The O-bomb

[ZIM]

Although I long ago gave up any serious objections to this, it has bugged me that we now use the word "asian" to describe people who we used to call "oriental." Not only because I've never once in my life used or heard the term "oriental" used in a racist way, but because "asian" is even more meaningless than "oriental".

"Asian" could literally describe almost anyone from Asia, which happens to be the largest land-mass in the world. It includes India, Pakistan, Siberia, Russia, Mongolia, China, and more. In other words, true "Asians" include everyone from pale pasty blue-eyed people to dark mahogony-skinned people, and every point in between--including very white people with thick lips and curly hair, to black people with thin lips and sharp noses and straight hair.

Yet here in America, we use the word "Asian" to describe one particular type of person: someone with medium-tan and slightly yellowish skin, straight dark brown or black hair, black or brown eyes, and eyelids that are thicker-than-average and have an extra fold in them, giving them a slighly "slanted" cast.

In other words, "asian" now means "oriental" to most Americans, and the only difference is that if you say "oriental" they think you're a racist. I've used "oriental" in conversations before. When its with whites I get this "Oriental? What are you, racist?" but with Asians, they tend to mostly let it go.

So, when did "oriental" become a bad word and why? Was it just the quest for the coveted hyphen that did it? Its like a Mr. Han joke: "We not orientals! We're Asian-Americans! Get that straight, rednecks! HA!"

[SPJ]

You have the correct.

Asia is a wide continent and subcontinents, from Ura mountain of Russia, Siberia, to Manchuria and Korean *****ula.

From middle Asia, Gobi desert, Mogolia to Beijing.

From middle east, Turkey, Abrabia, Persia, India to Indochina.

From Indonesia to Borneo.

From---

Who are Asian American? The Russian, Chinese, Korean, Mongolian, Arabs, Turks, Persians, Indians, polynesians and of course Japanese and Okinawans etc etc etc.

:eek: :confused: :D

[g0pher]

It depends on the crowd you ask. In Philly, PA, most Americans refer to what you think they call Asian as "Chinese." It doesn't matter whether you mean actual Chinese, Vietnamese, or Japanese. But on the other hand, the Asian crowd, e.g. the Indians, Pakistanis, Chinese, Vietnamese, and Russians refer to each race by the actual country the person is from.

..As a foreigner, Americans have always seemed to be a weird bunch. Parts of this country still fight the Civil War. If they cannot get over their fellow country men's differences, how can we really expect them to differentiate from among our differences?

It doesn't bother me much though. As far as I am concerned, we are all human and have 23 chromosomes.

[oasis]

well, it's not exactly correct to say "whom we used to call oriental," because oriental ('to the east') was simply a term conjured up by the western europeans to refer to all those 'east' of the occident/west, ie europe. thus, you will find old scholarly works on the middle east described as oriental. even the famous oriental institute (http://oi.uchicago.edu/OI/default.html) at the University of Chicago is specifically devoted to ancient Near Eastern (ie middle east compared to FAR EAST) archeaology and history :eek:

eventually oriental began to take on the connotation of those from the 'far east,' until gradually that became replaced with just 'asian,' my guess because of americans' often lack of geography

as a middle eastern, this left me no choice but to simply fill out all those standardized test forms in school by checking 'other' :cool:

[SifuAbel]

Oriental is a word best used for objects. "Asian" is best used for people. People are not objects, and thats the point.

[bonetone]

Does anyone feel that "white" is a racist word? What if you called an Asian person a "yellow", or an Arabic person a "brown". Seems like there is quite a double standard. Should caucasian Americans be called Euro-Americans, like blacks are now called Afro-Americans?

[SPJ]

Sifu A has the correct.

Oriental express is the train route to Turkey and beyond such as India and China. Oriental rugs are Persian rugs.

Oriental spice is Indian spice such as curry. Oriental silk is Chinese silk.

Europe is big, too.

Such as Irish American, German American, Italian, Greek etc etc etc.

----

:confused:

[bonetone]

Europe is big, too.

Such as Irish American, German American, Italian, Greek etc etc etc.

----

:confused:

Africa is huge compared to Europe. Why not Etheopian-American, Somalian-American, Egyptian-American, Sudanese-American, etc.etc.etc.? Why are African countries always lumped into one heading like it was all one country? Thus maybe white Americans should be called Euro-Americans to be given equal treatment.

[unkokusai]

Africa is huge compared to Europe. Why not Etheopian-American, Somalian-American, Egyptian-American, Sudanese-American, etc.etc.etc.?


Because a great many of the people of African origin in the US cannot trace their family heritage back to a specific country on that continent. The slave trade and all that. Plus, a whole lotta the countries in Africa today were not geo-politically divided/identified as they are today when the majority of folks of African origin came to the US.

[David Jamieson]

Having just come home from China, he felt disoriented, but knew that any comment to that effect would be an occident! :D


...sorry, had to do it.

[ZIM]

Having just come home from China, he felt disoriented, but knew that any comment to that effect would be an occident! :D
Heh. Sometimes, in 19th c. lit, you'll see westerners referred to as occidentals, typically by a middle easterner or Indian.

Which is why its so odd, the oriental tag. Its obviously archaic, but I remember it from growing up. I don't understand why others label it racist, though, which is what I'm questioning really. I mean, how ignorant is that? Or, is it offensive?

From what I'm reading, only whites are actually offended. Is it arrogant for them to say what is or isn't offensive for another culture or are we just giving ourselves grief to no purpose as we so often do?

[IronFist]

I heard Jesse Jackson once referred to some people in Africa as "African-Americans." They're not African-Americans; they're Africans. :D

[SPJ]

The truth of the matter is that:

Based on most recent evidence, all modern people came from Africa including Chinese.

;)

[GreenCloudCLF]

This discussion is why I just call everyone "hey you" regardless of race or ethnicity

[joedoe]

To me, the real issue is not the term that is used, rather the intent in which the term is used. I don't care if someone calls me Asian, Oriental, Chinese, Chinese-Australian, or ch1nk. As long as there is no malice or ill will involved it doesn't bother me. If it is used in a derogatory manner then that is a different matter.

[Ray Pina]

Oriental is used to refer to art coming from Asia.

[GreenCloudCLF]

dictionary.com definition:

o·ri·en·tal (ôr-ntl, r-) KEY

ADJECTIVE:

1. often Oriental Of or relating to the countries of the Orient or their peoples or cultures; eastern.
2. Oriental Of or designating the biogeographic region that includes Asia south of the Himalaya Mountains and the islands of the Malay Archipelago.
3. Lustrous and valuable: oriental pearls.
4.
1. Of or relating to a genuine or superior gem: an oriental ruby.
2. Relating to or designating corundum that resembles another stone in color.

NOUN:

often Oriental Often Offensive An Asian.

[MasterKiller]

I heard Jesse Jackson once referred to some people in Africa as "African-Americans." They're not African-Americans; they're Africans. :D

Liberia was founded by ex-American slaves...i.e. African American.

[Judge Pen]

Liberia was founded by ex-American slaves...i.e. African American.

Shouldn't that then be "former African-American American-Africans"?

As for Asians, I try to be specific. . . . Japanese-Americans. Chinese-Americans.

What would the preferred designation be for those of Asian descent?

Me, you can call me Irish-American, white, whittie, cracker, howlie.... it makes no difference.

[brothernumber9]

All the english terms used to describe race are predominantly from American english derivations and a few Brittish. In the U.S., whites have always held the highest of powers, i.e. Presidency, Supreme Court Justice, Cabinet, etc. And for the large part of U.S. history race labels and uses have been formed by left over results of what is and what is not "constitutionally" white. Thus calling someone "white" was hardly ever derogatory.

Now however, since the U.S. overt exploits in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iran, Kuwait and surrounding areas, where once Americans would have been lumped together with "whites". The term "whites" has been replaced by some with "American" or some identifying slur or label.

[ZIM]

Me, you can call me Irish-American.Why would I call a lazy, belligerent, foul-mouthed drunk that? :D

[Judge Pen]

Why would I call a lazy, belligerent, foul-mouthed drunk that? :D

Hey, who are you calling lazy? :mad:

[ZIM]

Hey, who are you calling lazy? :mad:
Eh, no one. Here, have a beer-! :cool: