Variations in forms...

[JiuKaiMan]

I know that "Traditional" wing chun under william cheung has an advanced Siu Lum Tao that includes some stepping movements in it.
Do any other Wing Chun systems have variations on forms or "Advanced" versions of traditional forms?

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[EmptyCup]

My teacher added a extra fourth part to Chum Kiu, a leg dummy set, a combat stances set, and a smooth no transition wooden dummy set.

So the total, including the original dummy, weapons and forms is 10 sets...

[Sihing73]

Hello,

Change is an outgrowth of the person performing the set. As they increase in understanding they may chose to make some changes to how they perform a form or a technique. Sometimes the changes are quite subtle.

I know that Leung Ting has made changes to his forms. I learned several different versions of the Chum Kui which were performed directly by him and transmitted by him personally. Some of the explanations given were that he found a better method after visting mainland China.

My current Sifu, Chung Kwok Chow, has also made changes in the manner in which he performs certain things. Many of the changes are due to exploring other Wing Chun lineages and taking what he likes and feels works and incorporating or as he likes to say, intergrating, this things into his method. I recently inquired about his Dummy form and he related that it is about 90% as he was first taught but that he has also incorporated things from Ip Chun and Wong Sheung Long into his approach. He feels that the changes have made the form more functional and better flowing. He has also changed the direction of the Fook Sau and Wu Sau in the SNT by reversing them. There are also some subtle changes in the Bui Tze and Chum Kui from what I was used to.

Change is not always a bad thing. It becomes bad when you ignore the basic concepts and go outside of the systems principles. However, as time progresses the needs of the Wing Chun stylist change to meet those times and his art must evolve as well. Even something as simple as a change in environment can have sweeping effects. Consider the difference in striking targets based on living in a hot climate where people wher less clothing and a cold climate where people were heavier clothing. Your attacks may be slightly different based on your location. Still the same art and the same concept in application but your actual approach may have subtle changes.

Peace,

Dave

[Martial Joe]

Out of curiousity why are there advanced parts in form...why add stuff?


There is really no point your just adding more things that arent needed...you can be a hell of a fighter just knowing sil lum toa and chum kui with no added movements.

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[old jong]

I think that if changes should be made,they should be to make wing chun simpler and easier to learn.Any changes made to complicate or add new things are really there for commercial reasons or for entertaining students who feel bored by the truth!

[Martial Joe]

Beautiful...

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[kungfu cowboy]

Good point, old jong.

"I ain't got time for no jibber-jabber!"-----Mr. T

[wongfeilung809]

i think that the changes are good, for some, but from what i get from ting, is that maybe he stripped down sil lim tao, very basic,easy to spread to the masses and later on maybe he'll show you some "secrets"..its like making a omlettte, first you got the basics, eggs; then when you get good at that, you could add milk,and some cheese,ham, stuff that gives it your unique "flavor".
simpleangles

[Shadowboxer]

My Sifu teaches another form altogether. It's called Sao Bo. I know SNT but not CK. Sao Bo mainly works kwun sao(sp?), tan and di-bong together, that rolls into seung kuen. It has 8 different sections with 5 repetitions. Anybody else learn this or know where it "came from"?

[whippinghand]

Is being a "fighter" good enough for you?

[Roy]

Yes we have beginner, intermediate, and advanced forms of all the forms.

[chi-kwai]

>>> My Sifu teaches another form altogether. It's called Sao Bo. I know SNT but not CK. Sao Bo mainly works kwun sao(sp?), tan and di-bong together, that rolls into seung kuen. It has 8 different sections with 5 repetitions. Anybody else learn this or know where it "came from"? <<<

Tsau Bo (Sao Bo) was created to get people to learn to move back into the opponent's centerline because students kept moving to the outside because it was safer.

It is not a form per se, but really can't be classified otherwise. It can be done on the dummy, against the bag or standing free. I forget who came up with tsau bo, but if i am not mistaken, it was one of Yip Man's students, and won't likely be seen outside our lineage. We can ask sifu when we are in class again :)

--
chi kwai

[Ish]

what lineage is that if you don't mind me asking

[Abstract]

that sounds like an interesting concept....I wouldn't mind picking that one up...i'm just starting Chum Kiu....hmmmmmm

[Shadowboxer]

Ish,
My Sifu trained under LT,then Koo Sang(sp?),and Alan Lamb-that I know of.