Hung System.

[Lohanhero]

hello, i must say sorry if there are more hung system topics here but i have logged in a few times and never see one active so im hoping to start one.. or at least get some info on this.

i would love to hear from people of this school of shaolin gong fu and what their forms are, what they consider hung system to be.
i have noticed talk that hung system not as relaxed or free flowing as others (coming from talk on the CLF section)

i like to collect info on different systems of gongfu and this is on my list.

thankyou very much.

[Mortal1]

Do you mean the Hong system?

I trained shaolin 6 years never heard of hung.

[Lohanhero]

ah perhaps i have places or written incorrect i am refuring to hung jia/ hong jia have also seen it spelt huung and hoong, considering chinese characters arnt letters it is the way it is pronounced that is key, but makes it interesting when trying to ask in letters :)

[David Jamieson]

Hung Kuen is wide spread and has many many practitioners worldwide.

There are different lineages that put different emphasis on forms, but the driving principles of Hung are similar across all styles despite the repositry of forms one school may use over anothers.

Some schools call themselves sil lum tiger crane, or sil lum hung pai, Hung Gar, Hung Kuen, Hung Mei , etc etc. All these Pai (schools/clans etc) place emphasis on upper body strength, deep root, solid stances, hard bridges, good internal energy, and other aspects.

There is indeed fluidic form as we see in teh expression of teh tiger/crane double shape fist.

People who only see the basic tiger sets like Gung Gi Fok Fu Kuen or the higher level set Tid sen kuen will naturally think Hung Kuen is about power and not about flow, there is nothing further from the truth.

Hung styles incorporate as much of sil lum(shaolin) fighting principle as possible into the various systems and also there is much to do with conditioning, hard conditioning.

One can practice Hung Kuen without using the so called pillar forms and instead using the principles incorporated in those shapes. So, we see various iteration of the iron wire, the tiger/crane and the tiger. Not to mention teh augmentation exercises.

In some pai of hung kuen, other family styles have been absorbed, such as in the Lam family line which also contains the Lau family sets and the Mok family sets.

In an example such as wong kiew kits Hoong Ka (a dialectic variant on hung ga) we don't see the same sets, but we see the same principles. In Tang Fung lines, again there is difference and again in the Chiu line. Of these, Tang Fung, Lam Cho and Chiu Kau were closely linked with Huang fei hung and yet each families iteration of the style has variance in shape and expression but much similarity in driving principle.

Hung is a pretty strong martial style. Takes a few years to learn the material and is worthwhile for a lifetime of practice from basic to advanced practices.

Then there are the village Hung styles. I learned a style called sil lum black tiger. It is a hung fist style and shares a lot with Hung ga in shape, application, etc etc and you name it, it's there.

the black tiger style I am learning through exchange with another practitioner now has the more white crane/ choy li fut flavour to it. It's an interesting mix.

There is one set from the new black tiger I 've learned that is not like their others and that is gum gong kuen. This is a sil lum set that is defensive and demands hard bridges. I didn't learn about the gum gong set in my old school because apparently it is new to the curriculum since I left with a couple of other sets also being new to that curriculum. But now it is a good addition to teh previous stuff I have had for a decade now.

I have even found similarities between Hung Kuen and wing chun. The wing chun shortens up the stances and doesn't make use of deep stances in training at all and doesn't go into hard conditioning until much later in the style. Usually with just the mook jong. But use of elbows, forearms, spear hands and body positioning is pretty much the same. The fighting techniques are all to familiar though.

You could probably get more core information about the larger families of Hung fist at the normal Hung ga sites such as siulahm.info or hungkuen.org and so on. They have more detail on the lineages and stuff and even videos of their versions of the sets and lots of old pics and stuff. fuhok.com also has tons of imagery, videos and articles about the style.

It's good stuff.

[Lohanhero]

thanks alot thats a great deal of info there, iam though looking for info on the relationship of ten tigers and hung system that are not wong fei hungs father (sorry i forgot his name all of a sudden)

i have seen that the tigers of guandong where taught by shaolin and from there they spread the different systems they focused on, this is why i dont under stand why hung, choy, lai, mok, ect.. arnt considered shaolin, but roots from shaolin.. since the art was taught by shaolin wouldnt this make them shaolin in whole?

[David Jamieson]

I think they are recognized as shaolin. like i said, many call themselves "sil lum -""

But, the styles of Hung, Choy, Li, Mok and Lau have been removed from the temple for quite sometime and are Shaolin based but still 'lay' arts. With a lot of the material being drawn from outside sources, some of which are not Shaolin.

Technically speaking, Shaolin proper is that martial arts which is taught in the current iteration of the temple. Many many styles are connected to Shaolin in more than one of it's eras, and even the modern shaolin recognize material from removed styles as shaolin. I think G~ spoke about this when he retold of a time when he demonstrated a BSL set for some monks at the temple and they recognized it as Shaolin. BSL has been out of the temple for some 300 years according to the timeline.

Shaolin were also the caretakers of some styles and added the shaolin flavour as teh style resided in the temple during times when other martial artists were given refuge within it's gates.

The whole Ming rebellion "out with the qing, restore the ming" lasted for a long time. Don't forget that the qing started around 1644 at teh fall of the Ming and extended right to the last emperor in the early 1900's. That's some 250 years or so of Ming loyalists and secret societies trying to oust the qing. A lot can happen in 250+ years. :)

[Lohanhero]

thanks alot, cookies for you ^^

[brothernumber9]

the ten tigers were a sort of revolving group, meaning that there are more than10 "ten tigers" members throughout history. Also not all styles represented by all of the "tigers" were of shoalin. Wong Yun Lam (sp?) was a Llama sytlist (Tibetan).

[Gold Horse Dragon]

[QUOTE=David Jamieson]Hung Kuen is wide spread and has many many practitioners worldwide.


There is one set from the new black tiger I 've learned that is not like their others and that is gum gong kuen. This is a sil lum set that is defensive and demands hard bridges. I didn't learn about the gum gong set in my old school because apparently it is new to the curriculum since I left with a couple of other sets also being new to that curriculum. But now it is a good addition to teh previous stuff I have had for a decade now.
QUOTE]

Do not know where you got this misinformation? Gum Gong Teet Kuen is Not new to the curriculum...just not listed before. A few forms were only going to be taught to inner circle students after they had progressed to a sufficient level and so the sets were not listed. Since that time, since deciding to put forth the entire curriculum, these sets are now listed...but will still only be taught to those who are at a sufficient level in knowledge, abilities and character.