EXCUSES & BS

[MESHEW]

Hello I am new to this forum and am very saddened by some of the things I have heard and read, I have just started training in Wing Chun and never heard such BS in my life the childish bickering back and forth about who's Wing Chun is better even amongst the people I train with. I hold a black belt in Brazzilian Jujitsu and we would never go around reapeating that I am learning the greatest system on earth but will not prove it. I have found that in Brazzilian we have open door to anyone that would like to challenge us not to prove we are the best but to grow and change things to make us better fighters we welcome defeat to make our system stronger. I am finding the opposite with wing chun it's almost like they are scared to lose because it will damage wing chuns rep What rep? I had someone tell me well my Grandmaster back in 1950 fought a boat full of sailors with knifes 12 men with knifes give me a break! what about now! The only person that could do that is Steven Segal. Or this one our system is too dangerous to full contact,
this kind of talk will only hurt this system. I have researched the web and can find very little if any Wing Chun fighters. Wing Chun is getting a bad rep because of all this BS. If I just did drills and theroy in jujitsu and never put it to the test I would not been able to use it successfully, I feel that most of these Wing Chun schools are creating paper Dragons false sence of security, I don't mean to come off harsh
or rude but this is sad. :confused:

[t_niehoff]

What's your name and who did you train with to earn your BB in BJJ? The only thing worse than folks that don't practice (i.e., fight) WCK and talk about their "skills" are those folks that make up credentials in good fighting methods like BJJ to try to impress people.

[Ultimatewingchun]

Did Knifefighter die and reincarnate as MESHEW?

[Merryprankster]

More importantly, I have a hard time believing a BB in BJJ would say anything very positive about Steven Segal.

[Losttrak]

Perhaps he is referring to the Steven Seagal of "movie fame" who clotheslines entire gangs of voodoo-crazed hoodlums into submission? You know, in the fictitious sense...


p.s. Since you are new to this forums, you need to accept the fact that the majority of content you read will be the biased bluster and hot air of fanatics who cannot see any further than their limited experience. Yet, thats how we like it... after all, discord keeps the boards thriving. :D

[Hendrik]

Hello I am new to this forum and am very saddened by some of the things I have heard and read, I have just started training in Wing Chun and never heard such BS in my life the childish bickering back and forth about who's Wing Chun is better even amongst the people I train with. I hold a black belt in Brazzilian Jujitsu and we would never go around reapeating that I am learning the greatest system on earth but will not prove it. I have found that in Brazzilian we have open door to anyone that would like to challenge us not to prove we are the best but to grow and change things to make us better fighters we welcome defeat to make our system stronger. I am finding the opposite with wing chun it's almost like they are scared to lose because it will damage wing chuns rep What rep? I had someone tell me well my Grandmaster back in 1950 fought a boat full of sailors with knifes 12 men with knifes give me a break! what about now! The only person that could do that is Steven Segal. Or this one our system is too dangerous to full contact,
this kind of talk will only hurt this system. I have researched the web and can find very little if any Wing Chun fighters. Wing Chun is getting a bad rep because of all this BS.

If I just did drills and theroy in jujitsu and never put it to the test I would not been able to use it successfully, I feel that most of these Wing Chun schools are creating paper Dragons false sence of security, I don't mean to come off harsh
or rude but this is sad. :confused:



you certainly have a wrong glasses today.
Try a different pair and focus in a proper place.
life will be much better and make you forgot that you are sitting in a toilet and what is in the toilet ------ A toilet sell rep.

[Phil Redmond]

What's your name and who did you train with to earn your BB in BJJ? The only thing worse than folks that don't practice (i.e., fight) WCK and talk about their "skills" are those folks that make up credentials in good fighting methods like BJJ to try to impress people.
I personally don't think we should respond to posters that don't honestly fill out their profile and introduce themselves using their real names. Hopefully this person will properly introduce himself. Since he mentioned the BJJ open door policy he should be able to name his instructors in BJJ and Wing Chun.
PR

[Ernie]

Hello I am new to this forum and am very saddened by some of the things I have heard and read, I have just started training in Wing Chun and never heard such BS in my life the childish bickering back and forth about who's Wing Chun is better even amongst the people I train with. I hold a black belt in Brazzilian Jujitsu and we would never go around reapeating that I am learning the greatest system on earth but will not prove it. I have found that in Brazzilian we have open door to anyone that would like to challenge us not to prove we are the best but to grow and change things to make us better fighters we welcome defeat to make our system stronger. I am finding the opposite with wing chun it's almost like they are scared to lose because it will damage wing chuns rep What rep? I had someone tell me well my Grandmaster back in 1950 fought a boat full of sailors with knifes 12 men with knifes give me a break! what about now! The only person that could do that is Steven Segal. Or this one our system is too dangerous to full contact,
this kind of talk will only hurt this system. I have researched the web and can find very little if any Wing Chun fighters. Wing Chun is getting a bad rep because of all this BS. If I just did drills and theroy in jujitsu and never put it to the test I would not been able to use it successfully, I feel that most of these Wing Chun schools are creating paper Dragons false sence of security, I don't mean to come off harsh
or rude but this is sad. :confused:

D*mn IT !!!!!!!! your on to us !

quick protect the rice bowl AAHHHHHHHHHHH !!!!!!

[MESHEW]

What's your name and who did you train with to earn your BB in BJJ? The only thing worse than folks that don't practice (i.e., fight) WCK and talk about their "skills" are those folks that make up credentials in good fighting methods like BJJ to try to impress people.

Well I guess you guys took it all the wrong way and now are playing switch master putting the focus on me, If I offended anyone I am sorry just stating facts Like Victor say the truth does hurt, Well my name is Anthony i have trained with the Royler Gracie- David adiv Jui-jitsu team somerset Hills YMCA In basking ridge NJ
for 7 years also trained under Carlos Catania, Rillion Gracie, Frank Ferris at the Bushido Dojo in Nevada. and in lansing Mi The pump house community center east lansing mi Under Jeff Kolman and Tom tomlinson. I do not know why I have struck so many nerves with these statments I have made just was being real and putting it out there looking for solutions to things like I stated. Again I apologize if I offended anyone these things I did not make up these are things I have seen and have been told. :)

[reneritchie]

I do not know why I have struck so many nerves with these statments

Spelling 'Brazilian' wrong was probably a start. What's your last name, Anthony? And was your black belt from Royler? If so, pretty awesome.

Rene Ritchie

[Ultimatewingchun]

Well, Anthony...I have some more facts for you.

One of my top students in Wing Chun (I've been teaching here in NYC for 20 years now)...he moved to Basking Ridge, NJ a few years ago...and only makes it to my classes here in Brooklyn only occasionally now. (There was a time when he was coming to my school 3-4 days a week...every week).

And guess what?

He's been studying Brazilian jiu jitsu out there (near his home) for a few years now. His name is Brett.

I've got to ask him about you.

[Shadowboxer]

****, MP you crack me up!!

[rogue]

I do not know why I have struck so many nerves with these statments I have made Because it is the Wing Chun forum you silly.

[Phil Redmond]

Well I guess you guys took it all the wrong way and now are playing switch master putting the focus on me, If I offended anyone I am sorry just stating facts Like Victor say the truth does hurt, Well my name is Anthony i have trained with the Royler Gracie- David adiv Jui-jitsu team somerset Hills YMCA In basking ridge NJ
for 7 years also trained under Carlos Catania, Rillion Gracie, Frank Ferris at the Bushido Dojo in Nevada. and in lansing Mi The pump house community center east lansing mi Under Jeff Kolman and Tom tomlinson. I do not know why I have struck so many nerves with these statments I have made just was being real and putting it out there looking for solutions to things like I stated. Again I apologize if I offended anyone these things I did not make up these are things I have seen and have been told. :)
I hope you don't mind if I politely ask who you have recently begun studying Wing Chun with?
PR

[MESHEW]

I hope you don't mind if I politely ask who you have recently begun studying Wing Chun with?
PR

I have been training with Sifu Sheldon out of his basement, there are only five men and one women small group but pretty friendly, located in Tawas I believe He is from the IP Ching school, sometimes I feel they are more intrested in my BJJ and wanting to learn how to not go to the ground, but for the most part very intresting art, except all the garbage I have read on line about the system, but I do not listen to everything I will find out for myself then make my decision whether to pursue the system or not.

[Phil Redmond]

I have been training with Sifu Sheldon out of his basement, there are only five men and one women small group but pretty friendly, located in Tawas I believe He is from the IP Ching school, sometimes I feel they are more intrested in my BJJ and wanting to learn how to not go to the ground, but for the most part very intresting art, except all the garbage I have read on line about the system, but I do not listen to everything I will find out for myself then make my decision whether to pursue the system or not.
Thanks, I've heard that it's very hard to get a BB in BJJ so it your rank in the system should be known by some people in BJJ. Could you divulge your complete name and who you got your BB in BJJ from? I'm not trying to be rude but, it would give you a little more credibilty here.
PR

[Phil Redmond]

Well I guess you guys took it all the wrong way and now are playing switch master putting the focus on me, If I offended anyone I am sorry just stating facts Like Victor say the truth does hurt, Well my name is Anthony i have trained with the Royler Gracie- David adiv Jui-jitsu team somerset Hills YMCA In basking ridge NJ
for 7 years also trained under Carlos Catania, Rillion Gracie, Frank Ferris at the Bushido Dojo in Nevada. and in lansing Mi The pump house community center east lansing mi Under Jeff Kolman and Tom tomlinson. I do not know why I have struck so many nerves with these statments I have made just was being real and putting it out there looking for solutions to things like I stated. Again I apologize if I offended anyone these things I did not make up these are things I have seen and have been told. :)
I'm in S.E. Michigan. We should get together sometime. Please email me at; sifupr@wingchunkwoon.com It would be nice to meet other WC people in MI. I hope to hear from you real soon.
PR

[MESHEW]

I'm in S.E. Michigan. We should get together sometime. Please email me at; sifupr@wingchunkwoon.com It would be nice to meet other WC people in MI. I hope to hear from you real soon.
PR

I see you are located in Detroit Mi. well don't make it there very often but thanks for the invite

[Phil Redmond]

. . . . . I had someone tell me well my Grandmaster back in 1950 fought a boat full of sailors with knifes 12 men with knifes give me a break! what about now! The only person that could do that is Steven Segal. Or this one our system is too dangerous to full contact,
What a coincidence. I was just telling a former student about the incident in question which made the newspapers, and then you post about the same subject. Small world eh? Anyway, check out this link. http://members.tripod.com/~Wing_Chun/
Of course this was 50 years ago so according to you it doesn't count. I'm not sure what Steven Segal can do now or could have done then but he does add WC to his Aikido regimen. Research this for yourself.
PR

[MESHEW]

Oh I see what the problem is looking at your web site I noticed you trained under William Chung hey don't take my statement to heart just being realistic to myself I just find it hard to believe, but thats just my opinion :D

[Nick Forrer]

Dear Mr Meshew

Dale Frank (knifefighter) is aleady our designated BJJ Black Belt troll. If we need another one we'll let you know. Until then pipe down.

that is all.......

[Liddel]

I agree with Meshew on some level.
I've been a VT man for seven years, i train in my Sifus house with only 14 people.
Ive visited other schools in my country but only recently discovered the "fourum" buzz on the net, discovering other VT peoples thoughts experiences etc.
What ive found is alot of bickering and in fighting that meshew talks about, for me he sounded like he spoke his mind and i accept his opinion.
The fact people got on the defensive towards him is extremly funny to me because it only proves in some small way how 'on the money' he was.

These disagreements / bickerings all began yaers ago and have now been exagerated by the explosion of VT worldwide.
My sifu told me about a disagreement he witnessed between Lok Yiu and WSL and the only way they came to a head was to ask the old man.. GM IP.
These things happened often. are we a product of history repeated ?
Our problem today is we have no Head Figure to have the final Say.
This saddens me, but i still feel very privilidged to learn an art that not so long ago was out of non chinesse reach.
Meshew - dont judge the many by your opinion of the few... even though the balance is shifting
RIP GM IP.

[Edmund]

Seems to me starting an argument with everyone on the forum doesn't reduce the bickering. Wonder why? I am saddened. We're all saddened. But that's about as constructive as a hole in the head.

Want to do something constructive for WC then do something other than bicker.



I agree with Meshew on some level.
I've been a VT man for seven years, i train in my Sifus house with only 14 people.
Ive visited other schools in my country but only recently discovered the "fourum" buzz on the net, discovering other VT peoples thoughts experiences etc.
What ive found is alot of bickering and in fighting that meshew talks about, for me he sounded like he spoke his mind and i accept his opinion.
The fact people got on the defensive towards him is extremly funny to me because it only proves in some small way how 'on the money' he was.

These disagreements / bickerings all began yaers ago and have now been exagerated by the explosion of VT worldwide.
My sifu told me about a disagreement he witnessed between Lok Yiu and WSL and the only way they came to a head was to ask the old man.. GM IP.
These things happened often. are we a product of history repeated ?
Our problem today is we have no Head Figure to have the final Say.
This saddens me, but i still feel very privilidged to learn an art that not so long ago was out of non chinesse reach.
Meshew - dont judge the many by your opinion of the few... even though the balance is shifting
RIP GM IP.

[t_niehoff]

Genuine BJJ BB's will have no problem giving their full name, who they earned their BB from (we know exactly who Royler has promoted to BB), etc. These things are very easy to check.

There is a lot of "bickering" in WCK because there is always bickering among theoreticians (nonfighters) -- in theory, folks have all kinds of "ideas" about things and all things are equal and all kinds of positions can be argued: my theory is better than your theory, my art/lineage is superior to your art/lineage, my teacher is a better fighter in theory than your teacher, my application in theory is better than your application, etc. Since 97% of WCK (and TCMAs in general) people are theoretician/nonfighters, bickering is to be expected. But what you can't argue with or bicker with is *results*, i.e., performance. The Dog Brothers have a great motto: "if you see it taught, you see it fought." This is true of any genuine martial art. It's true of boxing, BJJ, MT, etc. If it's not true of what you do, then you're not practicing a martial art. If you "see it fought", then there will be no bickering.

[Mr Punch]

Of course he's right... doesn't mean he has the right to come on here and talk smack like he's a twelve yr-old who's been dropped on his head too many times in the shoot without everybody demanding he say who he is and give his mom's address and the lineage of his entire family and their bank account numebrs for twenty generations... I mean, get real...! :rolleyes:

But yeah, coming on for the sole purpose of starting an argument about people arguing and going on about striking nerves does make him sound like a troll of 16 years old and 6 mths BJJ under his 'belt'... To which I've gotta say, why the hell does anyone here care?! :D

[Airdrawndagger]

Genuine BJJ BB's will have no problem giving their full name, who they earned their BB from (we know exactly who Royler has promoted to BB), etc. These things are very easy to check.

There is a lot of "bickering" in WCK because there is always bickering among theoreticians (nonfighters) -- in theory, folks have all kinds of "ideas" about things and all things are equal and all kinds of positions can be argued: my theory is better than your theory, my art/lineage is superior to your art/lineage, my teacher is a better fighter in theory than your teacher, my application in theory is better than your application, etc. Since 97% of WCK (and TCMAs in general) people are theoretician/nonfighters, bickering is to be expected. But what you can't argue with or bicker with is *results*, i.e., performance. The Dog Brothers have a great motto: "if you see it taught, you see it fought." This is true of any genuine martial art. It's true of boxing, BJJ, MT, etc. If it's not true of what you do, then you're not practicing a martial art. If you "see it fought", then there will be no bickering.

It seems that everyone at some time or another has made a point or two on this forum, like the nice quote by t_niehoff/dog brothers. But since this is a forum then what is written here is going to be 97% theory because these are only words and opinions, not actions.
But the truth of the matter is that everyone wants to be right and no one wants to be wrong. So whatever that person believes to be right is what he will write as fact on this forum (most of the time)which is in fact WRONG to do.
Then you have the people on here that will read what you write and try to pick apart every single word to try to prove you wrong to make themselves look better or more knowledgeable. Its just the way people are and there is not much you can do but except what seems logical to you and discard the rest. No need to get all bent outa shape over this forum.
Just some thoughts...

Airdrawndagger

[MESHEW]

I'm in S.E. Michigan. We should get together sometime. Please email me at; sifupr@wingchunkwoon.com It would be nice to meet other WC people in MI. I hope to hear from you real soon.
PR
You keep wanting to know everything about me who I trained with my sign, my shoe size, hair color, unit size, if I am single, I am straight. Try mens only forum

[Reggie1]

You keep wanting to know everything about me who I trained with my sign, my shoe size, hair color, unit size, if I am single, I am straight. Try mens only forum

Actually, all he asked for was your full name + who you trained with. This is a pretty typical thing to ask when someone claims the all too famous Internet Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu Black Belt.

A BJJ black belt is something that's extremely hard to obtain and something that deserves a great deal of respect. Nobody wants to listen to a fake Internet Warrior who made up a black belt so he can talk big on a message board. That's all.

[MESHEW]

There is no "bull****" in BJJ.

Too many of us have been let down by the segment of the martial arts community that lives in the "ego" fantasy world. Every BJJ instructor I have ever met, or even heard of, will get on the mat with you. Every black belt I have met has been an exceptional martial artist.

No calling themselves "master", "grandmaster", "soke", or whatever. It's usually first name basis.

No fake discipline and respect. Spend ten minutes in a BJJ class and you will see more respect for each other and the instructor than you will see in ten years in some "dojos." Its EARNED respect. No forced bowing and ritual stuff that gives the "appearance" of discipline and respect.

No teaching but never actually "doing." No teachers that never break a sweat in class.

The things that are so common now in martial arts. BJJ doesn't have the phoney, chop-sockey, fakes. Everything they teach, they can do (and do well!). It's also a fairly new art and every belt rank can be verified. Instead of the endless climb for the next 20 belt colors, I have seen BJJ guys NOT want to be promoted. The worst thing you can have in BJJ is called a "belt that doesn't fit." No one wants to be the next higher rank unless they can actually defend that rank.

You cannot fake BJJ, because eventually someone will call you on it. You have to put up or shut up.

Some of us are fed up with the Paper Tigers in martial arts.

BJJ just seems more honest

[Reggie1]

No doubt.

Then you should be able to understand why people want to actually verify that you are what you say you are. Taking somebody's word for it just doesn't quite do it in the Internet age. Far too many people make up stories + hide behind their keyboard.

Just like the 'no BS' rule in BJJ, the people here are just trying to destroy the 'Internet Paper Tiger'.

[Mr Punch]

There is no "bull****" in BJJ.Yeah there is. Maybe a different kind, but I've met some BS in BJJ, JJJ, submission wrestling, shooto, all of it. Don't kid yourself.


Every black belt I have met has been an exceptional martial artist. So that would include you then. Are you an exceptional martial artist?


No fake discipline and respect. Spend ten minutes in a BJJ class and you will see more respect for each other and the instructor than you will see in ten years in some "dojos." Its EARNED respect. No forced bowing and ritual stuff that gives the "appearance" of discipline and respect.JJJ, kyokushin, seidokan, muay thai, all these things have bowing... it's only forced if you're a numbnuts who goes to a numbnuts school. So what's wrong with these things if it's meant?


It's also a fairly new art and every belt rank can be verified. Yep, we know. That's why at least two people have asked you for your full name, including one person who has a friend at your dojo, and one person who also trains in MI, who you have chosen to insult and whose teacher you have chosen to insult in a thread you started to complain about people insulting other people in WC.


...I have seen BJJ guys NOT want to be promoted. The worst thing you can have in BJJ is called a "belt that doesn't fit." I've seen that in aikido, kendo, karate and wing chun... stick around pal.


Some of us are fed up with the Paper Tigers in martial arts. :rolleyes:

[Ultimatewingchun]

We're already on our 3rd page of this thread, MESHEW, and you've been asked repeatedly what your full name is and who gave you your black belt.

AND STILL NO ANSWERS???!!!

I'm coming to the conclusion that you ARE trolling.

Later for this thread.

[MESHEW]

Belt Ranks of Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu
I could tell you that I am one of these belts or frm THT jujitsu or many others I can see now that it would make no difference you would then say he could have just picked a name and on and on we would go I was just stating some facts that hurt some of you. The problem is you are not looking at yourself pointing the finger at others to make your system look better this is what I meant by sad. SOMETIMES YOU HAVE TO LISTEN TO THE MESSAGE NOT THE MESSENGER IF YOU ARE PUTTING UP A DEFENSE YOU ARE NOT HEARING THE MESSAGE THAT KEEPS YOU CLOSED MINDED

The information presented here is correct to the best of our knowledge, but please note that this is not an official list, and belt ranks change frequently. In particular, the list of colored belts is not exhaustive. Also see the alphabetical listing.

This page lists 3750 people, including 1300 black belts, 355 brown belts, 531 purple belts, and 947 blue belts.

Format: Surname, Firstname "Nickname" (Instructor, Date) Note

Black Belt

Adiv, David (Royler)
Adrenalina, Hércules
Agostinho, Andrei (C. De Souza, 2002)
Aieta, Vinicius (Carlos Jr.)
Akins, Henry (Rickson, 2/2004)
Al Jamal, Samy
Alberto, Pedro (Spider)
Albuquerque, Alexandre (Draculíno)
Albuquerque, Francisco "Toco" (Carlson Sr.)
Alejandro, Carlos (Ralph)
Alirezaei, Yousef (A. Mohler, 12/2003)
Almeida, André Luiz Gomes de "Dedeco" (M. Bustamante, 1997)
Almeida, Cristiano (Dedeco)
Almeida, Milton Regis de (F. Mansor)
Alvarez, Sean (Renzo, 1999)
Alves, Antonio Thadeu Esteves (F. Mansor)
Alves, Fredson (S. Ribeiro)
Amaral, João (C. De Souza)
Amorim, Luis (F. Behring)
Anderson, Lowell (F. Santos)
Andrade, Andre Luiz Moreira de (F. Mansor)
Andrade, Igor (J. Moreira, 1/2000)
Andrade, Marcelo "Tetel" (Bolão)
Angelis, Muzio de (Jacaré)
ˆngelo, Breno (C. De Souza, 2002)
Anthony Marco "Chuck" (Bolão)
Anthony, Reed
Anthony, Thomson
Aranha, Marco (Soneca)
Arona, Ricardo (M. Bustamante)
Assunçao, Andre "Andre-zinho" (B. Ferrão, 2003)
Atalla, Roberto "Risada" (Bolão, 1998)
Augusto, Carlos (J. Roque)
Augusto, Luiz (Charles, 1/2000)
Aurélio, Marcos (A. Pederneiras)
Azulay, Nicin (Rolls)
Bagby, Dartanian (W. Braga Costa)
Bandeira, Joao (Bolão)
Baquerizo, Marc "Doc" (J. Moreira, 1997)
Barão, Luis (Jorge)
Barão, Roberto (L. Barão)
Barbieri, Patrick (R. Maia)
Barbosa, Marcelo "Presunto" (Dedeco)
Barbosa, Marco (R. Godói)
Barbosa, Rafael "Formiga" (Dedeco)
Barreto, Alessandro (Bolão)
Barreto, Carlos "Carlão" (Bolão)
Barreto, Marcos (Royler)
Barreto, Renato (Royler)
Barros, Ricardo (Ralph)
Barros, Romolo (Rickson, 1994)
Barroso, Paulo
Bass, Bob (R. Machado)
Bass, Joe (R. Machado)
Bassoli, Luciana
Batalha, Rodrigo (Dedeco)
Batista, Delfino
Batista, Jackson (J. Roque)
Bauer, Ronald (O. Fadda)
Bebeo, Roberto (Carlson Sr.)
Been, Peter de (Carlos Jr., 2/1999)
Behring, Salutar
Belfort, Vitor (Carlson Sr.)
Benaion, Sidney "Tita" (Royler)
Beneville, Ed (J. Moreira, 12/2003)
Bennis, John (J. Moreira, 12/2003)
Benvenutte, Vitório (R. Lage)
Bichara, Carlos (A. Paiva)
Bicudinho, Rodrigo (Soneca)
Bitetti, Amaury (Carlson Sr.)
Bittan, Patrick (F. Behring)
Bittencourt, Edmar (J. Roque)
Bittencourt, Ricardo (Renzo, 11/2004)
Bittencourt, Romulo (Renzo)
Bittencourt, William (M. Grosso)
Bloom, Randy (J. Moreira)
Bobadilha, José Eugenio (O. De Almeida)
Bocek, Mark (J. Roque, 12/2003)
Bodas, Paulo
Bolacha, Marcos Sergio (Draculíno)
Bolão, Sandro (Ryan)
Bond, Kenny (R. Magno, 9/20/2003)
Borgo, Leandro (F. Gurgel)
Bormac, Moises J. "Russo" (M. Saporito)
Botelho, Ricaldo
Botelho, Tadeu (A. Silva)
Brafman, Guilherme (Bolão)
Braga, Franjinha
Braga, Silvio "Araponga" (Soneca)
Branco, Leo Castello (Jacaré)
Brandão, Alexandre (The Zen Machine)
Brandão, Fábio (Bolão)
Brandão, Paulo
Brandão, Pedro (Carlos Jr., 6/2003)
Brandão, Ricardo (Bolão)
Bravo, Eddie "Twister" (J. Machado, 5/2003)
Brennan, Chris (R. Machado)
Brigadeiro, Eduardo (R. De La Riva Goded)
Britto, Alex (Bolão)
Brooking, Roger Patrick (Jacaré)
Brothers, Kathy (C. Machado, 8/11/2004)
Brown, James E. (C. Machado, 8/11/2004)
Bueno, Francisco
Bunn, Haroldo Victoriano "Cabelinho" (A. Paiva, 5/1999)
Burke, Jon (Royce, 9/2004)
Burrill, Tim (C. Machado, 2002)
Bustamante, Murilo (Carlson Sr.)
Cacella, Marcus "Kiko" (R. Medeiros)
, Sean (Royce)
Bond, Ulysses (A. Mohler)
Book, Jeff (Royce)
Borges, Marcos (Hiray)
Borges, Wesley (N. Liboni, 5/26/1999)
Boring, Josh (Sucuri)
Boris, Greg "Psyco" (Maguilla, 5/1999)
Borzell, Bryan (Renzo, 11/10/1998)
Botelho, Clifton (R. Barros)
Botelho, Irv (Royce)
Boyd, Sarah (A. Crane)
Bozin, Kirk (Charles)
Bradford, Steven (Jacaré)
Braga, Felipe (F. Gurgel)
Branco, Bruno
Branco, Pedrinho
Branco, Rodriqão
Brandão, Rodrigo
Brasure, Brent "Animal" (Ralph, 2/4/2003)
Breger, Ben (Charles)
Brissette, Pablo (A. Crane)
Broa, Marcos
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[Reggie1]

What exactly was the point of that? :confused:

I can copy and paste names from BJJ.org, too.

A simple 'no, I'm not going to give you my name' is probably sufficient.

[AndyM]

I hold a black belt in Brazzilian Jujitsu and we would never go around reapeating that I am learning the greatest system on earth
Didn't stop you that time did it?




I am finding the opposite with wing chun it's almost like they are scared to lose because it will damage wing chuns rep
Based on what?
Your vast experience?



I had someone tell me well my Grandmaster back in 1950 fought a boat full of sailors with knifes 12 men with knifes give me a break!Yeah? Well I heard Royce can crack walnuts with his Butt Cheeks, and that makes me cry.



I don't mean to come off harsh
or rude but this is sad. :confused:
Don't mean to be harsh, or rude, but that's a Trolltastic 2 out of 10.
Please try harder.

What's your name again?
You know, I'm sure Da Gracies wouldn't think to highly of their BB's trolling MA forums.

[Knifefighter]

Well, I see nature abhors a vacuum. I leave for a couple of weeks and somebody takes my job.

[chisauking]

Now I know you have a sense of humour, Knivefighter :D

[SAAMAG]

Well, I see nature abhors a vacuum. I leave for a couple of weeks and somebody takes my job.

He didn't take your job...he's just a parrot without the experience. You on the other hand have fought.

I'd rather take criticism from you then this parrot.

[MESHEW]

. Stop the role-playing and associated nonsense in WCK. WCK is a fighting method, an approach to fighting and a means to train that approach. If someone wants philosphy, religion, social interaction, mysticism, the "kung fu life", to be someone's "disciple", to be part of a "family", etc. then by all means do that -- just don't bring it to WCK. None of that will help anyone be a better WCK fighter; it only detracts one from being a better fighter. And it just makes the WCK community look silly

Could not have said that any better Terrence

[SAAMAG]

NO ONE is disputing anything you've said as far as the BS going on within the microcosm of the wing chun community.

The problem lies in you expecting us as a whole to give you the "respect" simply because you've stated something that's been stated a million times over again on this thread by many individuals here.

The problem lies in that you cannot answer a simple question given to you. Instead you tap dance around like you're more of dancer then a fighter.

It's very simple. We don't hide here. A name, and a teacher. Not people you've "trained with", but the direct individual that gave you your rank.

For example:

-BB in TKD from Tang chin Wynn, TX
-Red sash in Southern Shaolin Diamond fists (Jingang quan) under Robert Melius,
TX
-Black Sash in Silent Dragon Shaolin (wu xing quan) under Master Lawrence Day,
FL
-MT under Phet Phongsavane and Sumnuk Gatsuang for a total of 5 years
instruction, and ten years including maintenance, TX
-WC from Chris Clark out of HI for 3 years, WT from Nico Lasalle for 3mts total
total practicing of wing chun abt 5 yrs, miscellaneous training with other
individuals from various lineage and locals, TX

There's some examples from my own background. This is only the major stuff. I've trained in other styles, and trained with other people across the globe...

Now it's your turn. Put up or shut up.

[anerlich]

I have just started training in Wing Chun and never heard such BS in my life the childish bickering back and forth about who's Wing Chun is better even amongst the people I train with.

You haven't spent much time on BJJ forums, then, huh? Plenty of trash talking goes on there, too.

I'm using my real name, and I can point you to a site that shows my own lowly BJJ rank if you wish (1 stripe blue). How about you?

[t_niehoff]

Meshew,

The point of my post is, in a nutshell, that we in WCK need to eliminate the BS that has become so prevalent in our art. The focus on performance does just that. Making up credentials or titles (grandmaster or BB in BJJ) is part of the BS in MAs. This is why you are being called on it. If you are what you say you are, then you should have no problem stepping up and proving it. If you're not, just say so -- no BFD. If we really want to eliminate the BS, we need to begin with ourselves. I don't call myself "master", I don't claim to be anything I'm not, I'm just a WCK practitioner that is trying to develop better skills and increase my abilities (performance), nothing more. The great thing about fighting (and not the pseudo-marital arts) is that it does build character, because the activity itself (fighting) really puts the "real you" out there for everyone, including yourself, to see. You can't fake performance.

Below is a link to a BJJ forum where they are discussing someone (Gene Simco) who is a legit purple but has recently started wearing a BB (to sell himself). If you read it, you might see why some of us that do practice BJJ don't like false claims of BB --

http://www.jiujitsugear.com/forum/index.php?topic=43970.225

"Why I hate Gene Simco:

Right now my right knee is killing me because I refuse to stop training even after severely tearing the LCL. The ring finger on my right hand has been swollen, stiff, and painful for two weeks, but I just tape it up and keep going back to training. My girlfriend is ****ed that I dont spend enough time with her and even when I do spend time with her, my mind is on jiujitsu. Instead of working my ass of at my career, Im following the sport bjj scene to find out who's on top and how they got there. Basically, for the last 8+ years I have been really obsessed with this grappling/jiujitsu thing and I am thankfully not a black belt yet.

A black belt should mean something. It should mean that, without a doubt, you have proven that you have put in your time and blood to improve yourself. The path to it should be extremely hard and at times very discouraging because none of the necessary skills come easily or quickly. While 4 year olds get their black belts in TKD and everyone and their mothers take up karate, I want to know that the art I train is too tough for most people.

So when someone like Gene comes along who takes the path of least resistance, a path lined with dollar bills and promises, it offends me more than you can imagine. He is EVERYTHING that is wrong with traditional martial arts and he is trying to pollute our waters with the very crap that BJJ had freed us from."

[Fresh]

What a wierd thread. Why is anyone even talking to this guy? Its like VTAA forum stuff.

[AndyM]

What a wierd thread. Why is anyone even talking to this guy? Its like VTAA forum stuff.It's a bit like Darwin Theory in some ways.
This troll goes back to the other troll's with a negative result, thereby breeding a superior variety of troll, by which we all benefit, in testing our humanity in the future, enriching our arts, practice and gleefull lives.

Look at it like friendly Bacteria in the gut.
Unpleasant under the Microscope, but makes bowel movement a rapture, rather than a rupture.