View Full Version : Does wing chun lack fluidity?

09-03-2000, 10:49 PM
i believe that fluidity is essential to an effective art. by fluidity i mean the smooth and continuous transition from one technique, stance, ect., to another. now i find this prevalent in wing chun's hand techniques with its emphasis on chi sao and sensitivity. however, i dont see it as evidently in its footwork, stances or leg techniques. its stancework is especially rigid to me. although it is relatively useful for forward and backward movement, i think it lacks a bit of preparation for circular and some side movement. the weight being 100% on the back leg leaves you vulnerable to being pushed over or simply unbalanced. also, in the stance there is no freedom and by that i mean you simply remain in the stance. i am used to continuous motion rarely remaining still. intraining students 'flow' with eachother similar to chi sao only utilizing the entire body. this is done very slowly and in my opinion greatly aids the development of instinctual technique. i recently began studying wing chun and would be interested in hearing any opinions about this. perhaps i simply dont understand.

09-03-2000, 11:13 PM
i've been thinking the same thing recently, and again i put it down to my lack of knowledge - i assumed all would become clear later on...


09-03-2000, 11:54 PM
I had the same problem when I started W.C.,and was never able to be comfortable with the rigid stances and linear attacks.I think it might be easier for someone who hasn't done martial arts to adapt. Not all styles suit all people.

09-04-2000, 12:30 AM
I too had the same problem with Wing Chuns footwork and stances. I do karate now but still use some of the basic hand work from Wing Chun. I'm not very good at it but when one of my karate brothers is outclassing me it's fun to throw the unexpected into the mix.

Raatra, don't do what I did and drop it too quickly, make sure you give Wing Chun (or any art you take up) a good chance. Ask your sifu or a senior student about your concerns.
Sometimes it takes a while for someone to acclimate to an art. Sometimes it takes someone a while to find the art that fits them and Wing Chun may not be for you. Just make sure you're not missing or misinterpreting something or just being impatient.
Good Luck

[This message has been edited by rogue (edited 09-04-2000).]

09-04-2000, 12:43 AM
In the beginning it was like that for me. Now it is easier. Stick with it and make sure you have a good instructor. I had to go through 3.

09-04-2000, 03:14 AM
i will give it time. it would be wrong to assume things so early. i was actually hoping people would disagree with me. but it is nice to hear that i am not alone in my thinking this way.

anyone have anything to say that is contrary to my thoughts? i like wing chun for some unknown reason, or at least i think i do. can anyone give me some thoughts about wing chun in regards to it being fluid?

09-04-2000, 03:46 AM
The single-weighted stance isn't as bad as it sounds. I don't know specifically about wing chun, but the training methods of many styles develop better mobility and stability with this counter-intuitive weight distribution, it just takes a bit of learning.

That said, wing chun tends to be more static with leg work. It usually takes about a year of training under a teacher to truly understand if/what you can learn from them, but on the other hand, if you really don't like what you're doing, you shouldn't be doing it.

There is a chinese proverb that says a good student takes 3 years to find a good teacher and a good teacher takes 3 years to find a good student.

It's hard to properly mix faith and attentive, patient study habits with a critical and questioning eye. But doing anything right is hard. Keep at it. Find what's right for you, then stick with it.

09-04-2000, 09:51 AM
hi raatra
i don't know where to start, so if this is all over the place please fogive me.
both my sifu & especially my sigung were very well know for their fighting abilities in hong kong so our style places great emphasis on footwork.(which can be the key to winning or losing a fight)
we first learn single then double dan chi followed by rolling.at this piont where we differ from a lot of other wing chun schools, at least to my knowledge ,is that after a student is shown rolling they will at least spend 8 months to 1 year (depending on the amount of time they train)on first stepping back at 45 degrees from the chi sao position(until they are quite fluid) & then stepping foward at 45, only then will they start to learn chi sao.
what i try to enphasis is that without good footwork they will more than likely have to use their hands to get them in & out of fighting range which leaves the hands unable to do their job correctly, which is to smack the hell out of the opponent.
look at it this way, a good boxer's footwork can get him in & out of trouble so it is the same with us & all other fighting styles, infact a friend of mine who boxed for at least 15 years said to me that the thing he was above all else impressed with was the footwork which we employed.(he'd never had anyone tie him up or crowd him so easily as when we used to play around)
i can't comment on the 100/0 stance or the adduction of the knees as we don't have this & as yet i have had no-one be able to explain it to me on the forum(i know there are many different ways people do vt & that it is very difficult to descibe them in this forum so pleas forgive my ignorance)but i will say that i personally feel that this could be a limiting factor as to why your footwork may lack mobility.(again don't jump down my throat as this is only my opinion)
all we really ephasis is that waist is constantly locked in a foward position(and faces the opponent) & that the knees are always slightly bent.
again there is a lot more i could say about stepping but i feel in this medium it would not come out as well as if we were able to talk in person so i would therfore rather not say anything or have anyone start practicing bad habits that are a ***** to fix.
the key to good vt footwork,no matter what branch of the tree you come from is simple-
PRACTICE, PRACTICE & then just when you think it's going ok PRACTICE even more.
one more thing,as i have mentioned in a previous post, when fighting the stance is not kept rigid, in fact a good vt man will probably look more like a boxer(except without the bouncing around).the idea that you stand in the one place has a lot to do with the fact that many vt teachers in the early days in hong kong didn't use the ideas of what their fellow students learnt through engaging in challenge matches(this is no way meant to be disrespectful)so even though they may know the entire system their knowledge of how to apply it to real fighting can sometimes be lacking.
sorry again if i may have offended anyone but that is just my opinion, on footwork, as to you will have yours(which i will look foward to hearing)
thanx again

09-04-2000, 11:18 PM
Buddha hand Wing Chun , also known at Fut Sao Wing Chun, Utilizes pa Kua footwork, which many believe to be the best footwork of any martial art. Sifu James Cama teaches it in New york, and he has a student who teaches it in Delaware.