Enter a tournament?

[Chief Fox]

So next month there's an open martial arts tournament in my town. I competed in this same tournament two years ago as a beginer. People from my school were the only kung fu people there. Everyone else was from Karate schools. I did well in forms, placed second, but by the time I got used to point sparring the match was already over. So I"m wondering if I should even bother with this.

If I do compete I would enter itermediate forms and intermediate sparring. The cost is $45. I think that I would do ok and, to be honest, I would like to see if I can do better at point sparring even though I feel that it's not realistic at all.

Any thoughts?

[PangQuan]

Go for it. If its open style competition, im guessing its karate? Kung Fu forms always win at karate championships for some reason. :D

Our school just went to a karate championship and all our forms divisions we took first place and then the grand champ as well, except kids, we just took first and second in the grand champ spot.

disqualified from sparring, and many deductions...oh well. We didnt really train for the sparring rules and it was kind of spur of the moment. I guess we kinda hurt a couple people.

[SaekSan]

I'm not a fan of point sparring, but I do beleive that competition can be beneficial (so long as you learn something from it), try to take from it what it offers speed, timing and reaction skills.

It sounds like you already figured out that you need to get used to the rules.

Key to success in competition is understanding the rules and practicing with those rules in mind. If you have a month to prepare (assuming you currently practice sparring in your school) it should be plenty of time to get accustomed to the rules.

Best of luck and have fun!

:)

[Shaolinlueb]

go for it man. its all a learning experience man. cant hurt at all. it will get you used to different style's and such.

[Akhilleus]

disqualified from sparring, and many deductions...oh well. We didnt really train for the sparring rules and it was kind of spur of the moment. I guess we kinda hurt a couple people.

Dude if you guys wanted to try to hit someone hard they have full-contact tournaments...oh wait what's that? You don't want to do something where the other guy can try to hurt you too? Point sparring is great, but it's for kids and people that want to go LIGHT...getting in there and hurting someone doesn't make you tough, it makes you a toolbox...

[SaekSan]

Akhilleus said:

"Dude if you guys wanted to try to hit someone hard they have full-contact tournaments...oh wait what's that? You don't want to do something where the other guy can try to hurt you too? Point sparring is great, but it's for kids and people that want to go LIGHT...getting in there and hurting someone doesn't make you tough, it makes you a toolbox..."

Great point Akhilleus, that is exactly the biggest danger in point sparring, people that think they can hit as hard as they want because it's "fighting". I've seen more injuries in so-called "light contact" tournaments than the full ones. The other thing I hate are the "beginner" and "intermidiates" that have been around for several years... :rolleyes:

[David Jamieson]

they can be fun...or they can be a sausage fest.

mostly, forms and point sparring tourneys are just to expose martial arts to the broader community as an alternative way to exercise and have a social activity that is good for you.

[SevenStar]

Dude if you guys wanted to try to hit someone hard they have full-contact tournaments...oh wait what's that? You don't want to do something where the other guy can try to hurt you too? Point sparring is great, but it's for kids and people that want to go LIGHT...getting in there and hurting someone doesn't make you tough, it makes you a toolbox...


I dunno... sometimes it is just ingrained. When I entered my first point tourney, it was at a time when I was training with a japanese guy who always had me sparring hard contact. Naturally, I did the same in the tourney. I ws able to control it for the most part, but I did get several points taken away for excessive contact.

[Akhilleus]

7*,
I understand things get ingrained and accidents happen anyway...that doesn't make you a cheater or a bad guy, but IMO if you are going to do point sparring/light contact, you should have enough control to stay within the rules...have you ever seen a kid cry because he is having trouble breathing and his ribs are broken as they haul him off on a stretcher after a point sparring match? If you have, you will know where I'm coming from...ever seen somebody knock someone out in light contact then go into a frenzy like Chuck Liddel?

What about in continuous sparring where a guy rushes in with his hands down throwing full contact haymakers to the body while pushing the other guy around the ring, only to be rewarded for his reckless behavior by the judges?

[PangQuan]

We had 3 teenagers sparring. 15, 16, and 18.

They had never been in competition sparring before. Likewise Sifu had only done fighting in asia, mainly Thailand. all full contact actual fights. no pads. we dont train for light sparring or competitions style point matches. I wonder now if we will in the future.

It would help if we trained for point sparring around the rules of course. Personally I dont like competition sparring. I wont train around rules like those. I think its stupid.

They all have much better idea of how to train for the next one. They were all medium level belts sparring against black belts though, I think that intimidated them and made them kind of go over board. One was a 8 month student female sparring male black belts of same age and weight. She did surprisingly good.

Xiao Hong Quan took grand champion in both of the divisions it was in though. :D

edit: oh and Kwan Dao form got all 10's in weapon division for first place, then came in second for grand. Broad sword comp took grand.

[norther practitioner]

Which, the colorado karate thing....

They were notoriously bad at scoring outside of the systems that were prevelent... I hear they have gotten a lot better though, not for nothing, if you ever want to go to a cma tournie.. these do help, I used to go to them every once in a while.

[Akhilleus]

Pangquan,
Sounds like you guys did great...congrats...I just hate the state of light contact sparring in the martial arts world today...as Saeksan pointed out we've had some pretty ugly injuries in the past...

[Akhilleus]

The other thing I hate are the "beginner" and "intermidiates" that have been around for several years...

Yeah and they are the same guys that go around calling themselves champs and what not...

[PangQuan]

Ya, I thought the sparring was pretty lame. I would probably do well competing in point sparring because Im very fast, and sinse you dont have to hit hard, you just have to touch the right spot. Speed, timing, footwork and aim are all that are needed.

I would rather not waste my time on something that is false. Just my own opinion I guess. Its a cool idea and can give you valuable experience, but I would rather just fight with my friends. :rolleyes:

[norther practitioner]

I don't like the point sparring...

never did it at these events.

[Chief Fox]

Hey, thanks for all the replys. I'm not sure if I'm going to do it. It sounds like it would be fun but I'm not sure if it will be $45 worth of fun. I'll check at my school and see if anyone else is going. Thanks again to all who replied.

[PangQuan]

Hey, at least do forms. If you have good kung fu you will at least walk away with some 1st place trophies at an open style tourney.

[Chief Fox]

Hey, at least do forms. If you have good kung fu you will at least walk away with some 1st place trophies at an open style tourney.
The last time this tournament was held here I competed in forms and came in second. I missed coming in first by like 1/100th of a point and I'm convinced I would have won if I had throw in a few extremely loud/top of my lungs KIAAAAAAAHHHHHH!'s

[PangQuan]

yup, sounds like a karate tourney. You probably should have won anyhow, I think you got jacked. Allthough I wasnt there, that is my faith in CMA. :)

[Shaolinlueb]

dude, just go for it man. 45 is worth it for the experience you get. less nervous and stuff. jsut do it. dont worry if you are going to be only one.

[Oso]

shaolinlueb kinda just summed it up.

i'll just offer one more opinion:

any competent fighter should be able to fight in any venue.

the only 'trick' is to learn and train the venue.

I would say that it probably takes 3 months or so of steady training to change your reflexes to fit the venue.

but, if your toolbox is varied enough then it should just be a matter of deciding which tools to bring out for the job.

that, in and of itself, is a good enough lesson that fighting in varied venues could be recommended given that any fight on the street is not going to be under the ideal situation one might spar with in the guan every week.

[WinterPalm]

I think training for point sparring is not the best idea. You should train to really actually fight and use power and speed when necessary, to train to just lightly tap someone may not be the best thing to do. What if you spend three months light tap sparring and then you get into a confrontation and out comes a light tap? You get ko'ed or worse. I'd stick to real sparring and leave the trophies, song forms, kiahs, and tap sparring to the kids.

[Chizica]

Since you'll be one of the few CMA guys there, you'll be suprised how many karateka guys come up to tell you how cool your "kata" looked. You'll probably be one of the most popular players there and get asked tons of questions regarding your style. It's a great way to make new friends.

[Oso]

I'm not saying to train exclusively for point sparring forever.

We all train under the big "What If" of "Am I going to get into a fight today?" I don't think very many of us are dumb enough to get into a fight often enough that a 3 month stint to get ready for a tournament in a venue that doesn't cater to our particular style is that big a concern at all.

It would be a bigger waste of time to enter a tournament and NOT train for that venue and lose because you didn't understand the rules.

This isn't the case for CF but for someone else who hasn't ever competed and the only option for a tournament is a karate style event then that person would most definitely be better off in the long run because they did take the opportunity to compete against complete strangers who are just as committed to winning as they were.

Just one match in competition, even the much maligned ‘point sparring’, will serve you well in the ‘real fight’ you might find yourself in on the street because of the mental steps you need to take to step up against someone.

[PangQuan]

Oso has a point, our kids did not make firts place because they did not train for the point style sparring. I tried to tell them...but oh well. They now know, and also they do have less nervousness now and as well they have an idea of what it feels like to step up to a stranger and say "lets go"

unfortunately when they sparred they did what we do in class. They hit hard...Wrong thing to do in the karate sparring world I guess. Also they were all just kids so they had fun and took home some good experience.

[Akhilleus]

Good post Oso...and guys remember point sparring is a game or sport...its fun...and teaches you some valuable skills...no by itself it probably won't make you into Rambo but neither will playing basketballl...that doesn't mean its a dumb sport...

[Oso]

They now know, and also they do have less nervousness now and as well they have an idea of what it feels like to step up to a stranger and say "lets go"

that's the biggest reason to take a little time out of your normal regime to get familiar with another ruleset.

They hit hard...Wrong thing to do in the karate sparring world I guess.

not necessarily. I know a school here in town that goes to some tourneys that fight point style but with WKF/AAU style rules and I've seen those folks come back with some great black eyes and bruised ribs. I've also sparred with them and been whacked pretty dang hard. Just do some research on the tourney and exactly how they fight. But, I'm sure most karate tourneys are for the Mcdojo type schools that are more about making sure every kid leaves with a trophy for 6th place. :rolleyes:

Also they were all just kids so they had fun and took home some good experience.

and THAT is the way it should be for kids



good luck in your next event.

I just came back from a kung fu tourney where a couple of my adults sparred and won their division and a couple of my kids went to watch. now they are all stoked about competing in the next local event in Nov. luckily I have these two kung fu based tourneys every year and they are just two hours drive.