1st night at Gracies

[Ray Pina]

I didn't care for 3 or the 4 teachines/positions shown but really liked the fourth (a sciccors sweep from the back)... good leverages involved.

A little concerned over the size of the class. I'm used to very small or private classes and found myself one of about 10 first day newbies in a class of 30 other white belts ranging from 1st week, 1st month, 3 month ect.

First month fee (including registration so tuition can be pulled from your account): $250. Monthly tuition fee there after: $187. That gets you up to 3, 1 hour classes a week. I can live with that, I was paying $150 for two classes a week before, granted those classes were 3 hours long.

I'm interested and will most likely sign up and officially start tomorrow, but a little concerned about the class size. Though, at the same time I know you have to start at the beginning. It's a nice challenge because it's completely new: no kicking or punching, just rolling and conditioning and grappling.

I figure I got nothing to lose now, might as well give it a chance, and will go 3 night a week.

[Oso]

I wouldn't worry about class size. If they run it right you'll be rolling with lot's of different people and that's a good thing. If what they say is true, and you dominate your belt level, you'll get moved up quickly.

1 hour is too short though. Do they offer longer classes for more advanced students? I could see running just one hour for like white belts to introduce them to the discipline and get their stamina built up. But, once you move past that I would think they'd give you more mat time in a single class. Are there open mat times?

good luck and have fun.

[MasterKiller]

I would also ask about no-gi training. I'm sure the instruction is going to be top-notch either way.

Good luck!

[hjt]

does renzo teach the class? or his senior students do?

[Chief Fox]

The instructor is a Machado purple belt. Last night there were only 7 people in the class including me and the instructor. So that was pretty cool. We warmed up for a bit and then worked techniques for about 30 min or so then the more experienced people had individual matches in 5 minute rounds. Each person probably rolled for about 3 rounds each. I just watched for that part. It was cool. The rolling was pretty intense. I'm not sure if I was expecting that much intesity. I'm going to take another free class on Thursday night and give rolling a go. If everything goes well, I'll probably sign up on saturday. Fees are $100 a month.

[TenTigers]

Ray, how much for privates, or if you can only make it in once a week? My schedule is real tight. Matt Serra is right around the block from me, but I don't want to go local. Do you know anything about the BJJ school out east?
Since you're in Long Beach, NYC might be easier for you anyway.

[Ray Pina]

We're working with the gi now and that's fine. I actually want to learn it that way so I can see the elvolution for myself. I always prefer studying a styles formula over getting the bottled finished product.

I've already thought about how I could use the sweep in a no gi situation, but right now, there's some benefits about being a newbie. No pressure, just absorb what I can.

I want to move up and roll with some of the more advanced guys, but at the same time I don't want to overstep the basics, things like rolling and breakfalling. I'm philosophically against some of these things, but I want to keep an open mind... empty the cup so to speak.

They have randori sessions during the day but I have a 9 to 5. What was cool, one of the guys said, "Oh, we got guys that are here all day' they're pros. This is their job." I liked that.

I'm sure once I move up more opportunities will present themselves.

[Nick Forrer]

Ray

There is a guy there called John Danaher...He is a black belt from NZ originally. If you get the chance take privates with him or at least try and take classes with him if hes teaching them. Some friends of mine used to train with him and say he is an amazing teacher.

[IronFist]

but I want to keep an open mind... empty the cup so to speak.

Just don't forget your cup when you go to class :eek: :D

[Ray Pina]

Funny you say that. I didn't bring one last night and my female partner kept digging a shoulder on a shoot drill:o

[Knifefighter]

I didn't care for 3 or the 4 teachines/positions shown .
Which ones were those and why didn't you like them?

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

Just don't forget your cup when you go to class :eek: :D

i dont know why but this made me think of someone losing a bet and having to drink out of their buddies sweaty ass cup.

man .... why would anyone ever agree to that kind of bet? weirdos.

[SevenStar]

man, I feel fortunate... We've got a BTT black belt and two brown belts and our classes aren't that much - and we offer 4 two hour classes per week. Even though I train for fee now, when I was paying it wasn't like that. However, I would definitely say that it's worth it. Good luck with bjj and with the new school. I think you'll love it.

Which positions were you shown that you didn't like? why didn't you like them?

as for rolling with the advanced guys, be patient. Trust me, you'll spend PLENTY of time getting tapped out by them soon enough. ;)

you said there are randori sessions during the day - are there none in the evening?

Lastly, what philosophically do they do that you are against? is that why you didn't like the three positions?

[Ray Pina]

I didn't like this oen drill where someone grabs your waist from behind.

First to step to the side and hook their leg. Yes, once you hook the leg they can't lift you, but even in a cooperative drill it wasn't easy to find that leg and hook it.... I'm sure I'll get better in time.

After that, you bend and put both hands on the floor so your weight doesn't go back, then grab the leg and pull and sit on it.

It works, but it seems like a lot of steps while your back is exposed. I'd rather take half a step forward creating space, and shoor my ass and hips out and come around with an elbow. Better to focus on one hand and not let them complete the lock.

But like I said, I'm open. Just liked that one the least, doubt they do that in real situations. Sure it's a base skill to be implemented later in another way.

The other was the shoot, but everyone knows my feelings about that. But again, I'm emptying the cup.

The break falls, where you slam your hands on the mat... I don't see that as a viable option on the cement. I have a different method I'm comfortable doing on cement, even train it by letting students capture a round house kick and sweep the support leg.

But again, empty, empty, empty. Looking forward to tomorrow night. I'll be training Tues., Thurs and Fri. nights.

Stoked. Great work out. Soaked after one hour.

[lunghushan]

That does sound pretty lame.

Sounds like you need a training partner in your martial art that is interested in fighting, and/or a fight coach.

There's gotta be somebody in NY like that.

Breakfalls are no big deal on concrete, though. I don't know how they do them in BJJ but at least Judo breakfalls aren't a big deal on concrete.

(That is, with lower throws. Over the hip or head throws could hurt a bit).

[SevenStar]

I didn't like this oen drill where someone grabs your waist from behind.

First to step to the side and hook their leg. Yes, once you hook the leg they can't lift you, but even in a cooperative drill it wasn't easy to find that leg and hook it.... I'm sure I'll get better in time.

sounds like their self defense stuff. We do a different variation of that one where instead of hooking the leg, you step the leg behind them and take them down with something that looks like judo's sukui nage or silat's kinjit kepala. Good stuff.


The other was the shoot, but everyone knows my feelings about that. But again, I'm emptying the cup.

once you've actually gotten hang of the shoot, I think you'll like it. We'll see. And hell, it's perfect for what you like to do anyway - get inside.


The break falls, where you slam your hands on the mat... I don't see that as a viable option on the cement. I have a different method I'm comfortable doing on cement, even train it by letting students capture a round house kick and sweep the support leg.

I've done it several times. I've done it in altercations and also in class - In judo I used to demo the breakfalls on a concrete floor to show them that the breakfalls can work on such a surface. On the same token, I've seen a nasty vid of a guy's arm shattering from slapping it on the cement. If I remember correctly though, he landed funny anyway, and once his hand slapped, you just see his arm snap.

[SevenStar]

That does sound pretty lame.

Sounds like you need a training partner in your martial art that is interested in fighting, and/or a fight coach.

There's gotta be somebody in NY like that.


He's already said that nobody in his art wants to fight. As for a coach, he would still have to train at the coach's gym, meaning he would be training in what his school taught. Essentially, that's what he's done now. He's on the right track.

[lunghushan]

He's already said that nobody in his art wants to fight. As for a coach, he would still have to train at the coach's gym, meaning he would be training in what his school taught. Essentially, that's what he's done now. He's on the right track.

It sounds kindof like a stupid drill, though. It's too bad there's not a way to drill your own MA with fighters.

[hjt]

It sounds kindof like a stupid drill, though. It's too bad there's not a way to drill your own MA with fighters.

there is, its called UFC, but they have failed.

[lunghushan]

there is, its called UFC, but they have failed.

That is not drilling. That is fighting.

[fiercest tiger]

Ray,

Simplist thing to do is buy or download instructionals or even visit sites on mma and bjj, subgrappling and get a partner and work it out. Eric Paulson has some great dvds, as well many other subgrappling masters. Then go back to the school and roll in a casual lesson, this has worked for me and i did well against the grapplers here.

Maybe just do a casual lesson a week go home refine the skills and then go back and train again...?

good luck with it all.

Garry

[SevenStar]

there is, its called UFC, but they have failed.

UFC is a fighting venue... how has it failed?

[SevenStar]

Ray,

Simplist thing to do is buy or download instructionals or even visit sites on mma and bjj, subgrappling and get a partner and work it out. Eric Paulson has some great dvds, as well many other subgrappling masters. Then go back to the school and roll in a casual lesson, this has worked for me and i did well against the grapplers here.

Maybe just do a casual lesson a week go home refine the skills and then go back and train again...?

good luck with it all.

Garry


that would work with the guys at his former school, but would not against competitive fighters.

[SevenStar]

It sounds kindof like a stupid drill, though. It's too bad there's not a way to drill your own MA with fighters.


Do you find it odd that you are the only one who has a problem with that? Most likely, the only way you'd EVER find something like that is to start a fight club of sorts. People go to schools to learn what the school is teaching, not to learn from / play with every tom, dyck and harry who wants to work with guys from a different style. I'm very open minded, and I wouldn't even allow that. why? because you're wasting both my and my fighter's time. The only way I would entertain the thought is if on a sparring night you were there - he needs bodies to spar with, so I'd let you in the ring with him.

[lunghushan]

Do you find it odd that you are the only one who has a problem with that? Most likely, the only way you'd EVER find something like that is to start a fight club of sorts. People go to schools to learn what the school is teaching, not to learn from / play with every tom, dyck and harry who wants to work with guys from a different style. I'm very open minded, and I wouldn't even allow that. why? because you're wasting both my and my fighter's time. The only way I would entertain the thought is if on a sparring night you were there - he needs bodies to spar with, so I'd let you in the ring with him.

No, Sevenstar, I don't find it odd.

Because Ray has the same problem.

And I suspect a lot of other people have the same problem. Otherwise we'd be seeing a lot more CMA winning in the ring.

[Three Harmonies]

Seven Star,
Don't waste your time nor breath bro. I have been back and forth with Lung via email since I moved up here trying to help him to a better understanding, but he is set in his ways and what he wants. It is too bad really because the kid obviously has a bit of desire, but it is not focused. Just think of all the time he has wasted trying to convince people of his ideology here on the web, when he could be training with someone! Oh well, to each their own a wise woman once told me!

Cheers
Jake :)

[lunghushan]

Seven Star,
Don't waste your time nor breath bro. I have been back and forth with Lung via email since I moved up here trying to help him to a better understanding, but he is set in his ways and what he wants. It is too bad really because the kid obviously has a bit of desire, but it is not focused. Just think of all the time he has wasted trying to convince people of his ideology here on the web, when he could be training with someone! Oh well, to each their own a wise woman once told me!

Cheers
Jake :)

Jake, I'm 35 ... I'm not a kid. Plus, like I said, my sifu doesn't like publicity.

I'm not going to join something doing a style that I don't like just because there's more partner training. I already tried that. I did karate for a while because they did more sparring, but karate is kindof boring.

Bottom line is, it is YOU guys who don't get it.

[SevenStar]

No, Sevenstar, I don't find it odd.

Because Ray has the same problem.

And I suspect a lot of other people have the same problem. Otherwise we'd be seeing a lot more CMA winning in the ring.

that's not his problem. His problem was he was wanting his teacher to be his fight coach and his teacher was not interested in fighting. Now, he's looking for a coach and school to suit him.

[lunghushan]

that's not his problem. His problem was he was wanting his teacher to be his fight coach and his teacher was not interested in fighting. Now, he's looking for a coach and school to suit him.

Actually, no, he wanted serious training partners in his style. There was no one at his place that was interested in training to fight.

It was US who said he needed a fight coach.

[SevenStar]

Seven Star,
Don't waste your time nor breath bro. I have been back and forth with Lung via email since I moved up here trying to help him to a better understanding, but he is set in his ways and what he wants. It is too bad really because the kid obviously has a bit of desire, but it is not focused. Just think of all the time he has wasted trying to convince people of his ideology here on the web, when he could be training with someone! Oh well, to each their own a wise woman once told me!

Cheers
Jake :)

you've definitely got a point there.

[SevenStar]

Actually, no, he wanted serious training partners in his style. There was no one at his place that was interested in training to fight.

It was US who said he needed a fight coach.

same difference. if he's at a school with guys who want to fight, he's obviously gonna have someone to coach him as well. He left because of differences with his teacher, not because of the students.

[lunghushan]

same difference. if he's at a school with guys who want to fight, he's obviously gonna have someone to coach him as well. He left because of differences with his teacher, not because of the students.

If I had to guess, I'd imagine that the conversation with the teacher went along the lines of something like:

Ray: "More fighting and practice."
Teacher: "No."
Ray: "More fighting and practice."
Teacher: "No."

Ray: "See ya."

Because I've had the same conversation with teachers. You can't reason with old Chinese guys. LOL

[Merryprankster]

Ray,

Hooking the leg is simple and you'll get better at it.

If you are describing the rest of the move accurately, you're actually learning how to do a rolling kneebar. You just don't realize it yet :D

[lunghushan]

So I've had conversations with a lot of MA teachers.

Bottom line is: nobody wants to be flexible in what they're doing. The shoe thing is a great example of that. Lots of things grow on the mats. There's ringworm, there's mat herpes, etc.

So wearing shoes is a good idea. Not wearing shoes is a very bad idea.

But nobody really wants to deal with that subject. In fact, the only person I ran into who realizes it is a problem is Scotty Sonnen. Coincidentally, he also has a PhD. Maybe he's just smarter? I don't know.

I could list a lot of examples.

Anyway, I'm not really worried about it anymore. If Ray wants to do ring fighting then he should go find a good ring fighting coach. He won't get enough realistic partner practice at most traditional schools to be a good ring fighter.

He had a very noble idea of applying traditional CMA into the ring, but where are you going to find a teacher like that? Probably aren't going to find one. I don't know of any.

So if I were Ray, I'd just book myself immediately into Coach Ross's school, or Team Quest or something.

[Merryprankster]

lung,

almost everybody realizes it's a problem. That's why they wash the mats at least once a day, with a germicidal mat cleaner.

If that hasn't been your experience, then all I can say is I wouldn't train there either.

And shoes on the mat are a bad idea, unless those shoes have never been on the ground outside. How do you think mat gonaherpesyphilaids gets spread?

[lunghushan]

lung,

almost everybody realizes it's a problem. That's why they wash the mats at least once a day, with a germicidal mat cleaner.

If that hasn't been your experience, then all I can say is I wouldn't train there either.

And shoes on the mat are a bad idea, unless those shoes have never been on the ground outside. How do you think mat gonaherpesyphilaids gets spread?

You use mat shoes, shoes that have never been outside. That will help keep people's feet from bleeding and picking up something.

I mean, people used to always bleed in martial arts classes years ago, but it wasn't such a big deal because so many fewer people had these illnesses.

Anyway, I just think it's ironic because I brought this up before on Bullshido and the co-founder got on my case hard about it, and then he got mat herpes from a BJJ tourney.

But yeah, I've been to lots of places that don't clean the mats after every class. Especially if they do classes every hour or every 1 1/2 hours, they don't clean the mats. Sometimes for days.

In fact the first place I ever went to that had very non-porous mats that cleaned them after every class was some kind of karate in 1997, I think. I can't even remember what kind, now.

Judo they had a canvas porous mat that you couldn't even clean right. The instructor carefully cleaned it before every class, but what's the point if it's totally porous?

[Knifefighter]

I didn't like this oen drill where someone grabs your waist from behind.
I'm with you here Ray. I'm not a big fan of the majority of BJJ "self-defense" moves either. When I was in beginner/intermediate classes, I used to walk out thinking I wanted my money back for the classes in which that stuff was taught.

[Knifefighter]

If you are describing the rest of the move accurately, you're actually learning how to do a rolling kneebar. You just don't realize it yet :D

I don't think he is talking about the rolling knee bar. He is talking about the Self Defense move in which one reaches between one's legs and pulls the opponent's legs up, dumping the opponent on his butt and then cranking the knee from a standing position. If I remember correctly, it is done when the arms are free and the opponent is holding around the waist from behind. It is one of the standard Gracie self-defense moves.

[lkfmdc]

I don't think he is talking about the rolling knee bar. He is talking about the Self Defense move in which one reaches between one's legs and pulls the opponent's legs up, dumping the opponent on his butt and then cranking the knee from a standing position. If I remember correctly, it is done when the arms are free and the opponent is holding around the waist from behind. It is one of the standard Gracie self-defense moves.

I believe that KF is correct, it's a fairly standard move (even GASP, seen it in sambo and Shuai Jiao) .... not that fond of it but for what it is worth I've seen it pulled off live in San Da matches :D

[Three Harmonies]

Lung
Age is a number. Maturity is totally different. Again you expect people to work around what you want/think is right. Let me ask you this.... would you have the same attitude about a job you are interviewing for? I think not, or you would never get it. I understand your frustrations, but your attitude is what is turning a lot of people off I think. I am in no way trying to wad your panties, just giving you an unbiased opinion.
You make a lot of general statements like the shoe thing for instance.....I wear shoes on my mats! My students do if they choose. So maybe you should not project such a negative attitude in this regard.
Hope I did not offend,
Jake :cool:

[dleungnyc]

If I had to guess, I'd imagine that the conversation with the teacher went along the lines of something like:

Ray: "More fighting and practice."
Teacher: "No."
Ray: "More fighting and practice."
Teacher: "No."

Ray: "See ya."

Because I've had the same conversation with teachers. You can't reason with old Chinese guys. LOL


You weren't there, that's not what happened, don't make up a story.

[lunghushan]

Lung
Age is a number. Maturity is totally different. Again you expect people to work around what you want/think is right. Let me ask you this.... would you have the same attitude about a job you are interviewing for? I think not, or you would never get it. I understand your frustrations, but your attitude is what is turning a lot of people off I think. I am in no way trying to wad your panties, just giving you an unbiased opinion.
You make a lot of general statements like the shoe thing for instance.....I wear shoes on my mats! My students do if they choose. So maybe you should not project such a negative attitude in this regard.
Hope I did not offend,
Jake :cool:

Interviewing. You are interviewing for a job, not me. You are expecting me to pay you $. You are the one interviewing.

If you went on an interview and were inflexible, then yes, you probably would not get the job.
In fact, I did interview you. And you were inflexible, so you did not get the job.

So now that we have that over, we can resume our discussion. :) And no, we are not cool. Your insinuations of immaturity are not cool. :)

[lunghushan]

You weren't there, that's not what happened, don't make up a story.

It was a guess. I have no idea what happened. Honestly I really don't care.

[lunghushan]

Bottom line is this. It is no longer 100s of years ago when you had to do what your martial arts 'master' said. It is now a consumer economy where martial arts teachers and schools offer a service.

So if you do not offer something the student wants, they do not have to take your classes or pay you.

It's very simple. You don't have to insinuate that I am young or immature. That's not going to make me want to study with you. In fact, it's not even going to make me like you very much.

[hjt]

UFC is a fighting venue... how has it failed?

i was referring to lungsomething post

he mention that CMA'ers cant drill or use their techniques for fighting.

[Ray Pina]

Here is the letter I mailed to my master's daughter, the school's manager, yesterday. It explains my sentiment perfectly

I am withdrawing from the school,

The first thing master asked me last friday was, why didn't I tell him I was going to fight. Besides telling him at the start of the summer (when I doubled my training and tuition), I reminded him periodically, including the time I showed him the gloves I was going to wear a week before the fight .... the same gloves he liked, the same ones you called me to get more information about. On top of that, two days before the fight both the promoter and myself called him telling him that I needed a waiver to fight. First he suggested I don't go (after training all summer and dropping the required weight) and then told me to just forge it and then, "good luck."

So he knew about the fight. I know somehow things look better if a student lost and the teacher didn't know, didn't have the chance to prepare him, but he knew.... he had the chance.

Secondly. I have been turned off by the ceasless comparison with other schools, and even with fellow students. I train to be the best I can be. While it's awesome to train with other styles in mind, I find it rediculous to put these styles down. They are winning at the highest levels, we haven't stepped out of the back yard. I wanted to train harder, not distance myself by saying it's only sport, too many rules, etc. There is a huge difference between beating karate and kung fu "masters" and students, playing with guests, and facing a highly-skilled, trained and motivated modern fighter in open combat.

I say this, because I know from first hand experience. I haven't lost one challenge match against Kung Fu, Tae Kwon Do, Karate, Ju-Jitsu, etc.... I haven't won one "sport" fight. The sport fighters aren't only better, they're MUCH better. I don't think anyone being honest with themselves would deny that a professional fighter is better than a hobbyist.

I say these things because I think few apreciated master's technique more than me. I don't regret my time with him for a second; I have a confidence in my hands that I didn't think possible. Just lately, there seams to be more emphasis on "doing things differently" than doing them for real. There's seams to be more emphasis on protecting the style (by championing its greatness within the confines of the garage's four walls) rather than realistically developing it.

To master's credit, his material is great, and if you're willing to get dirty you can incorporate his material and become a fighter. It's just a shame that there's not enough people who feel the same way to keep a fighter there, to allow a fighter to grow and experiment and stay with the style.

I know master's dream is to take a team to China to fight. I wish you the best of luck.

As for me, I will not share anything I have learned with anyone other than my students. I have developed several safe drills incorporating boxing gloves that train capturing the hand and hitting if you're interested.

Best of luck to you as a martial artists,
Ray

PS
Just finished reading Ali's biography. His all-time favorite bag (his words, not mine) was a custom made 185lbs bag that he gave to Joe Frazier...... he replaced that bag with a 200lbs bag.

[yenhoi]

:eek: :eek: :eek:

[FatherDog]

The shoe thing is a great example of that. Lots of things grow on the mats. There's ringworm, there's mat herpes, etc.

So wearing shoes is a good idea. Not wearing shoes is a very bad idea.

Ringworm spreads primarily through direct skin-to-skin contact, and secondarily through indirect skin-to-skin contact (contact with a surface that has previously contacted skin. Your feet are not substantially more likely to have ringworm than the rest of your body, and whether or not you wear shoes, other areas of your body (such as hands, arms, neck and face) are much, much more likely to be in skin-to-skin contact with training partners. Wearing shoes does not substantially reduce the risk of ringworm or other skin-to-skin diseases.

[lunghushan]

Ringworm spreads primarily through direct skin-to-skin contact, and secondarily through indirect skin-to-skin contact (contact with a surface that has previously contacted skin. Your feet are not substantially more likely to have ringworm than the rest of your body, and whether or not you wear shoes, other areas of your body (such as hands, arms, neck and face) are much, much more likely to be in skin-to-skin contact with training partners. Wearing shoes does not substantially reduce the risk of ringworm or other skin-to-skin diseases.

If you're doing CMA, there's not as much skin-to-skin contact usually as something like BJJ where you're grappling.

In fact, doing forms and sparring, there is usually little to no skin to skin contact, if you're wearing a long sleeved uniform and gear.

Therefore, the primary surface that is exposed and shared is the feet. I visited a place recently, and they were working out, and one of them went, "Oh, there's blood on the mat." The sensei was like, "Oh, that's a day old at least, that's not from us."

In other words, they didn't clean the mat. If you had a cut on your foot you could get the blood in it.

I'm not going to deal with it.

Actually the only place that I ever went that had non-porous mats that cleaned the mat with Lysol after every class was NY Kyokushin. It is highly likely a lot of people are getting Hep-C from mats and nobody is realizing it.

[Merryprankster]

I stand corrected then, by KF and lkfmdc.

If it makes you feel any better, I actually used to use that move to escape after a stand-up in wrestling in high school, several times.

But yeah, I can see why you wouldn't like it. It'll get better soon.

[Water Dragon]

Train it all, Ray. You're not even sure what you like yet as far as the ground is concerned. There are techniques I didn't like at all that became bread and butter techniques for me a year down the road. You're game will constantly evolve and change. You'll pick things up, discard them, then picj them back up again as your understanding of the game changes. That's what makes BJJ so fun. It's a thinking martial art.

[WanderingMonk]

Hey H2O Dragon, someone has been paging you at the emptyflower off-topic forum for the last two days.

http://www.emptyflower.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi/YaBB.cgi?board=Off;action=display;num=1158190330

[tjmitch]

"There is a guy there called John Danaher..."


I train with Jaime Cruz, one of Renzo's black belts and he says the same thing about NZ John. If it at all fits into your schedule try to get in one of his classes. I think he teaches real early in the AM.

[Ray Pina]

So, on day 2 Henzo's teaching the class and George St. Pierre is there and a camera crew because Henzo's fighting this weekend. They asked if I would sign a waiver because Henzo was working with me and my partner and they might use the footage.

That was Thursday and I was stoked, so many fighters, super positive environment.

On Fri., some guy stops by to present the school with a trophy for being the most winningist (I know that sounds funny) BJJ school.

Pretty cool place.

[omarthefish]

So, on day 2 Henzo's teaching the class and George St. Pierre is there and a camera crew because Henzo's fighting this weekend. They asked if I would sign a waiver because Henzo was working with me and my partner and they might use the footage.


Got a small laugh here.

Are you sure his name isn't Renzo....? :D

In Portuguese, "r" is pronounced like an "h".

Royce = Hoyce
Rorian = Horian

Also Helio (I thinl it's with an "h") has some sort of wierd superstition about naming his kids with names starting with "r".

Even the "invincible" Rickson's name is pronounced "Hickson". ;)

[chud]

Here is the letter I mailed to my master's daughter, the school's manager, yesterday. It explains my sentiment perfectly

I am withdrawing from the school,



So you're not studying with David Bond Chan anymore?

I don't blame you for wanting to study some BJJ to improve your ground game, but I thought you were going to do both.

[Ray Pina]

In Portuguese, "r" is pronounced like an "h".

Royce = Hoyce
Rorian = Horian

Also Helio (I thinl it's with an "h") has some sort of wierd superstition about naming his kids with names starting with "r".

Even the "invincible" Rickson's name is pronounced "Hickson". ;)

I actually knew that. Jusy typing fast I guess.

I think I remember reading somewhere that the elder Gracie actually believed names with R have a special power.

Ray:)

[Chief Fox]

Ray, you're an inspiration. The new school sounds great.

This quote spoke to me.
"I haven't lost one challenge match against Kung Fu, Tae Kwon Do, Karate, Ju-Jitsu, etc.... I haven't won one "sport" fight. The sport fighters aren't only better, they're MUCH better. I don't think anyone being honest with themselves would deny that a professional fighter is better than a hobbyist."

Keep up the good work and keep growing as a martial artist.

[BoulderDawg]

Having read this thread I think it's rather obvious that Ray's goal is to be a professional fighter.

I guess if that's what you want then go for it. However it's a lot easier for an 18 year old to have this goal than someone in their thirties. You will get stronger until you're past 50.....however speed is another thing.

[Chief Fox]

Having read this thread I think it's rather obvious that Ray's goal is to be a professional fighter.

I guess if that's what you want then go for it. However it's a lot easier for an 18 year old to have this goal than someone in their thirties. You will get stronger until you're past 50.....however speed is another thing.

I look at it as Ray wanting to be the best fighter he can be. He's discovering that the better fighters are in a certain arena so that's were he's going. Nothing wrong with wanting to be the best you can be at any age.

[Mutant]

Good job Ray, sounds like you are doing the best thing possible for you right now!

[Ray Pina]

it's rather obvious that Ray's goal is to be a professional fighter..... it's a lot easier for an 18 year old to have this goal than someone in their thirties. You will get stronger until you're past 50.....however speed is another thing.

Right now, my immediate goal is to learn the basics of Gracie Jui-Jitsu and move up the ranks in my new school. I'm highly competitive, and don't like to be a kook. So I'm going to the maximum 3 classes a week right now, but will let them know I want to fight and don't want to grow rusty so maybe an exception could be made and I could do randori on Sat. as well.

Long term, and ultimate goal, is to win 1 pro cage fight. That's it.

After that I'll reaccess the situation and create new goals.

As for age, etc. Merely existing in a physical realm will always present physical limitations. I never played football before and became HS captain, first team all state and played college ball.... I was born and raised in the city and now consider myself a world-class surfer. I believe if you truly want something you will do whatever it takes to achieve it. If you do whatever it takes to achieve it you will achieve it or die in the process of trying to achieve it. Or, you can give up. You can change your goals and focus and move on to something else, or, realise you're not willing to do what it takes.... in this case, sometimes its easier to say "I'm too old," or "I have a job" or, "I have a wife."

There are men fighting in the UFC right now who are in their mid 30s, married, studying to be lawyers, etc. Even comparing the physical capabilities of men in their 20s and those of their 40s, it's not that much .... the difference in one man's mind, discipline, focus, etc. can be huge. And I find in life this is usually the deciding factor.

[Mutant]

Right now, my immediate goal is to learn the basics of Gracie Jui-Jitsu and move up the ranks in my new school. I'm highly competitive, and don't like to be a kook. So I'm going to the maximum 3 classes a week right now, but will let them know I want to fight and don't want to grow rusty so maybe an exception could be made and I could do randori on Sat. as well.

Long term, and ultimate goal, is to win 1 pro cage fight. That's it.

After that I'll reaccess the situation and create new goals.

As for age, etc. Merely existing in a physical realm will always present physical limitations. I never played football before and became HS captain, first team all state and played college ball.... I was born and raised in the city and now consider myself a world-class surfer. I believe if you truly want something you will do whatever it takes to achieve it. If you do whatever it takes to achieve it you will achieve it or die in the process of trying to achieve it. Or, you can give up. You can change your goals and focus and move on to something else, or, realise you're not willing to do what it takes.... in this case, sometimes its easier to say "I'm too old," or "I have a job" or, "I have a wife."

There are men fighting in the UFC right now who are in their mid 30s, married, studying to be lawyers, etc. Even comparing the physical capabilities of men in their 20s and those of their 40s, it's not that much .... the difference in one man's mind, discipline, focus, etc. can be huge. And I find in life this is usually the deciding factor.
Great post Ray. Its all relativity and what you can forge for your own reality. Screw all perceived limitations.