Bodhidharma's Cane

[ZhuiQuan]

Where can I find a quality Bodhidharma's Cane?

I saw some on eBay, but I don't really like eBay because it's often questionable. Does anyone know where I could get a good quality cane?

[GeneChing]

But they're fairly easy to make. All you need is a wood rasp (although a lathe would be cool too ;) ). I originally got mine at Shaolin. The shaft was made of white wax wood, and you know that's just about the tastiest wood if you're a termite, so it got exposed and eaten in a matter of days. I salvaged the head and put in on another shaft. I've also made my own.

BTW, I'm assuming you're talking about the unique hammer-like head Bodhidharma cane, akin to a buffalo horn stick. Some use regular umbrella-handle headed canes.

For reference, see my article The Crutches of War: Bodhidharma's Legendary Fighting Cane in our 2002 Shaolin Special (January/February) (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/magazine/article.php?article=144).

[ZhuiQuan]

I have that issue at home.

Yes, I'm talking about the hammer-like one. The ones I've seen sold on eBay were supposedly acquired from Dengfeng, but the hammer end seems so small and the shaft seems too thin. It just seemed much different from what I've seen in Shi De Yang's video and the photos in issues of Kung Fu Magazine.

[GeneChing]

...so there's lots of variation. Back in the days of Shaolin village, you'd see stacks of them in the little weapons shops, and you'd spend hours picking through to find the heftiest one (or at least I would). And it would only cost you like 5 kuai. Man, those were the days. The last time I was there was '04 and I didn't see as many available.

There was this beautiful one in the temple some years ago. I tried to buy it several times. They wouldn't let me have it. No way. I was ready to put down some serious USD for that too.

Seriously, they are really easy to make. The only part that might be tough is fabricating a butt cap. You'd need a metal lathe to do that properly. Most of the ones don't have a butt cap, but the real nice ones do. I used a spear head on my salvaged one and my Shaolin master shook his head and said it wasn't proper. I keep dreaming of doing a nice fat one someday. Of course, I've forgotten the form now, so there's not too much point in that...:o

[ZhuiQuan]

Here's a picture of the cane on ebay (the seller titles all of his things as "rare", I'm not sure how truthful this person is)


It looks super thin, and the head and I think even the stick is covered in rubber.

[G-MA]

Is there a website that sells cheap Shaolin T-Canes?

[uki]

the best ones are the ones you make yourself and give away to your friends. :)

[David Jamieson]

I find them all the time in the generic "million pieces of crap" stores that litter chinatown where I live.

I'm sure you could poke your head into a convenience store on Mott street and find one. :)
Look for where they keep the umbrellas and no I'm not kidding.

[taai gihk yahn]

the best ones are the ones you make yourself and give away to your friends. :)

A gnarled and knotted moose greets me every morning in my kitchen...:)

[David Jamieson]

A gnarled and knotted moose greets me every morning in my kitchen...:)

I hope your wife doesn't read this forum man...

[sha0lin1]

A gnarled and knotted moose greets me every morning in my kitchen...:)

That's cool, a silver winged one drinks Molson with me every night.

[uki]

I hope your wife doesn't read this forum man...brilliant.

[GeneChing]

Bodhidharma Canes Imported from Shaolin (http://www.martialartsmart.com/25-214.html)
These Bodhidharma Canes are handmade by village craftsmen near Shaolin Temple. Each cane is unique and expresses the humble character of this treasured folk art. Approximately 1 yard tall.
Item Code: 25-214
Catalog/Phone Order Price: $18.99
Web Price: $18.04

If this product sells well, we hope to import more.

[Lucas]

Shop martial smart, shop martialartsmart.com (http://www.martialartsmart.com/)

HAIL TO THE KING BABY!

[GeneChing]

Bodhidharma Cane & Shaolin Tonfa - ONLY $9.95! (http://www.martialartsmart.com/dvd-ca117.html)

Also available as Master Kits!

Bodhidharma Cane and Instructional Bodhidharma Cane & Shaolin Tonfa DVD: $23.99 (http://www.martialartsmart.com/dvdk-ca117a.html)

Tonfa and Instructional Bodhidharma Cane & Shaolin Tonfa DVD: $22.99 (http://www.martialartsmart.com/dvdk-ca117b.html)

Bodhidharma Cane , Tonfa and Instructional Bodhidharma Cane & Shaolin Tonfa DVD: $35.99 (http://www.martialartsmart.com/dvdk-ca117c.html)

[Blacktiger]

If this product sells well, we hope to import more.

Wicked but will I have any issues getting these shipped to Oz :confused:

[Shaolin]

They look pretty okay. I'm interested in purchasing them as I teach Bodhidharma Cane and Plum Blossom Crutch. I'll buy them when Tiger Claw starts carrying them. No whole sale for me with Martial Arts Mart.

[GeneChing]

@Blacktiger - In all honestly, it's challenging for MAM (http://www.martialartsmart.com/) to ship to Oz, or any other country for that matter. There are unique customs regulations for each country and MAM frequently gets stung with a parcel stuck at the border, which is why shipping costs outside the U.S. are pretty pricey.

@Shaolin - At this point, we don't know if this product will evolve into a Tiger Claw (https://www.tigerclaw.com/home.php) offering. We have to sell a lot for it to get to that level. We're off to a good start, but we're still way deep in the primacy effect. Once the newness wears off, we might not be able to move enough to justify making this into a wholesale offering. I'm hoping we will, of course, but it's really up to the market and how well the Shaolin community supports it. Keep your fingers crossed.

[Shaolin]

@Shaolin - At this point, we don't know if this product will evolve into a Tiger Claw (https://www.tigerclaw.com/home.php) offering. We have to sell a lot for it to get to that level. We're off to a good start, but we're still way deep in the primacy effect. Once the newness wears off, we might not be able to move enough to justify making this into a wholesale offering. I'm hoping we will, of course, but it's really up to the market and how well the Shaolin community supports it. Keep your fingers crossed.

Understandable.

[Scott R. Brown]

Hey Gene!

If you are going to sell the cane you ought to at least include an "Authentic Bodhidharma Shoe" with each one!

[GeneChing]

Thanks for that everyone. We're ordering more, but it will take a while as they have to be carved in Dengfeng and then shipped to here.

@Shaolin: I should add that if these ever did become a Tiger Claw product, the price would double. We offered the last batch at $18.99 (http://www.martialartsmart.com/25-214.html). That's basically our price plus shipping X2, which would be 'wholesale' price. If we offered wholesale, we'd have to raise the retail. Retail is usually cost+shippingx4. Anyway, it's moot now as they are sold out. I'm hoping we can keep the price of the new shipment the same, but you know how it is with China. We're haggling with some folk carvers in Dengfeng. We're hoping to get them to improve the quality. They'll want more kuai for that.

[Scott R. Brown]

So I guess you didn't like my shoe idea huh?:o

[taai gihk yahn]

So I guess you didn't like my shoe idea huh?:o

it's better than the one I had about it coming with a pair of eyelids...

[Scott R. Brown]

it's better than the one I had about it coming with a pair of eyelids...

Those are so small they would easily be lost.

Earrings would have been nice except I understand his eyelids became tea bushes. So maybe a shoe and a box of tea would be nice!

[GeneChing]

....whoops! Too late. (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/ezine/article.php?article=527) Now you're sorry, aren't you? :p

[Shaolin]

Thanks for that everyone. We're ordering more, but it will take a while as they have to be carved in Dengfeng and then shipped to here.

@Shaolin: I should add that if these ever did become a Tiger Claw product, the price would double. We offered the last batch at $18.99 (http://www.martialartsmart.com/25-214.html). That's basically our price plus shipping X2, which would be 'wholesale' price. If we offered wholesale, we'd have to raise the retail. Retail is usually cost+shippingx4. Anyway, it's moot now as they are sold out. I'm hoping we can keep the price of the new shipment the same, but you know how it is with China. We're haggling with some folk carvers in Dengfeng. We're hoping to get them to improve the quality. They'll want more kuai for that.

I'm sure there's plenty of Americans who'd be willing to carve your canes for you at a reasonable price. The quality will be probably be better and you'll save on shipping.

[GeneChing]

I'm actually carving one myself right now, just for fun. But I wouldn't do it for under $10 bucks. That's what it would have to be under to meet that $18.99 price point. It's a fair amount of work. Even if I had a lathe and a bandsaw, it would still be a fair amount of work because the horn shape must be hand rasped - much more than $10 I should think. Frankly it's hard to undercut the price of Chinese labor.

[Shaolin]

If "they" are trying to keep the retail price under $20 it's understandable to outsource the work. Personally I'd rather see the whole sale cost go up to around $25-$35, bring the production to the U.S. and increase the quality. Retail it for $40-$50. Buy low price = get low quality.

[GeneChing]

We now know it is successful at this price point. We are looking at making improvements - in fact, I was just in discussion with the makers yesterday about this - without raising that price point. If it really takes off, I could foresee turning Cane production over to the same manufacturers that do our tonfa, which are really well made and still inexpensive. Those are machine made, for the most part, so the issue there is the start-up costs. We'll see. This is a work in progress.

Meanwhile, I'm debating about going into high-end cane production - handmade Bodhidharma Canes by me. If I sell them at $108 (love that price point) and cover my hours on task, I might just go back into the weapon making business. :cool:

[sha0lin1]

I think Shaolin has a point. You guys have a distribution center in Tennessee and there are a whole lot of wood carvers in the Appalachins right? One of the poorest parts of the U.S. where a lot of people need work.

[David Jamieson]

Those are so small they would easily be lost.

Earrings would have been nice except I understand his eyelids became tea bushes. So maybe a shoe and a box of tea would be nice!

The shoe comes with the Japanese version, the eyelids and tea come with the Chinese versions.

I think they should also come with a box of silence.

[GeneChing]

I'll ask the TN office to look into it.

When I used to make swords, we hired this carpenter who was living out of his van for a spell. He had a lathe in his van and would shape handle blanks for us at $5 a pop, which was cheaper than we could do and saved a lot of time. Unfortunately, he went his way eventually.

[Blacktiger]

@Blacktiger - In all honestly, it's challenging for MAM (http://www.martialartsmart.com/) to ship to Oz, or any other country for that matter. There are unique customs regulations for each country and MAM frequently gets stung with a parcel stuck at the border, which is why shipping costs outside the U.S. are pretty pricey.

Bugger I really want one!!!

[GeneChing]

My Shaolin connect told me last week that it will take about two weeks to finish up a new batch. We're ordering twice as many as last time. I'm not sure how long it will take to get them from China to here however. Last time, it hit a delay because of our China's quality control manager. I'll keep you updated.

@Blacktiger - when they come in, contact sales@martialartsmart.com about ordering. That office is actually in TN and I can't really speak for them on this.

[Blacktiger]

My Shaolin connect told me last week that it will take about two weeks to finish up a new batch. We're ordering twice as many as last time. I'm not sure how long it will take to get them from China to here however. Last time, it hit a delay because of our China's quality control manager. I'll keep you updated.

@Blacktiger - when they come in, contact sales@martialartsmart.com about ordering. That office is actually in TN and I can't really speak for them on this.

Thanks Gene will do :D

[GeneChing]

Designed by me. :cool:

Bodhidharma Cane (http://www.martialartsmart.com/25-214.html)

[Shaolin]

Designed by me. :cool:

Bodhidharma Cane (http://www.martialartsmart.com/25-214.html)

Looks great! Now how reliable is martial arts mart going to be about keeping them in stock? And how do we get them over on the sister company tiger claw? As a school owner I'd have to charge $40 buying them from martial arts mart just to make anything and I refuse to do that to my students.

[GeneChing]

The Tamo Canes that we had earlier were made by folk craftsmen from the Shaolin area. We sold out of them a lot faster than we anticipated, and restocking was challenging because we weren't working with a professional manufacturing company. Those makers were common folk. I designed these new Tamo Canes upon an old cane I got at Shaolin in '95, as well as several other examples I've seen over the years. They are manufactured by one of the companies that manufactures tonfa (http://www.martialartsmart.com/weapons-sai-tonfa-kama.html) for us, so we know that they can deliver consistent quality.

As of now, these are strictly MartialArtsMart.com (http://www.martialartsmart.com/25-214.html) products. If we move enough units in a reasonable period, these will become a Tiger Claw (https://www.tigerclaw.com/home.php) product, but that might not be for a while. While MAM and TC are connected, they are separate companies. We'll often test market products for TC through MAM. We'll also sell items irregular items there, products that are not stable enough for TC. For TC, sales must be both brisk and reliable.

[Shaolin]

I appreciate the info.

[Pk_StyLeZ]

what!!!!??!?!? another new cane?!?!
this one looks so much better than the first batch.....i miss the one that I used when I was training with shifu shi de shan...i want one like that again.....=(

[GeneChing]

The first batch were cheap, yet charming in a folksy way. These new ones are made by one of our martial arts manufacturing companies, so the quality will be a lot more consistent. Also, I've had them design them a little on the long side to accommodate taller practitioners. It's easy to trim of the end if you want them shorter.

And of course, we offer master kits - three, in fact.
Bodhidharma Cane and Instructional Bodhidharma Cane & Shaolin Tonfa DVD (http://www.martialartsmart.com/dvdk-ca117a.html)
Tonfa and Instructional Bodhidharma Cane & Shaolin Tonfa DVD (http://www.martialartsmart.com/dvdk-ca117b.html)
Bodhidharma Cane, Tonfa and Instructional Bodhidharma Cane & Shaolin Tonfa DVD (http://www.martialartsmart.com/dvdk-ca117c.html)

[Pk_StyLeZ]

The first batch were cheap, yet charming in a folksy way. These new ones are made by one of our martial arts manufacturing companies, so the quality will be a lot more consistent. Also, I've had them design them a little on the long side to accommodate taller practitioners. It's easy to trim of the end if you want them shorter.

And of course, we offer master kits - three, in fact.
Bodhidharma Cane and Instructional Bodhidharma Cane & Shaolin Tonfa DVD (http://www.martialartsmart.com/dvdk-ca117a.html)
Tonfa and Instructional Bodhidharma Cane & Shaolin Tonfa DVD (http://www.martialartsmart.com/dvdk-ca117b.html)
Bodhidharma Cane, Tonfa and Instructional Bodhidharma Cane & Shaolin Tonfa DVD (http://www.martialartsmart.com/dvdk-ca117c.html)

can I trade in my first one for the new one?....lol...it came apart on me while i was performing...I knew i should of reinforced it with some glue..but I got lazy and didnt "prep" my weapon...my fault...lol

maybe one day when i get some spare money I will order this new one!

[RenDaHai]

It looks pretty good gene! A lot better than most in DengFeng!

A lot of times the GuaiZhang break at the join between the cane and the handle.... But this is a lot more common if you practice the dui lian. There isn't really a good solution except to custom build a super tough one. I know a guy here who had one made completely out of metal! It was awesome. It was kind of a coppery-goldy hue. But I don't think there is a large market for that.


Gene, is there any plan to build an actual Shaolin Tonfa (Shuang Guai)?

I guess it is a bit too rare a weapon. Although the standard Tonfa would work well enough for the stand alone forms, it is not so useful in the Dui Lian (two man sets, like Shuang Guai Po Qiang). The actual ones are like miniature versions of the GuaiZhang, and have the hook protruding out the bottom of the handle. This is used to hook the opponents weapon and move it, just like a hook hand. Unfortunately a regular Tonfa just can't be used in this way. But to be honest these are hard enough to find in DengFeng, it is a rare weapon these days. I hope it gains in popularity because it is awesome.

[GeneChing]

Come on, now Pk_StyLeZ. How hard is it to repair a cane? Besides, we sold those folk-made canes for less than $20. That's less than a KFC Family Meal Deal.

RDH: I was toying with making a metal one too, back when I had access to a metal lathe. It was a crude manual lathe and would have taken days, so I never made any progress on it.

As for doing the shuang guai, that is a dream of mine, but at this stage, it's way too obscure to be marketable. At one point, I was hoping you could cut down the shafts of these canes, but that doesn't give the proper balance as shuang guai shafts flair slightly. One of the nice things about this video (http://www.martialartsmart.com/dvd-ca117.html) is that it includes both methods, so there's some cross-over to karate/open market, as some of those folk are interested the possible roots of their methods. That was completely intentional, of course. However, as we carry so many tonfa (http://www.martialartsmart.com/weapons-sai-tonfa-kama.html) already, it'll be a while before a significant enough following for the Chinese version emerges to warrant creating a new product.

[Pk_StyLeZ]

Come on, now Pk_StyLeZ. How hard is it to repair a cane? Besides, we sold those folk-made canes for less than $20. That's less than a KFC Family Meal Deal.



Haha I was jking Gene =)
It was basically my fault for not even testing the weapon out before performing with it, I usually test my weapons before using them in a performance, but this one time I got lazy and just used it on the spot. Which is never recommended!

[GeneChing]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eq62EY7oqZw

More to come...;)

[bawang]

it comes from cane hammer if anyone likes obscure info. don't know when they actually started using a real cane for the form tho.

[RenDaHai]

it comes from cane hammer if anyone likes obscure info. don't know when they actually started using a real cane for the form tho.

Your right.

All the antique ones I have seen in old masters homes have a metal spike on the end (making it useless as a walking cane).

Interestingly there was a 'crutch spear'. A full length spear which has the t-shape handle at the end. By holding it in this way you get a new dimension of mobility.

Actually this weapon is a 'crutch'. The standard walking stick cane is a separate weapon with its own forms and techniques. Its called a crutch I assume because it is shaped more like a crutch to go under the arm rather than to be held by the handle although the actual weapons are always too short to be used this way. I think, as you seem to say, it has always been a specific weapon that looks like a crutch rather than an actual crutch. And yes, it can have a proper hammer section to it.

It is an extremely mobile weapon, with many of its techniques designed specifically against a spear. It is, in my limited experience of weapon application, the best short weapon to tackle a long weapon.

[bawang]

It is an extremely mobile weapon, with many of its techniques designed specifically against a spear. It is, in my limited experience of weapon application, the best short weapon to tackle a long weapon.

its prolly one of those old song dynasty weapons because of the butt spike.

[GeneChing]

...of course, being that this is the KFM forum, why would you start such an absurd behavior now?

Srsly, post some evidence or sources.

Here's some back story: Shaolin Ways Episode 1: Bodhidharma Cane (http://www.kungfumagazine.com/ezine/article.php?article=1158)

:cool:

[GeneChing]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFbPyghy3V4

See my article, Mixed Martial Weapons: The Dao and Tamo Cane in our Shaolin Special 2014 (http://www.kungfumagazine.com/magazine/article.php?article=1151)

[GeneChing]

Shaolin Ways Episode 2: Plum Flower Bodhidharma Cane (http://www.kungfumagazine.com/ezine/article.php?article=1161)

THREADS
Bodhidharma's Cane (http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?42937-Bodhidharma-s-Cane)
Shaolin Trips (http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?57311-Shaolin-Trips-by-Gene-Ching)

[Djuan]

Heres another new video from Shaolin about Damo's Cane. Again, I like the dialogue from Shi Yancen.
Gene I know you will like this one just for them highlighting the "Damo Cane philosophy." ;)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CB17p2GZBwU

Amituofo!

[GeneChing]

Yesterday a bird flew into the office. It was a tiny bird, a sparrow or finch (I don't really know birds). I used my Tamo Cane to gently guide it out. Applications, man. It's all about those applications. :cool:

I'm tempted to rename my cane 'Tamo Sparrow Chaser' :p

[Djuan]

Yesterday a bird flew into the office. It was a tiny bird, a sparrow or finch (I don't really know birds). I used my Tamo Cane to gently guide it out. Applications, man. It's all about those applications. :cool:

I'm tempted to rename my cane 'Tamo Sparrow Chaser' :p

and yet, gently guiding the bird back to the freedom of fresh air still requires good ChanWu :p
some one else might smash the office up, or forbid, smash the bird in the process lol
Tamo's cane is in good hands.

[GeneChing]

I'm still on furlough from KungFuMagazine.com, so here is another essay I contributed to the Academy of Martial and Internal Arts (https://www.reelingsilk.com/academy/) where I train.

Shaolin Sheltering: Weird Weapons (https://www.plumpub.com/kaimen/2020/shaolin-sheltering-weird-weapons/)

https://www.plumpub.com/kaimen/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/art_wusong5.jpg

THREADS
Academy of Martial and Internal Arts (http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?71765-The-Academy-of-Martial-and-Internal-Arts)
Bodhidharma Cane (http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?42937-Bodhidharma-s-Cane)