The thais start early...

[SevenStar]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGnaOQigIlU&eurl=

[tug]

Good stuff. If that kid keeps it up, he's going to be a serious force in the ring. I think he had good basics - form, stance, excellent trademark MT kicks. Knees and elbows he still needs a little work on though :). Looks like he can already hit pretty hard too.

[Hieronim]

its funny how they train so much more and start os muche arlier yet couldnt even beat kid kope, that other guy with him, or even the young Osbourne.

[ChinoXL]

eh.. buddy newsflash young osbourne was staged, it's called money :eek: and that kid is a little monster

[Hieronim]

news flash, msot thais have very short and young careers. It isnt what I would call a healthy sport.

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

i bet he could beat up his mom already.

i think he should just to see if he can.

[Ray Pina]

Kid's pretty crisp already. Hopefully he can stay healthy and not wear himself out.


That one guy kneeing the bag though, seemed like he was kind of jumpy, his foot on the ground didn't seem stable, like that would be the time to throw him.

I know he's just training, and that drill was more for will than technique, but I think you can get a bad habit that way. Same with doing 10 fast consecutive kicks on the same leg .... can wear out the leg and wich one is perfect?

I think it's better to just do a good, solid crisp kick, then good solid crisp punching, then good solid crisp knees and elbows. But this is just the way I aproach training and surely those guys can handle their own.

That last guy punching away on the guys stomach pad, he looks ready to go.

[SevenStar]

news flash, msot thais have very short and young careers. It isnt what I would call a healthy sport.


their careers aren't really short, when you compare it to the number of fights they have. By the time they are 21, many have had 100 fights or more.

[Pork Chop]

Ray- they control you in the clinch and *then* throw that knee or throw it as a close quarters counter to a punch. With that much body behind it, it's gonna hurt. And no, he's probably not going to throw them rapid fire like that in a fight, between 1 and 3 at a time I'd figure.

sevenstar- trudat. Buakaw por pramuk is like 200-60-40 (or 200-40-60, i forget); point is, he's on the top of the ladder at K-1 max and has 300 fights. I hear he's still fighting almost every month. He survives another year or two (I'd say he'll be at the top of his game for another 3 to 5 years) and he's going to have more fights than any boxer that ever lived.

Thai boxing is much more healthy on the body than boxing- because it displaces the damage across the whole body. There's no reason a thai boxer couldn't have a career as long as any nba player, many do, and mainstream western sports have AT LEAST as high occurance for injury (in most cases higher).

I think the reason most thai boxers retire by 27~28 is that most get into it so they can have enough money to eat, it's not a hobby for them as it is for us, but a necessity. by that age, they've probably got enough in the bank to go off and do something else.

being "the national sport of thailand" not withstanding I don't think all that many thais like muay thai anymore. it's a lil like boxing over here. people can name off ali and tyson; but most american parents aren't going to push their kids in that direction. there are better, less painful ways to make a living.

Speaking of Thai, I had my first workout at my new gym last night and it killed me. I'm so outta shape. The coach trained with bunkerd and jongsanan fairtex and really knows his stuff. It looks like I'm probably going to be able to hit up the big seminar in plano with Saeksan, Sakasem, Bunkerd, Jongsanaan, and Matee.
Things are starting to turn way up. :)

[Hieronim]

their careers aren't really short, when you compare it to the number of fights they have. By the time they are 21, many have had 100 fights or more.

I heard being a thai boxer at 22 is like old or something, and they use some shortcut methods like some oils to mask the bruises they have which wears their bodies down before they can heal and they fight again and keep repeating the processes. And it is alot mroe brutal than boxing cause getting kneed, elbowed, or having your shins collide is alot worse on the body than egtting punched by a glove.

[Ray Pina]

Ray- they control you in the clinch and *then* throw that knee or throw it as a close quarters counter to a punch. With that much body behind it, it's gonna hurt. And no, he's probably not going to throw them rapid fire like that in a fight, between 1 and 3 at a time I'd figure.

I understand that. But it takes two to clinch, and his "root" (for lack of a better word) seems to be up in the air and he kind of skips off his toes. If he did the same thing while driving off that leg, keeping his heal down, I'd say "right on, looks powerful."

With what he looks like he's doing, looks like a judo guy or someone experiences in the clinch, would feel that hoppiness and push up with one arm and pull down with the other and sweep him.

I understand anything can happen in a fight and there's no such thing as "that's it," just seems like he's reinforcing "hoppiness" instead of "rootness."

To each their own though. But I wouldn't want that.

[Pork Chop]

I totally understand what you're saying. In the thai clinch if you throw a knee like that at an inopportune time, they'll just push your hips (really more like your dan tien area) and you'll fall off balance.

I think you'd be really surprised at muay thai's level of technique- especially in the clinch. they have a reputation of being the leg version of hung gar's "if he offers a bridge, I smash it down". But there's a lot of other stuff in there too. The thai clinch is much more than the "plumb".

I had a big tai chi push hands and hsing yi background from when I started martial arts (kung fu) 12 years ago. I see a lot of the same principles. Unfortunately since most of them start as kids and have a LOOOONG time to learn the intricacies of the sport through doing it, they don't spend a ton of time talking about it, they pick a lot up through experience. The thai coaching style is more about "showing you" instead of "telling you".

The concept of the centerline is heavily covered in thai. Usually only thai coaches call it such, and only if asked, but it's a huge part of what they do.

In Judo you have kuzushi, which is the breaking of balance before the throw. In the thai clinch there's a very similar theory of breaking the balance before you throw the knees. Diesel Noi was a master of this (considered the greatest fighter ever)- probably because he was 6'3 and weighed 130 pounds. You tie up the opponents limbs, control his balance, and then launch your whole body behind a knee once he's helpless to defend. Most times you want to offbalance him in such a way that he crashes into the knee and doubles the force.

Watch Buakaw fighting Sanda, or fighting Andy Sauer in K1 max if you want to see proof that thais have kuzushi (and good throws) from the clinch.

The essential argument here is whether or not you should stay rooted in such an attack and I understand your point that you never wanna give up your root, but in this case you can get a heckuva lot more power behind that knee if you put everything behind it. Thais tend to have a lot more rooted knees when they're throwing them as a counter, as opposed to being in the clinch.

[Ray Pina]

Please don't misunderstand me. At no time did I say Thai bixing was no good or their principles were no good. I highly respect the Thai Boxer. I had issue with what the ONE guy was doing, and how.

I'm always open to see what's out there, and from my experience I naturally judge something as sound or faulty. And I know I carry my own prejudice when doing this, hard not to. My standard is, does it work? Obviously. Then, does it work small to big, old to young.

LLots of good stuff out there.

[Pork Chop]

no worries, i only replied that in depth coz i was thinking the exact same thing the first time i saw it- and yeah, the not-so-rooted bottom foot while throwing knees is standard practice.

As far as the age thing, thai gets a bad rap. A lot of the coaches in the states who've immigrated from Thailand are in their 40s & 50s. A lot of them regularly whip up on their students, often giving away upwards of 100 pounds but still bringing it. I just haven't seen the "crippled ex fighter" in practise. They just merely find other ways to make money that don't require such a dedicated lifestyle.

[SevenStar]

I heard being a thai boxer at 22 is like old or something, and they use some shortcut methods like some oils to mask the bruises they have which wears their bodies down before they can heal and they fight again and keep repeating the processes. And it is alot mroe brutal than boxing cause getting kneed, elbowed, or having your shins collide is alot worse on the body than egtting punched by a glove.


read above RE: relativity between age and number of fights.