Was Fong Do Duk the same person called Bak Mei?

[kung fu fighter]

Hi,
I recently bought Kwong Wing Lam's hung gar book, and in it he mentions the following:

"Grandmaster Fong Do-Duk, also known as the white eyebrow priest (Bak-Mei Do Yen), trained hard in the northern temple when he was young and reached the skill level of the other four elders when he was only thirty years old. Unsatisfied with his skills, he settled on wudang Mountain to further explore the arts and later created his own style. He became less involved with secular affairs as he got older. After the southern temple was burned down, he remained on Wudang Mountain for the rest of his life."

From the above, it seems that the Bak mei style was evolved from bak fu pai (white tiger style) which would logically make it a more advance system in theory and training methods.

I was wondering if the bak fu pai (white tiger style) and bak mei pai (white tiger style are similar, and what the similarities and differences are?

Any info about a comparission between these two great systems would be great.

[fiercest tiger]

As i train and teach both BFP and Bak Mei i believe the story above to be the most accurate. I heard there was a Bak Fu Hall at Wudang!? Maybe Fung Do Duk had his BFP system and when he was called BAK MEI by his students and maybe they created a "Bak Mei" system and left the temple and travelled to OMEI SHAN?

Since these 2 arts share similar stuff and i know CLC bak mei as well BFP's bak mei systems i think this could be true!


Thanks for posting

FT

P.S You know Bak Mei people will disagree?:)

[TenTigers]

ye[, most Bak Mei and Lung Ying guys say that Bak Mei didnt exist as a style before CLC gave it that name.

[Shaolin Master]

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. So my 2 cents is below:

All Baimeipai tends to lead to Cheung Lai Chun.

Having studied at Wudang and gone through most records of Wudang history in both official record and those of researchers of the Wudang Research Association in Danjiangkou (next to Wudang), there are no records of any Bai Mei or Bai fu or Feng Dao De in that location nor nearby.

Having studied a little bit of Emei martial arts there are legends associated with a Bai mei BUT recent discoveries have noted that this bears no association to the southern novels/stories of the 5 elders. As a result there is a set of methods associated with a Baimei but have no resemblance on any level to Dongjiang Baimeiquan.

It has clearly been noted that Dongjiang Baimei is a combination of Liyi's Huizhou Lijiaquan and Dongjiang's Sanbutui (From which two styles evolved Longying and Bakmei). Through experience and self discovery Cheung lai Chun developed the formidable Baimeipai, which consolidated an advanced all his previous materials.

Kind Regards
Wu Chanlong

PS: Irrespective of origin Baimeipai is a very effective direct Hakka combat method and although I have never seen the US Bakfu, one would presume their relationship would make it similar. Both very good combat methods.

[fiercest tiger]

Nephy,

Hows things mate, good to here from you again!

Can you breakdown the chinese info you just posted please intersted in what you say as always. That being said i can add that thats why some systems are handed doen within a family and cause it aint public doesnt mean its not real.

CLC Bak Mei is very combat orientated indeed.

regards
Garry:)

[fiercest tiger]

lee's fu jow? and 3 step push something ....lol i need to learn chinese properly!

[Shaolin Master]

Garry,

Things are fine, very busy with work. Congratulations on the upcoming new member of the family and I hope all is well.

Liyi's Huizhou Lijiaquan = Master Li Yi from Huizhou County in Guangdong province's Li Family style (This is to ensure the exact Li style (as there are a few) is mentioned).

Dongjiang's Sanbutui = Dongjiang region's 3 step push, again just to clarify area and method (as 3 step push means totally different method in other locations).

Regarding family systems, yes totally agree there are many family systems and I am sure one day you may have GarryPai, but with the Baimeipai, it my have been more appropriate to be Cheung Ga Kuen (Chueng's family fist) more so than a legendary figure. But as many new styles prefer to call themselves White Dragon or Golden Tiger instead of there own names (larger than life aspect to it) so did people in the past at times.

Oh, Are you still studying chinese (Cantonese right?)? It takes time (and practice).

Till soon,

Nephy (aka Wu Chanlong)

[fiercest tiger]

Thanks im really looking forwards to being a daddy! :) Thanks for the finner breakdowns, i think you are correct in saying what you did, Garry Pie hmmm all the girls like it, but look at it as a sausage roll! ;)

Seriously, ah my cantonese course was short lived i didnt like the way the teacher taught in regards for people to learn she didnt have a clue.

Have you seen 3 step push before? If so what does it look like?

I dont do much external anymore, i just do YKM Serng Toi Jurng and Wun Yuen Yut Hei Jurng. Im very content these days and away from the hard stuff. How about you what you teaching and studying now?

regards
Garry:)

[Yum Cha]

Wrong.

Fong Do Duk was the Green Grass Monk....

don't you guys know anything???

Cheers lads!

:p

[fiercest tiger]

I heard Fung Do Duk was still around in the 70s as the leader of te green grass followers? :)

See your Bak Mei comes from Bak Fu Pai dude, now commit suicide yummy or switch teams? ;) Evil Laugh Muhaha mUHAHAHA MUHAHAHAHAHA

Long time no hear, hows everything with you and yours? Hope all is well mate!!

Garry:)

[Yum Cha]

(to the tune of "Green Green Grass of Home"

...I step down off the astral Plane,
And there to greet me are Fung do Duk and twin Pak Mei...
down the road I look and here comes Doo Wai,
Smoking fingers and herbal secrets at levels so high,
I think someones smokin the Green Green grass at home!

Cheers Mate. Keeping on keeping on. Sounds like you're having fun with Corney. Good on ya.

Say hey Nephy, I'm with you on your observations. The whole thing is rather like saying, "do you think Goofy and Pluto are really the same dog"...totally missing the point that both are just cartoons.

[fiercest tiger]

Nice Poem, you forgot but you forgot the second part

Killers, Killers
Bak Mei Prize Fighters, M.I.B
CLC travelled long but found emptness,
Opium fields grow wild, with the white tigers

Green Grass of Home, you know the name when the
Bak Mei Twin and the Family join
Chasing the Dragons Tail till the night comes
and waking with the new dawn as the Sparrow desends to its perch!

This is on the walls at Omie Mts!

I have the full poem maybe you have also we can swap?


Yeah,

Having heaps of fun with the Internal arts, something i should have gotten serious about years ago. Anyhow each to there own, enjoy life buddy!

Garry

[Yum Cha]

Hey Garry, we need to get your mate from NYC to put down a beat-box track, and unleash the Southern Fist Rap, just as long as we can slip in "Big-titty Biatches" in there somewhere.

Internal is cool. I'm still exploring the internal side of Pak Mei, and ever curious. I'm also reading up on Chinese medicine too.

[fiercest tiger]

hahaha yeah, talk about DOPE lyrics huh?

I hope you find the path in the bak mei internal or you get what its all about. You looking at TCM course or just 5 elements, yin yangs polarity etc?

Travis my student is doing TCM in college, says its not so easy...Ill work my masage and energy healing instead! ;)

Take care mate
Garry

[Yum Cha]

TCM Course material. 5 Elements, cycles, organs - yang and yin, meridians, points, and the like. A primer on accupuncture. Seems I ran up the a$$-end of somebody in traffic, so I'm doing the public transportation shuffle for a couple of weeks. Got to have your reading material....

One comment, IMHO there is only one kind of internal training. But, different people look at it from different angles. Like the 6 blind men describing an elephant...

[fiercest tiger]

Yum Cha,

if you are relating you Bak Mei hand forms to what i consider internal i beg to difffer, but i dont want to get into a debate or arguemnet over this here. You can email me if you wish! :)

Be easy dude
Garry

[Yum Cha]

I'll switch in on one of those other threads when I have the time.

Cheers mate

[fiercest tiger]

I'll be waiting, i feel you lurking anyway! ;)

Gaz

[timmons]

Getting back to the thread KIDS!!!

They cannot be the same person Fung Do Dak and Bak Mei were two differnt people coming from different lineage. The only thing which gets them to be seen as the same was they help the Ching Goverment with the down fall of the Siulum Temple.
They also had one student each which were generals in the Ching armies after they burnt down the Temple.

They are also Two of the Five elders :

Bak Mei
Fung Do Dak
Ng Mui
Gee Shim
Mui Hing

There is no similarities in Bak Mei to Bak Fu Pai. Only some individuals who claim this.:mad:

And if there were any then it should have been document or mentioned.

As Bak Mei and Lung Ying since they have similar sets and techniques.

Fung Do Dak was Wu Dong and Bak mei also studied Wudong theories.

[kung fu fighter]

Hi Timmons,
Do you practice bak fu pai, if so with who?
Can you give us a discription of the white tiger style is it similar to wing chun or any of the the hakka southern styles?

I had a friend that did this style and it looked alot like kempo mixed with bagua Zhang. His teacher was a guy up here in canada by the name of grandmaster Simon

[fiercest tiger]

Timmons,

Who do you study BFP with, and what forms do you have that are BFP?

Regards
FT

Forget it you must be tom rizzo? You on southern fist? if so i have information that GMDW does explain its very similar to bak mei pai. I also talk to him everyday! :)

[timmons]

LMAO!

Why do you guys think I learn BFP.

When did I mention This. No I do not practice SouthernFist.

[kung fu fighter]

Timmons,
What style of martial arts do you practice?

[timmons]

I study Northern Style Chiang Quan. under Shifu Liang Jing of taiwan.