New updates on greencloud.net

[Green Cloud]

Just wanted to remind the curious, I got some new updates incuding a video of me doing Dai sing peck gwa. I put that one up first since It's so rare, there is more to come soon, including some CLF, LAMA, Mook Jung, and some sparring clips. Please be patient we will get this stuff up soon:)

Don't forget to hit the greencloud.com link and go to the e gallery to see some pics of the studio

[CLFNole]

The form is interesting, which of the 5 monkey sets is it? I know Sifu Chan Sau Chung and have trained with one of his top students, Sifu Chow Keung and it looked slightly different from their monkey, but then again each person plays a set differently and they only focus on Tai Sing Pek Kwar Mun.

Did Sifu Chan Tai San learn from Ken Dak Hoi?

Peace.

[Green Cloud]

lI'ts the Crafty monkey. As far as who CTS trained with, I believe it was from one of CSJung's classmates alttough I never got his name .I am very curious about it and would love to find out who he is or even if he is still alive.

The form focuses more on the hou kune and not the peck gwa, it definetly doesn't have any reseblence to Paulie zink's stuff who clames to do DSPWM.

[CLFNole]

I trained with Sifu Chow Kueng this past year and we hung with with GM Chan Sau Chung and some of his other students in 2000 for about a week. We discussed a lot of things and found out that the system of Tai Shing Pek Kwar is mainly Pek Kwar sets (fist and weapon), which looks kind of like a northen CLF with a Buk Sil Lum flare. The monkey portion has 5 monkey hand forms and the monkey staff. Most of the students learn the pek kwar stuff and never learn the monkey sets. Nowadays they tend to teach the monkey sets to students who seem that they might be good at it and have the right body style.

Personally I like the pek kwar stuff over the monkey forms. I find they easier to learn from a CLF perspective and they have good applications. All of Chan Sau Chungs famous full-contact fighters from the 1970s would generally use the Pek Kwar stuff for full contact. The stories they told us about their training was off the hook.

I would really recommend training with Sifu Chow Keung if you are ever in HK. His kung fu is real tight.

Peace.

[Jules]

The Crafty Monkey! It looks very cool. Do you think you would ever pass that on?

~~J

[Ou Ji]

If you're taking requests I'm real interested in seeing some of the Lama sets.

[Green Cloud]

The Crafty Monkey! It looks very cool. Do you think you would ever pass that on?

~~J

Yes and no, I usualy teach the applications since there is a lot of effective joint locking and ground fighting tech.

As far as teaching the forms they are nearly impossible to teach, since the forms require alot of athletic ability.

Learning the characteristics of the monkey make it very hard to teach, but every now and then I find people taht actualy want to learn this style.

As far as the Peck Gwa stuff that's easy to learn since it resemles the CLF stuff.

[Green Cloud]

If you're taking requests I'm real interested in seeing some of the Lama sets.

Comming soon to a website near you I'l keep you posted.

[Knifefighter]

...there is more to come soon, including some... sparring clips.
That should be interesting.

[Green Cloud]

Just for you baby;) ;)

[hskwarrior]

gus,

you know no matter how good the sparring is knifefighter will always have something negative to say, or he is still better than that. so take his words lightly.

[Knifefighter]

you know no matter how good the sparring is knifefighter will always have something negative to say, or he is still better than that. so take his words lightly.
Unless is is complete crud, or not really sparring at all, it is pretty rare that I would make a comment about someone's sparring clips. At least people who are sparring hard are working their stuff in a more realistic manner than the forms collectors and two man set dancers.

[Green Cloud]

Yea I know frank cant impress the un inmpessable, besides it's not like I'm designing my web site for guys like him.

[Green Cloud]

Yea it's not like guys like kf are ever gonna walk into my school any way. I'm just trying to share info with other kung fu guys that's all. If he likes what he sees cool if he doesn't well it's not like I'm gona loose any sleep over it.

[Jules]

Unless is is complete crud, or not really sparring at all, it is pretty rare that I would make a comment about someone's sparring clips.

Then why did you bring it up in the first place with "this should be interesting"? Just wondering.

~~Jules

[Ou Ji]

Props for putting up no matter what it looks like.

[Knifefighter]

Because I have a few doubts that these will actually be posted there.

Jules,
Let me ask you a question as a student there.
How often do you do hard sparring?

[Ou Ji]

Hey Knifefighter, props to you too for getting in there and mixing it up even though I don't agree with your views on training.

You're both doing more than I'm doing right now.

[Green Cloud]

What's your point??? Lets see your sparring clips.

[Jules]

Because I have a few doubts that these will actually be posted there.


So what you're saying then, is this: You're going to go out of yur way to make negative comments and be a jerk before you see any clips. If you think you don't like them, you're going to continue to be a jerk. But if they're actually good, then you're not going to own up and say anything?



Jules,
Let me ask you a question as a student there.
How often do you do hard sparring?

I'm not sure what you consider "hard sparring." But I'll admit that sparring still intimidates me and as soon as I'm paired up against someone, I get nervous that I'm going to do something wrong. I have seen the other students fight in a tournament, and it looks pretty rough. I'm not afraid of pain, but permenant injury (which would be my own fault because I tend to be my own worst enemy due to my lack of focus--I put myself in the hospital once just with surfing,) intimidates me. I wouldn't want to have to stop training for any reason.

I'm not sure if I'd fight in a tournament like the one I saw in NJ, although it's definitely tempting in some ways. That one was very harsh. Our guys did well there and I was impressed, and it is interesting to think of what you could do if you just went all out and tested yourself. Hey, maybe someone would punch me in the face--it could only be an improvement. :p Yet, Kung Fu is like nothing I've ever done before and the idea of wailing on someone who is probably a pretty nice person is kind of foreign to me.

Sorry for the tangent, and I'm wondering why you chose to ask me that question. What does it matter to you?

~~Jules

[Knifefighter]

Well, I wasn't the one who said I would be posting clips of myself in the first place. However, there are quite a few clips of my fights on the Dog Bros site.

[Green Cloud]

Hi jules I just wanted to add something, The NJ tourney that your talking about was the wong fei hung tournament. Thrown by Yee,s Hung Ga a very well known school. The fighting was pretty hard core.

Oh yea I justed wanted to share with every one, we took home the Champion ship flag. That's two years in a row. In 05 we had less than half our team there but we still took the flag home.

By the way your face is just fine, we don't need to go messing it up did you see the movie million dollar baby???;)

As far as the type of fighting that KW wants to see is the kind of fighting that disturbed people with issues like to see. I must admitt that I am just as disturbed as they are. Oh well Kung Fu is therapy I guess and different people get off in different ways. Different strokes for diferent folks.

[Jules]

Hi jules I just wanted to add something, The NJ tourney that your talking about was the wong fei hung tournament. Thrown by Yee,s Hung Ga a very well known school. The fighting was pretty hard core.


It was; I've never seen stuff like that up close before. It was really an eye-opener. Now, I want to go to more. ^_^



Oh yea I justed wanted to share with every one, we took home the Champion ship flag. That's two years in a row. In 05 we had less than half our team there but we still took the flag home.


That rocks ... there were some awesome guys there. I actually found the web site on that on Google the other day with some of my training brothers' names up there.



By the way your face is just fine, we don't need to go messing it up did you see the movie million dollar baby???;)



:D Not yet but Lao Shir was telling me to see it this one time.



As far as the type of fighting that KW wants to see is the kind of fighting that disturbed people with issues like to see. I must admitt that I am just as disturbed as they are. Oh well Kung Fu is therapy I guess and different people get off in different ways. Different strokes for diferent folks.

That's totally true, and I think that people enjoy Kung Fu in different ways, too. I know I've never been happier, and I always leave with a big grin on my face and a lot to think about, too.

~~Jules

[Knifefighter]

So what you're saying then, is this: You're going to go out of yur way to make negative comments and be a jerk before you see any clips. If you think you don't like them, you're going to continue to be a jerk. But if they're actually good, then you're not going to own up and say anything?
Generally, I don't make comments on sparring unless it is really good or really bad. Most sparring falls somewhere in the middle.

If you really want me to, when and if the clips are posted I will comment, if you'd like. However, I think you will find that sparring clips generally get more than enough "comments" from the others in the peanut gallery around here.


Sorry for the tangent, and I'm wondering why you chose to ask me that question. What does it matter to you?
I'm wondering what the average student does at that school, sparring-wise.


I'm not sure what you consider "hard sparring." But I'll admit that sparring still intimidates me and as soon as I'm paired up against someone, I get nervous that I'm going to do something wrong.
I mean do you regularly do freestyle sparring where both people are trying to hit each other hard and/or grapple until someone taps?


Hey, maybe someone would punch me in the face--it could only be an improvement.
Getting hit in the face would be part of what happens with hard sparring.


I have seen the other students fight in a tournament, and it looks pretty rough.
What type of tourney? Point fighting in a gymnasium or full-contact fighting in a ring or cage?

[fiercest tiger]

Do you really enjoy that form?

Can i ask a serious question, do you use any of these moves in sparring or realistic fighting?

regards
FT

[Green Cloud]

Absolutely FT

[Jules]

Generally, I don't make comments on sparring unless it is really good or really bad. Most sparring falls somewhere in the middle.

If you really want me to, when and if the clips are posted I will comment, if you'd like.


I don't care if you do or don't; my point is that you had already made a comment ("Oh, this will be interesting") and then immediately after said that you weren't going to make a comment. When you had, in fact, already done.



I'm wondering what the average student does at that school, sparring-wise.


I'm the wrong one to ask about "average", being one new student in one school, out of loads of other students among three different schools who have been there much longer. Ask Sifu Gus if you're interested, or maybe one of my Sehing or Sije here can answer that better than I could.



I mean do you regularly do freestyle sparring where both people are trying to hit each other hard and/or grapple until someone taps?


More grappling until someone taps out, in my personal experience, but I couldn't give you an overall average.



What type of tourney? Point fighting in a gymnasium or full-contact fighting in a ring or cage?

Actually, Sifu answered that one already upthread.

~~Jules

[Green Cloud]

the kung fu tourneys we go to are continuous sparring tournaments, no ring or cage just wood floors. One sweep and you crack your head, lots of guys get hurt. I think you must be thinking of point karate tourneys we dont do that type of stuff exept for kids.

Any way mr. expert where are your guys and what accomplisments have they made?? Oh I"M sorry you work at a hotel as a personal trainer. Do you give massages to?? How about a Happy ending:)

You see KF I already got mine years ago it was called the 80's now I train champions in fighting forms and buiss.

[Knifefighter]

I don't care if you do or don't; my point is that you had already made a comment ("Oh, this will be interesting") and then immediately after said that you weren't going to make a comment. When you had, in fact, already done.
The comment was based on the fact that I doubt there will really be a sparring video.


I'm the wrong one to ask about "average", being one new student in one school, out of loads of other students among three different schools who have been there much longer.
Do you see the other students doing hard sparring? Do they get hit in the face often.


Ask Sifu Gus if you're interested, or maybe one of my Sehing or Sije here can answer that better than I could.
I believe your word far before I would believe his. That's why I am asking you.



More grappling until someone taps out, in my personal experience, but I couldn't give you an overall average.
Cool... hopefully, the sparring clips will be representative of what the students do there and will show the grappling.


Actually, Sifu answered that one already upthread.
So, it sounds like it was more of the point fighting variety done in a gymasium, right?

[Phil Redmond]

Just wanted to remind the curious, I got some new updates incuding a video of me doing Dai sing peck gwa. I put that one up first since It's so rare, there is more to come soon, including some CLF, LAMA, Mook Jung, and some sparring clips. Please be patient we will get this stuff up soon:)

Don't forget to hit the greencloud.com link and go to the e gallery to see some pics of the studio
I just remembered that I have a video of a Masters Demo in Chinatown, NY from the late 80's. Your sifu is one of the Masters on the tape.
Phil

[ingchao]

KF:
When you are 80 years old how will you practice your art?
I bet you'll re-enact your old fights or practice by yourself and then guess what..... those moves become forms.

[Knifefighter]

the kung fu tourneys we go to are continuous sparring tournaments, no ring or cage just wood floors. One sweep and you crack your head, lots of guys get hurt. .
Yeah, I remember those from my WC days. Those are the ones where you get disqualified for using "excessive force" to the head.

[Green Cloud]

That's the problem with these guys they don't think their ever gonna get old. I've never seen 60 year old guys grapling or rolling around the floor. I do know that my Sifu killed a 40 year old guy in a duel when he was 60, and oh yea it never went to the ground.

[Knifefighter]

KF:
When you are 80 years old how will you practice your art?
I bet you'll re-enact your old fights or practice by yourself and then guess what..... those moves become forms.
Well, I've already been doing this for 35 years now. The chances are I will still be doing pretty much the same, just as almost 70-year-old Dan Inosanto and 85 year old Helio Gracie are doing now.

[ingchao]

For the glory or for the art?

[Knifefighter]

While I don't comment on sparring videos, I will definitely comment on hilarious forms demos.

That form is everything that is wrong with forms demonstrated in one 20 second interval. LOL!!!!!!LOL!!!!!!LOL!!!!!!LOL!!!!!!LOL!!!!!!
Talk about dancing around like a dying bug!!!!!
That is great.
You're stuff is worse than I thought.-

OMG- That is you???
That skinny geeky nerd?
And you make fun of me??????
Holy c ra p!!!!
Too friggin' funny!!!!!!!

[Green Cloud]

It depends on wich ones you go to. What you don't realize is that the rules are just for insurance reasons. No one follows the rules and know one ever gets bood for a disqualification, it's incouraged.

Lets not forget that we don't wear boxing gloves, We use the same type of glove that UFC fighters wear. The fighters get two warnings before getting disqualified. The rules vary depending on who the judges are. Basically the rules are loose, pretty similar to san shou rules with more controll since your not protected by a matted floor.

[Wood Dragon]

double tap.

[Knifefighter]

Jules-
Is that how you spend most of your training time?
Doing forms like that?

[Jules]

The comment was based on the fact that I doubt there will really be a sparring video.


It kinda doesn't matter what you believe at this point. You're going to think what you want to think, and more importantly, the web site is for the school and peopel interested in it. You said you would have no comments either way. Yet here we are ... still "commenting."



I believe your word far before I would believe his. That's why I am asking you.


Why is that, I wonder? Sifu Gus obviously has a much better idea of what goes on overall. It seems that you just don't want to believe that either way.



Jules-
Is that how you spend most of your training time?
Doing forms like that?


Actually, we don't do forms all too often. I enjoy doing forms, though, because they incorporate a lot of the stuff we drill all the time. Also, I just like it because it feels good. I don't see what's wrong with doing forms once in a while, because they are one way of practicing.

Ingchao asks a few good questions upthread. You don't know for sure that you will be doing exactly what you're doing now into your 70s or 80s. You could bust a leg. You could get sick; this is, unfortunately, not uncommon. Someone could get fed up and shank you, injure you in some way. What will you do then? Nothing?

Also, may I just ask what is your obssession with people getting hit in the face?

~~Jules

[Knifefighter]

It depends on wich ones you go to. What you don't realize is that the rules are just for insurance reasons. No one follows the rules and know one ever gets bood for a disqualification, it's incouraged.

Lets not forget that we don't wear boxing gloves, We use the same type of glove that UFC fighters wear. The fighters get two warnings before getting disqualified. The rules vary depending on who the judges are. Basically the rules are loose, pretty similar to san shou rules with more controll since your not protected by a matted floor.
Never mind, dude. After seeing what a tough guy you are in that awesome display of fighting talent, I'm in awe. I will never doubt your toughness or the toughness of your students, or the toughness of your tournaments again. I bow down to the martial arts master.

[ingchao]

KF ,
you've no idea what the real applications are for that form DO YOU?

[Green Cloud]

Hey NK I thought you don't do forms how can you comment on them. And do you think I actualy put complete forms on line, so guys could steal my ****?? Cum on
give me more credit than that.

Anyway you don't even know what you looked at. I think I need a happy ending. What hotel chain do you work for???

[Jules]

While I don't comment on sparring videos, I will definitely comment on hilarious forms demos.

That form is everything that is wrong with forms demonstrated in one 20 second interval. LOL!!!!!!LOL!!!!!!LOL!!!!!!LOL!!!!!!LOL!!!!!!
Talk about dancing around like a dying bug!!!!!
That is great.
You're stuff is worse than I thought.-

OMG- That is you???
That skinny geeky nerd?
And you make fun of me??????
Holy c ra p!!!!
Too friggin' funny!!!!!!!

Actually, you know what, forget everything I said in that last post. Here I was trying to have an actual conversation with you--what was I thinking? I don't know why I bothered. Please don't bother to answer that or ask anymore questions, as you aren't ready for real, thought-out answers. You may as well go back under your bridge. Maybe I'll send you some Lysol or something. It's probably pretty dank under there.

~~Jules

[Knifefighter]

Also, may I just ask what is your obssession with people getting hit in the face?
Getting hit is part of what it requires to learn to fight or handle a confrontation in a self-defense situation. If one is not somewhat used to this, he or she will get their world completely rocked the first time it happens for real and it will be all down hill form there.

No obsession... just part of what sparring is about.

Of course all this was before I saw your incredible "master's" amazing dispaly of kung fu fighting. My world view is now completely changed. I no longer think that getting hit in the face has any place in sparring or fighting.

[fiercest tiger]

KF,

Are you a submission grappler of MMA guy? I really have alot of time for submission grappling right now, ive been doing alot and enjoy it much more then forms. Have you entered any comps of SBG, Arbu Dharbi etc?

I'll be entering a subs comp in march if i can drop my weight, any good tips on training fo grappling?

I think forms are good if you want to to train when you are old and dont want to get hurt doing any contact training. Grappling is a great way to keep fit and helps the body to be sensitive, plus ist more technical then forms.

regards
FT:)

[Knifefighter]

Hey NK I thought you don't do forms how can you comment on them. And do you think I actualy put complete forms on line, so guys could steal my ****??
Darn... and I was hoping to completely change my approach to fighting by stealing those incredible techniques, but you are too smart for me. You didn't show the rest of them. Foiled again.

[ingchao]

When you are 80 years old are you gonna play slap happy w/other 80 y/os
or with 25 y/o kids?
Inosanto and Gracie aren't silly enough to roll like that now are they?

We are in it for life!

what are you in it for?

[Green Cloud]

KF what are babeling about what fight vid, there was no fight vid it was a monkey form and it wasn't posted to convince you that forms are important. Look don't hate me because I'm beautiful:D

[Green Cloud]

Look KF I know you still mad at me because I called you an old midget, well I apologize for that statement. You know Jesus loves you he told me so

[Green Cloud]

You know what Knife I love you too.

[Knifefighter]

Actually, you know what, forget everything I said in that last post. Here I was trying to have an actual conversation with you--what was I thinking? I don't know why I bothered. Please don't bother to answer that or ask anymore questions, as you aren't ready for real, thought-out answers. You may as well go back under your bridge. Maybe I'll send you some Lysol or something. It's probably pretty dank under there.
Jules,
My conversation with you was serious. . I was trying to find out what the average student there does and I felt like you would be a good, honest source for that.

All of my conversations with your instructor have led me to believe that most of what he says is to build himself up and I believe he is either lying or living in a fantasy world about most of his stuff. Any answers I get from him reflect this, I believe.

If you are training there because you like the cultural and artistic aspects of CMA, then you are fine there. However, if you are training because you want to be able to defend yourself one day, I hope that day never comes because I feel you will come to great harm if your only training has come from this instructor's program.

I understand that you feel a loyalty to your school and I hope you are getting your money's worth...

[Knifefighter]

I'll be entering a subs comp in march if i can drop my weight, any good tips on training fo grappling?
Train with a submission grappling school or club that has a competition team and follow thier program.

[Wood Dragon]

the kung fu tourneys we go to are continuous sparring tournaments, no ring or cage just wood floors. .


Sounds cool. Which tourneys are these? I only ever see promos for semi-contact, outside of Kyokushin.

I once went to the Battle of Atlanta. No amount of showers will remove the pollution.....

[Green Cloud]

You know there is a forgotten style called the short monkey too. Most people don't know about that style.

[fiercest tiger]

KF,

Thanks mate, you done any training with Erik Paulson, i hear he trained at Dans JKD academy or taught there?

Oh, my school has submission grappling plus i go and roll with BJJ guys and friends that comp in MMA and SBG.

Cheers
FT

[ingchao]

KF,
Everyone thinks they have the key to saving someone in a life or death situation,
and their way is the only way, but we're stuck in NY how can you save us?


(am now hiding under bed in fear, waiting for you to save me)

[Knifefighter]

Look KF I know you still mad at me because I called you an old midget, well I apologize for that statement. You know Jesus loves you he told me so
I'm not mad at you about anything. I'm just cracking up that that is actually you!!!!

That is the person who was making threats that he was going to hunt me down and kill me!!!
Ho, ho, ho, ho!!!!!

And it just gets better.
Next you say you are afraid people are going to steal techniques out of your dead bug forms. You are one paranoid dude, dude.

God, This is great, you've made my day.
I haven't laughed so hard in I don't know how long.

[Knifefighter]

When you are 80 years old are you gonna play slap happy w/other 80 y/os
or with 25 y/o kids?
Inosanto and Gracie aren't silly enough to roll like that now are they?

When I was at the Gracie academy 6 years ago, Helio used to roll with us whenever he came into town. I think he still does and I'm pretty sure Dan still rolls just abuot every day with his students.

[Green Cloud]

I'm here for you dude, just reach out dude. I know your daddy didn't mean mean to touch you that way. Stop blaming your self, you were only a kid.

[Knifefighter]

KF what are babeling about what fight vid, there was no fight vid it was a monkey form and it wasn't posted to convince you that forms are important.
But you said you actually think you would fight like that!!!!!!!
LOL!!!!!
LOL!!!!!
LOL!!!!!
LOL!!!!!
LOL!!!!!
Gawd, this is too freakin' funny.
You're the mad, dude.

[ingchao]

KF,
Are they rolling for real? the way you like it?
I bet out of respect whoever they are rolling with lets them get the upper hand.
'cause I would.

[Green Cloud]

But you said you actually think you would fight like that!!!!!!!
LOL!!!!!
LOL!!!!!
LOL!!!!!
LOL!!!!!
LOL!!!!!
Gawd, this is too freakin' funny.
You're the mad, dude.


Actualy I do fight like that. But I want to be more like you teach me, show me the way gand puba. Hey do you get good tips working at a hotel as a personal trainor. Do you slap the guests and then submit them.

[fiercest tiger]

You can learn alot about KUNG FU fighting if you train MMA way, you will soon realise that most of the forms will not work against a real fighter. You need to polish your techniques and see what works and what doesnt, doing forms and breaking them down in techniques like 1 step sparring is not the way you must really test it and see if the monkey form really works.

[Knifefighter]

KF,
Are they rolling for real? the way you like it?
I bet out of respect whoever they are rolling with lets them get the upper hand.
'cause I would.
When I rolled with Helio, I was a high blue or new purple belt. He used to choke me so fast, I didn't get much of a chance to "roll for real", but I did try hard to keep him from choking me, that's for sure.

I haven't rolled with Dan, but I hear he rolls hard with everybody.

[fiercest tiger]

KF,

What are you doing now? Jui Jitsu or ???

[Green Cloud]

You can learn alot about KUNG FU fighting if you train MMA way, you will soon realise that most of the forms will not work against a real fighter. You need to polish your techniques and see what works and what doesnt, doing forms and breaking them down in techniques like 1 step sparring is not the way you must really test it and see if the monkey form really works.
I agree with you and I have many times. Remember Monkey kung fu is designed to seem comicall, this gives your opponent a false sense of security. Well most Kung fu people know what I'm talking about.

[Knifefighter]

Actualy I do fight like that. But I want to be more like you teach me, show me the way gand puba. Hey do you get good tips working at a hotel as a personal trainor. Do you slap the guests and then submit them.
This stuff just keeps getting better.
Once again, methinks you've got your stuff incorrect, as usual. It looks like your reconnaissance source filming the movie here wasn't too bright and looked up the wrong guy at the wrong place.
Now I see why he never showed up... too bad.

[Knifefighter]

KF,

What are you doing now? Jui Jitsu or ???
Yeah, I still train BJJ, just not at the GA anymore.

[Knifefighter]

I agree with you and I have many times. Remember Monkey kung fu is designed to seem comicall, this gives your opponent a false sense of security. Well most Kung fu people know what I'm talking about.
Yeah, I definitely have a false sense of security after seeing YOU in action, that's for sure... and it sure did seem comical... so it's doing what is was designed to do.
Bwaahshshaahahahah!!!!!

[Green Cloud]

huuu what are ya takin amout man:mad: Bloood clott:eek: Good night Knife, I love you and so does Jesus, and Buda too. Oh yea take it easy on the pipe:(

[Green Cloud]

On that note it's 12:32 east coast time got to go to bed playa.

[Lama Pai Sifu]

Uh, Sifu Kaparos, did you forget what we talked about? You're involving yourself in a "NO WIN" situation that has no finallity. Best to drop it now, and avoid resorting to childish retorts. Quite frankly it belittles you and you are better than that. Besides, unless you and Knife fighter actually fight (which probably isn't going to happen) you will never end this discussion, or thers like it. Leave it alone and discuss things more befitting of your talents and knowledge, dig?

Just a word from your brother.

[Green Cloud]

OOPS youre right sifu Mike, if you read my post I wasn't realy taking him seriously.

[greencloudtj]

It;s such a shame little willow will not come and visit

[Knifefighter]

OOPS youre right sifu Mike, if you read my post I wasn't realy taking him seriously.
Maybe next time you could post a clip of how you think a dying bug might fight with sticks.

[Green Cloud]

You must be thinking of the preying mantis style.

[Green Cloud]

I got to clear the air this guy Knife fighter grows on you after a while. He definately breaks up the monotony on this forum.

Nothing he sais realy bothers me, and he is kind of amusing, I actualy wouldn't mind sitting down with him and having a beer with him. I'm sure in person he is probably a fun guy.

Everyone in the MA buiss. knows that I have a good sense of humor and I am usualy the prankster of the group. If I veer off topic and start fooling around with KF it's just for laughfs.

I don't take him seriously and no else should either. I'm on the forum because it's fun that's all.

[Mook Jong]

Even though at this point it seems almost useless to do so:
Knife fighter at our school we do continual light contact sparring. We try to not hit to the face and head as hard as we can b/c we also keep in mind that we are going to train with the person we're fighting with so we don't really want any bad blood. It's not the most accurate portrayal of a fight but it is better than nothing. Usually we don't take things to the ground b/c we train to fight standing and most of our grappling counters require either a shot to the groin or an arm break. When we spar w/ sifu we go no gloves with ver very light contact to the head and face with some grappling. In early december or late november a we went to a San Da tourny in NJ. One of our guys fought in 3 5 min rounds. I don't know where the pics are but he got roundhoused in the face early first round. His face looked like he was getting eaten. He made one bad mistake and it probably cost him the match. If anyone has pics of tristans fight please post one of him to try and show that we do actually know had to spar.

[Knifefighter]

Knife fighter at our school we do continual light contact sparring. We try to not hit to the face and head as hard as we can b/c we also keep in mind that we are going to train with the person we're fighting with so we don't really want any bad blood.
That's kind of what I figured you guys did.


It's not the most accurate portrayal of a fight but it is better than nothing.
You are right. It is better than nothing. At least you are not spending 100% of your time doing bug forms.
But there are better ways.


Usually we don't take things to the ground b/c we train to fight standing and most of our grappling counters require either a shot to the groin or an arm break.
Unfortunately, that's not the way grappling encounters happen in real life. If your instructor is telling you that, he more than likely has little or no grappling experience.

While you might stop a grappler with a groin shot on a rare occasion, you will pretty much never get an arm break while standing.

[ingchao]

The Arm break occurs while on the ground

[Knifefighter]

Are you sparring these or just doing the technique with a cooperative partner?

[greencloudtj]

Maybe next time you could post a clip of how you think a dying bug might fight with sticks.

Thats so funny little guy,on top of sifu's students having a mixed martial arts back ground,I would love to shove those sticks right down your throat,you have some nerve,talking about my sifu with such disrespect you old clown.Some day you will get yours with your mixed martial arts bull..keep it up grandpa..

[Jules]

In early december or late november a we went to a San Da tourny in NJ. One of our guys fought in 3 5 min rounds. I don't know where the pics are but he got roundhoused in the face early first round. His face looked like he was getting eaten. He made one bad mistake and it probably cost him the match.


Tristan, from what I remember, thought that the ref was sending them back to their corners when in fact he was just breaking them up. He had Trinh on the ropes (I've got this on video) and was wailing on him, and the ref came and broke them up. Tristan turned all the way around to go back to his corner, then realized that the round wasn't up yet, and turned back around. Trinh roundhoused him in the face just then. I actually dropped my camera when that happened, but you do see the moment before. It was brutal, but the guy was just taking advantage of his opponent's distraction and mistake. Anyone would have done the same thing.

It was a really close match. From what I understand, one of the judges was going to give the match to Tristan. For a while there in the second round it really seemed like he had won.

I was pretty sure that Dave had his nose broken in that tourney, too.



If anyone has pics of tristans fight please post one of him to try and show that we do actually know had to spar.

I have pictures from during and after the fight, but we'd better ask Tristan before we use him as an example. ;) Also, you know that you know how to spar. (As for me, I'll get there soon, I hope. I bought a bunch of new sparring equipment today.)

Also, just a quick point: doesn't Choy Li Fut have to do with anti-grappling? As in, if you're really proficient at it, someone's not going to get you on the ground or locked in the first place? That's where it's helpful to be flexible. ^_^

See you Monday, Banira Ice Cream! :D Have a good weekend.

~~Jules

[fiercest tiger]

You can train anti grappling but most of the time if you dont knock out your opponent then he might take you down. You better off training stand up, clinch, takedowns, and submissions to be a all round fighter i think.

It all depends on your game and how good you are as well how well you can read your oponent.

At the end of the day a jab to the head can be a anti grappling move.....


FT

[Fu-Pow]

Hey Greencloud-

Thanks for posting something, that takes balls. I can't really comment on your form because I don't know much about Monkey Style and what it's supposed to look like, it seems like night and day from CLF. You look to be in very good shape though and I was impressed with the rolls and back hand spring.

Hopefully, you can post some CLF or Lama in the near future. When I have some extra time I'm gonna post some more stuff ...probably double broadsword, tiger fork...and Won Hop Kuen from my Sifu.

FP

[Green Cloud]

thanks for the compliment fu pow I'l bee posting more stuff soon. Looking foward to seeing some of your new stuff.

[greencloudtj]

[
looking great sifu.It's nice to see some people one here are here for the right reasons. It really helps to bring the kung fu community together,within the United States.

[Knifefighter]

I would love to shove those sticks right down your throat
The next stickfighting gathering is here in June. If you book your flight now, you could probably get a really good deal. I'll save a fight for you.

[Green Cloud]

While millionare Bruce Waine flew around the world fighting bad guys the rest of us saved our money to go to the Bahamas with our wives. This guy is living in a fantasy world.:rolleyes:

[Knifefighter]

Hey, he wants to shove the sticks down my throat. That's his chance.

[fiercest tiger]

hehehe It would be a good fight, monkeys love there staff form!

Can we get it on?:) Just playing guys, chill and take a dump no one is going to fight!

[Green Cloud]

Listen I have no problem fighting one of my peers, but there is only one problem and that is distance. I live in New York not California so talking about fighting with someone that live so far away is a mute point.

[Ou Ji]

Maybe some of the larger competitions could host a grudge division for all the challengers and smack talkers. :D

[greencloudtj]

[
HUMMMMMMMMMMMM,Lets see sifu,A Vacation with my girl??or stick fighting with trailer trash. I wonder

[Green Cloud]

Maybe some of the larger competitions could host a grudge division for all the challengers and smack talkers. :D

Hey that's a great Idea, the only problem is that no one will show. :(

[Ou Ji]

True, true.

[Mook Jong]

Knife fighter: with our grappling drills we don't rely exclusively on a groin strike to extricate ourselves, it's more to either loosen an opponents grip or help us set up for another technique. My sifu has said that grappling isn't just trying one arm break. He is trying to show us alot so we can try one from one position. if that doesnt work reposition and try another etc. Also though similar to the groin shot, ripping a testicle off is another one that sifu has showed us. Granted it would not be my preffered method but if i'm in a dire situation and the oportunity presents itself...
As for the better ways to spar; we could probably change it to give a more realistic feel but i think going no gloves with a person with 30+ years of martial arts experience is plenty for me. And you seem to talk alot of smack about sifu and the for, which is based on a monky, without showing any clips of you. You say that you are in the Dog Bros thing, fine. Put up that clip and tell us who to look for.

OR we could do the mature thing and drop the flame war becasue it is stupid.

[Mook Jong]

I have a half galoon of banana ice cream sitting in my freezer right now. Take that.

[Jules]

Good points, Mook Jong. The other thing I was thinking about full-on, hardcore sparring is that, to be honest, it's not quite practical. Most of the students are either in school or have real jobs, where you can't be showing up with your face busted the next day. It's not like Fight Club, it's real life where you have to show up at classes or make money and be out in public and other things like that.

If Green Cloud were an academy where it was required for all students to lose their teeth or get their eyes blackened, I'm sure that business would not be, uhh, brisk.



I have a half galoon of banana ice cream sitting in my freezer right now. Take that.

Don't tempt me, I just might! :D

~~J

[Mook Jong]

Ironic thing about the ice cream is it's sitting next to vanilla or as i like to call it the flavor that ****ed me.

[Ou Ji]

Jules

Like any other activity known to man there will always be those at the extreme ends. Ever see one of those Karate guys that can punch through a brick wall but can no longer sign there paychecks?

If you rely on such things for your livelyhood then that's fine. Just don't expect bank managers and others to feel the same way or train the same.

Somehow that concept gets lost on some people.

[hskwarrior]

why is knife fighter always trying to draw us into his venue? anytime a threat is thrown at him, he always says "at the next dog brother gathering........" why does it have to happen at a dog brother gathering? safety? why can't it happen out there in new york or where ever with a very few witnesses on each side and just be between the two people.

nothing has to go to the dog brothers venue. take it to the streets or gong sau it. but leave the dog brothers out of it. they have nothing to do with the way knife fighter talks to people here.

[Ou Ji]

Kickbacks maybe? :rolleyes:

[hskwarrior]

do you see my point?

what im trying to say is if he wants to test out these people to see who is skilled or not, why take it to a dog brothers show when it should be done on neutral ground.

yeah im sure its kick backs, but it is still (so called) his territory. he should bring it to them if he's all what he says he is.

kickbacks sounds more like it.


hsk

[Knifefighter]

why is knife fighter always trying to draw us into his venue? anytime a threat is thrown at him, he always says "at the next dog brother gathering........" why does it have to happen at a dog brother gathering? safety? why can't it happen out there in new york or where ever with a very few witnesses on each side and just be between the two people.

nothing has to go to the dog brothers venue. take it to the streets or gong sau it. but leave the dog brothers out of it. they have nothing to do with the way knife fighter talks to people here.
I've invited people to the Dog Bros when challenged on stick or knife stuff. That's the perfect venue for that.

As far as doing it at your venue, it's interesting when I PM'ed you about SF, all you could say was that you would try to shoot me.

[Knifefighter]

do you see my point?

what im trying to say is if he wants to test out these people to see who is skilled or not, why take it to a dog brothers show when it should be done on neutral ground.


The gathings are held on neutral grounds, at the RAW which is a MMA training facility. Fighters from a variety of different styles from all over the country attend.

[Green Cloud]

Because a Dog Brother gathering would be fun.


I agree with Watchman it would be a fun gathering, but who is going to get on a plane and fly there and incurr such an expense. I admitt if I were realy insecure with my abilities maybee the trip would be worth the time.

Hell it's hard enough to go to competitions in my area.

[Knifefighter]

Well, if it is so unrealistic, why do people keep saying they are going to hunt me down, cram sticks down my throat, kill me, etc.

If you're not going to back up your threats, maybe you shouldn't be making them.

[hskwarrior]

yeah thats right.

you think im in this for the fun of it? no, thats ok. if you want to come for me, then you will play MY way. i had a spinal injury, so my i miss my chance to train for the ring, or i would challenge you all over the place.

but i will re-iterate and im not afraid to admit it, i said if you have something to prove and want to come and hunt me down to satisfy whatever midlife crisis you may be experiencing, you will have to play my way. i don't want nothing to do with you. so if you ever come looking to make a name for yourself by thinking you can beat me at grappling you are wrong.

if you doubt my words, then feel free to come looking for me. we might have a real knife fight on our hands. or a shoot out. either one. but you must realize if you find me, i will consider that as a threat and .........."will be forced to defend my self.........i have a black belt you know. in what i can't tell you.


lmao.

[Knifefighter]

just out of curiosity, KF, I know it's a bit OT (actually, the way things are going arond here these days, is anyting really OT anymore?), but in order to participate in a DB event - do you just show up? or do you need to pre-reg? does it help to have a ref from a previous participant? also, are there people there who would try to do stuff without using any protective gear at all? not to stir the pot, nothing to do with KF and anyone else's little pas de deux, just curious - in the past, those things looked interesting, not too many people interested in that sort of thing around these parts, i would definitely like to go play one time, just as soon as i don't have to be the main financial support for my family using my hands and needing to be in one piece physically (in about 1 1/2 years my wife is done with her medical residency, so then i can start to go play again a bit harder..); besides, I have to demo to KF that stick thrusts can work if properly applied ;) (and hey, maybe I'll be wrong, but it's pointless to talk about it at this point - just need to go and show...)
Chris,
You have to pre-register by filling out the form on their website and mailing it in... there is no charge. They do recommend that you have at least viewed videos of the events to see what you are gettting into, but this is not mandatory.

The only gear that is mandatory is a fencing headgear. You cannot wear any more protection for your head than this. The headgear comes off once the fight hits the ground. Occasionally, people who want to fight with no head protection at all will meet somewhere afterwards to do this.

You are also allowed to wear medium to light hand protection to keep your hands from getting mangled, although this is not required. Light knee or elbow pads are also allowed and used by some people.

Shin guards, body padding, or any other protective equipment is not allowed.

[Ou Ji]

I know. You have a black belt in leather, extra long. Am I right?:D

[Knifefighter]

i said if you have something to prove and want to come and hunt me down to satisfy whatever midlife crisis you may be experiencing, you will have to play my way. i don't want nothing to do with you. so if you ever come looking to make a name for yourself by thinking you can be
Doesn't seem ironic to you that you are saying this, but just made a big deal about me going to other people's venues?

As far as me having something to prove- nope. I'm inviting the people who feel like THEY want to make a point with me. I'm not the one making threats.

[Green Cloud]

KF what do you mean there is no charge, is that to send your paperwork in or to fight at an event??

[Knifefighter]

There is no charge to fight- or to send in the paperwork.

[Ou Ji]

I'm also curious. Is there a sign up or something when you get there. It looked like you just show up and look for someone to fight. Or will they match you up with someone?

Do you know of anyone else doing something like this in one of the other states?

[Green Cloud]

KF I don't understand, do they make their money from spectators?? What's the angle?? Events cost money who pays for it ???:confused:

[Jules]

Jules

Like any other activity known to man there will always be those at the extreme ends. Ever see one of those Karate guys that can punch through a brick wall but can no longer sign there paychecks?

If you rely on such things for your livelyhood then that's fine. Just don't expect bank managers and others to feel the same way or train the same.

Somehow that concept gets lost on some people.

In fact, that was my exact point. Many of us don't have a lifestyle where we could afford--literally--to be getting our faces busted up regularly. So we train in a way that teaches us, that also best suits our lifestyles. It's not Imperial China with Jackie Chan as a general or something. (Hey Sifu, I saw that movie last night. It was definitely outside of his usual fare!)

I want to still be training when I'm 80 or something. I don't want to ever have to quit because of injury.

~~Jules

[Knifefighter]

KF I don't understand, do they make their money from spectators?? What's the angle?? Events cost money who pays for it ???:confused:
Not a money making event... it's a venue for fighters to test themselves and their techniques.

[Green Cloud]

So let me get this right anyone can go including spectators and it's absolutely free.

Do the Dog Brothers havea school, I'm just trying to figure out how they make a living at this or are they just wealthy, where does their funding come from.

[hskwarrior]

knife fighter,

i want you to understand i have no ill will towards you. i said what i said to you about coming to me because thats how serious i take things. Im not interested in fighting at the dog brothers events, and am not in the game for sport, for me it is a tool for survival. i hope you understand that about me.

i am not even offended by your stand on forms. the only time i will pump my chest out is when i think i am being attacked, or threatened. I don't come from a group of people who like to test their skills against other people for fun. it wasn't how i was taught. i was taught more along the lines of don't show unless you have to, and if you do fight to win. that is the whole mindset of the choy lee fut system.

i intend to use my gung fu for street purposes, if i was younger or never had my accident maybe i would even enter the ufc. who knows. so what i do is keep up my skills now, and teach my students. it is them who want to go out and fight all the time. i teach them the way my sifu taught me, with a few little modifications here and there. after all i've been through in life, all i want to do is live a little more peacefully.

disagreements are good. but when you put your own opinions above others without knowing who you'r dealing with is not all that wise. don't take this the wrong way, please, its only for you to understand about me. the kind of people i know and hang around are like the people who killed harry ng the hop ga master in sf. i know the guy who did it, not well, but i know him.

so when i said what i'd do if you came looking for me is because thats the background "I" come from. no its not a fantasy. i just grew up that way.
no i don't think im tougher than you or anyone else. i just know im no punk.

so i would appreciate if our little squable was squashed, and in the end maybe we can actually learn a few things about each other and from each other. if not, i made my case.

no hard feelings.

hsk

[Wood Dragon]

knife fighter,

i want you to understand i have no ill will towards you.


What?

No, here, let me help.


knife fighter,

You're a deadman. Your skills are no match for my Kung Fu!


love,

hsk

P.S. I killed your dog. Eventually.


MUCH better.

[Green Cloud]

I'm feeling warm and fuzzy now I call for a group hug

[Green Cloud]

I'm just joking around, but I have to say this in the short time that I have known Frank he is a passionate guy and truly follows the warriors path.

He sometimes speaks before he thinks bit who doens't. My first conversation with him turned into a war, like true gentlemen we fought it out then worked it out.

We don't agree on everything but we talk about it with out being insulting because we have respect for each other.

How did this happen well a simple phone conversation, and a few PMs. Like I have said in the past the best way to know someone is to fight them. Originaly I lost my tember because I didn't like my sifu being made fun of.

Personaly, you can say what ever you want to me and I wont get mad. If anyone expects me to take them seriously than a simple phone call or PM would suffice.

As far as challenges go, well lets say that's not realistic since we all have different life styles in different parts of the world. Most people that know me know that I welcome all chalenges, if I could get the oportunity to go toa DB venue I would. The perfect way to releave stess, god know how much stress I have living in New York.

Anyway distance is the problem for me and for other people well it's not something that everyone is into. For example Franks the kind of guy that was rased by the streets and he couldn't be bothered with things like venues. I get the feeling based on his old world mentality that he trains for survival.

[unkokusai]

I don't come from a group of people who like to test their skills against other people for fun.


Do you come from a group of people who never 'test' their skills at all?

[Green Cloud]

I think he means that when his skills were tested it wasn't for fun it was survival.

[hskwarrior]

yes i come from a line of street fighter, and gung fu assassins (sounds like a movie, but read up on lau bun before you judge what i've said first) who use their gung fu on the streets where to US it really matters. but i'm training my guys to enter san shou. i just want to have their basics sharp before their first matches.

one of my classmates has been doing some crosstraining and have fought and won a few matches. he also competes in the police olympics regularly, and also trains the SAN FRANCISCO law enforcement groups. its cool because we get to train with his REDMAN suit once in a while . a must for all TCMA folks. we like to use the tiger claws too much and when you have those big gloves on it takes away from the effectiveness of Choy lee FUt strikes.

see, in the ring i would not be allowed to do a sow choy to the neck, however thats what i train for. to hit you int the neck and if your neck breaks oh well. you can actually kill someone with that strike. and that is choy lee futs bread and butter. it has been known to beat shaolin monks in asia.

in the ring i wouldn't be able to use the maiming techniques like the cup choy, panther punch, tiger claw, snake fist, or even the elephant fist. see, to many of you ring fighters this means nothing to you. but out on the street it can mean your life. i know blah blah blah. but im still connected to the streets where i live and living and working in it doesn't help either. i can't help how i was raised, but that is the code i follow.

like i said, i have never claimed to be this or that. im just a guy who teacher choy lee fut to his students. i train them for the real world, and unfortunately one of them had to use it in a life or death situation and work out for him in only about a years training.

oh shet, my school, the hung loong kwoon has been open for more than a year now. how cool.

anyways, i don't mean any disrespect to knifefighter or anyone who anyone else for that matter here, but i will stand up for myself.

so after this big group hug (with chests only,,,,this aint no sausage party:mad: )
i apologize Knife Fighter for some of the things i've said to you. Im not here on this forum to fight over words. i came to this forum to share my lineages gung fu with whomever wanted to know.

but if you were to meet some good choy lee fut people, i would urge you to train with them so you could understand the sow choy and some of our other stuff. you don't have to trust me, but its not ALL useless.

HSK

[unkokusai]

yes i come from a line of street fighter, and gung fu assassins

see, in the ring i would not be allowed to do a sow choy to the neck, however thats what i train for. to hit you int the neck and if your neck breaks oh well. you can actually kill someone with that strike. and that is choy lee futs bread and butter. it has been known to beat shaolin monks in asia.

in the ring i wouldn't be able to use the maiming techniques like the cup choy, panther punch, tiger claw, snake fist, or even the elephant fist.

im still connected to the streets where i live and living and working in it doesn't help either. i can't help how i was raised, but that is the code i follow.




I think all this really speaks for itself.

[Knifefighter]

So let me get this right anyone can go including spectators and it's absolutely free.

Do the Dog Brothers have a school, I'm just trying to figure out how they make a living at this or are they just wealthy, where does their funding come from.
I think there is a small charge of 5 or 10 bucks for spectators to help defray the cost of renting the facility. The events used to be held at a park and there was no charge then for spectators.

I'm not sure if anyone is making a living at this. Marc, the guy who organizes the events, might be as he teaches seminars and puts out instructional tapes.

There are various Dog Bros training groups around the country, but, as far as I know, no commercial schools. The Dog Bros have always been very grassroots. The gatherings are not commercial endeavors, but just a way for people who train with sticks to try out their stuff in a real contact environment.

[hskwarrior]

unkok

do you really?:confused:

[unkokusai]

unkok

do you really?:confused:


Oh, it speaks volulmes...

[hskwarrior]

unikok,

does it really?:confused:

how many volumes?

can i make some money from it?

[GreenCloudCLF]

hsk,

Jean Reno, the Hitman in the professional, made $5000 per hit...and that was 10 years ago...rates must have gone up since then...

[hskwarrior]

who's my first victim?


oooooh im gonna be rich!!!!!!


thanks greencloudclf;)

[unkokusai]

unikok,

does it really?:confused:

how many volumes?

can i make some money from it?


Sure. There's a sucker born every minute.

[hskwarrior]

oh okay:confused:

im as much a sucker as your bald headed auntie with one leg fitted with a kick stand. hop along peg leg!!!

[unkokusai]

Yeah, well that certainly made sense. :rolleyes:

[hskwarrior]

really?:confused:

it did?:confused:

[greencloudtj]

ajslkjwlk;lask;l32;llwe;4fll

[Green Cloud]

Realy I did what??? what were talking about??? hello is any one hope:confused:

[Green Cloud]

Ingchao, I can feel your presence I know youre lurking about:)

[ingchao]

Sorry to miss this party! But the pillow was calling me by 1st and last name.
Watching my wife grow babies is tiring work!!:D :D

[Green Cloud]

Dude get cable, anyway it's a boring day on the forum have a good night.

[Jules]

AHHH I can't wait to see the fan form on the website. I can send it to my non-Kung Fu friends and then gloat. ;)

I don't know about anyone else, but I can barely type after all that staff stuff tonight. That was harsh. But fun, in a perverse way. :D

~~J

[greencloudtj]

[lets keep it alive

[Green Cloud]

Some clips of the CLF fan just got posted. Video 3


greencloud.net

[JAZA]

Greencloud,

What is the name of your fan form.

Here is a Chan family fan form that had been around in the net for a long time, it is fei lung sin.

http://home.iprimus.com.au/choy/clf/video/craig_fan.mpg

[Jules]

W00t for the fan form! It's the bomb. And I see we now have a chatroom. That promises to be loads of fun. ^_^

~~J

[Green Cloud]

Yea but it seems that I'm the only one on it. Chris said that we might be able to turn it into a forum.


greencloud.net

[Jules]

Yea but it seems that I'm the only one on it. Chris said that we might be able to turn it into a forum.


I'm going to try to get on it tomorrow night if I can. Right now I have to get to bed because I have to work early tomorrow. Blech. A forum would be cool, too!

I sent the fan form link to my parents ... they thought it was awesome.

~~J

[Jules]

10:21 and I'm on chat. Will probably be for about half an hour or so. If anyone comes on and types something and I ignore you, it's just because I'm in another window. I'll be checking every few minutes to see if someone else came on. Maybe I'll catch one of you.

~~J