Shaolin Kung Fu Studios

[ninjutsu9]

Does Anyone know if the shaolin kung fu schools in rocky point and or medford are good

Thanks for any feedback

[greencloudtj]

Does Anyone know if the shaolin kung fu schools in rocky point and or medford are good

Thanks for any feedback
whats re you looking for??and do you have any martial arts traning??

[Seven]

What state? NY, NJ, MA, OR, The only old school kung fu in or around Medford, Oregon is Fen Kwoon. The Sifu there is a guy by the name of Jason ?? He is a student of Master Robert Louie of Jing Mo SF and some others on here. From what I read and here. I have know I idea if he is any good? Most of the Masters here on the KFM and (Gene Ching) know him. I think he is on here from time to time. Tao of Wushu is his nick. hope this helps.

Seven

[ninjutsu9]

NY onlong island area, i have done some jujitsu and ninjitsu but the ninjitsu seems just like a hybrid of karate and jujitsu to me so i am going to quit that and join somewhere else plus at both places they don't teach you mutch and the training is extremly easy sorry about not verifying what state i was rushed when i posted that

[ninjutsu9]

also i am looking for a place that is actually trying to teach and where they train hard the other places turned out to only be in it for money and didn't bother trying to teach classes where just ment to be fun for as many people to join as possible

[Seven]

No Prob. Good luck with your search man.

Seven

[greencloudtj]

Thats what happens with most instructers who only teach martial arts fo a living and dont have any other job,they dont give a rats *** what they teach as long as you and evry one else keeps paying

[ninjutsu9]

k thankx guys

[ngokfei]

Check out this directory of LI KF SChools

http://www.martialartsny.com/longisland/kungfu.html

plus

http://www.lingnamsiulum.com/contact.htm

[greencloudtj]

Sifu mike from long island also runs a hardcore fighting and kung fu school

[ninjutsu9]

cool where is it

[richard sloan]

if you want shaolin you can come into nyc- there's a lot to choose from.

[greencloudtj]

rich were do you train

[ninjutsu9]

thanks, i live on suffolk county so i live to far from the city to train there :(

[greencloudtj]

Sifu mike's school is on hempsted turnpike in east medow,he is also no a bull****commercial school,he is also a great lion dance instructer

[ZhuiQuan]

I train at Sifu Gregg Zilb's on Hawkins Ave. in Ronkonkoma. It's very hard core training, and it's not just wushu. We learn a lot of self defense and fighting techniques. Sparring every Friday night as well. There is also a demo and lion dance team.

You can send me a PM if you need more information.

[Venom]

I study in the ronkonkoma studio, I can tell you that it is not a joke. It is a compete system and sifu gregg is legitimate, he has vast knowlege of the art and also shows the pratical applications. He is probably one of the best instructors i have had the privilege of training with and i have studied with some of the best in my 20+ years of traning. I cant speak for the other branches, but im sure they are very good, all of greggs instructors are excellent, If any one has any questions, you are welcome to come down, he is there every day.

[t.j]

sifu greg loves vistors expesaly people who talk **** about there kung fu ability,as well as there fighting ability

[t.j]

dident you fight one of sifu gregs guys craytons tornament

[t.j]

any one who has mixed it up withsifu gregs students no that they can fight and the fighting ability is no joke

[famenchuan]

If you want WuShu Shaolin Kung Fu is OK:rolleyes:

But if you want Kung Fu that is as close as anyone today is gonna get to old school
straight outta China then (insert commercial here )
try out
Green Cloud Kung Fu



http://www.greencloud.net

P.s If u are a troll you will be sorry! you have been warned!!!!!!!!!:D

Where do you get off saying that Shaolin kung fu studios is wushu. I train at that school and we fight all the time. Any time you want to test my skill we'll just set a time and place. I have no problem with that. Just say the word.

[t.j]

Where do you get off saying that Shaolin kung fu studios is wushu. I train at that school and we fight all the time. Any time you want to test my skill we'll just set a time and place. I have no problem with that. Just say the word.



I think he fought one og gregs guys a george craytons tornament and he got his a** kicked

[ZhuiQuan]

Oh boy... :rolleyes:

[t.j]

:) :) :) :eek:

[richard sloan]

rich were do you train

I train with Shi Yan Ming.

[t.j]

very cool how has your experience bin at the temple??

[TenTigers]

I don't know how that ad for my school got there, we don't usually advertize, as we are more of a private school.(hmmm, I probably filled out some form online or something) In any event, Gregg-Shrfu is an excellent instructor as is Sifu Mike at Ling Nam Siu Lum, and you will do fine in either of those schools.

[t.j]

whats up sifu rick,I do agree they are both hard core kung fu sifus and very well ronded sifus

[Green Cloud]

Hello gentlemen, how is everybody. First off let me start by saying all the Sifu's that were mentioned are the real deal and are all very good. Different strokes for different folks. Each one of these schools have training that apeal to different people.

It's all a matter of preference, Students choose to train in the environment that they enjoy. The fact is there will always be varying opinions on what kwoon is better, base on peoples preference.

I don't know where this thread is headed but we should maintane a respectful attitude towards one another. The reason for is is that there are only a hand full of Kwoons in the Long Island area and we all need to stick together. Kung Fu is just a pea in a sea of none kung fu school.

As far as I'm concerned from a sifu's perspective we have all had our diferences but as Sifu's we always work things out and looking towards the future. As kung fu students you should also mantaine a friendly raport and always set a good example.

The nonsense about we are wu shu or we are a fighting school and that guy got beat up at a tournament, these discussions are counter productive. Quite frankly at first glance at this thread my first reaction was wow how petty and catty. Lets leave gossip to the girls.

If you want to talk about George Crayton's tourney well I was dissapointed that more schools didn't show up. The first kung fu tourney on long island in years and the attendance was horible. Sifu's showed up but with no students, where is the support?? That's why the comercial schools will always throw better karate tourney because they are better at net working.

If we could all put our petty differences aside and work on promoting kung fu together than maybe the industry won't be 30 years behind the karate industry.


greencloud.net

[Green Cloud]

I think he fought one og gregs guys a george craytons tornament and he got his a** kicked


TJ this is what I'm talking about you weren't at the Crayton tourney so how would you know that. Read the thread the guy was just pluging green cloud and he never said that gregs guys don't fight.

Famenchuan, chill out no one from my school fights anyone without the expressed permission from me and I'm sure sifu Zilb feels the same way. Don't make me call your sifu:mad:

greencloud.net

[Green Cloud]

Thats what happens with most instructers who only teach martial arts fo a living and dont have any other job,they dont give a rats *** what they teach as long as you and evry one else keeps paying


TJ how are profesional martial arts instructors supposed to pay the rent. Are we supposed to live on welfare. And why would someone teach kung fu without getting paid. I paid Millions for my training and sacrificed my whole life to learn kung fu. That statement makes no sense.:o

[GreenCloudCLF]

:confused: :confused: People are still issuing internet challenges?:confused: :confused:

[Green Cloud]

Yea, the funny thing is these button heads are issuing challenges, meanwhile their sifu's are friends:rolleyes:

greencloud.net

[t.j]

TJ how are profesional martial arts instructors supposed to pay the rent. Are we supposed to live on welfare. And why would someone teach kung fu without getting paid. I paid Millions for my training and sacrificed my whole life to learn kung fu. That statement makes no sense.:o

sorry sifu you miss interpated what I ment,I was talking about kempo schools like united studios,and tiger shlomans.. you spent millions????

[t.j]

TJ this is what I'm talking about you weren't at the Crayton tourney so how would you know that. Read the thread the guy was just pluging green cloud and he never said that gregs guys don't fight.

Famenchuan, chill out no one from my school fights anyone without the expressed permission from me and I'm sure sifu Zilb feels the same way. Don't make me call your sifu:mad:

greencloud.net I know famenchuan for a long time and he is a great fighter he takes things personal when it comes to his system...

[Green Cloud]

Our schools are on good terms, Famenchuan's attitude could cause problems. This is what I was talking about. Ingchao was not out of line he was just pointing out stylistic differences.

Shaolin studios are northern we are southern, there was a question asked and Ingchao was trying to be informative. This is an open forum and I don't think he was out of line by pluging the school.

Northern Shaolin does resemble wu shu but it's not, It's just a way of describing the style without going into detail. Note that he never said anything about the fighting.

Famenchuans attitude seemed hostile, I found this disturbing since me and his sifu are on good terms.

As far as United studios is concerned They should realy be more concerned about them. United studios are opening schools left and right. They opened 2 in Shoreham wading river. And of course they know offer make believe kung fu.

The petty ****e has got to end I don't have time for this. This is what I was talking about in my last thread. We got bigger fish to fry, these kempo schools are like a virus and they are spreading fast.

When it comes to challenges I take them seriously, especialy from another kung fu guy. Chalenging one of my students means youre chalenging me!!

greencloud.net

[GreenCloudCLF]

The worst of Kung-Fu + The worst of Karate = Kempo on Long Island

[Green Cloud]

Yup that's a great way to put it. Bad kung fu + bad karate = United Studios of self defense.

[richard sloan]

Do not even get me started on USSD.

Technically speaking DeMasco is my gong fu brother since we both undertook the San Bao vows, but he is whoring Shaolin in the worst way and it is frankly embarassing to many monks and other disciples. Some things that go on are internal family matters but this is some unprecedented crap with this guy.

In fact, some of the things he has put out there is what prompted SYM to write his book...I remember the day quite clearly. The man is full blown laying out claims and putting out innacurate information any disciple would immediately know as bunk. He doesn't even have his generations right in some of his printed materials.

Greencloud you are right, it never ceases to amaze me at how quick people are to incorrectly percieve where their energies should be devoted- USSD is a sham and is attacking the treasure many of us hold dear- the legacy of Shaolin.

One of the worst affronts I have heard of from USSD actually took place in Vegas- my gong fu brother and Gene's as they share the same shifu, the author of the russbo site, was doing seminars- his posters came back torn up in an envelope. Can you imagine!! These clowns tore up posters of Xing Wei or Shi De Cheng- on that score I don't recall who's image. Actually now that I think about it it must have been De Cheng because when I told SYM what happened he practically went apoplectic and we went to look for flights to Vegas.

I myself walked into a USSD studio- one right next to Green Cactus off Willis Ave- really good taquieria. All over the walls were posters of shaolin "monks." All Yong Xin's people I would imagine. The pitch was hard and fast, and all of it was "Shaolin." I have seen DeMascos books and what a travesty so I can only imagine what this clown was teaching. In the book his basics are like watching Eddie Murphy live. The guy is still training so what the hell is he doing teaching as an offical ambassador and poor Guolin who I thought was the official ambassador, and the way he has his belt awards and testing at Shaolin, what a sleight of hand he is pulling, as if his black belts are somehow sanctioned by Shaolin.

In any case I am not a liar so I point blank told the instructor there that I was only interested in getting some tacos next door but I saw the posters so I wanted to check out the school to see what that was about and I was already training Shaolin gong fu under Shi Yan Ming. This homeboy actually told me, why are you going all the way into the city when you could learn all that right here.

I laughed- I could not help it. It was the funniest shyte I had heard all week.

I was happy to see that school close the next time I went back for the carne asada. Unfortunately it was replaced by a Quizmos or Subways, which was worse USSD or either of those I am not sure. I don't know how a sandwich chain like that can exist in the NY or L.I area but there are also dominoes and pizza hut so go figure.

I don't know much about the other schools mentioned in this thread but I my younger brother came to check out a class at Greencloud in the Sunvet mall. He had been in a very severe accident and needed someplace close by our family home to train. A poster from russbo who used to post under the name Jeff and was a student of Chan Tai San's and was with him when CTS came to visit us held Sifu Gus there in very high esteem. My brother said the classes looked great and that is more than enough of an endorsement as far as I am concerned. I guess in the end he did not sign up and just started making the arduous trip into the temple, after all it saved his life so I guess he felt like he had to make the effort to get back.

I think I also met one of the greencloud students on line at a local bank. He comported himself exactly as a good gong fu student.

t.j- my experience at the Temple has been spectacular.

[greencloudtj]

I was the guy you talked to at the bank. Sifu gus is a great sifu and it was a privlige to train with him. It just wasent for me my heart is set on nothern kung fu that is what i tranied for 2 years prier. have a good one brother

[Lama Pai Sifu]

TJ,

You are going back to Northen Shaolin? Why no more training at GC?

[Green Cloud]

Thanks for the compliment Rich, I hope your training is going well and I'm happy to hear that you guys have found a home. Talk to you soon peace.

Lama Sifu in short TJ is my friend and he is just looking for something else. Like I said different stroaks for different folks. I'm southern he likes northern. I wish him the best he is a good guy.

As far as Damasco is concerned the title ambassador of Shaolin, that's bought and paid for and only means that that he is a gloryfied travel agent. His job is to bring lots of people to Shaolin. It doesn't state that he knows any kung fu what so ever.

Take one look at his ridiculous book and well pictures tell 1,000 words. Hey what can I say the British bought Hong Kong for how much?? It seems that most Chinese including revered monks are fooled by the Charms of the west.

Little do they know the West doesn't abide by idealistic and ethical standars of the Shaolin way.

It's amazing how people get away with such fraud.

[YenYuChuen]

Hi guys:

I was wondering if someone could help me; I live in Costa Rica, I've been taking Shaolin Kung Fu lessons for the past 6 months, I do feel fine but I don't know, sometimes I feel that something is missing, we run a lot, we do stretching, a lot of conditionning and forms but ever since I started we haven't done sparring or techniques at all. By the way, my professor is just an instructor, he took like an intensive course in Argentina for a month with Sifu Carlos Aleman. What do you suggest I should do, keep going training or move to some other academy?
Thanks.

[famenchuan]

Our schools are on good terms, Famenchuan's attitude could cause problems. This is what I was talking about. Ingchao was not out of line he was just pointing out stylistic differences.

Shaolin studios are northern we are southern, there was a question asked and Ingchao was trying to be informative. This is an open forum and I don't think he was out of line by pluging the school.

Northern Shaolin does resemble wu shu but it's not, It's just a way of describing the style without going into detail. Note that he never said anything about the fighting.

Famenchuans attitude seemed hostile, I found this disturbing since me and his sifu are on good terms.

As far as United studios is concerned They should realy be more concerned about them. United studios are opening schools left and right. They opened 2 in Shoreham wading river. And of course they know offer make believe kung fu.

The petty ****e has got to end I don't have time for this. This is what I was talking about in my last thread. We got bigger fish to fry, these kempo schools are like a virus and they are spreading fast.

When it comes to challenges I take them seriously, especialy from another kung fu guy. Chalenging one of my students means youre chalenging me!!

greencloud.net


No disrespect to Sifu Gus but when somebody describes a martial art they should describe it as what the art is really. A nothern tradional, southern traditional or wushu. You know we study a Nothern traditional and that's what it should be described as. There are also southern wushu styles and you would not be happy if someone called your art wushu. Please explain to your student that we are a nothern tradtional school and that our traditional schools should stick together.

[GeneChing]

You do know that Russbo got his black belt through USSD, right? :p

[Green Cloud]

Hi jean, actualy I didn't know that. I just know him through some people that train at the shaolin temple in Vegas. From what I know he is a multi milionare and made his money in the medical industry. He does this as a hobby and funds the temple in vegas, I don't think he has any dealings with United studios.

[ingchao]

FaMenChaun:

I apologize if I offended you or your school. Like Sifu Gus said, I was just plugging Green Cloud.
I did not realize describing a school as Wushu was the equivalent of a racist remark. Your style is very athletic in its' execution of forms and I made a mistake in the way I described it.
Green Cloud also correctly stated that I did not mention fighting. I have seen some of your people fight full contact years ago at sports plus and they were very good fighters. That night I also saw Sifu Moses fight and he destroyed his opponent!

Can we please put this to rest?

[t.j]

thats a great idea im done with this stupid forum it's for all the #### talkers and i have a life unlike some people. and by the way all the smack talking gets right back to me so if someone has something to say you all have my phone number so dont be shy because like i said it all gets back to me and i dont need any more friends expesialy ones who talk crap about me and make up **** so peace to all and we all learn from our mistakes and ive learned from mine....so lets all keep focused on our kung fu traning

[famenchuan]

FaMenChaun:

I apologize if I offended you or your school. Like Sifu Gus said, I was just plugging Green Cloud.
I did not realize describing a school as Wushu was the equivalent of a racist remark. Your style is very athletic in its' execution of forms and I made a mistake in the way I described it.
Green Cloud also correctly stated that I did not mention fighting. I have seen some of your people fight full contact years ago at sports plus and they were very good fighters. That night I also saw Sifu Moses fight and he destroyed his opponent!

Can we please put this to rest?

No problem man it is a dead issue. Good luck in your training.

[Green Cloud]

I know I want to put this to rest, but I can't help it I'm at home witha bum leg and the wife isn't home and I have nothing better to do. But just for the record so you guy know that we are not to blame.

My personal experience with one of your guys is a child prodigy that came from Sifu Moses. I encouraged him to train at my school since he needed a place to work out. Well that boy did strait out Wu shu and he was fantastic I'm talking Jet lee material.

When my students asked me if he was one of my student's I shook my head and said nope he is one of Sifu Moses guys. Back in the day I also saw Sifu Moses in competition doing some Wu Shu, I got it on tape.

This isn't a diss I myself did nanchuan, we were kids it was fun and it was cool and it won tropheys. Later I discovered that Javan Holmes a great Wu Shu stylist that I know was actualy training Rory, none the less this kid had great respect for one of my friends and that is sifu Moses.

My students have also seen Sifu Zilb perform a drunken set that is a Wu Su set he is amazing at it but it's wu shu and there is nothing wrong with that. As far as Sifu Zilbs abilities I have much respect for them.

I love Wu Shu and I think it's cool, why you guys would take that as an insult I don't know. You have to understand we were going by what we saw. Not to say That we didn't see any traditional forms. I've seen some forms That are done by Shi Yang Ming wich are traditional that I believe are in your system. So Ingchao's statement was realy not an insult. He assumed that you guys did Wu Shu and Nothern Shaolin.

I hope this sheds some light on things. As far as who the best fighter is common you guys know it's me;)

[Green Cloud]

thats a great idea im done with this stupid forum it's for all the #### talkers and i have a life unlike some people. and by the way all the smack talking gets right back to me so if someone has something to say you all have my phone number so dont be shy because like i said it all gets back to me and i dont need any more friends expesialy ones who talk crap about me and make up **** so peace to all and we all learn from our mistakes and ive learned from mine....so lets all keep focused on our kung fu traning

TJ i hope everything is alright you sound mad about something?? Don't worry about it, this is just a bublic forum with different opinions. You know what they say about opinions there like ase holees everyones got one. Peace


greencloud.net

[richard sloan]

Take it easy guys, if the real deal holyfields split only the chaff will be left.

I do seem to recall there was an instructor, I guess it must be Sifu Zilb from the sound of it, who learned or picked up some stuff from Shi Yan Ming, many years back.

I don't think that is a relationship that continued because I would know but that is interesting some stuff made it into the curriculum.

Man, I haven't been to Sportsplus since Halo came out, lol...

Doc's black belt is a rich vein of comedy.

[GeneChing]

Green Cloud: It's true. It's always important to know the backgrounds of feuds like russbo's with ussd. It fills in the context. richard sloan's comment nails it on the head.

t.j: Come on now. It's an online discussion forum of the martial arts. Were you expecting everyone to agree with you nicely, and if so, why? Only losers quit.

[Green Cloud]

Jean you know you are opening up a can of worms right?? Dr. Richard Russle was just another unknowing sucker at United studios of self defense. After visiting Shaolin it was only then he realized that everyone at United had beed lied to.

What they did was a sham, UNSS style didn't even come close to the shaoilin monks way of doing things. After Russbo had his Malcom X moment he then went back to United studios to inform them that they are a fraud.

United studios decided to start a smere campaine against Russbo. Russbo decided if people would listen to the truth, he would bring the truth to them. It took 3 years of hard work to get Visas for the monks and finaly brought them over. He built and funded the temple. This is a missunderstood man but a man of great integrity.

Reliable sources tell me that Richard Russle was very disturbed over the poverty and treatment of boys that are dropped off by their parents to learn Shaolin. The conditions were very hard. Most of these kids get to see there families maybe one a year.

This man has done a lot to counteract the harm that United studios and other organizations have done to these people. Hey what can I say don't shoot the messenger.

Last I herd The man lives in Thailand what a life hugh no to shabby.

greencloud.net

[quickjab]

Richard is there any sparring ar SYM's temple?

[richard sloan]

well one thing is for sure- china is a transformative experience.

I give Dr. Russell a lot of props for his work and his efforts. And his humor, lol...

I will not soon forget my time at Shaolin. First of all, it was during the big shakeup- yet even though a lot of the kids did not have a "school" anymore, they would still form up and train- in rubble.

At the tail end of this trip Master De Yang had just located an abandoned school which he could take over. Yong Xin was really flexing, and there was just a lot of open questions and nobody knew what was really going to happen. We thought we were just going to the airport and taking a detour, but De Yang had other plans for us. After about a 45 minute drive we turned off the road we were on according to his direction. Shifu had been a little upset that Master De Yang was in the position he was in- and we did not have any opportunity to train with them. Well we turn off the road and what a sight. His students and disciples were lined up in the road for like a mile waiting for us, all hands clasped in front of their chests and full robes. They had hosed down the field to keep the dust down. You could see they had planted hundreds of flowers all around. And at the reception, they had simply set out a bottle of water for each of us. Shifu was nothing but waterworks and the whole thing was like we were watching the first five minutes of Bambi looped.

That and the screams from the little kids being stretched...not something you could forget easily...

It did not help USSDs marketing to have a monk's disciple- a real disciple- much less a monk like De Cheng, in their backyard...especially when the people being sent over on their behalf were not exactly...um....well I must be diplomatic.

I think a lot could be said without saying it.

Quick- fighting is not really a big concern for the majority of our students. There is some informal sparringamongst a few of us but much of the training is hardcore pad work which I actually like a lot better than sparring- you can do full power techs and not risk ruining your kung fu brothers or yourself. In my last couple of schools before I went to the temple I did a lot of sparring, but you never could really do full contact even when they say it is, and if you have a good partner working with you doing padwork you get the same benefits and you train full out full power. Light sparring I never found to be very beneficial personally, I just found it very frustrating.

I really like working pads and a lot of our fighting stuff I think really needs that kind of training for you to derive maximum benefits. Like Fototui. To really get that kick, well to just goof around and light to medium spar with it, it doesn't work and you wind up training a weak ***** version of it.

I actually think that in this respect training grappling skills have an easier time of it- it is easier to train grappling arts contact wise.

[Green Cloud]

Richard please don't digress from the issues that are USSD. Just like the Indians sold Manhatted for some trinkets, I feel the Shaolin Monks were dooped by them.

Because Of USSD many traditionalist turned threir backs on the Monks due to the fact That USSD was involved with them. This truly hert Shaolins rep, and made it seem that they can be bought for any price. The whole embassador of Shaolin thing with Demasco was realy a joke and in the long run hurt Shaolin.

When it came to my organization we refused to have anything to do with the monks, nor did I feel like visiting The temple in China once USSD was involved. I know I was dissapointed that the monks would allow them selves to be plaid by these guys.

I just hope that more virtuous Kung Fu schools can alighn them selves with Shaolin and realy focus on the issues at hand in China, like the kids for one. Most of them never see their parents again and train for 20 years for what?? A few become cops and work for the military and for the rest it's just a hard life ahead.

That sucks when large franchises make big money off their blood sweat and tears. What sickens me is none of that money goes back to China.


greencloud.net

[richard sloan]

Greencloud- trust me bredren I hear you loud and clear.

It is something that is just....well, it is upsetting to some of the monks.

You must realize that with Shi Yong Xins ascendency, some would even argue usurpation, of the Abbocy, many things are different now.

With the recent passing of Shi Su Xi, I fear even more will change. Even before his passing much was under a kind of assault. For example, many monks going through the san bao di zi again under Yong Xin...

As Shaw bros moviesque as it might sound there are sort of what you could call families within the temple, and not everyone is supportive of the things such as DeMasco and Mattera's whoring of the treasures which are of such value as to be indescribable.

I've mentioned that looking at some of the materials presented by them vexed Shi Yan Ming to the point where he wrote a book. What is perhaps most embarassing to me is they are my gong fu brothers, albeit well removed- they should at least endeavour to represent Shaolin to the best of their ability- even if it is a money ploy at least come correct. But don't fudge simple things that even a non disciple would know.

You are totally right, it casts Shaolin in a horrible light and it makes it look very hypocritical to hear about how the Temple is now issuing law suits to "protect" itself from infringements. You are aware of their trips to Shaolin, and their "testing" in front of the monks? What a crock- especially as it is presented to their own students, as if this is some kind of official endorsement and the belts are issued by the temple and it's monks.

Compounding the issue is the convergence of the Abbot, the PRC and the local gov, and the money being made by everyone angling to cash in. Money is what created the surrounding wushu schools- god man it is such a complicated issue it is really tough to see it with any kind of clarity even if you are in it- and even some of them are folk master run or monk established because for awhile there was a purge at Shaolin that drove out some of the traditional masters who held the gong fu transmission, if not also much of the Ch'an. Monks like De Yang, De Cheng, all have their own wushu guans.

Presently I am sure you are aware of the legal issues now surrounding Shaolin and usage of the name. In Vienna, my gong fu brother is involved in a legal dispute initiated by the temple in Henan. At the heart of the matter is what is "Shaolin."

Now this temple was founded by Shi Yan Ming- a Shaolin Monk. Shi Yong Xin also opened a school- same area through a German group.

Yong Xin's temple failed- the disciples he sent had no bones and withered.

With right speech, right conduct, and planting shaolin flowers, then certain things will prevail.

You speak as though you have some direct exposure to USSD.

[richard sloan]

also green cloud- the chinese are very crafty- you know this.

from one perspective it might look like Shaolin is being played, but perhaps one has to sadly wonder who is playing who when it comes to USSD and what is going on there. And also, many monks have little to no choice, and that is the really sad thing.

either way it sometimes makes me glad we are sort of doing our own thing. we still have connections to the temple where it counts, but we do not have to deal with any of the kinds of fuggery that USSD and "official" status would bring. Our capital campaign is in full swing, with over 160G raised. And we are spreading internationally as well, most recently to Trinidad.

I think Yan Ming would have an aneurism before he supported these clowns at USSD so I am glad that at least amongst certain circles they are like a pane of glass.

The poster tearing incident was about to get very interesting.

Did you see the book of secrets they were gifted and had "translated."

They may have used the Bo Peel Publishing House. After reading the web site I wanted to take a shower in gasoline.

[Green Cloud]

Hello Rich hope all is well, I apreciate talking to some like your self since you are so well informed. Not like the rest of the big birds that like to stick their heads into the ground. As far as my dealings with United Studios is concerned, I trained some of their instructors who wanted to learn some kung fu.

I got to see first hand how under handed of an operation United Studios realy is. These people are scum and down right fradulent when it come to the Shaolin stuff. These guys are cunning buissnesmen and should not be under estimated ever.

They will seem very friendly at first and sincear about learning kung fu, but all they do is gather intel for their own use. With or without your permission they will eventualy steal what ever they can and use it in their studios.

Don't get me wrong I have no problem with people teaching Kung Fu when they actualy get good at it and are authorized to teach it. As far as quality is concerned if it sells and makes money who cares about deceiving the public. When it came to the monks well I guess they used Money to take care of the problems.

In no way do I blame the monks for this they were just used the same way I was.


greencloud.net

[richard sloan]

GC everything is cool, hope you are well and training hard.

So you got to train some of their instructors, I am surprised they did not suddenly have pictures of Green Cloud Monastery and all your martial ancestors plastered all over their walls.

Probably one of the things most heartbreaking is the sheer and unbridled usury of some of these monks and the sad thing is it comes from all sides.



Hello Rich hope all is well, I apreciate talking to some like your self since you are so well informed. Not like the rest of the big birds that like to stick their heads into the ground. As far as my dealings with United Studios is concerned, I trained some of their instructors who wanted to learn some kung fu.

I got to see first hand how under handed of an operation United Studios realy is. These people are scum and down right fradulent when it come to the Shaolin stuff. These guys are cunning buissnesmen and should not be under estimated ever.

They will seem very friendly at first and sincear about learning kung fu, but all they do is gather intel for their own use. With or without your permission they will eventualy steal what ever they can and use it in their studios.

Don't get me wrong I have no problem with people teaching Kung Fu when they actualy get good at it and are authorized to teach it. As far as quality is concerned if it sells and makes money who cares about deceiving the public. When it came to the monks well I guess they used Money to take care of the problems.

In no way do I blame the monks for this they were just used the same way I was.


greencloud.net

[Green Cloud]

Good point Rich, I actualy caught them using my material several times. They werent alowed to use my name or material since I took the liberty to have them sighn a contact. The name Green Cloud AKA Clear Cloud also is has a copyrite.

Unfortunatly it wouldn't be a problem if they gave credit to me for learning the material, istead they simply steal material and insist that it's part of their system. This is typical for USSD.

The other thing they like to do is atach them selves to an ethnic Chinese to establish legitamacy, Case in point the Monks. It wouldn't be so bad if they were actualy good at kung fu.

Schools like this are the reason Kung Fu is loosing respect in the MA world, but at least there are guys like you that know the difference so maybe there is hope after all.

[richard sloan]

yeah if it weren't so sad it would be funny.

this is a perfect example of the kind of crap I am talking about:



Released for the first time ever in the United States of America…
Secrets of the Shaolin Temple....Revealed!

You Can Now Discover the Secret Training Principles of the Legendary Shaolin Temple and How They Train the Famous Warrior Monks - Discover the Training Techniques that They Use to Fly Through the Air, Walk on Walls, and Other Incredible Feats of Strength and Skill!
Dear Friend,

For the first time ever, you can have access to the "Dead Sea Scrolls" of the martial arts - the actual recorded history and information from the very beginning of the Legendary Shaolin Temple.

Stop everything you are doing. Turn off your cell phone, throw away the remote and don’t answer the door. This may be the most important letter that you’ll ever read.

My name is William Huff and I am going to reveal to you how you can get access to this information, but before I do, let me tell you how it was even possible.

I am a 4th degree Black Belt in the Shaolin Arts and for the last fourteen years it has been my privilege and honor to work with some of the finest masters in the martial arts. It is through one of these great masters that it was possible to even get this information. Let me explain...



I mean come on...and it gets worse.

[richard sloan]

how about this gem:


It was during this visit that Mr. Mattera was informed that his abilities as a Shaolin Master would be tested, by none other than the Head Abbot of the Shaolin Temple himself!

Imagine going to visit the highest authority in the martial arts world, and while you’re there, he tells you that you are going to test your abilities against the Warrior Monks of China!

What happened next was shocking. The Head Abbot was so impressed that not only was Mr. Mattera promoted to 10th Degree Black Belt in the Art of Shaolin Kempo, but the Head Abbot adopted Mr. Mattera as a son; gave him a Chinese name, and made him an Official Disciple of the Shaolin Temple!

That had never happened in the history of the Shaolin Temple!

I don't even know where to begin.

[TenTigers]

where are you finding all this drivel?
I'd sooner learn Kung-Fu from David Carradine.
(jeez, I just made myself vomit in my mouth)

[Green Cloud]

Come on Rick you got to be kiding me this is old news, these guys are out of control. Too bad Shaolin can't paten their stuff so they can sue dirty scum like them. How can this happen how does this happen it's down right hurtful.

Anyway USSD is definately the axis of evil, no Ideal, no ethics, no morals.green cloud

[richard sloan]

where are you finding all this drivel?
I'd sooner learn Kung-Fu from David Carradine.
(jeez, I just made myself vomit in my mouth)

TT this is coming right from their website.

It's simply stunning. The website for this book set is like watching that BoPeel guy sell pocket fishermen or some crazy juicer with 7 different juicing attachments and if you order now you get a steak knife set.

Yet they do not lack for students.

[Green Cloud]

Actualy the steak knife set isn't bad. :D

[Green Cloud]

So seriously Rich how the training going what are you guys working on?? and oh yea it's 12:00 what are you still doing up??;)

[richard sloan]

lol...I am working on too much GC...updating our website with a Shi Su Xi memorial page, a return to trinidad to assist the disciple there and get another round of seminars planned...and I was just away in Jamaica for 2 months trying to make my money so I am trying to get my wind back for a return to a more serious training regimen...

but I got addicted to computer chess so that is why I am still up, lol...too bad I can not seem to get myself addicted to trying to kiss my toes heh heh heh...

[Green Cloud]

Sounds like life is a great time Joy gin:)

[richard sloan]

and I left out xiao bao chuan...lol...baby leopard fist.

[GeneChing]

...but I found a Shaolin teacher in Medford....

Master of martial arts (http://www.mailtribune.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20091013/NEWS/910130322)
Former Buddhist warrior monk teaches students through the St. Mary's 'Confucious Classroom' grant
October 13, 2009
By Paris Achen

Zheng Hongfeng, a former Buddhist warrior monk, has entered another realm, but not the kind spelled out in the tenets of Buddhism.

The former head instructor and bodyguard to the abbot at China's famous Shaolin Temple, the birthplace of Shaolin kung fu in the fifth century, now teaches kung fu to four Catholic high school girls at St. Mary's School as well as martial artists at Medford's Valor Fighting studio.

"The reason I came here is I want to improve relations between the United States and China," Hongfeng said through a translator. "We have similar physical land masses and big economies, yet our cultures are so dramatically different. With the differences can come misunderstanding and fear. By helping the West understand Asian culture, I can help improve relations between the two countries."

The kung fu master, regarded as the best in the world at 12 styles of kung fu, landed in Medford as the result of a chance encounter with the son of the St. Mary's principal.

Nick Phillips, son of Principal Frank Phillips and now a teacher at the Catholic school, fell in love with a Chinese woman, Xia Yun, who was attending the same graduate school.

While on a 2006 visit to meet her family in China, Phillips' future father-in-law insisted Phillips study kung fu — an important part of Chinese culture — if he wanted to continue to date Xia Yun.

"I lived the monastic life for one week at the Shaolin Temple eating vegetarian meals and studying kung fu, and then I was found worthy," Nick Phillips said.

That's where Phillips met Hongfeng, who mentioned to the American that he would like to teach kung fu in the United States.

At the time, Phillips didn't think there was much of a likelihood he would be able to help Hongfeng in his aspiration. Then, last year, an arm of the Chinese government dedicated to spreading Chinese language and culture named St. Mary's as its first "Confucius Classroom" in North America for its Mandarin program. The designation came along with an annual $50,000 grant and Mandarin instructors provided by the Chinese government. Through the program, St. Mary's was able to bring Hongfeng to help teach an important aspect of Chinese culture — kung fu.

"It's a really good way to get students interested in the (Mandarin) language," Phillips said. "We hook them with the culture, and then start them with the hard work."

Other monks from Shaolin have come to the United States to teach, but usually in bigger cities such as San Francisco, which has its own Shaolin Temple.

A resident of Dengfeng, Hongfeng was accustomed to instructing students who spent all day learning kung fu at the temple. Now he is instructing students, some of who took his class to fulfill a physical education class.

His four St. Mary's students have never been to China and were new to the practice of kung fu.

"I realized I could do kung fu instead of playing dodgeball," quipped sop****re Pari Parsons. "I tend to hurt myself whenever I touch anything ball-shaped. This is a pretty good alternative."

At 8:15 a.m., Hongfeng's small class convenes in the St. Mary's gymnasium. All of the instruction is given in Mandarin, along with a few words in English such as "no," "yes," "one," "two" and "three." Hongfeng is taking English language classes at Medford's Rogue Community College but still hasn't attained enough of the language to give commands. Instead, he uses a lot of modeling, gestures and facial expressions to communicate with students.

The class is intended to teach kung fu as a means of physical fitness rather than a spiritual practice, and students said the exercise is effective.

"It's actually hard," said senior Paige Robino. "If you are not doing the position well enough, he will make you hold it for a long time. He just pushes you past your limit."

Hongfeng began teaching at St. Mary's and Valor in April but almost didn't make it back this fall because of visa problems.

He received his work visa just in time to return for the fall semester, but because of doubt about whether he would make it, the kung fu class hadn't been included in the class schedule, which led to the small class size.

The kung fu class gives the students a taste of Chinese culture as well as a memorable experience.

"Your average school doesn't have a Shaolin Temple master," Parsons noted.

Reach reporter Paris Achen at 776-4459 or e-mail pachen@mailtribune.com.

[TenTigers]

wow, when I met my Chinese ex, all her mom had me do was drive her to Mah-Jong, or pick up oxtails and tripe...
oh yeah, I once took her to get a new hearing aid...

[David Jamieson]

With the internet and access to volumes of information in refutation and in support, how does anyone in the last decade mistake the disingenuous for anything other than what it really is?

Do people not look into these things for themselves?

Is it really that easy to dupe the masses?

I guess it is. Go figure!