Quick question about sholders

[Becca]

I have been noticing a strange trend lately, and I thing it is in my sholder area.

No mater how much I try, I just can't do pull-ups. I can do about 15 no-kip chin-ups, but no pull ups. A can also do push-ups all day long, but absolutly no dips without assistance. Is this something I should be concerned about? Is there anything you guys would recoment to fix it? Are am I just stuck?:confused:

[Chief Fox]

You can do assisted pullups and dips. Or you can do negatives and work your way up.

ONe way to do assisted pullups is to do jumpiing negatives. Grab the bar and jump up into the up part of the pullup and then as slowly as possible lower yourself back down.

Another way to do assisted pullups is by using jumpstretch bands. Attach one end of your band to the pullup bar. Put a foot in the part that hangs down. The stretchy band will assist you as you do pullups.

If you belong to a gym that has a gravitron machine, use it. You can set the machine to different percentages of your body weight. Before you know it you'll be doing unassisted pullups and dips.

Oh, one more thing. A great way to do assisted dips is by doing bench dips. You have two benches. Your feet go on one your hands go on the other. you will be seated in a "L" position with your hands slightly behind you on the bench. Do your dips.

Hope this helps. Good luck.

[Sifu Darkfist]

you might have found your weak spot. Rejoice you know it early,
many never learn theirs.


Mine is simple, i give my life to to save others period. so in order to get me you must threaten the indivduals i am protecting and then destroy me if you are a good shot, and able to with stand real shots fom me.

[Becca]

you might have found your weak spot. Rejoice you know it early,
many never learn theirs.


Mine is simple, i give my life to to save others period. so in order to get me you must threaten the indivduals i am protecting and then destroy me if you are a good shot, and able to with stand real shots fom me.
:D

And thanx, Chief. My company's health center does have one of those machines.

[FooFighter]

Becca,

Doing pull ups is a skill and I am sure once you understand your weak links and get proper progressively training, you can master the pull ups. Can you please clarify what you mean in "no-kip chin-up" and its difference to the pull ups. What is your definition of "pull ups"? Here are some things to consider. I have questions which might lead to some practice intuitive solutions and maybe it will clear the direction for you to develop your skill. Instead of telling you what I think is right for you, I will try to ask thoughtful and insightful questions so that we can both work together to help you.

How is your posture?

Is your structure sub-opitimal?

How functional is your back?

Can you activate your core?

How is your mobility in neck, spine, and shoulder?

Are there any impediments in your spine and shoulder structure?

Are you unconscious of your posterior chains?

Do you work at a job that requires to be anterior conscious, sitting in front a desk or computer?

How do you breathe when you do your pull ups?

Have you ever injuried your lower back?

Do carry any tension in your neck or upper back?

I hope these questions will help unlock your problem and confusions.

[fa_jing]

wierd. Chin-ups are more arms and pullups are more lats. Make sure you are mentally pulling your elbows to your torso and not trying to pull yourself up with your arms. Doesn't sound like a shoulder problem. Also, dips are significantly harder than pushups.

[Becca]

Becca,

Doing pull ups is a skill and I am sure once you understand your weak links and get proper progressively training, you can master the pull ups. Can you please clarify what you mean in "no-kip chin-up" and its difference to the pull ups. What is your definition of "pull ups"? Here are some things to consider. I have questions which might lead to some practice intuitive solutions and maybe it will clear the direction for you to develop your skill. Instead of telling you what I think is right for you, I will try to ask thoughtful and insightful questions so that we can both work together to help you.


No kip = dead hang; you don't use your legs to help gain momentum.

Chin-up is with elbows tucked in and fore arms facing your chest.

Pull-up is with fore arms out tward the wall. Finger tip pull-up is done on a 2X4 mounted to a wall above a door.

I'm pretty sure my posture is correct, I exhale on the way up (or try to as I can't even get started if I gow down all the way while doing chin-ups.)

Mt back is pretty strong; I can military press 190 lbs. I also make a habit of activating my core with every exersize I do, even if it isn't strictly nessisary. My mobility is also good, though my sholders do tend to be tight.


Are you unconscious of your posterior chains?

Do you work at a job that requires to be anterior conscious, sitting in front a desk or computer?

I do work at a comuter alot, but not for extended periods of time. Other than that, I have no idea what you meen by the rest.:o

[FooFighter]

Becca,

Thank you for clarifying your definitions. So from what I understand a "pull-up is with fore arms out tward the wall. Finger tip pull-up is done on a 2X4 mounted to a wall above a door" and you have a problem in performing a pull-up?

Here are some ways to progressively get yourself ready to do a pull up. You may use these preminary pull up methods but please consider using PTP (power to the people) principles which really will help you get there faster.

Assisted chin/up/dip machines may be useful as Chieffox have recommended, but these machines do not really allow you to activate your core. Using large rubber bands are helpful to assist your pull ups. www.performbetter.com is a link which sell these kind of bands. These bands are quite helpful if you don't have the fancy machine or a partner. Last but not least having a partner help you in the concentric phase of the pull ups while you focus your attention on eccentric phase.

From my experience, you can also try to master your static handstand position and dynamic
handstand push ups which indirectly will help your pull ups. You have to counter balance your pull ups with opposite movements such as hand stands. Another weak link is usually a man's grip. You may also want to develop specific grip strength conditioning. I sure hope these minor suggestions can help you. Please keep us updated with your discoveries. I would be very interested learning about your progress and reading your insight on how you solved your problem.

PS: Here is an interesting article by Coach Scott Sonnon "The Internal Power of the Pull-up" http://www.circularstrengthmag.com/41/sonnon10.html

[Becca]

Another weak link is usually a man's grip
I think this might be the problem, then.;) :D

But thanks for the advice.:)

[Merryprankster]

I can military press 190 lbs.

If you can military press (two arm overhead press with a barbell) 190 lbs with freeweights, then you need to retire from your CMA career and consider training olympic lifts, then joining the olympic team.

This is INHUMANLY strong for a woman.

[FooFighter]

I had no idea that Becca was a female, MP? If you can press 190 over head, you are strong regardless of gender. I know some men who cannot do that but more strength to you. Have you successful gotten your pull ups, yet?

[Merryprankster]

Nope! My shoulder really just prevents it. It's supremely uncomfortable for me to do them.

Rather than risk some sort of repetitive strain injury, I'd rather just not do them at all.

It works in pretty much every other situation though!

[Becca]

If you can military press (two arm overhead press with a barbell) 190 lbs with freeweights, then you need to retire from your CMA career and consider training olympic lifts, then joining the olympic team.

This is INHUMANLY strong for a woman.
So I've been told. The last time I popped into the health center, one of the company's personal trainers was sitting around doing nothing, so she gave me a mini fittness test. That was one of the things she tested me on. And it wasn't my lats, it was a pinched nerve. The strength was there, but I'd been using bad form while trying to favor it. Whent to my favorite accupunturist. S'all better now.:cool:

BTW, yes I am strong for a woman; it runs in my family. The trainer also gave me body fat test. At 5'1", I have 125 lbs lean weight with a total weight of 160 lbs. She said I need to drop about 10 lbs to be at my ideal weight.:D

[Ford Prefect]

I'm not saying you're embellishing or anything, but the 9th place runner up from last olympics in the women's clean and jerk in the 69kg class only clean and jerked 198 lbs... Generally, you can clean more than you can jerk too.

This genetically gifted, highly trained olympic athlete (who is 9th best in the entire world) could only jerk (an overhead press that uses a big explosive leg dip to hoist the weight overhead and yields higher lifts than military pressing) 8 lbs more than you can military press at bodyweight of 8 lbs less.

If you are serious, then you could be in the next olympics with very little training. No US woman was in there with these ladies.

[Becca]

Serious about being able to Military press that much? Yes. One of these days I'll un-earth a photo of me and post it. But, I have no more intrest in competing in wieght lifting than in anything else. The political side of it buggs the heck out of me and takes away all enjoyment.:mad: :)

[Merryprankster]

The political side of it buggs the heck out of me and takes away all enjoyment.

If you are as strong as you seem to be, then politics will not exist for you.

[Becca]

sure they would. But I don't know the first thing about lifting anywho. The only strength development I do is body weight stuff and working in a warehouse. Moving 80+ air dryers at 70 lbs each will build up your arms, sholders, and back faster than anything.:eek: :p

[fa_jing]

nothing much political about weightlifting. Either the weight goes up or it doesn't. I guess the drugs issue could be a factor, but if you are winning without them, no problem. You could probably train to compete at least on a local level.

MP was probably a shoulder press using a machine, yes? anyway 15 pullups is impressive too.

[IronFist]

The 190 had to be on a machine. I can't even military press that much (not like I'm strong). Well, last time I tried, I could overhead press 135 twice, but that's all I tried for. I'm pretty sure I could NOT do 190, though.

[Becca]

Yep, on a machine. No idea what it was called, never used one before. Prefer hand stand pushups for that kind of workout.:)

And there is always something political in competitions. What's the name of that lady runner that keeps being accused of dopping? Even though she has never, not ever, popped on a test?!? That's political BS. I don't point spar because I hate having points counted against me for punches that missed by several inches then loosing a point because the other guy faked getting hit hard. :mad: I haven't tried any of the other MA "sports" because I doubt the fakes stayed only in Point sparring...:(

[fa_jing]

Well as a woman an being able to do 15 pullups and handstand pushups for reps, you are definitely incredibly strong. I met someone like that recently, she can press her own weight (105) in kettlebells over her head for at least 10 reps, and do pullups etc.

Having competed just a bit in both, I still say there's less politics in weightlifting and track than point-based or heavily refereed sports.

cheers

[Merryprankster]

Ok, on a machine. That's WAY different. You never know how those things are calibrated, and they take out stabilization.

Becca, if you were as strong as we were thinking you were, there really wouldn't be any politics. You'd be so much better than everybody else in your weight class that there wouldn't be anything political about it.

Plus, unlike sports of form, like ice skating or what have you, the judging of weightlifting is pretty simple. Either it got up there, or it didn't. The winner is quantitatively determined with clear rules.

Taking nothing away from your abilities, the machine explains a lot.

When I said 190 is inhumanly strong for a woman, I wasn't exaggerating in the slightest. I really meant that if you could do that, you were a freak of nature and should seriously consider taking up oly-style lifting full time.

[Ford Prefect]

Ahhhh. Yes, a machine is a lot different. That is at least believable.

[rubthebuddha]

never trust machine weights. the day i could only chest press 120 10 times 24 hours after benching 180 10 times (early college) was the day i stopped trusting machines. i think it was the same week the military press machine funked up my shoulder, which means it was the same week i gave up on machines for anything other than calf raises. :)

[Becca]

Ok, on a machine. That's WAY different. You never know how those things are calibrated, and they take out stabilization.

That's why I don't use them much, no need to activate the core. And never going to a proper gym means not having access to free weights. And handstand push-ups are plenty hard enough to do.:eek: :p Stances work the legs just fine, as well. Especially when you add a weight vest and leg/arm weights.:)


And thank you all again for your advice and general help. :)

[Becca]

nothing much political about weightlifting. Either the weight goes up or it doesn't. I guess the drugs issue could be a factor, but if you are winning without them, no problem. You could probably train to compete at least on a local level.

MP was probably a shoulder press using a machine, yes? anyway 15 pullups is impressive too.
... Ok. You guys actually did get me thinking about finding a trainer and learning how to lift. it took a while ,but I started lifting about 3 weeks ago. I've yet to master the art of taking photos of myself, so the only one I've got that shows anything is this one. It isn't all that good...

I've been told it will take about 6 weeks before I see much gain. But I've already noticed some cuts I didn't used to have. Is that normal?