Su Nim Tao as Qigong

[Mark Durica]

Greetings,

Does anyone have any advice on SNT/SLT as Qigong ? I have been having spine problems (neck pain and arm numbness) and am looking for alternatives ( like TCM, Qigong) to surgery and/or narcotics. What are the benefits of SNT/SLT as far are qi cultivation and development ?

BTW, I'm only a beginner (3rd Level) in Wing Chun and this may have been discussed before, but there are some knowlegable folks out there that may have some good advice to a beginner like myself who is having spine problems.

Thanks in advance,

Mark

[reneritchie]

Qigong is working the breath, and almost anything can be Qigong if you know the proper principles and methodology. However, IMHO, Siu Lien Tao was optimized for fighting-oriented mechanics, and nothing is 100% at everything.

I would recommend you find a Qigong specialist if you have interest, and work movements optimized for Qigong. Some can be very short and still give great benefit because of their specific focus.

[Hendrik]

Mark,


IMHO, compare with the complicated SLT, you need only something simple to work with the equal sholder Stance to naturally" tune up" the body.





Contact this people
http://www.meimen.org/English/e_index.htm

Thier "balance Hand Swinging Kung" in the paraller equal sholder Stance might be what you need to take care of your problem and heal you.

It is a simple Kung, I would not call it exercise because it is more than physical exercise.


introduction here. if you have someone who knows chinese, you can start practicing it.
http://www.meimen.org/health/index.htm
http://www.meimen.org/health/index.htm


SLT has tons of things in it. and since those are advance stuff and without a nature lower abdoment breathing one will not be able to activate it. And, it takes sometimes to get the breathing....etc



Now, Peace, and Harmony.
May God's grace heal you.

[anerlich]

As Rene said, SLT is a form providing a vocabulary of fighting techniques. you could make it into something like Qigong, but then you could probably do the same with Irish Dancing or being the lollipop man at a school pedestrian crossing.

As a person who had significant lower back problems through his twienties and thirties and is now pretty much cured, I feel hatha yoga, especially Astanga, have much more to offer than Wing Chun as regards spinal health. Indeed if anything WC moves the spine too little to be of value.

Hopefully you are seeing health professionals rather than entrusting your future health to a bunch of unqualified pundits on a Kung Fu forum. I got benefit from chiropractors, no benefit whatsoever from three acupuncturists, but what really made a huge difference for me was three months of weekly visits to a physiotherapists. YMMV, but to paraphrase another saying, a man who tries to be his own healer has a fool for a client.

[Mark Durica]

Thier "balance Hand Swinging Kung" in the paraller equal sholder Stance might be what you need to take care of your problem and heal you.

It is a simple Kung, I would not call it exercise because it is more than physical exercise.


Hendrik,
Is what you are referring to above the same as Bai Bi, the simple swinging of the arms, a Yi Jin Jing based excercise? I found this excercise in the book Qigong for Health and Martial Arts by Dr Yang, Jwing-Ming. BTW this range of motion is the exact same range of motion that my physical therapist prescribed, except the physical therapist's excercise employs those elastic resistance bands (theraband). If we are all referring to the same thing, than I may be on the right track. And thank you for the kind words.

Anerlich,
I've already been to a physican (prescribed steriods - no improvement), massage therapist (some improvement), and a physical therapist. Next stop is accupucture. I'll heed your caution try to be a good patient, follow my physical terrorist's (I mean physical therapist) directions and let the professionals sign off on anything I do at home.

Rene,
Thanks putting things in perspective - that SNT/SLT is SNT/SLT and Qigong is Qigong.

Thanks to all for your responses. I guess maybe the answer is that at the least, doing SNT everyday will do no harm, but the "cure" to a chronic spine problems may lie somewhere else.

Peace,

Mark

[anerlich]

Hey Mark,

Yeah, keep doing SLT. If it hurts, stop. Otherwise, your WC will get better if nothing else.

Good luck, if you do find any miracle cures let us know. I saw a LOT of healers over time, many were totally useless, but a few, especially my physio, were wonderful.

The article below is about me, big deal I know but it gives some indication of the spinal problems I faced and eventually overcame.

http://www.wingchunkuen.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=8

[Hendrik]

Hendrik,
Is what you are referring to above the same as Bai Bi, the simple swinging of the arms, a Yi Jin Jing based excercise? I found this excercise in the book Qigong for Health and Martial Arts by Dr Yang, Jwing-Ming. BTW this range of motion is the exact same range of motion that my physical therapist prescribed, except the physical therapist's excercise employs those elastic resistance bands (theraband). If we are all referring to the same thing, than I may be on the right track. And thank you for the kind words.


Peace,

Mark


Mark,

It is an evolution and a better one.
The YJJ one is harder, this one is very relax and smooth and soft.

Credits must be given to the creator GM Lee Fung-San as in the web. who fused the YJJ and TaiJi kung to create this one. And it was proven that it can heal, restore and bring lots of dis-order or illness back into health.

The principle is simply -- Balance, equilbrium nature resonance swing to tune up the body/mind/qi /breathing.






The Keys to this one is that

1, the core key is the word. Balance.

2, one stand in the equal shoulder stance with all parts and join in a relax and slightly bending nature, and then, relaxly bring both arms up to shoulder high, then, let the arms drop naturally. let it swing down and back without forcing anyting. Meaning, one raises the arm to shoulder high, then drop it, let the arms' weight swing by itself.

So, every time, let the arm swing naturaly to shoulder high at front and then naturally swing down and backward without forcing anything but just drop it naturally. let it swing similar to a pendulum.

So, one's job is just to house keeping to make sure the speed is keep naturally and evenly by appliying just enough force needed.

Keep checking oneself for the motion, speed, and body to adjust with the Principle of Balance, smooth, relax, and nature. Balance between up and down, inside and out, and left and right... balance, relax, resonance. it is done in a non broken arrow platform similar to white crane + emei = SLT platform.



Then, after 4 swing with high stance one does a lite springy drop sinking to lower stance . Meaning, doing a lite nature lowering the stance by droping the knees, thigh, angle, similar to the begining of the TaiJi. One does a lite springy drop sinking down and a lite springy up to compensate for the arm swing since one is lowering the stance.

check on
http://www.meimen.org/health/index.htm

there is a picture C with the knee bend and little more. that is the lower stance swing.

So, 4 swing in high stance, and 1 swing in lower stance after every 4 high stand swing. the 5 swing makes a sequence. one repeat this sequence for 5 mins, then 10 mins then 20 mins then 30 mins. or as one likes it.


3, No part of the body should be tense up or taking the pressure from body weight or stop breathing and let the breathing and body swing and work by itself naturaly.




The beauty of this set it that it is simple, very good result. and no breathing training is needed. This is a great one. I even recoment for anyone before or after doing SLT to smooth out the body qi flow and breathing. this can take care for warming up or lose up or smoothing the flow if the SLT training get too rigid or tense up. It will tune the body/breathing/mind to nature state.

it is so simple can great that even the Grandma and Grand pa can do it and recieve benifit to health.

IMHHHO, SLT is advance stuff. until one got a hold or attain some nature state similar /equivalent to doing this swing. IMHHHHO it is better to not practice it. IMHHHO. because jumping stage to do SLT before any conditioning is setting up for failing. IMHHHO

I am prescribe this as the pre-requisite to all who I know and asking my advise who wants to master SLT but have no sifu to guide them for internal training.





Hope this can help you some.
Contact the website. I am sure they will be happy to help you to learn this swing.

In the path of healing, be positive and learn to love your body -- provide it with good food, rest, and good positive thoughts so that it has conditions to heal itself. I learn this from Louise Hay. Miss Hay heal herself from Cancer. If She can do that, then lots of things is possible to get better and better and heal.

May somedays when you find your way of healing help the less fortunate to heal.


Best Regards
Now, Peace and harmony

[Hendrik]

如何練習平甩


　　每回至少甩十分鐘（約五百下），一日甩三回。若能一次持續甩到三十分鐘，效果更好。練完之後，慢條斯理 的喝杯溫開水，更有助於全身氣血循環、穩定氣機。

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動作說明

１．雙腳與肩同寬，平行站立，呼吸自然。雙手舉至胸前，與地面平行，掌心
　　朝下。（圖Ａ）
２．然後讓手像鐘擺似的自然往後甩，甩到哪裡算哪裡，保持放鬆，不要刻意用
　　力往後抬。甩到舒服的位置，利用慣性，把手甩回胸前。雙手輕鬆打直，保
　　持平行，五指微微舒展。（圖 B）
３．甩到第五下，手往後甩的同時雙膝微微下蹲，輕鬆的上下彈動兩次。(圖 C)



練習原則

１．腳踏實地。
２．雙手在前面始終擺平。
３．左右平衡。
４．手不必刻意往後甩，每次讓它自然落下來即可。平甩的特點，從一開始就養
　　成不取巧的態度。
５．每甩到第五下，膝蓋保持彈性，蹲兩下。
６．蹲的時候，視個人放鬆狀況，可高蹲亦可低蹲。
７．速度不要快，始終保持輕鬆，否則甩快了反而會有緊繃之感。
８．每日至少三十分鐘，以十分鐘為一個單位來緩衝初步練習時，可能產生的四
　　肢酸麻的現象。

練功過程中，如有任何問題，請回歸到梅門，隨時與我們連絡。並且務必要下功夫紮實的鍛鍊，切忌自己還沒弄清 楚，就與他人分享，反而將彼此都耽誤了。