pet peeve - turning the head away during chi sao

[Simon]

There's been heaps of video posted lately (greatly appreciated :) ) but one thing has really annoyed me from many blindfolded chi sao videos is people turning their heads away during chi sao.

-Is it meant to show an observer that they are not cheating? Is it therefore a habit copied from an instructor showing off?

-Wing chun is meant to be about structure - how badly is the body structure affected when you are looking over your shoulder rather than at your opponent?

-When you do want to use your eyes (what "real" fighter would arrogantly diminish the use of one critical sense?) is this practice going to develop bad habits for application of the chi sao i.e. sparring and fighting?

any thoughts? (just a personal annoyance!! :) )

[Vajramusti]

An annoyance? Rightly so. Turning the head away results in bad habits. Blindfolding is just for showing off.

[anerlich]

This does happen a lot.

I think it comes from wanting to concentrate on the tactile rather than the visual, which is the point of the exercise, rather than a desire to show off.

Also, staring directly at your partner engages the central rather than peripheral vision, which tends to introduce an emotional response. Peripheral vision is better for reactive situations. I've seen a complex explanation for this somewhere, the source of which I have forgotten. Basically though, I think you can avoid any such problems by looking at the chest or throat area rather than into the guy's eyes.

I've rolled BJJ with guys who seem to want to stare off into space when they are trying to pass my guard - leaning forward too much is a bad idea - so like many other things, this is not a phenomenon unique to WC.

[Zhuge Liang]

Hi All,


Originally posted by anerlich
Also, staring directly at your partner engages the central rather than peripheral vision, which tends to introduce an emotional response. Peripheral vision is better for reactive situations. I've seen a complex explanation for this somewhere, the source of which I have forgotten. Basically though, I think you can avoid any such problems by looking at the chest or throat area rather than into the guy's eyes.


I've found it helpful to look "through" the person. Since I'm not focused on any particular point on the person, my peripheral vision is automatically engaged. And since I'm not staring off into space, my intent and structure is not compromised.

Just my 2 cents,

Regards,
Alan

[Vio]

I move my head during chi sau, im told not to.
But i cant just look and get hit.

[Airdrawndagger]

I dont know why those people do that, but if I do that during chi-sao then im just trying to focus on the feeling and not using my eyes.


An annoyance? Rightly so. Turning the head away results in bad habits. Blindfolding is just for showing off.

This is done to allow the person to focus on the feeling of chi-sao without seeing, while still doing proper techniques... showing off, not in my school.

[SAAMAG]

exactly...I think the guys that do blindfold themselves...as Joy said, are typically doing it to show off or get students or whatever. Turning the head when doing chi sao I believe just helps some people to focus on their sense of touch rather then sight.

I will look at the center alot, but not really "look", periphial vision is indeed better then staring directly. Sometimes I will look to the side, it's never been a problem for me, it hasn't detracted from my "structure" that I have seen or been told.

It's just one of those things....

[Wingman]

Originally posted by Simon
There's been heaps of video posted lately (greatly appreciated :) ) but one thing has really annoyed me from many blindfolded chi sao videos is people turning their heads away during chi sao.

-Is it meant to show an observer that they are not cheating?
No. If they are already blindfolded (their eyes are covered), then there is no need to look away from their opponent to show that they are not looking.

[Simon]

Originally posted by Wingman
No. If they are already blindfolded (their eyes are covered), then there is no need to look away from their opponent to show that they are not looking.

I could have been more explicit - at my old school we used to call it blindfolded even if you just closed your eyes. :)


[Blindfolding is just for showing off.

I believe that a small portion of blindfolded (or eyes closed :D ) chi sao helped out heaps when it came to forgetting about the predetermined rolling actions. Of course you need heaps of eye training too.

What pi$$es me off is arrogance of any sort in martial arts, especially what looks like unfounded arrogance (to me)

[couch]

I don't know about anyone else, but after wearing the blindfold for a little bit and coming back into it with the eyes...I'm a lot faster and more directed to the centre as well. It's amazing what feeling does - more than looking. That's why we are told to not look at our training partner during Chi Sao practise, but to always look at the opponent on the street.

Sincerely,
Couch

[Wingman]

Originally posted by Vajramusti
Blindfolding is just for showing off.
I beg to disagree. Blindfolded chi sao is a good way to improve your sensitivity if done properly. When blindfolded you will be trained to rely on your sense of touch (sensitivity). Relying on your sense of touch (sensitivity) will become a habit even without the blindfold when doing chi sao.

In blindfolded chi sao, both partners should trust each other. They should not do it very fast & go all out and try to hit each other. Remember that chi sao (blindfolded or otherwise) is not fighting. Their chi sao must also be "sticky". If it is not "sticky", then it is difficult to use their sensitivity.

I remember in the film, "Warriors Two", where Samo Hung and a partner were doing blindfolded chi sao. They were constantly disengaging so they cannot use their sensitivity during chi sao. Later on, they resorted to cheating by peeking. That is a bad example of blindfolded chi sao.

[dej2]

Agree'd blind fold and turning your head away are both the same thing. In Chi Sau our eyes decive us, they are distracted by the motions gestures of the contact. After learning the basics... I believe the turning head is allmost necessary in this exercise. People are really trying to develop their sense of touch. The blind fold thing is mostly used in demonstrations (It looks more impressive than turning ones head away.)