View Full Version : Its there another Taijiquan

shaolin white crane
04-03-2001, 06:14 AM
I just recently learn that there is another version of Yang taijiquan that was practice before the modification of Yang Cheng Fu, Does anyone know something about it?, What is diferente about it?
Order of sequence of movements

Mr. Nemo
04-03-2001, 06:54 AM
Some people claim to teach what they call "Old Yang" style, supposedly the style that Yang Lu-Chan did (before Cheng-fu's modifications, obviously). Erle Montaigue (not sure if that's spelled right) teaches this style.

I don't really have any idea how many grains of salt you should take their claims with. There's a guy around here called Sam Wiley that is knowledgable about this stuff. He'll post a **** dictionary's worth of info if you get him going.

04-03-2001, 01:50 PM
If I am not mistaken, Dennis Rovere (who posts on this forum) has studied "Old Yang Style" Tai Chi. He is an excellent source of information.

"Luminous beings are we."

shaolin white crane
04-05-2001, 06:48 PM
Thank you for the comments, I live in Mexico, so good tradicional trainig is hard to come by, if anybody knows something more about old yang style, I urge them to post an aswer.
Thank you

Sam Wiley
04-05-2001, 08:34 PM
Buenos Dias, Shaolin White Crane. Como estas?

There are actually a lot of differences between the new and old Yang styles. Some movements were eliminated, others were changed, fa-jing movements were eliminated, as well as several low postures, leaping kicks and leaping spins were taken out. Some of the sequences were changed. For instance, in the old Yang form, Grasping Sparrow's Tail is done about 8 different ways, while in the newer form it is only done a few different ways. There are also more subtle differences between the two, such as slightly different weighting or weight changes.

The old Yang style form is more martial and more athletic as well.

Erle Montaigue has a book available on his website for download (for free) that details this form, with sequential photographs and in depth explanation. Just click on the "full index" link (I think that's the name of it) on his starting page, and then go to the free items section, and the book is listed near the top if I remember right. It's in 4 parts, so you just have to go through the download and print process 4 times. But it's a pretty big book to be printing on your printer, so you may want to just leave it on your hard drive to look at it on screen.

In addition to the main form, there are a few other forms in the system, as well as training methods that are probably no longer around except in this particular system.

Erle's claims that his "old yang" form is the original do have some merit, as the form in places resembles the Chen style more than the new Yang form (and the Chen style is one of the arts this form was based on), plus it strongly resembles the Wudang Taiji forms Erle teaches. At his recent workshop in New Jersey, he taught us some of the Wudang "push hands" methods, and not only do they include movements straight out of the Wudang Taiji forms he teaches (in some cases even including the qi disruption moves, though the "push hands" exercises are not themselves about qi disruption as far as I know), but they strongly resemble movements from the old Yang style form Erle teaches. As well, the old Yang form itself has movements directly out of these Wudang forms, suggesting that there is at least some connection.

Anyway, take a look at the book and the form in it, and if you want to learn it, Erle has video tapes that teach this form. As far as I know, the closest WTBA instructor to you would be Tom Wilson, in New Mexico, though I could be wrong. Tom's a pretty cool guy, but in any case, if Tom is too far away, you still have the tapes, which are pretty good content-wise.

And if you ever travel into Atlanta, look me up, or e-mail me; you're welcome to drop by and train with me any time.

Oh, before I forget, Erle's website is at http://www.taijiworld.com

If you go to the full index section, you can find Tom's e-mail under the USA instructors section. You might want to e-mail Erle as well, and see if he has an instructor in Mexico that would be closer.

Hasta lluego! :)

"I put forth my power and he was broken.
I withdrew my power and he was ground into fine dust."
-Aleister Crowley, The Vision and the Voice

Sam Wiley
04-05-2001, 08:37 PM
Well...I tried to keep it short! ;)

"I put forth my power and he was broken.
I withdrew my power and he was ground into fine dust."
-Aleister Crowley, The Vision and the Voice