Ving Tsung, Wing Tsung, and Wing Chun

[totallyfrozen]

Can anyone tell me if Ving Tsung, Wing Tsung, and Wing Chun are the same style or not?
I have seen some things which ellude to the fact that they are the same style but nothing CLEARLY says if they are the same style...or simply related styles (or maybe not related at all). Some historical reference to Yip Man has been made but the only CLEAR link that I have read was between Yip Man and Wing Chun. I am not sure if he was the Grand Master of these other two (if they are different).
Is there any difference?

[Sihing73]

Hello Totallyfrozen,

Wing Chun/Ving Tsun/Wing Tsun are all basically the same art. The problem comes with the Chinese not translating directly into English. There are more than one way to translate into English with slightly different spellings.

Having said that I would like to add that the differences between each of the arts/spellings is more superficial than not. All of these three stem from Yip Man. All contain the same number of forms and the choreography is similiar if not the same. All contain Chi Sau. Now the differences is more of a marketing thing than anything else. Some will claim their version is softer or has the correct footwork. But, all came from Yip Man and are simply variations on what he taught. A simple example would be that some of his earlier students may emphasize strength while his later students might favour positioning. Please keep in mind that there is more to it than this but this is a very brief response.

As to Yip Man being the "Grandmaster" of Wing Chun; Yip Man was the first to teach openly in Hong Kong and his students helped to make the art famous. The poplularity of his system is due in par to such great fighters as Wong Shueng Leung, Hawkins Cheung, William Cheung and, of course, Bruce Lee. There are other versions of Wing Chun which would have their own heads for each particular system or branch.

A good reference for a nice overview of the system and history would be the book "Complete Wing Chun" by Renen Ritchie and Robert Chu. There is a third author but his name escapes me at the moment.

Each person who does Wing Chun/Ving Tsun/WingTsun will claim the superiority of the way they do things. The bottom line is that if you delve into each "seperate" version you will find the differences are really minor in nature. All come from the same root and are but interpretations of the teacher. Much the way I and my students will do Wing Chun yet do it differently. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Hope this is somewhat helpful. Good luck in your quest.

Peace,

Dave

[totallyfrozen]

Thank you, Dave.
That was a very helpful post and answered my questions.
According to you post, you sound like an instructor. Since I am very new to kung fu (although I'm not unfamiliar with fighting), I have another question.
Does Wing Chun include any (or much) grappling? I understand that as a Southern style, it will generally be more of a "close range" system and more hand dominant than foot dominant (as opposed to the Northern styles). Am I correct in this?
Thanks again for all your help.

[Sihing73]

Totallyfrozen,

Wing Chun is predominently hand based. The kicks to be found in the system are low and direct, nothing fancy. Depending on who you speak to they can be done with or without chambering the knee. Still, most early Wing Chun was done without the chamber and came directly off of the floor. Each has its own methodology and it is mostly personal preference.

As to grappling: Well Wing Chun does contain plenty of throws and Chin Na which can be found in the forms. However, as to groundfighting the answer would be not really. There are concetps which can be carried over to the ground but Wing Chun is a striking art and that is where it performs best. Although, the sensitivity one developes during things like Chi Sau can be very helpful if you find yourself on the ground. Still, best, IMHO, to get back on your feet as quickly as possible.

If you would like to see a very good Wing Chun man who has incorporated a lot of Chin na into his system check out Alan Lamb. He has brought several Chin Na techniques directly into his Chi Sau program.

I no longer teach, although I do have one or two students that keep coming back. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif I feel I have a lot to learn still and am trying to concentrate on my own training at the moment, selfish are'nt I? Still, I try to contact anyone in my area doing Wing Chun and may even organize a get together sooner or later. I am non-political and try to be open minded. However, I am still human and have many faults. Sometimes I allow my emotions to get the better of me. But, I am workign on it. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Peace,

Dave

[totallyfrozen]

Thanks again for all your help. You have answered all of my questions satisfactorily.