Is Tai Chi Sweat Different??

[MuayTaiChi]

Hi All,

I've been practicing Tai Chi for about six months and I've noticed that the sweat that comes from a Tai Chi workout feels different than any other kind of workout. Does anyone know what I'm talking about and why that is? or am I just imagining it?

[green_willow]

Hi All,

I've been practicing Tai Chi for about six months and I've noticed that the sweat that comes from a Tai Chi workout feels different than any other kind of workout. Does anyone know what I'm talking about and why that is? or am I just imagining it?

Yes it sure does. Have you got a copy of this book?

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/188229002X/103-4555485-7001421?v=glance&n=283155

[MuayTaiChi]

no i havent...does it mention it in the book? what does it say?:confused:

[Phrost]

You're kidding, right?

What biochemical process in the human body would cause a new kind of "sweating"? Maybe you should lay off the cheesy poofs before class as diet is the only thing I can think of that has an effect on what you perspire.

[MuayTaiChi]

No, I'm not kidding....btw i'm a fan of ur site...

sweat removes toxins from ur body...and its well known that the stuff you sweat out can change due to different things you do to ur body. If you fast, for example, your digestive process has a chance to clean itself out and detoxify; a biproduct being toxins released in sweat more so than normal. i'm not suggesting, as some might, that tai chi has mystical powers...i was just wondering if anyone experiences what i see for myself when i practice.


and i like cheesy poofs so no i wont lay off

[omarthefish]

Not so ridiculous. It's a subjective experience so I don't know what to make of it. The process of sweating can't possibly change much but the particular toxins and stuff that you excrete can. I mean, the feeling from sweating from it being just hot and stuffy is totally different from the sweat you get from a work out. I can't imagine why Taiji would produce different results from just any other training but it might.

Different biological processes produce different wastes so that's probably something to do with it.

[green_willow]

no i havent...does it mention it in the book? what does it say?:confused:

I don't but I've heard that its very good. It describes doing tai chi as a new sense of being. so what you said about sweating it out seems to make sense.

[5Animals1Path]

I always get funny little sensations when I practice. If it's not painfull, and it's not detrimental to your practice, I wouldn't spend too much time worrying about it. Some people sweat, some people get the tingly feeling, some look at everyone else like they're crazy because they don't feel anything.

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

Different organs/bio-systems contain different toxins.. different Taiji movements/sets affect different systems.. so, it is plausible to assume that depending on the Taiji or QiGong set there may be different qualities of toxins present in the perspiration.. hence differing smells, colors, textures..

I am a profuse perspirer as i pass the half-hour mark in my routines.. my mentor comments that my system is functioning well, the perspiration is normal and a good indication that the Taiji is doing one of its jobs, cleansing.. he also says to focus on the Taiji, not the sweat..

It's interesting to do do Taiji in cool weather and watch the steam rising off the students, in the right light it's almost ethereal..

Be well..

[Phrost]

Greetings..

Different organs/bio-systems contain different toxins.. different Taiji movements/sets affect different systems.. so, it is plausible to assume that depending on the Taiji or QiGong set there may be different qualities of toxins present in the perspiration.. hence differing smells, colors, textures..

I am a profuse perspirer as i pass the half-hour mark in my routines.. my mentor comments that my system is functioning well, the perspiration is normal and a good indication that the Taiji is doing one of its jobs, cleansing.. he also says to focus on the Taiji, not the sweat..

It's interesting to do do Taiji in cool weather and watch the steam rising off the students, in the right light it's almost ethereal..

Be well..

Is there any actual peer-reviewed scientific research backing all of this up, or are they just subjective observations leading to such conclusions?

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

Phrost: Yes, there is great data out there.. i've done my homework.. and, i'm not going to do yours.. look it up, make up your own mind.. I stand by my post, i'm not in the habit of posting unfounded statements.. or, if i do, i will qualify such statements as such.

Be well..

[Phrost]

Greetings..

Phrost: Yes, there is great data out there.. i've done my homework.. and, i'm not going to do yours.. look it up, make up your own mind.. I stand by my post, i'm not in the habit of posting unfounded statements.. or, if i do, i will qualify such statements as such.

Be well..

You made the claim, it's not my job to prove it; it's yours.

And I don't know you well enough to take your word as any guarantee. Appeal to Authority (even your own) is a fallacy often used by people who have little-to-no proof to support their claims.

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

Phrost: The statement stands. You are the challenger, the burden is upon you to discredit (with facts, please) the statement(s).. you can accept the statement (recommended), reject it without cause.. or challenge it with evidence.. i have no interest in your action on this matter, i've already done the work and formed well-reasoned conclusions.. i have no intention of debating this issue, at least not until evidence is produced that causes me to doubt my own research (unlikely).

Be well..

[Phrost]

Greetings..

Phrost: The statement stands. You are the challenger, the burden is upon you to discredit (with facts, please) the statement(s).. you can accept the statement (recommended), reject it without cause.. or challenge it with evidence.. i have no interest in your action on this matter, i've already done the work and formed well-reasoned conclusions.. i have no intention of debating this issue, at least not until evidence is produced that causes me to doubt my own research (unlikely).

Be well..

Sorry, Science does not operate on the Gong Sau method. It operates on the Scientific Method and Empiricism. The burden of proof is on the person who is claiming X as true.

This is because you cannot disprove a negative; it's impossible. Prove there isn't a 5 legged green tiger that reads Sartre... go on, prove it.

Your reason for not debating this issue is more than likely because you have no solid facts you can point to to verify your claims. And until you produce such evidence to back up your statements, I'll be like you and continue claiming I've already done all the work to prove the existence of the green tiger.

His name is Larry.

[Brad]

Personally, my sweat has allways felt like sweat (no different than any other workout). I think you're probably imagining things, but I really don't know anything about sweat chemistry :p Meditation can sometimes cause you to percieve the same things differently though.

[Hatsuyuki]

Your reason for not debating this issue is more than likely because you have no solid facts you can point to to verify your claims. And until you produce such evidence to back up your statements, I'll be like you and continue claiming I've already done all the work to prove the existence of the green tiger.

"Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence."

[Phrost]

"Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence."

Absence of evidence is evidence of the absence of evidence.

In other words, it's self-evident that there's no proof. And it still doesn't change the fact that the burden of proof is on the claimant, not the one seeking verification of the claim because of the impossibility of proving a negative.

You can't in good-faith and of rational mind claim something is true and then expect the rest of the world to take your word for it when you refuse to produce evidence to support your claim.

If the world worked like that there'd be extensive trade in the desert bridge real estate industry. You have an analytical mind for a reason; use it and stop being so credulous.

[green_willow]

Absence of evidence is evidence of the absence of evidence.

In other words, it's self-evident that there's no proof. And it still doesn't change the fact that the burden of proof is on the claimant, not the one seeking verification of the claim because of the impossibility of proving a negative.

You can't in good-faith and of rational mind claim something is true and then expect the rest of the world to take your word for it when you refuse to produce evidence to support your claim.

If the world worked like that there'd be extensive trade in the desert bridge real estate industry. You have an analytical mind for a reason; use it and stop being so credulous.

I think western reasoning falls short of understanding chi kung / tai chi which requires a certain element of faith. I reason that this belief is the difference between eastern & western reasoning.

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

Phrost: I made a statement. I assert that i have done research that supports my statement. I do not assert its truth, only that i have been exposed to sufficient evidence to satisfy my curious and reasoned mind. I have no interest in re-researching this matter in order to satisfy your doubts. I do not keep copius files on all my research.. upon sufficient evidence to support a well reasoned opinion i move on and maintain the opinion until i encounter evidence to the contrary. Then i re-evaluate the issue in light of new evidence. Your doubt is not new evidence.

Sir, i do not know you or your dear friend Larry (good luck with that).. i don't visit these forums in search of conflict, nor do i incite it. I am confident in my ability to evaluate evidence and form opinions. I am not interested in challenges to my credibility, i already know where i stand. I would ask you, sincerely, what is your interest in this matter? Is the chemistry of sweat and the processes originating it so important.. i suggest that you not "sweat" the small stuff, or.. if you find it so important, do some research.. you know, like: "don't give a man a fish, teach him how to fish".. you will be more the wiser for doing your own research..

Now, i've already wasted far too much time entertaining your challenge.. this forum is full of people that challenge the credibility of others.. endless questioning of supporting evidence, assertions of fallacy, etc... most of these challengers believe that their efforts somehow enhance their image as intellectuals, it does not.. but, seldom do the challengers have any substance.. they use tactics like yours, if you don't tell me then you don't know.. i don't tell you because i don't have the inclination to spend the time re-looking up stuff that i have been exposed to over the years.. Your options are simple, accept it as plausible and do some research of your own.. reject it for whatever reasons you choose.. or, continue this challenge (meaningless in the big picture).. further challenges, without evidence to the contrary, will fall on deaf ears (or, blind eyes, in this case)..

Please try to understand that i have been in this game since 1964 (when my dad put me in a Judo class at the Air Force Base), i've been serious about oriental healing and philosophy since the mid '80's.. during that time i have been exposed to vast amounts of data and research that have shaped my opinions and understanding.. now, at age 55, i have little time or inclination to spend time re-visiting these issues..

Lets be friends! if you don't believe my statement, it's okay.. no harm done.. if i don't spend the time satisfying your inquiries, no harm done.. Life is far too good to get caught up in matters as trivial as this.. it's likely we have much more to share than quibble about..

Be well..

[CFT]

I think western reasoning falls short of understanding chi kung / tai chi which requires a certain element of faith. I reason that this belief is the difference between eastern & western reasoning.Totally irrelevant in this case. If there is tangible evidence, i.e. the chemical composition of the sweat is different then this is not a matter of faith.

Even if the physiological function is different it should show up in different comparative levels of hormones, etc.

However, I do find it hard to believe. I think it is subjective. Different activities make different demands of our bodies. I would love to see the evidence, but I don't feel I need or should badger TCB about it.

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

CFT: Your consideration is appreciated.. considering the interest in this matter, i will keep an eye open as i do current research.. if i run across anything relevant i will post it.. i don't intend to be elusive on this issue, i'm just managing my time appropriately for issues i am currently interested in..

Be well..

[Chief Fox]

Absence of evidence is evidence of the absence of evidence.
Absence of evidense is evidence of the absence that there was any evidence in absence.

No wait, that's not right.

Evidence in absence is evident that...

Um..

Absence...

It is evident...

Oh never mind.:mad:

[Amp]

I've never contemplated the details of sweat during training. I guess I am just too busy trying not to get punched and kicked.

I wonder if tai chi blood smells different too? Oh well, I guess you'll find out soon enough if you ever actually fight.

:)

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

LOL Chief.. that is the typical exchange of evidenciary proofs.. everyone ends up :mad: ...

Most people are really looking for validity or verification of their own perspectives, too few are sincerely seeking to expand their perspectives..

Now......... Evidence not produced on demand is not evidence of no evidence, it is evidence of unrealized expectations, evidently...

Be well...

[green_willow]

Totally irrelevant in this case. If there is tangible evidence, i.e. the chemical composition of the sweat is different then this is not a matter of faith.

Even if the physiological function is different it should show up in different comparative levels of hormones, etc.

However, I do find it hard to believe. I think it is subjective. Different activities make different demands of our bodies. I would love to see the evidence, but I don't feel I need or should badger TCB about it.

See you're alreadsy assuming its about chemicals and reaction. what if there are no chemicals involved?

[CFT]

See you're alreadsy assuming its about chemicals and reaction. what if there are no chemicals involved?Read TaiChiBob's first post in the thread.

[Infrazael]

Sweet Jesus.

[green_willow]

Read TaiChiBob's first post in the thread.

what does it prove besides?

[qiphlow]

and so the joys of this forum are once again revealed in all their glory.

[ngokfei]

green willow

you trolling over here too.

Must of be a New Years resolution or something:rolleyes:

[CFT]

what does it prove besides?Oh nothing .... we're not made up of chemicals, we're just all bags of chi/qi.

[green_willow]

Oh nothing .... we're not made up of chemicals, we're just all bags of chi/qi.

No, we're flesh, blood, bone and spirit - not chemicals certainly not I hope. But we ingest so much chemicals in our food perhaps some stays in unfortunately.

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..


No, we're flesh, blood, bone and spirit - not chemicals certainly not I hope. Well.. flesh, blood and bone are all made of chemical compounds and elements.. spirit, is an elusive quality that is better left out of this dialogue..

Perspiration can be analyzed according to its chemical makeup, similar to how blood is analyzed from "blood-tests"..

Be well..

[green_willow]

Greetings..

Well.. flesh, blood and bone are all made of chemical compounds and elements.. spirit, is an elusive quality that is better left out of this dialogue..

Perspiration can be analyzed according to its chemical makeup, similar to how blood is analyzed from "blood-tests"..

Be well..

But we get told be scientist that we should be careful what we eat like fish contaminated by chemicals. It's chemicals that cause harm not natural substances.

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..


But we get told be scientist that we should be careful what we eat like fish contaminated by chemicals. It's chemicals that cause harm not natural substances.I'm just trying to help, here.. "Chemicals" are everything, that is to say that everything is made of chemicals, compounds and elements.. H2O is the "chemical" expression for water, a natural substance.. two atoms of the element hydrogen bond with one atom of the element oxygen to form the molecule of water.. it's not that "chemicals" are harmful, but there are harmful chemicals..

Be well..

[green_willow]

Greetings..

I'm just trying to help, here.. "Chemicals" are everything, that is to say that everything is made of chemicals, compounds and elements.. H2O is the "chemical" expression for water, a natural substance.. two atoms of the element hydrogen bond with one atom of the element oxygen to form the molecule of water.. it's not that "chemicals" are harmful, but there are harmful chemicals..

Be well..

Why take the chance. Not everyone is a scientist to know which chemicals are harmful and which aren't. Just avoid chemicals. Maybe tai chi allows you to sweat out some chemicals.

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

green_willow: I'm gonna take a chance, here.. is it possible that you mean "toxins" rather than chemicals.. your use of the term "chemicals" is too general to be applicable.. chemicals are both beneficial and harmful, and simply can't be avoided. we need the beneficial chemicals. Toxins are a group of chemicals and compounds that are considered harmful.. and, i agree that we should avoid toxins..

Be well..

[green_willow]

Greetings..

green_willow: I'm gonna take a chance, here.. is it possible that you mean "toxins" rather than chemicals.. your use of the term "chemicals" is too general to be applicable.. chemicals are both beneficial and harmful, and simply can't be avoided. we need the beneficial chemicals. Toxins are a group of chemicals and compounds that are considered harmful.. and, i agree that we should avoid toxins..

Be well..

Thanks. I was just playing :) You've been a good sport :D Like wise be well!

[CFT]

It's chemicals that cause harm not natural substances.How about cobra venom, or pufferfish venom, or black widow spider venom. Harmless right because it's all natural? ;)

[Ford Prefect]

Phrost,

1) There is very little scientific research done on the effects of tai chi on the body besides the obvious parallels that can be drawn between other similar activities.

2) YOU CAN PROVE A NEGATIVE. People who say you can't generally have little background education in actual logic. I don't have a snickers in my left hand. To prove this statement, I can open up my left hand and show you that there is not a Snickers there. This argument is usually thrown around in debates about religion/super-natural phenomena. The problem therein lies in not being able to "prove a negative" but not being able to prove anything without a clear definition.

3) People who make claims and then refuse to back them generally did not really research as deeply as they make believe. Just ignore them.

[qiphlow]

1) EVERYTHING is "all-natural" because it all comes from our universe (nature). Therefore, there is nothing in our lives that is not natural.

2) Tai chi sweat IS different from regular sweat: it moves much more slowly and carefully...

[Ford Prefect]

Nice word play, but natural means "naturally occurring". There are many things we have made which are not naturally occurring.

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..


People who make claims and then refuse to back them generally did not really research as deeply as they make believe. Just ignore them.Not that it matters, but.. refusing to "back a claim" differs from not having the inclination to re-research old sources.. i assert that i have done research in similar areas years ago, that i have made statements consistent with information gleaned from those studies.. i make no "claims", since the research is not mine.. i only give an accounting of matters of which i am familiar..

Now, advising someone to "Just ignore them", based on generalizations is poor advise.. rather, i would advise someone to store such claims away for future reference, that.. in the event they should find some evidence consistent with such claims, their knowledge base might be expanded.. but, that requires an open mind..

Be well..

[Ford Prefect]

*yawn*

How did you guess that is exactly what I was saying?! Your tai chi must have given you some extra sensory powers. I was telling him to ignore people making unsubstantiated claims, but what I really meant was "if somebody makes an unsubstantiated claim, then write off the possibility for that claim ever being true or for evidence ever to come to light to prove that claim". You are good mister. :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

Ford Prefect: Re: *yawn*.. the classics say "if you are tired, sleep".. it might help you with that sarcasm thing, too..

Be well..

[Ford Prefect]

They obviously don't help with much else if your posts on this thread are any indication.

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

Ford: Nice try, i'm already past it.. Troll someone else.. or, bring something of substance to the table..

Be well..

[Ford Prefect]

Greetings..

Something fo substance like say making ridiculous claims, claiming they come from research, and then refusing to produce this "research"? That will be hard to do I must admit.

It's funny. For all your phoney bologna serenity, you are empty of any real character. At least little shown in your posts.

1) You take no responsibility for your claims. You say they aren't your claims, so you don't need to back them up. Newsflash: if you can't produce the research, then it is your claim. It's like me saying, I saw research showing 99.9% of people named Bob who practice Tai Chi are insecure stemming from childhood abuse, and then saying "Well, it's not my claim. I read it somewhere. I am merely openning your mind to the possibilities." Would you take that seriously? Doubtful.

2) In the face of being called on your claims, you switch immediately to being condescending, and infer that my advice actually has some deeper meaning and that it is close minded.

3) When shown what a ridiculous reach that was, you come back with name calling... a la troll.

Be well..

[imperialtaichi]

Hello Guys, let's get back on the subject....

As a dental surgeon, I noticed a certain differences in the quality of sweat when:

1. On ME while I'm taking out a bl--dy difficult wisdom tooth: coming from a frustrated, stressed dentist. Tends to be hot, profuse, coming from my back, and the back of my hands under the glove. Tends to be oily.

2. On the PATIENT while I'm taking out a bl--dy difficult wisdom tooth: coming from a scared, stressed patient. Tends to be cold, fine, coming out of the palms and necks. Tends to be more watery.

Now, this is just an observation, I didn't do any research to back this up.

Let's say if the quality of sweat is different between different physical/psycological state, could it also be different during different physical activities?

Cheers,
John

[Merryprankster]

2) Tai chi sweat IS different from regular sweat: it moves much more slowly and carefully...

But when it finally hits you, it's EXTREMELY LETHAL!!!! :D


Nice try, i'm already past it..

And yet, you continue to post.

For the mildly interested "Lack of evidence is not evidence of lack," is the colloquial version of "Argumentum ad Ignorantiam." It is the logical fallacy that just because something is currently unexplained, then it did not, or could not happen.

It was completely misapplied in this instance. A search for a difference in "types" of sweat SHOULD lead to evidence of a difference, provided such a difference exists. Lack of evidence, in this instance, can be reasonably construed as a lack of phenomenon - much as one can, through inductive reasoning, reach the conclusion that if there are no tumors in the body, and no specific antigens detected, that the body is free from cancer.

Certainly lack of evidence IS evidence of lack, when there are concrete steps that can provide empirical evidence that something did or did not occur.

I have no particular dog in this fight. I just like hearing the sound of my own voice because I'm so wonderfully special.

[Ou Ji]

Hey let's all jump in on this one!


but what I really meant was "if somebody makes an unsubstantiated claim, then write off the possibility for that claim ever being true or for evidence ever to come to light to prove that claim".

I say the world is round but I offer no evidence to substantiate that claim.

Therefore you can "write off the possibility for that claim ever being true" so all you flatlanders can go back to sleep and not worry about things you don't understand.


For me, I've never noticed any difference in sweat but it seems possible that whatever triggers the sweat can determine it's composition based on body parts involved.

Like imperialtaichi observed, fear sweat might be different because it's a superficial sweat where the glands secrete mainly water. Workout sweat (pulling a tooth could be a workout sometimes) would be a deeper body sweat that could pull toxins and other substances (vitamins, minerals, etc) depending on which body parts are massaged or involved in the workout.

What I'm wondering is what triggers the sweat in Taiji practice?

About halfway through the Yang long form I bust out in a profuse sweat. It doesn't happen gradually like a workout. I just hit a point and BANG the sweat pours out.

Anyone care to venture an explanation, substantiated or not?

[Merryprankster]

Ou Ji,

Ford was joking (Happens when your name is "nicely inconspicuous"). He was being rather sarcastic in the remark you quoted, I think.

[Ou Ji]

Mr. Electric Kool Aid Acid guy, I forgot to put smileys after that remark. I'm just jumping on the impending flame war. I like a good fight every now and then. :D

I really like how these threads evolve into the really important things in life. :)

[Ford Prefect]

Some people just don't like Adams, Merry.

Ou ji, I'm all for people talking about emperical observations of their own experiences. I'm under no illusions that the verdict is out on many things pertaining to TCMA and TCM, and I'm always interested to see what people have to say about it. I was a former IMA'er (Ba Gua) in between my boxing and submission fighting/grappling phases. There were certainly some things I felt during chi qong and circle walking practice that I couldn't explain scientifically (although I often times try to logically disect the experience). When somebody starts talking about research linking various phenomena with TCMA practice, then I'll call the bluff everytime.

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

To those thay have some issue in this matter.. innocently, i made reference to some research i had seen at a TCM clinic, stuf like pamphlets or brochures.. the data had been collected in an effort to analyze the characteristics of waste as related to QiGong, including Taiji, relative to toxic cleansing.. i don't recall the organization or much else other than i was surprised at their conclusions regarding the various dispersions of toxins in perspiration according to disciplines compared to a control group. So, for those that have the inclination, follow-up.. i don't have the inclination.

Ford: If i have, in some way, offended you.. i apologize.. But, it is common on these threads for some folks to incite conflict just for the sake of their own amusement.. There is much potential for exchange of concepts and experiences that might benefit some people, here.. likewise, there is a self-defeating mechanism (trolls), they so diminish what potential these threads have that they are deserving of disdain. You have made several statements about my character, yet you know nothing of who i really am.. your research is limited to opinion formed by reading only a fraction of my posts.. i have no intent to deceive or incite conflict, i only intend to share what i have experienced and learn from the experiences of others.. Similarly, you have made several statements subject to the challenge of statistical accuracy, but i cannot see a benefit from such a pursuit, concerned observers will note the porbability of statistical error and move on.. The reference to "troll" in my previous was used as a verb, not a noun, not a "name-calling".. i suggested that you use the tactics of a "troll" elsewhere.. my limited experience with your style of posting precludes me from forming an opinion as to your MO (method of operation).. the reference implied that your current set of postings were consistent with tactics of known "trolls".. you cannot "call my bluff", there is no "bluff".. it is as i have stated. Further pursuits regarding my initial "claim" as you put it, will remain unanswered.. it is pointless. I can offer no more clarification than has been stated and i have no inclination to change my current focus to satisfy your inquisitive pursuit.

It is tempting to abandon such venues as this due to such nonsense as as this thread has manifested. Valuable time has been wasted in favor of certain people's quirky eccentricities.. regardless of reserach sources, the data can be manipulated to indicate what is desired.. and, along this particular subject's sparse research most data is preliminary or subject to revision pending more in-depth work. I am not asserting some scientific discovery, only relating what i have seen..

I am sincerely hoping that we can move on, now.. the direction of this thread is benefitting no one.

Be well..

[spiralstair]

Finally! Two Behemoths Collide!

In this corner of the Top Verbal cage match of (early) 2006!

Ford, "King of the Training Forum", Master of the Yang, eye bulging, vein popping, muscle bulking, pyramid using, Hard Gaining King of the Solid
vs.
TC Bob, "King of the T'ai Chi Forum", Master of the Yin, always yielding, never resisting , gently fa-jinging, dim mak believing King of the Empty

A Great and inevitable Forum Moment we've all been waiting for!

I recommend Iron Fist as Ford's second. Buddy as Bob's.
Mantis 108 as referee.
5 rounds till someone taps or the words run out.
Man, this could be great.

[Scott R. Brown]

I don’t believe that Ford is the Master of Yang because I have not seen proof of this! Just what makes him a “Master” and why is it Yang? Just because he posts on the Training Forum doesn’t make him an expert. I have seen no veins pop or muscles bulge! And even if he did it is probably due to all those steroids, which would explain his aggressiveness as well.

I don’t believe he is Behemoth, because I have seen no evidence of this either, he is probably more of a Pea-hemoth!

And don’t tell me to look on the Training Forum because I don’t have to look. First of all I don’t believe anything Ford says just on principle and second of all it is up to you to provide the proof to me. Why should I have to actually go look for it! You made the claim so you provide the proof!!


But just for the sake of conversation, I recommend Greater Yang to defeat Yang, so for TaiChiBob I say attack Ford with a Mack Truck! For Yin I recommend attacking with Greater Yin, or is it Lesser Yin?? Therefore, for Ford I recommend attacking TaiChiBob with a hug!!!;)

[spiralstair]

Sorry Scott, I forgot about you, and your history with Ford.
I now recomend you as TC Bob's second, not Buddy.

Scott R. Brown as TC Bob's second.

[viper]

hahahah that is funni well put sprial can i be one of the crazy spectater watching with a giant foam finger please

[Scott R. Brown]

Sorry Scott, I forgot about you, and your history with Ford.

That's cuz I have been hiding under my bed lately!!;)


I now recomend you as TC Bob's second, not Buddy.

Scott R. Brown as TC Bob's second.

Accepted!! I think that just means I just have to be sure the tank if full, the engine is tuned and the tires are properly inflated, right??

Or do I intervene if the hug starts lasting uncomfortably long????:o

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

TaiChiBob withdraws on principles of non-violence and the absence of a purse exceeding his normal fee of $25,000.00 (necessary to cover errors and omissions and leave enough for another China trip).. However, he inserts fresh clip into Glock, just in case.. Now, while enjoying a snack of refried bean sprouts he wishes his second, Scott, well...

Be well..

[Chief Fox]

One summer in college I worked in a chemical factory. We produced raw materials for rubber products. We made rubber slabs that would be sent off to other manufacturing facilities to actually be made into something. Like tires or medical tubing or what ever.

Anyway, the week before going back to school they made me work with this really smelly stuff. I wore a white jumpsuit with gloves and boots. I put tape around around my wrists and ankles. The jump suit had a hood. I wore eye protection and a dust mask.

This stuff smelled bad, real bad. Of course it was summer in New Jersey and extremely humid.

So for months after working with this stuff once, every time I sweat I could smell it. Eventually the smell went away and was replaced with the smell of beer.

[qiphlow]

mmmmmm.....

......beer.