You are invited to study Korean Kung Fu

[Steronius]

The School of Chung Moo Kwan Sib Pal Gee (Korean Kung Fu) Association wishes to invite new and continuing students of all ages and experience to study at our headqarters located at

7613 Fourth Street
Marrero, Louisiana 70072

Phone: 504-328-6345

Sib Pal Gee -- 18 Methods (sometimes called 18 Weapons) is a Korean lineage of Kung Fu. In particular it includes methods used in Shaolin Long Fist, Plum Flower Mantis, Bagua, Chin-Na, and Korean style kicking.

Classes are being instructed by Master Dai Soung Chun and his assistant instructor who is a 5th Dan in the system and 6th Dan in TaeKwonDo.

Please visit http://www.ChungMooKwan.com for more info.

A short bio for Grandmaster Chun can be found in The Mantis Cave:
http://www.geocities.com/mantiscave/chundai.htm

logo: http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/8191/chungmookwanlr4.jpg

schedule:http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/1526/chungmookwan3hi2.jpg

flyer1:http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/5173/chungmookwan2xf8.jpg

flyer2:http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/3513/chungmookwan4pj4.jpg

[Steronius]

Because of the distance from my home I attend class twice a week and home study (group) once a week. If you schedule a date, I will make certain to attend also.

[novemberbaby]

Hello.....I am interested in Martial Arts......Know of anyone who would teach out of there home? I'm female & a little shy around people i dont know.
Do you do One on One @ your home?>??

[Ben Gash]

I do, but probably a little far to travel. Also Teachers may not be that comfortable teaching a woman alone in their house.

[B-Rad]

Did anyone else thing this was going to be a troll post involving a certain cult when they first saw it? :D

[B-Rad]

Just saw how old this thread is too :o

[Royal Dragon]

The intersting thing, by comparing the singnature movements from the core forms of our favorite cult, to those of the lineage above, we can see that John C. Kim learned from this line. We can also compare and see that he only learned the first section of the forms. John C Kim's forms are almost identical (except for bad basics) to the mantis from the lineage above. However, they only match for the first section of the forms. After that they get very wierd and look more like bad Hong Kong Chop saki movies. This means that Kim did learn from this line, but wasn't there long and is thus, only a beginner. Later he made stuff up to fill the gaps in his learning by watching Shaw Brothers movies.

So if anyone wants to see what Kim's style is *Supposed* to look like, click on the link in the first post and contact them.

[Ben Gash]

Don't be disheartened, many schools will offer private tuition at the club, but to be honest group tuition is usually better in the long run. I know a few schools do give free private taster lessons for prospective students.

[MasterKiller]

The intersting thing, by comparing the singnature movements from the core forms of our favorite cult, to those of the lineage above, we can see that John C. Kim learned from this line. We can also compare and see that he only learned the first section of the forms. John C Kim's forms are almost identical (except for bad basics) to the mantis from the lineage above. However, they only match for the first section of the forms. After that they get very wierd and look more like bad Hong Kong Chop saki movies. This means that Kim did learn from this line, but wasn't there long and is thus, only a beginner. Later he made stuff up to fill the gaps in his learning by watching Shaw Brothers movies.

Steronious' line comes from Lu Shui Tien (No Sue Chon), who taught Bagua. But the Mantis comes from Lin Pan Zhang and Kang Kyung Bang because all three new each other and exchanged students/information.

EVERYONE who practices a Chinese style from Korea can trace back to at least one, but usually two or three, of these individuals.

I've heard from several sources that the Kung Fu teachers refused to teach the local TKD/Karate groups, so these teachers would sign up as a "new" student, learn a couple of forms, and then start teaching them to their students. It's possible Kim's forms came this route.

[Eddie]

Hello.....I am interested in Martial Arts......Know of anyone who would teach out of there home? I'm female & a little shy around people i dont know.Do you do One on One @ your home?>??

this seem like a job for Royal Dragon :cool:

[Royal Dragon]

I've heard from several sources that the Kung Fu teachers refused to teach the local TKD/Karate groups, so these teachers would sign up as a "new" student, learn a couple of forms, and then start teaching them to their students. It's possible Kim's forms came this route.

Reply]
That would not suprise me in the least. It would explain the bad "Karate like" body mechanics, and why only the first section of the forms match.

[Royal Dragon]

I've heard from several sources that the Kung Fu teachers refused to teach the local TKD/Karate groups, so these teachers would sign up as a "new" student, learn a couple of forms, and then start teaching them to their students. It's possible Kim's forms came this route.

Reply]
That would not suprise me in the least. It would explain the bad "Karate like" body mechanics, and why only the first section of the forms match.

I would still like to get a closer look at that one form of yours though, remember the vid you put up on your Youtube for like a day and then took down? It had the guy and two kids doing a Mantis set in the park? That was the form Kim calls "Tang Nan", only it was performed in a much more direct and straight forward manor without all the rediculous fluff Kim added to his.

[MasterKiller]

If it's the video I'm thinking of, that form is called Kerro Kwon in Korean (Kai Lu Chuan in Chinese)--Open Road Fist.

I may have a video called Tang Nan, though, come to think of it. I'll check the laptop when I get home.

[BruceSteveRoy]

novemberbaby you have a fantaastic avatar.

[Royal Dragon]

this seem like a job for Royal Dragon

Reply]
:D

[Mas Judt]

Well RD, why don't you contact this guy and ask him if he's ever heard of John C Kim?

[Royal Dragon]

It's doubtfull he would, I really don't think Kim was there long enough to be remembered. Besides, *John* Kim is an alias, and so is Jack park. We don't know what his real name is.

He's using Won Chun Kim or some such thing now (see the yahoo baord for the exact name). is that his real name, or yet another alias?

Everything he told us about the lineage was a lie or misdirection.

In order to figure this out, we had to CSI the system itself. Kim's CORE forms match this group of Korean Kung fu Masters.

It's the same technique I have used to track Tai Tzu lineages when I was researching Tai tzu.

[Steronius]

If it's the video I'm thinking of, that form is called Kerro Kwon in Korean (Kai Lu Chuan in Chinese)--Open Road Fist.
I may have a video called Tang Nan, though, come to think of it. I'll check the laptop when I get home.


Our forms (that I have learned [am learning] so far) (correct spellings unkown)
1. Ba Chu
2. Tong Rong Kye Ro Kwon (GM Chun's spelling)
3. Tong Rong Jo Yo
4. BaGua Il Fi Kan
5. So Ho Young

Generally Each class will begin with Bagua Ti Tae (Bagua High Leg Raise), then move into several Tan Tui (Roads). There are at least 8 Roads.

Generally we do these and depending on the day we do power drills, defense drills, palm drills, kicking drills, sword drills, staff work, etc, etc, etc.

P.S. THERE IS NO CULT INVOLVED

[MasterKiller]

5. So Ho Young


I bet this is So Ho Yun (Xiao Hu Yan)--Little Tiger Swallow.

[Mas Judt]

Hey Steronius -

Check out "oom yung doe" and also search them on YouTube. You will discover a vast criminal conspiracy that went by the name Chung Moo Quan... and claimed to be the 'most correct' kung fu from Korea.

It's a shame that name will impact you guys...

I always liked Korean Kung Fu guys - the Korean culture breeds a specific type of tough guy that just makes for a good fighter.

[MasterKiller]

Well RD, why don't you contact this guy and ask him if he's ever heard of John C Kim?

Well, No Sue Chon is dead, and it's doubtful Steronious' teacher would have studied at the same time as Kim. And anyway, thousands of people have studied these styles in Seoul since the 1940's. Some guy who took a few classes probably would not be very memorable.


I always liked Korean Kung Fu guys - the Korean culture breeds a specific type of tough guy that just makes for a good fighter.

Word.

[Royal Dragon]

Well, No Sue Chon is dead, and it's doubtful Steronious' teacher would have studied at the same time as Kim. And anyway, thousands of people have studied these styles in Seoul since the 1940's. Some guy who took a few classes probably would not be very memorable.

Reply]
Yeah, I agree. The only way to trace it at this point would be to compare the forms, and we did that. Of Kim's core forms, they match...well, the first sections do anyway.

Also I had spoken to someone from Park's lineage years ago, and he told me Park was of the opinion Kim had stolen thier Broad Sword form.

There was a really good discussion of this on Emptyflower, where some of that lineage recognised Kim's forms called Pargey and Tong Nan. He even was able to give us the real name of Tang nan, and tell us it is a mantis form.

There is no question Kim's system comes from this line anymore. Now it's a matter of how much is there, vs how much he made up. I think 10% is badly performed, but authentic movements, but the other 90% is just stuff he took from movies.

Kim's Kong Su Do is much more authentic, but still badly taught to the point of being ineffective.

[Royal Dragon]

Check out "oom yung doe" and also search them on YouTube. You will discover a vast criminal conspiracy that went by the name Chung Moo Quan... and claimed to be the 'most correct' kung fu from Korea.

It's a shame that name will impact you guys...

I always liked Korean Kung Fu guys - the Korean culture breeds a specific type of tough guy that just makes for a good fighter.

Reply]
Not nessasarily. Now that it is known Kim actually studied from that line, they can easy to point to him as an example of what impropper teaching of a system or inexperiance in a system can do. It's not the style that is bad, but Kim. being public, and open about Kim, and where he reallly stands in the lineage (Rank beginner) might actually be good, since it can be show what the system is supposed to be like, as opposed to the way Kim *******ised it.

There are a lot of OYD students that are 1st degree and down that would make great students, and would clearly contrast the difference between the authentic artical, and John C Kim's sham.

It's all just a matter of how one looks at it. The way the site is layed out, and all of the lineage and explanations there is, no one will see Mantiscave as being part of Kim'sgroup, and thearfore not attach Kim's stigma to them. It's Very clear they are not the same organisations.