Who brought the 8 diagram pole into the hung gar system?

[Laukarbo]

Hey,

I kinow there are some Hung Gar specialists or experts on the board..I always wondered who brought the 8 diagram pole into Hung Gar?
I know this suppose to be the first weapon at all taken into the hung gar system and it can be traced back to wong fei hung.... (in the movie (wich of course is more or less fictional) " challenge of the masters" WFH learned it from Luk Ah Choy)....

anyone?

[chasincharpchui]

Hey,

I kinow there are some Hung Gar specialists or experts on the board..I always wondered who brought the 8 diagram pole into Hung Gar?
I know this suppose to be the first weapon at all taken into the hung gar system and it can be traced back to wong fei hung.... (in the movie (wich of course is more or less fictional) " challenge of the masters" WFH learned it from Luk Ah Choy)....

anyone?


havent u answered your own question?

well dont know for sure, but thats wat i heard.

[Laukarbo]

havent u answered your own question?

well dont know for sure, but thats wat i heard.


no...I just mentioned how it was in a movie...

[htowndragon]

i think lama pai has it too

[Ben Gash]

As Luk Ah Choy taught Wong Tai, Wong Fei Hung's grandfather, and Luk Ah Choy only lived until he was 68 (and must have been about 40 when he started teaching a young Wong Tai), it's somewhat unlikely he taught Wong Fei Hung.
As for the origins of the form, who knows? It's present in most of the main lines, which rules out Lam Sai Wing, making it Wong Fei Hung or earlier. The form is obviously descended from the Yang family 5th brother spear system, a northern style. Luk Ah Choy was a proficient northern stylist prior to training with Gee Sim and Hung Hei Gung, so he could be a likely source of the form, but alternatively Tid Kiu Sam , with his broad shaolin knowledge is just as likely. Another likely source is Wong Kay Yin via his involvement with the ten tigers, or Wong Fei Hung could have learned it from another fighter.

[Lama Pai Sifu]

Lama Pai has a set and Choy Lay Fut has a set as well.

It's a famous story. Who knows who did it first.

[chasincharpchui]

no...I just mentioned how it was in a movie...

well there is a hung gar story that he beat someone with 5th brother 8 diagram pole
dont know the details, remembering reading this chinese document presented to me a while back for translation lols

i mean lama pai does have a good point it could have also been teet kiu sam or wong kei ying, however the document i read(duno how accurate the document was) said luk ah choy used 5th brother 8 diagram pole, so unless tid kiu sam or wong kei ying taught luk ah choy the 5th brother 8 diagram pole(which is not unusal lol, look at clf origins haha). Then i'd have to say that Luk Ah Choy is the first documented practioner of the hung kune system to have known 5th brother 8 diagram pole

[golden arhat]

i think the 5th brother of the 8 trigram (diagram would mean design which wouldnt make any sense) pole was absorbed in to southern shaolin not exclusively in to hung gar and was taken from the spear techniques of the 5th brother who became a monk at the southern temple after his brothers were all killed in battle. as for who taught wong fei hung im not sure but i think it could well have been luk ah choy because wong fei hung didnt learn from his father, and i cant think of any other lineage that was around back then other than hung hei gwun and luk ah choys original system :)

[mikestefan]

i think the 5th brother of the 8 trigram (diagram would mean design which wouldnt make any sense) pole was absorbed in to southern shaolin not exclusively in to hung gar and was taken from the spear techniques of the 5th brother who became a monk at the southern temple after his brothers were all killed in battle. as for who taught wong fei hung im not sure but i think it could well have been luk ah choy because wong fei hung didnt learn from his father, and i cant think of any other lineage that was around back then other than hung hei gwun and luk ah choys original system :)

Why do you say he didn't learn from his father? His father was his first teacher. My understanding is that Luk Ah Choy taught Wong Kei Ying the pole techniques.

[CLFNole]

I believe baat kwa kwun in general was a well known poling style in and of itself that was incorporated into a variety of southern styles.

[Laukarbo]

wah old thread....in the meanwhile I found out that Luk Ah Choi is indeed the first one mentioned who had this set.Although documents not always are correct..
what else I found out is that untill lam sai wing the set had 64 movements,lam Sai Wing had a uncle who learned red boat sub system which contained 3 sets..theleft handed 6.5 pole,war palm and and the butterflyknive set called dai hang yat seong do..those 3 sets LSW learned from his uncle and later he added the the 6.5 point five pole into the 8 diagram set..the the section where u change from leading the pole with the right hand to the left hand...

[once ronin]

The pole form was added into shaolin during the Sung Dynasty as a Yang Family spear.

Monks tend not to kill so they changed it to a long pole form. A red band is tied to the long staff known as a huet git symboliziing it to be a spear.

So coming out of Shaolin there is very few bladed weapons.

Like Choy Li Fut there is many versions of staff forms.

[South Paw]

This set was designed by Yeung Ng Long during the Jiusung Dynasty.
It's designed in the spirit of Taiji, combining Ying and Yang.
Lam Sai Wing added 6.5 stafftechniques to this set.