Side track

[Forkintheroad]

What's going on all? I usually don't start threads, let alone pointless ones, however I've been re-reading the Book of 5 Rings latley and noticed quite a few similarities in mantis. First the idea of striking first. The book sites on more than one occasion that is is bad to wait for the enemy to iniate an attach. This reminds me of mantis using a feeling strike (back fist, or a hook, or even a straight punch) to set up a counter to the initial counter. What Musashi calls Tut Tut, or thrust up. When the opponent decides to attack, and I decide to attack I counter his counter as I yell thrust up, basically re attacking from underneath, then from above or vice versa. Not to mention the 5 approches are all about being able to quickly and naturally re-attack, when the first attack is stoped. I like this, because you get used to being suprised, or not suprised when your intitial movement doesn't work. The second similarity is in holding the long sword. Musashi says to hold the long sword in one hand with the fore finger and thumb loose, and the middle finger neither tight or loose, with the last two fingers tight (it's bad to have play in your hands. This reminds me alot of mantis' grabbing, where we control the arm, by using the last two fingers, to quickly release, and re-attack. Not to mention he also reminds the reader, at any time make a fist with the left hand, and punch the person in the face, or strike their chest with your left shoulder. The biggest similarity I found though was in the foot work. In 8 step I was told that the forms should be played like "walking through the park". In his book he says the footwork should be like every day walking, allways controled, and never favoring one foot over the other. Moving as if walking makes fighting on uneven ground, or wet ground or any other type of ground alot easier, than trying to beat the opponent with speed alone. In short the after studying 8 step for a little while, then re-reading this book, the principles are alot clearer. Just wondering if anyone else knows of any other books that also relate to their Kung fu, or Wu-shu?

Sorry to get off topic, but I think everybody serious about strategy or general war arts should read this book, you can find free versions online if you look alittle.

Later, thanks for your time.

[Forkintheroad]

Almost forgot the most important thing, Musashi fought in over 60 duels, as well as some battles, wile Grand Master Wei tested his skills by fighting with other masters.

[Three Harmonies]

Spoon in the highway,
Good post bro, one of the better ones here in quite some time!
I believe that principles are principles, so surely you should be able to find many similarities in the classics of yester-year, with our arts today. Fighting is fighting, until we all evolve a third arm out of our chest!
Good stuff.
Jake :D

[-N-]

A Book of Five Rings has always been a favorite of mine... particularly the Water and Fire sections of the book.

Check out also, The Unfettered Mind. This is a collection of letters and advice from Zen master Takuan Soho to famous samurai.

Another good book is The Sword & The Mind, a book of the tactics and methods of the Shinkage school of swordsmanship.

You will recognize many things from these 3 books in your Mantis.

N.

[Ou Ji]

Like Jake said Fighting is Fighting. A lot of the same principles can be learned just from street fighting. Add the techniques from one of the arts and you can definitely kick some arse.

Streetfighting teaches you stuff like Hit First, Hit Hard, Hit Fast, and don't stop until it's over. Oh, and Be Sneaky. Sneaky is good in fighting.

Basically the MA masters of the old days were street fighters and the arts reflect the basics of survival fighting.

[Three Harmonies]

My grandfather gave my father (and me) the same advice about fighting.......avoid it if at all possible, but if you have to fight hit them first, hit them hard right in the nose, and don't stop until they are down!

True,
Jake :D

[mantid1]

I have posted this once and I will post it again. I believe it is the simple truth.

My Master said: "if you want to learn how to fight, you have to fight. Reading books, doing ling/two person sets, self defense and practicing apps are a part of the picture, but unless you get in there get hit and take the hits (not slapping around) to find out how your praying mantis works, you will not become a fighter".

I believe that the books, theories, two person sets will help in a self defense situation against an untrained fighter. If you come up agiainst a trained fighter who practices "fighting" the outcome will not be as good.

There is no better teacher than experience.

In my old age I prefer drinking tea and doing Qigong over fighting.

Hope I didnt get off the track of the thread to much:)

[yu shan]

Here here Mantid1, my sentiments as well.

[Oso]

'fighting is fighting' is true.

is problem, no fighting.

get hurt, not like. i.e. protective gear.

but then people say 'not real mantis'

can't be 'real mantis' w/o hurt

circle it is.

fix it by making mantis still mantis w/ protective gear.

easy fix.

[Forkintheroad]

The best way to become an effective fighter is to fight. Pa Dukes stressed this by example, every report card, interm report, when me or my brothers "acted up" (if one got it, we all got it). Yet ever situation I've ever been faced with I've been able to talk my way out of, the only time some one ever actually raised a hand at me, two of my friends stomped out (and this person was one of their friends), before I could even get out of my chair, and before their strike came anywhere near me (high school Sh). When I was looking to learn swordsmanship, i tried to memorize the water and fire books and only was able to memorize the 5 approaches, and 3 methods to forestall the enemy. Any one ever read the Tao of Pooh, or the Tao Te Ching, or Machiavelli's The Prince, The Discourses, or his version of the Art of War, though Sun Tzu's is good to. I will have to check out the books -N- Requested, as I haven't read or heard of them. Thanks for the input everyone.

Have a good one,
Rich (not spoon)