music for that form was very interesting, and creative. Not Back in Black or TNT... thank God.

What's wrong with a little AC/DC? At least he wasn't playing the Wong Fei Hung theme song....LOL....

[arinathos.valin]

Let's give mkriii his due. We might reach 600 pages a lot faster with him posting...

I was about to write something along the lines of what sean_stonehart wrote, but he already stated it so eloquently. Nicely put.

[kwaichang]

Take a look at this.

[sean_stonehart]

Take a look at this.

I dunno about the temples, but it looks exactly like the sign at Zhao Chang jun's school in Xi'an that greeted us in 2001. Later that night it was also at the T'ang Dynasty theatre show & dumpling restaurant. It wasn't at Liang's Shaolin school in Dengfeng 2 days before.

[BM2]

Yeah they went on (the guides) about how good the dumplings were at the show and I thought that they were saying that because they had never had my mom's chicken and dumplings.
Oh, but the dumplings were that good. And that rice wine:D Man those were really good dumplings, I think that there were 21 different types? Anyway, I liked about nineteen of them!

[sean_stonehart]

Yeah they went on (the guides) about how good the dumplings were at the show and I thought that they were saying that because they had never had my mom's chicken and dumplings.
Oh, but the dumplings were that good. And that rice wine:D Man those were really good dumplings, I think that there were 21 different types? Anyway, I liked about nineteen of them!

The dumplings were ok... I guess they were that good because of the stuff we had in Henan, I dunno.

The rice wine?? OMG... I was so hung over for the flight to Tibet, but that junk was great!!!!!!

[TrollTerminator]

Is that the best you can come up with......."I'm an idiot"? Come on, be more creative than that. If anyone is an idiot it is you for taking up for SD. You know what Barnum & Bailey said.....There's a sucker born every minute. You just keep drinking your cool aid and thinking you are the SH** and one day when you'll need to call apon that knowledge you learned in SD and you'll probably get your arse whoooped because it no good and unpracticle. You only need look at the cover of GM Sin's book and you'll see that its a joke. He's standing in a crane stance wearing tennis shoes.....New Balance tennis shoes at that, not even a good brand of shoes. And he's got his arm spread in what appears to be an ATTEMPT to look like crane wings. His wordrobe kind of takes away from the look that I think that he was trying for. It look like a joke. I almost busted out laughing.

You are an idiot......racist........pervert, and a Troll.......I'm the Troll Terminator and you will be terminated.......I know where you can be found MARK.........DON'T FEAR THE NIGHT.......FEAR WHAT HUNTS AT NIGHT:)
TT

[BM2]

The dumplings were ok... I guess they were that good because of the stuff we had in Henan, I dunno.

The rice wine?? OMG... I was so hung over for the flight to Tibet, but that junk was great!!!!!!


Oh man, I recall that stuff in Henan:eek: I really recall waking up at 4:00 a.m. with my stomach hurting so much as I ran to the toilet just in time. I had stopped taking the pepto bismal because I was starting to pass precious jade everytime I left a dump. It seems I stopped taking it one day too soon though.

[sean_stonehart]

Oh man, I recall that stuff in Henan:eek: I really recall waking up at 4:00 a.m. with my stomach hurting so much as I ran to the toilet just in time. I had stopped taking the pepto bismal because I was starting to pass precious jade everytime I left a dump. It seems I stopped taking it one day too soon though.

I ate Pepto from the time we arrived at the airport in Guangzhou til we got back to LAX & I had a margarita & burrito in the terminal.

I just didn't eat in Henan if I could help it. If I couldn't I tried to eat whatever looked fried. That went double in Wenxian. I had beer there... lots of that, but nothing to eat until we got back to Zhengzhou that night.

Jade I got in Xian at the night market & in Beijing. I wish I'd gotten some of the black mayflower jade in Luoyang, but oh well. Sometimes you miss on things.

[The Willow Sword]

Havent been here in a bit. wont comment about Mrkiii posts. As i am reading it looks as if some of you went on another China trip. okay so here is the question. Did ANYONE who was there, who likes high quality green tea, happen to buy some in a decent quantity and bring it back? i have always been into the green tea and pretty much spend my money on high quality loose leaf oolong, green oolong, and white along with the Puh Erh(red tea) as well. But was wondering if any of you had the opportunity to try the local tea faire?

Peace to all,,,TWS

[tattooedmonk]

Havent been here in a bit. wont comment about Mrkiii posts. As i am reading it looks as if some of you went on another China trip. okay so here is the question. Did ANYONE who was there, who likes high quality green tea, happen to buy some in a decent quantity and bring it back? i have always been into the green tea and pretty much spend my money on high quality loose leaf oolong, green oolong, and white along with the Puh Erh(red tea) as well. But was wondering if any of you had the opportunity to try the local tea faire?

Peace to all,,,TWSNot that you were asking me but, I found this great place in San Francisco called www.redblossomtea.com. Great stuff.

[tattooedmonk]

Tantui /Lohan ,does anyone have any history on this form of SD training other than it was originally 108 forms and comes from Shantung???

[bodhi warrior]

I seen on sin's DVD that these forms came from jie shou fu, a teacher at central shaolin along with ie chang ming.

[tattooedmonk]

I seen on sin's DVD that these forms came from jie shou fu, a teacher at central shaolin along with ie chang ming.Which DVD??

[bodhi warrior]

Go to shaolinlegends.com they have 3 vids of gm sin giving talks about the history of different styles in sd.

[sean_stonehart]

Havent been here in a bit. wont comment about Mrkiii posts. As i am reading it looks as if some of you went on another China trip. okay so here is the question. Did ANYONE who was there, who likes high quality green tea, happen to buy some in a decent quantity and bring it back? i have always been into the green tea and pretty much spend my money on high quality loose leaf oolong, green oolong, and white along with the Puh Erh(red tea) as well. But was wondering if any of you had the opportunity to try the local tea faire?

Peace to all,,,TWS



I hate tea... it was worse there than what you get in restaurants. I generally drank beer or Coke. Except at Shaolin Temple where I had the best Orange Soda of my life and in Tibet I was downing about a gallon of bottled H2O a day to help deal with the altitude.

[Yao Sing]

I dunno about the temples, but it looks exactly like the sign at Zhao Chang jun's school in Xi'an that greeted us in 2001. Later that night it was also at the T'ang Dynasty theatre show & dumpling restaurant. It wasn't at Liang's Shaolin school in Dengfeng 2 days before.

When were you there in 2001? I was at Liang's in September. We flew back in on the 10th and wouldn't have made it home if we didn't get out of Tokyo before the typhoon hit. So Degfeng would have bee around the 5th (my birthday) or so, I don't remember exactly. We spent 4 days in Zhengzhou.

Oh yeah, shhh. Don't even think about bringing up that story. :eek:

[sean_stonehart]

When were you there in 2001? I was at Liang's in September. We flew back in on the 10th and wouldn't have made it home if we didn't get out of Tokyo before the typhoon hit. So Degfeng would have bee around the 5th (my birthday) or so, I don't remember exactly. We spent 4 days in Zhengzhou.

Oh yeah, shhh. Don't even think about bringing up that story. :eek:

Story... what story??? Oh you mean... :eek::eek::p

I was there late May, early June '01.

Liang had just moved into the big school on the side of the hill on the road to Shaolin from Dengfeng.

[BM2]

I really liked the tea, there were so many different flavors in it and every place had a different one. Only once though, it did suck. It tasted like dirt.
Hey, how about the jars with the lizards and stuff in each one. I thought you would die if you drank from it. I had the chicken foot soup in Tibet. Did you make it to the Hard Yak Cafe ?

[bakxierboxer]

.... I had the chicken foot soup in Tibet.

I had the Chicken Foot Soup nearer to home (at the time).... on Mott Street in NYC Chinatown. Good stuff! Lubes the joints rather nicely!


Did you make it to the Hard Yak Cafe ?

Didn't have one of those though....... not even a soft one.
(although I guess we could try for a couple of yuks....)

[sean_stonehart]

I really liked the tea, there were so many different flavors in it and every place had a different one. Only once though, it did suck. It tasted like dirt.
Hey, how about the jars with the lizards and stuff in each one. I thought you would die if you drank from it. I had the chicken foot soup in Tibet. Did you make it to the Hard Yak Cafe ?

Ah the Hard Yak. Yeah... ate there for lunch the day of the wedding. It was a God send at that point. Burger, fries, coke... I've got a pic of me somewhere with some folks chomping down there. Surprisingly, the Ted's Montana Grill Buffalo Burger is similar to the Yak... minus the yak stink.

I probably had the soup & don't remember it. The first couple of days are still a blur from lack of o2. It wasn't until after we got back from Yamdrok that things clear up save for pictures.

[Yao Sing]

Story... what story??? Oh you mean... :eek::eek::p

I was there late May, early June '01.

Liang had just moved into the big school on the side of the hill on the road to Shaolin from Dengfeng.

I was there in 1998 and the dorms were still under construction but it was somewhat operational. They were still doing the show a few doors down from the Temple though. That was before they moved the village and i really thought the next time I went back there would be a Shaolin McDonalds there.

[Citong Shifu]

Hey guys, I watched this vid again:

http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=6004254

Are you guys sure this "ground dragon" isn't Dog Boxing. I mentioned once that the Chinese refer to Dog Boxing as "Earth Dragon" Boxing, and from what I've seen of Dog Boxing, this fits the bill. The sweeps, the suicide kicks, etc....

Does anyone know the pinyin for the form?

(And when it the style might come to ATL?:D)


Thats definitely "NOT" dog boxing ( Di Shu Quan). Not sure if its dragon boxing, but then again, I dont train SD.

Take Care
CS

[Shaolin Wookie]

Tantui /Lohan ,does anyone have any history on this form of SD training other than it was originally 108 forms and comes from Shantung???


Yeah, I think that other dude mentioned the Shaolin Legends DVD's. Essentially, there was some kind of challenge match between (I think) GGM Ie and some other martial arts master at one of their schools, and afterwards they exchanged what they thought the best techniques in their systems were. He mentions that GGM Ie used a lot of hte Ground Dragon techniques in the match. After the encounter, which ended in a stalemate, GGM Ie decided to model the short forms on those collected techniques to mark the occasion, and the focus of them became SD's controversial short-form-"snap", which basically means--hit the ****ing hell out of whatever you're throwing a punch at.:D

But really, if you've ever seen the Tan Tui, you'll recognize every one of the movements in the form.

However, from what I've read/seen, Tan Tui is taught in smaller sections of small movements, and isn't really a "complete" form, even though it can be strung together--which would be more like what we teach.

But I might be wrong, so if someone better informed can offer the info, better to listen to him or her.

[Shaolin Wookie]

Thats definitely "NOT" dog boxing ( Di Shu Quan). Not sure if its dragon boxing, but then again, I dont train SD.

Take Care
CS

Cool. It was the ground techniques that had me thinkin'.....because dog boxing, when on the ground, takes a lot of those same postures--the leg up kicks (like a dog taking a wizz), etc., and the excessive amounts of sweeps. But then, I think I've only seen wushu versions of Di Shu Quan.

[Judge Pen]

Thats definitely "NOT" dog boxing ( Di Shu Quan). Not sure if its dragon boxing, but then again, I dont train SD.

Take Care
CS

Well it's not southern dragon. :p Seriously, have you seen any style that called itself "ground dragon" outside of SD. Curious to see if there is something to compare it to.

[sean_stonehart]

Well it's not southern dragon. :p

You are correct barrister!!



Seriously, have you seen any style that called itself "ground dragon" outside of SD. Curious to see if there is something to compare it to.

Nope... only dragon stuff I've seen is the Ken(m)po offshoot super secrect family stuff, or some bagua (Swimming Dragon).

[mkriii]

Good morning SD people. How are you all doing this fine morning? You won't hear any negative comments from me today or ever again (just like I said in my last post). It's a new me. Well, just wanted to say good morning to all.

[sean_stonehart]

Good morning SD people. How are you all doing this fine morning? You won't hear any negative comments from me today or ever again (just like I said in my last post). It's a new me. Well, just wanted to say good morning to all.

Actually in your last post you said nothing of the like & was rather ****ty to a good friend of mine.

Please... refresh your self... http://forum.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showpost.php?p=848020&postcount=8565

[mkriii]

Well I thought that I said I was going to turn over a new leaf. My last post must have not been posted for some reason because I said that everyone knew my views and it didn't do any good to keep making negative remarks about SD so I was going to stop (which I plan to do UNLESS you all would like me to keep going with the negative comments). I'm just trying to make a posative contribution to the conversation from here on.

[Judge Pen]

Good morning SD people. How are you all doing this fine morning? You won't hear any negative comments from me today or ever again (just like I said in my last post). It's a new me. Well, just wanted to say good morning to all.

What's the over/under on how long until the old mkriii rears his head?

[Golden Tiger]

What's the over/under on how long until the old mkriii rears his head?

Over: 1 day
Under: next post

[Eternal Student]

Well I thought that I said I was going to turn over a new leaf. My last post must have not been posted for some reason because I said that everyone knew my views and it didn't do any good to keep making negative remarks about SD so I was going to stop (which I plan to do UNLESS you all would like me to keep going with the negative comments). I'm just trying to make a posative contribution to the conversation from here on.

We have heard this song and dance before...
http://forum.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showpost.php?p=803031&postcount=7262
What is it with you? You come on, talk **** for a day or so, and then lay low for a couple of days. Then, when you realize that no one is going to agree with your drivel, you say you’re sorry and that you won't do it again.
You have to realize by now you have ZERO credibility on this forum. If you want to make a positive contribution, then don't post anything.

[mkriii]

LMFAO..........Normally I would come back with a smart arse remark but not the new me. :D

[Eternal Student]

LMFAO..........Normally I would come back with a smart arse remark but not the new me. :D

Until a couple of days later, when you revert back to the old you.:rolleyes:

[mkriii]

Come on, stop it. Your just trying to bait me and it's not going to work. I think we should just have a big group hug:p Maybe sing the Barnie song. :D Or maybe even sing Kumbiall (sp?). :)

[Judge Pen]

Come on, stop it. Your just trying to bait me and it's not going to work. I think we should just have a big group hug:p Maybe sing the Barnie song. :D Or maybe even sing Kumbiall (sp?). :)

I'd pick on your spelling for Kumbaya, but I don't know how to spell it either.

[mkriii]

Lol........I wonder how you do spell that?

[sean_stonehart]

JP has it correct.

[Judge Pen]

JP has it correct.

I do? Ok, then mrkiii is an idiot for misspelling kumbaya! :D

[Baqualin]

I do? Ok, then mrkiii is an idiot for misspelling kumbaya! :D

You just couldn't resist!!:D
BQ

[TrollTerminator]

Come on, stop it. Your just trying to bait me and it's not going to work. I think we should just have a big group hug:p Maybe sing the Barnie song. :D Or maybe even sing Kumbiall (sp?). :)

I told you........... he is a pervert:eek:
TT

[kwaichang]

Hey BQ I will be in town next week end saturday for my lesson want to have a lunch or late lunch ?? Pm me and let me know KC

[Baqualin]

Hey BQ I will be in town next week end saturday for my lesson want to have a lunch or late lunch ?? Pm me and let me know KC

This Sat. or next Sat.??

[kwaichang]

The 29th BQ KC Lesson 1-3 pm

[shadowlin]

Yeah, I think that other dude mentioned the Shaolin Legends DVD's. Essentially, there was some kind of challenge match between (I think) GGM Ie and some other martial arts master at one of their schools, and afterwards they exchanged what they thought the best techniques in their systems were. He mentions that GGM Ie used a lot of hte Ground Dragon techniques in the match. After the encounter, which ended in a stalemate, GGM Ie decided to model the short forms on those collected techniques to mark the occasion, and the focus of them became SD's controversial short-form-"snap", which basically means--hit the ****ing hell out of whatever you're throwing a punch at.:D

But really, if you've ever seen the Tan Tui, you'll recognize every one of the movements in the form.

However, from what I've read/seen, Tan Tui is taught in smaller sections of small movements, and isn't really a "complete" form, even though it can be strung together--which would be more like what we teach.

But I might be wrong, so if someone better informed can offer the info, better to listen to him or her.

That was not GM Ie, that was a story he told to GM Sin. It was another master who gave the short forms.

Interestingly enough Master Nance has said that upon asking GM sin the hardest technique he ever had to master, GM Sin said "kata #1"

[Shaolin Wookie]

Yes, but what I found particularly comical about that story (I like the story, though) is that it was so blatantly in contradiction to the story about GGM Ie being the ex-Shaolin monk "rover". It set up a kind of lineage with established schools, not a Shaolin renegade pimping "authentic, straight-from-the-temple Shaolin."

[Shaolin Wookie]

KC in 5, 4, 3, 2, 1.......:D

[kwaichang]

Who Me ? OK Ill take the bait Shaolin Wookie tell us the story you heard so we /I can derive if what you heard is what I heard. You know guys I have missed about 4-6 weeks of good hard training and I have had time to do some intellectual training and soul searching. Here is my opinion.

Much like Japanese styles are influenced by geographic and social areas so was Shaolin as it came out of the Temples. This would account for the physical/flavors of SD compared to other arts from Shaolin Much like Hung Gar and CLF many teachers teach them with different emphasis based upon their indeginous (sp).? developing. Ie : Indonesia Okinawa Japan Nort / South China etc.,etc. The Okinawan martial arts are different than those developed in Japan due to the philosophical differences of the area. As far as stories go , they are just stories, not to be taken as fact 100% but as a way to transfer the "legend" of Shaolin. Of which there are many, not just from SD. BTW remember GMT is telling stories he was told by training partners GM Ie and SKTJ to GM Ie. so I am sure there will be imbellishment and changes . So tell us what you heard. I for one miss training and am trying to make the best of a situation dont worry though SW I will still cross hands with you being the compromised practioner I am at this time HAHA. :) KC

[shen ku]

just dropped in haven't been on for,,,,,,,,,,,,,,maybe years,,,i JP and sean are doing good,, do you know who this is sean? hint china 2001

[sean_stonehart]

just dropped in haven't been on for,,,,,,,,,,,,,,maybe years,,,i JP and sean are doing good,, do you know who this is sean? hint china 2001

The ONLY man I know to take what... 5 lbs of peanut butter, oatmeal & the like half way around the world to a country where he knows before he left he didn't like the cooking maybe?? :eek::eek:

Also... could be the same guy that had his pants come undone (but not drop to display the tighty whities) at a demo in Xi'an??? :eek::eek:

[Judge Pen]

just dropped in haven't been on for,,,,,,,,,,,,,,maybe years,,,i JP and sean are doing good,, do you know who this is sean? hint china 2001

Still punching and kicking. How's things in Kentucky? It's weird to see Tennessee still in the tournament and Ky is out of it.

[shen ku]

that would be me, still dont like the food, and JP ok UK is out but i was really suprised they even made it? but hay WKU is still there? ya i am still kicking , have you had the golden leopard?

[Judge Pen]

that would be me, still dont like the food, and JP ok UK is out but i was really suprised they even made it? but hay WKU is still there? ya i am still kicking , have you had the golden leopard?

Yeah, I've had them, but I haven't kept them worked up. Testing during that time will focus your priorities to other things!

[kwaichang]

Go there and key in Wu Shu Masters China KC enjoy

[sean_stonehart]

Ok... lots of modern stuff... is there something we're supposed to see? :confused:

[kwaichang]

Can you flip around and go into a split ???? well just enjoy the athleticism.
Question who is the greater athlete Ron Jeremy or Lance armstrong??? KC

[sean_stonehart]

Flip into a split?? Are you serious?!?!?!?! If I did that I'd feel & everybody in a 5 mile radius would hear, my lower body breaking.

Ron Jeremy... definately...

[Shaolin Wookie]

Who Me ? OK Ill take the bait Shaolin Wookie tell us the story you heard so we /I can derive if what you heard is what I heard. You know guys I have missed about 4-6 weeks of good hard training and I have had time to do some intellectual training and soul searching. Here is my opinion.

Much like Japanese styles are influenced by geographic and social areas so was Shaolin as it came out of the Temples. This would account for the physical/flavors of SD compared to other arts from Shaolin Much like Hung Gar and CLF many teachers teach them with different emphasis based upon their indeginous (sp).? developing. Ie : Indonesia Okinawa Japan Nort / South China etc.,etc. The Okinawan martial arts are different than those developed in Japan due to the philosophical differences of the area. As far as stories go , they are just stories, not to be taken as fact 100% but as a way to transfer the "legend" of Shaolin. Of which there are many, not just from SD. BTW remember GMT is telling stories he was told by training partners GM Ie and SKTJ to GM Ie. so I am sure there will be imbellishment and changes . So tell us what you heard. I for one miss training and am trying to make the best of a situation dont worry though SW I will still cross hands with you being the compromised practioner I am at this time HAHA. :) KC

LOL.....

I'd have to re-watch the DVD, and maybe I will so we can discuss.

As for me, my opinion's pretty clear. Stories are stories are stories. GM Sin didn't pull SD out of his ass, no matter what these KFM pundits say.:D

It came from GGM Ie, that much seems clear--as both Sin and his brother (who don't seem to see eye-to-eye in all matters) have pretty much the same cirriculum. Occam's Razor pretty much supports the obvious.

As for where that came from....anybody's guess. Looks like a mishmash of styles that were labelled Shao-lin, despite their probable origin. IF we doubt GM Sin learned what he learned in his time as a student, we'd have to doubt his capacity to make up as many forms as the system claims he has, while still retaining his capacity to perform forms with the lyrics and explain applications (which he still does at his age, better than some of the chinese teachers I've seen younger than him)...LOL.....

I like the system. The meditiations, the I Chin Ching, the forms, the style. For me, it's just kung fu, ya know? Shaolin? Ehhhh.....at least Shaolin-esque.

[kwaichang]

OK KOOOOOOOL I can agree with that KC

[bodhi warrior]

I've been doing some searches on the internet about this style and have found that there are many different versions. Does anyone know the history of SD's version? and is there any styles similar to ours? also when were these originally taught out?
thanks

[Baqualin]

The 29th BQ KC Lesson 1-3 pm

I teach from 10 to 12.....I can cut it a little early and do a quick lunch before your lesson. Let me know.
You can also get here early and help out in class.... your input would be welcome:cool:
BQ

[Shaolin Wookie]

I've been doing some searches on the internet about this style and have found that there are many different versions. Does anyone know the history of SD's version? and is there any styles similar to ours? also when were these originally taught out?
thanks

From what I've seen, they look the same. Of course, none of our forms have a 1:1 translation into another art in terms of the layout of the form--which I actually consider SD's strength, whereas others consider it a detraction (conformists!:p). But you see the same strikes, the same body postures, the same techniques.

[bodhi warrior]

I've have seen similarities in the individual techniques, and I do agree that our forms being performed differently is a strength. They seem stripped of all the flowery excess and more geared to simplicity and practicality.

[Ground Dragon]

I just stopped by and couldn't believe this thread is still going. Hope all is well with everyone.

[kwaichang]

Yeah it is still going on but the original subject hasnt been discussed in quite a while. I guess all of the sources have been exhausted and no one made a definitive statement of truth so after 500 or 600 pages nothing is proven or disproven KC

[Baqualin]

Yeah it is still going on but the original subject hasnt been discussed in quite a while. I guess all of the sources have been exhausted and no one made a definitive statement of truth so after 500 or 600 pages nothing is proven or disproven KC

Hey man...where were you Sat.?
BQ

[kwaichang]

I called ,did Master B get my message?? I hope so. The weather would not permit the drive I was going like 30 mph for an hour or so would not make it on time so I calleded canceled but "Ill be Back" KC

[Baqualin]

I called ,did Master B get my message?? I hope so. The weather would not permit the drive I was going like 30 mph for an hour or so would not make it on time so I calleded canceled but "Ill be Back" KC

I'm sure he did......both of us were really busy....I had a full class + a couple of new b's........give me a heads up when your coming back in.
BQ

[Judge Pen]

OK got a question.......Sin The' is the Grandmaster of SD. His brother is Grandmaster of Central Shaolin. How did his brother get to be a grandmaster? Does anyone know who promoted him to 10th degree or was this a self promotion? And whats the difference between SD and Central Shaolin? Come to think of it what the heck is Central Shaolin? Sounds bogus to me.

You'll have to ask Hiang The or some of his students. I have no idea. Weren't you around when Sin and Hiang were still teaching? What rank was Sin The'? What rank was Hiang The'?

[Eternal Student]

OK got a question.......Sin The' is the Grandmaster of SD. His brother is Grandmaster of Central Shaolin. How did his brother get to be a grandmaster? Does anyone know who promoted him to 10th degree or was this a self promotion? And whats the difference between SD and Central Shaolin? Come to think of it what the heck is Central Shaolin? Sounds bogus to me.

Here is a novel idea. Since you are so interested, why don't you e-mail THEM and find out for yourself. Better to get information directly from the people who know, don't you think? Here is their e-mail address if you have difficulties. mail@centralshaolin.com

[tattooedmonk]

OK got a question.......Sin The' is the Grandmaster of SD. His brother is Grandmaster of Central Shaolin. How did his brother get to be a grandmaster? Does anyone know who promoted him to 10th degree or was this a self promotion? And whats the difference between SD and Central Shaolin? Come to think of it what the heck is Central Shaolin? Sounds bogus to me.Why not read his website?? As far the differences, why not do your own comparison?? You should go into both the schools and tell them who you are, how you feel about the Masters and the material. I do not know if you will find anything different in either school. Getting your @$$ kicked is pretty universal!!:DCentral Shaolin refers to the location of the Original Shaolin Temple.

[tattooedmonk]

When I was taking classes at the Sports Center Haing The' was a 7th degree black belt and Sin The' was a 9th degree black belt. He might have already been a 10th degree but I don't think so. I find it strange that Haing The' is now GM.
It's his own system , he is a master and he has taught people up to master. Grandmaster= Master of Masters

[mkriii]

Here is a novel idea. Since you are so interested, why don't you e-mail THEM and find out for yourself. Better to get information directly from the people who know, don't you think? Here is their e-mail address if you have difficulties. mail@centralshaolin.com


Why such an attitude, I was just curious about Haing The' being a GM. No need to get an attitude. Thought someone here might know the answer. Excuse me.

[tattooedmonk]

You'll have to ask Hiang The or some of his students. I have no idea. Weren't you around when Sin and Hiang were still teaching? What rank was Sin The'? What rank was Hiang The'?From what I heard Hiang is still teaching daily classes.

[brucereiter]

OK got a question.......Sin The' is the Grandmaster of SD. His brother is Grandmaster of Central Shaolin. How did his brother get to be a grandmaster?
Does anyone know who promoted him to 10th degree or was this a self promotion?
i do not know the facts for sure but i think his senior students made hiang grandmaster after the "split"



And whats the difference between SD and Central Shaolin?
look for yourself.
http://www.shaolingrandmaster.com
http://www.centralshaolin.com/cshaolin_pages/intro.html



Come to think of it what the heck is Central Shaolin? Sounds bogus to me.

that is one thing that is not bogus.

translation
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o83/brucereiter/diploma.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o83/brucereiter/diploma.jpg

original
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o83/brucereiter/1sintherankcert-05.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o83/brucereiter/1sintherankcert-05.jpg

[brucereiter]

Those are some pretty nice looking diplomas but I can't read Chinese. Can you? For all I know it says that Americans are full of S***. I don't know what it says. I'll take your word for it though.

i figured so i also put a link to the translation ...

[brucereiter]

Well isn't that sweet of you to be so considerate. :)

does that answer your question?

[Eternal Student]

No not really because I can easily make a diploma on the computer that looks just as authentic that says that I'm a 15th degree black belt in whatever style and then sign any masters name on it. Thats the beauty of computer technology.

Then no amount of photo proof submitted to this forum is trustworthy, by your logic. What exactly are you looking for, then?

[brucereiter]

I'm not really looking for any proof of his belt level. I'm just saying that besides paper (diploma) proof is there anyone that can vouch that so and so (Great Grandmaste I) promoted him to that rank? Was anyone present during this rank promotion? To my understanding the answer is no. If I'm wrong then please correct me. As I understand GM Sin left for China an 8th degree and came back a 10th degree. When I studied at the Sports center he was a 8th degree and that was in 1984 or so. I would question anyone that claimed to be a 10th degree GM, it's not just Sin The'. This is just good common sense when looking for a kwoon/dojo to train at. If the owner/teacher is not willing to give out this kind of information then that should raise red flags about this school and person. As for my teacher I can honestly say that I have met his teacher and other people that trained with my teacher that can say yes he earned his 8th degree black sash (because they were there and trained/studied with him).

good luck to ya.

[Golden Tiger]

When I was taking classes at the Sports Center Haing The' was a 7th degree black belt and Sin The' was a 9th degree black belt. He might have already been a 10th degree but I don't think so.


When I studied at the Sports center he was a 8th degree and that was in 1984 or so.

Dude...:rolleyes: