Hsingi in New York

[Student]

Can anyone tell me anything about GrandMaster David Lin who teaches up in New York. Is this Guy pretty Good?

[count]

Very.ˇ

[Self-Thinking Follower]

:D :D :D :D :D

[Eight_Triagram_Boxer]

I have to agree with STF. He is not someone you'd want to learn from. Oh by the way...STF can you e-mail me? Baguaboxer@aol.com Thanks.

[razakdigital]

Hello,

I'm not a student of his but how does anyone know that he is not good?

Just curious ...I don't know anything about this guy

[count]

Is this the David Lin you 2 are chortling about?

http://www.combatshuaichiao.com/photo/m_t_c07c.jpg

Just curious. I have never met this man but his shuai chiao looks pretty good to me from a distance.

[Self-Thinking Follower]

Have you ever seen him? have you ever challenged him? have you ever played hands with him? Please do so! He came to my Mentors home and could'nt even fall properly!

His pseudo aikido influenced shuai (kuai) jiao has nothing to do with the real thing. A lot of people have no problem with him making money in America. I however, feel its wrong to rip people off with BOGUS claims of mastery, and you cant learn thru osmosis.

Please dont confuse him with the real David Lin of Shuai Chiao in Atlanta!

Eight Triagram, I hope your doing well, I will try to e-mail you soon.

[Self-Thinking Follower]

That's a picture of the REAL David Lin!
That's not who we are talking about.
Our fraud is Lin "cheat them young"

[razakdigital]

you guys answered my question

[count]

answered mine too.
;)

[Eight_Triagram_Boxer]

His students are like zombies that hang on his every word and for no good reason. I did actually go to his school to check him out. I took a free class for fun and while he tried demonstrating a take down on me he lost his balance and failed to take me down. Then his student did it with him and the student flung himself about 5 feet. He claimed that he didn't want to hurt me...and he gave me a rather sour face. Haha.
That's just one story...

I'm doing well STF, I just lost you e-mail... How are you?

[Esteban]

Hi,

FWIW, there's always a big difference between what a teacher can do and what a student can learn from him. I live in NYC, too, and I've seen lots of the instructors here. My opinion is that one can learn from David C.Y. Lin, regardless of what some might think of his ability. As for that, even if some westerners may not respect him, which is certainly not true, he is well respected in the Chinese community here. He was invited to sit at the upper-table at Li Tai Liang's tournament in January (Razak was there)sponsored by the PRC. He was also recognized at the recent inauguration of United Kung-Fu Federation of North America. Maybe he's a good "pitchman", but for some reason his picture is alongside those ofui Chan, Wai Hong, Lily Lau, Henry Poo Yee, William Chen, Gin Soon Chu, and Frank Yee, among others. Well, when representatives from Taiwan's (ROC) Culture Institute come to the city, they usually go to see him --and I'm not sure if they go to see anyone else. Anyway, David C.Y. Lin is, or was recently, a V.P. of the United States Chinese Koushu Federation. Some of his students have also competed and won at the USCKF tournaments. Well, I could go on, but I didn't write to defend Lin, only to point out that some people, including myself, respect him. I think you could also ask Pat Rice, the director at A Taste of China. Of course, most traditional instructors will say, if you can't learn from someone, study with someone else.
Shucks, I only wanted to put in my .02, and it turned out to be a dime.
Respects,
Esteban

[virus fist]

He is a good politician and have the "looks" of a Master,but when it comes to show me....well....

I saw that old man do a Pa Kua demostration once and fortunately that joke lasted only one minute.

To each it's own.


VF

[Self-Thinking Follower]

Estaban, sure he's accepted he has $$$,understand? Dont fall into the trap of believing he has anything, there are plenty of people who can read chinese martial arts publications and come off knowledgable in certain areas. There is a saying: "The fruit doesnt fall far from the tree", it means dont fool yourself into thinking that your learning instead of collecting dances like Lin. By the way his Hsing I and Bagua instructor lived in NJ, some of my seniors attended these seminars he took under Madame FU.
She's the one who really studied under Sun Lu Tang!.....but of course....MONEY TALKS!

[This message was edited by Self-Thinking Follower on 05-26-01 at 05:55 PM.]

[Esteban]

Hi STF,

I don't know enough about David Lin's finances, and would be embarrassed to comment if I did. If you're arguing that he has been able to pay for instruction, I don't see how that would make him somehow money-hungry or uninformed. I know of his association with Madame Fu, and I also know that he studied with Sun's daughter as well. Again, I don't know the man well enough to defend the where's and how's of what he teaches. I only pointed out that there are those who respect him, apart from his students. Hey, there are those who say "Bah, Yang Cheng Fu. He wasn't really any good." Etc., etc. All I'm saying is those claims don't have anything to do with being able to learn something from someone. As for being fooled, well, it can happen. It's been said that "A wise man can learn from a fool. But a fool can't learn from a wise man." Anyway, I'm just expressing my opinion. There are plenty of places to study in NY and NJ.
Best,
Esteban

[Self-Thinking Follower]

Estaban, you have the right to study or respect whoever you want, I can only say I have no respect for him within Chinese martial arts or American society. He is a fake in skill, has bought his endorsements and has con all those who buy his "old age" as an excuse for lack of ability. On top of that he does an injustice to americans who are seeking the experience of real CMA. He cons people into believing he has something authentic or substantial when he doesnt. This is my opinion, but your entitled to your own. He recently demonstrated in NYC chinatown, did you not catch the show? It was quite amusing.

[Esteban]

Hi STF,

you asked:

"He recently demonstrated in NYC chinatown, did you not catch the show? It was quite amusing."

Yes, I was there and saw everybody. They were all entertaining. Which did you like? Gin Soon Chu did stuff, and Henry Poo Yee, too. Then there was Bow Sim Mark. Who impressed you?

Best,
Esteban

[Self-Thinking Follower]

Yip Sifu of Dragon shape school, no bull****, still consistant and true to his art form!
Always ignored by those looking instead for magic and flash.

[Esteban]

Hi STF,

Yip Sifu was good, and you're right about teachers being ignored by students who seek "magic and flash." Do you study his style, or at his school? I guess you don't mean that all the other demonstrators were just magic and flash? Well, I know lots of people who'd disagree. I've heard uncomplimentary things about Gin Soon Chu and Bow Sim Mark --it's why I mentioned them-- but it's hard to question the depth of Sifu Mark's training, even if she likes opera. It'd been downright silly, imho, to say that she had nothing to teach. OTOH, there's G.S. Chu. Whatever you think of 'fa-jin' or dynamic push hands, or even him, don't you think someone could learn from him? You're from NY, and may have been here when Wai Hong came. I can't count the number of people who said he was a fake, only out for money, etc. There were fights, but his school produced fighters. Most of them were satisfied; some became champs in PKA --P. Vizio was there. Anyway, I'm not saying any of this to put anyone down or raise him up. The only reason I said anything at all is that, in my time, I've heard bad things said about everybody --from Bruce Lee to Yang Cheng Fu to Dong Hai Chuan, etc., etc., etc.. Anyway, I think it's ok to tell people to "take what is useful" because the art --whichever one-- is for them. I'm not new-age. This is the way I was taught: i.e., Respect my elders; "Teacher for a day, father for life"; and even "If they like the taste of ****, let them eat it." Still, I hope you don't assume that you're the only person who can "think for self" and "follow" at the same time. I think every student who gets anywhere has to.
Best,
Esteban

[Self-Thinking Follower]

Estaban, I know too many of these characters to comment, but I'm sure there are those out there who will agree that something can be learned from everybody. By the way if you saw Paul then you also saw Tak Eng, Wai Hong's nephew with him. So much for the rivalry started on this board between their NON chinese students, eh? Family is Family even in disagreement.

[Self-Thinking Follower]

Oh, I forgot, No I dont study under Yip! and your right about students who follow, thinking for themselves, to get somewhere.

[Esteban]

Hi STF,

yes, I saw Tak Wah and Paul, and everybody had smiles on their faces. And, you know none of them really had to, but you're right, Family is family. Oh well, look at Wing Chun. Anyway, I was happy to see a lot of faces from the old days. About the demonstrations, I know what you mean. I've met B.S. Mark and was able to visit V. Chu because I went to grad school in Boston in the 80s. Everybody has their good and not so good points --even me :) Well, I don't have so many good points, come to think of it.
Respects,
Esteban