using weighted training IN wing chun

[foolinthedeck]

hiya
i was wondering what you all thought the benefits and problems would be in using weighted wrist or ankle weights in class, obviously the problem with wrist weights will be that they get in way wehn drilling or in chi sau, but not so with ankle wieghts. overall i would have thought that since the movements performed are functional and using good structure then it would be fine to wear them, to even use wrist weights when doing punches or one man drills etc. but how would they affect things really? i could imagine that if you punched with them on for a few weeks and then took them off and did the same, that you may overextend the arm and damage it...
my experience of ankle wieghts is that i had some when i was 16 and wore them everyday for school all day for about 2 years, my legs became very muscular - sinewy, not bigger but tough. this imporved my endureance in horse stance etc, but i dont know what the long term effect was.

any thoughts?
(ps, given your ideas, how do western weighted training methods like these differ or similar to iron ring training?)

[Kevin Bell]

I feel Chi Sau in itself is a type of resisitive training depending on the type of Lut Sau your opponent utilises.For training with weights itself i tend to look to the eastern bloc countries particularly the conjugate method of strength training.I tend to steer clear of loads of isolation type work except the biceps.Which (though trained hard in the conjugate method anyway) i use to protect against hyperextension of the elbow when punching.

My thoughts only

[YongChun]

I remember in Hung style, there was one student who was exceptional with the Trident which looks like a three pronged pitch fork and had a fair bit of weight. They said it used to be for killing Tigers. Anyway he used to practice with this long thick iron bar that they used to keep the doors shut like those horizontal beams that kept the doors shut in castles. So he really whipped the Trident around after he trained with that iron bar. So I thought that was a great training idea. If I trained that way then I would also be able to whip a pole around like it was a toothpick. So I grabbed the iron rod and started to swing it around like in a pole form. But the momentum of the thing kept it going and nearly broke my back in half. I stopped it just in time to prevent major damage.

[hunt1]

Get 2 empty long neck beer bottles. fill them with sand and cap them. Perform Huen Sau and all your other favorite motions. This will get you what you seek.

[Kevin Bell]

Or practice the Pole and knives for a couple of hours

[YongChun]

Originally posted by hunt1
Get 2 empty long neck beer bottles. fill them with sand and cap them. Perform Huen Sau and all your other favorite motions. This will get you what you seek.

If you drink the beer first, it will help you to relax.

[anerlich]

Slow kicking with ankle weights is great for developing the kick. A staple solo exercise at my academy.

Fast kicking with ankle weights will damage the tendons. Full power kicks in the air are discouraged by most teachers anyway with or without weights. If you want to kick full power, use a bag or other target so your joints do not hyperextend.

Running with such weights is generally not recommended by experts as it tends to mess with your gait and increases injury risk.

My instructor does a lot of form work with (not too heavy) wrist weights. It doesn't seem to have any negative impact on his skill or speed.

[sihing]

My Sifu made some weighted shoes back in the late 70's, I think they were around 10lbs+ or so each and do the Hung Gar floor excersises as well as kicking drills up and down the floor while leading the class, but be fore warned. I use to just walk around with them all day and then when you take them off you have the lightness feeling. I like those Iron/steel ring things also that the Sil Lum styles use, that may be applicable to WC also.

James

[couch]

To echo what Sihing and Anerlich has said and to add my flavor...

Don't do any fast movements with the ankle and wrist weights. Imagine how much damage you are doing when you throw a fast kick and the momentum of the end weight keeps on going. Slow kicking to isolate muscles is good. Plus walking with them is really good.

One of my seniors from another club that I miss dearly would wear the ankle weights during class, but he would run the class with more slow motions in mind, like counted kicks (1. Bring leg up to crane stance 2. Side kick and pivot 3. Return to crane stance)

Lots of excercises can be created to use the weights effectively to build strength.

[AmanuJRY]

I have used wrist/ankle weights in form training, I found that even just a little training in isolated form exercises wearing the ankle weights significantly improved my chi gurk abilities. However, I didn't see as noticable increase in chi sau abilities from wearing wrist weights. I would agree that chi sau itself offers the correct resistance for that. Also, I would agree that agressive training with the weights is detrimental to joints, tendons and such.