Taijiquan Private Lessons Cost

[hinokata]

I have managed to find someone that teaches a variety of internal Chinese arts and they seem to really know what they are talking about (of course being that I know almost nothing about it, I am not a good judge on that). I have studied mostly Japanese martial arts for the past 22 years or so and I have never had to pay for a private lesson. This person charges $75 per session and I'm curious to know if this is high/low/average price for this type of art?

Thank you for your time

[RonH]

My old taiji profe offers ones for about 30 dollars a month for private lessons at his studio and you could come many many times a month. I forget the exact number, but it was a lot, not like one of those studios where there's a shedule for everything. He teaches both taiji and shaolin kempo karate. The only reason I don't go is because his studio is so far away that it isn't cost effective for drive time, gas and then, paying for the lessons. He taught at several places, the Y I trained with him was in my town and was something he started long ago and last I heard, he had gotten taiji lessons started up at several places between the town I live in and his studio.

But, my profe's profe is so much more expensive, even though he teaches the same styles and lives a few minutes away. He charges a couple hundred bucks regularly and his classes are much larger and he'd charge basically the same price for private lessons. I don't train with him because he's too sodding expensive. It'd be cheaper to go to my profe's studio, even with high gas prices.

My profe's profe is more about business and my profe is more about passing on the art in better quality. One of the things that makes him so cool.

[lunghushan]

Private lessons are the way a lot of instructors make extra dough on top of teaching regular classes, and some instructors only give private lessons.

The cost can range from $20 to $500 or whatever depending upon how famous the instructor is, how many $$$ they can get, etc.

For metros it seems like $60-$125 is the usual cost.

Before you go to private lessons you better make sure that you are getting what you want. Unless you have money to throw away.

Private lessons are not very useful IMHO for beginners because they a) don't know what they are doing or want, so it's kindof a waste anyway and b) there aren't usually other students to practice techniques with. Before you sign up for private lessons you might want to educate yourself a bit.

Just the fact you are asking how much private lessons should be would seem to indicate you are generally clueless.

In other words, before you sign up to spend a ton of $, you might want to attend some regular classes, get an idea of what different teachers are like, and if this teacher even has something you want, before you open up your wallet to a lot of expense.

Unless you're rich and don't really care, in which case then it doesn't really matter, does it?

[hinokata]

My profe's profe is more about business and my profe is more about passing on the art in better quality. One of the things that makes him so cool.

Thank you for your input. :)

[hinokata]

Private lessons are the way a lot of instructors make extra dough on top of teaching regular classes, and some instructors only give private lessons.

I'm going to go ahead and respond to you on this. If you will notice, I stated that I have been practicing for 22 years. I understand the principle behind private lessons, just that I have never had to pay for one and am unfamiliar with the costs associated with them. I also did not know if this was common practice for Chinese martial arts in general.


The cost can range from $20 to $500 or whatever depending upon how famous the instructor is, how many $$$ they can get, etc.

For metros it seems like $60-$125 is the usual cost.

Thank you for answering the question.


Before you go to private lessons you better make sure that you are getting what you want. Unless you have money to throw away.

I am open to suggestions as to how I can go about that considering this instructor only does private lessons.


Private lessons are not very useful IMHO for beginners

I would disagree with you there. One on one instruction from the instructor I think is fantastic in the beginning, as they are able to prevent you from forming bad habits in the first place due to the extra attention you will receive.


b) there aren't usually other students to practice techniques with.

I do agree with you there to a slight degree. If they are doing striking/tumbling/katas, is it paramount to have a partner? No, as these are things that you must work on by yourself till you have reached a point where you can safely practice with another student. I agree that grappling is more of an issue while not having a partner, but it can still be done, especially if you have a good instructor.


Before you sign up for private lessons you might want to educate yourself a bit.

Educate myself on what exactly? The styles? I have done some initial research, purchased books, read about the histories, hence why I was seeking an instructor so that I could get a better feel for the art. In this case, it is vastly different from anything that I have trained in, so I asked a question. One learns by asking questions and by doing.


Just the fact you are asking how much private lessons should be would seem to indicate you are generally clueless.

No we come to the spot that I don't understand. What exactly provoked this attack? I asked a question explicitly about the pricing of Chinese martial arts private lessons, which in my first post I stated I come from a Japanese MA background. Now how exactly does asking an informed question make me "generally clueless"?


In other words, before you sign up to spend a ton of $, you might want to attend some regular classes, get an idea of what different teachers are like, and if this teacher even has something you want, before you open up your wallet to a lot of expense.

I would do that if he had beginners classes. I figure I will try it once and see how I feel about the quality of instruction. I may not know the art, but my experience will provide me a little insight into the type of instructor he is.


Unless you're rich and don't really care, in which case then it doesn't really matter, does it?

The thread I read before this was one were you jumped in on something just troll about a minor point in the initial post and you were filed with negativity and pessimism. Again here, we can see that negative attitude showing through again. If your life is so sad that you must troll the forums, you truly have my sympathies.

[lunghushan]

It's not an attack. I'm just saying that if you're clueless about CMA you might want to educate yourself. Why do you take it as an attack?

Just because somebody purports to teach something doesn't mean that they actually do. Or are any good at it. Just because people say somebody is good doesn't mean they are.

I've run across people who wasted a LOT of time, especially on private lessons.

And I have met rich people who don't care and don't want to waste the time, who think nothing of spending thousands upon thousands just to see if something is good or not, so my comments were only put forward to you if you care about saving $.

Otherwise, just take Oom Young Doe and shell out $20 grand for their BB program -- why not?

In CMA circles there are a LOT more cheats and frauds, IMHO, than in Japanese arts, which is WHY I SAID IT.

Don't take everything as an attack.

[lunghushan]

In fact, on second thought, since you were too lazy even to check the going rates, and then got on my case for trying to WARN you what you were getting into ...

Why not just sign up for Oom Young Doe, spend the $20 grand, take taiji, bagua and all that, and save the trouble of looking around for anything else?

[Three Harmonies]

Maybe it is not "everyone" else taking your posts as "attacks," perhaps you really are rather negative!? This gent brings up some good points.

To answer the thread....
Going rate for private lessons varies on city and teacher. Around Seattle $50-75 an hour is game. Colorado can be a bit pricey especially up around Vale, Boulder etc. Some good players up there though, may I ask who it is?
It is my honest opinion that private lesson's are a great way to learn regardless of level. You may want to ask him if he offers any discounts on multiple lessons? I offer that to my students, that if they pre pay for X amount of lessons I cut them a bit of a break. Not everyone does it, but it never hurts to ask.
Good luck,
Jake :)

[hinokata]

Going rate for private lessons varies on city and teacher. Around Seattle $50-75 an hour is game. Colorado can be a bit pricey especially up around Vale, Boulder etc. Some good players up there though, may I ask who it is?

First off, allow me to thank you for the information you provided. The gentleman's name is Doug Olmstead. I haven't found much on him outside the medical aspects that he practices, but I also have to admit that I haven't tried looking very hard. :)


It is my honest opinion that private lesson's are a great way to learn regardless of level. You may want to ask him if he offers any discounts on multiple lessons? I offer that to my students, that if they pre pay for X amount of lessons I cut them a bit of a break. Not everyone does it, but it never hurts to ask.
Good luck,
Jake :)

I will be sure to ask him this. He did state that it's more of a traditional teaching style where he will teach me (versus workout) and work with me for home training and when I need help and/or feel I am ready to move onto other things, then I would go see him. From just speaking with him on the phone, he seems to really know what he is talking about. Of course, I have only read 3 books on the subject, so it would be rather easy to fool me on that topic. ;)

[ngokfei]

Private lessons was the norm. Only after getting a good foundation in the art/style that you are training would an instructor then arrange for 2 or more students to compare skills or simply drills.

Some of my early teachers only offered Private sessions 1 a week. Over time fellow students would get together to train and this then led to a group class being held.

Also private lessons is a great way to avoid "flaky" students (i've borrowed that term, it fits well).

Now for cost hell its the new millenium. The average going rate in most large cities is $100 and above. Most schools average tuition is between $85-200 a month (and thats for only 2 sessions a week).

[hinokata]

Private lessons was the norm. Only after getting a good foundation in the art/style that you are training would an instructor then arrange for 2 or more students to compare skills or simply drills.

Thank you for the information. Forgive me if this is a stupid question, but does the the internal arts "comparing" of skills consists mainly of push-hands and forms? From the books I have read, it mentions very little about "heavy" sparing. Heavy in this case being mid to full contact.


Some of my early teachers only offered Private sessions 1 a week. Over time fellow students would get together to train and this then led to a group class being held.

The gentleman stated that he *might* be offering a class in the spring for beginners, and I was free to wait till then, however one thing I still have to work on is my lack of patience and I would rather begin training now that it has piqued my interest to the Nth degree. I have to admit, when I started that I found CMA to overly flashy/useless in fights. Now that I have practiced for awhile, I realize that I just didn't understand many of the concepts behind CMA (and I'm sure I still don't), but my focus has shifted away from the overly aggressive to self-improvement, and the CMA internal arts seems to be the way I want progress now and into the future.


Also private lessons is a great way to avoid "flaky" students (i've borrowed that term, it fits well).

That is a good point. It's frustrating even as a student to have to deal with other students that are "flaky".


Now for cost hell its the new millenium. The average going rate in most large cities is $100 and above. Most schools average tuition is between $85-200 a month (and thats for only 2 sessions a week).

This information leads me to believe that I am actually getting a pretty good deal. Thank you again for the information.

[lunghushan]

Maybe it is not "everyone" else taking your posts as "attacks," perhaps you really are rather negative!? This gent brings up some good points.

To answer the thread....
Going rate for private lessons varies on city and teacher. Around Seattle $50-75 an hour is game. Colorado can be a bit pricey especially up around Vale, Boulder etc. Some good players up there though, may I ask who it is?
It is my honest opinion that private lesson's are a great way to learn regardless of level. You may want to ask him if he offers any discounts on multiple lessons? I offer that to my students, that if they pre pay for X amount of lessons I cut them a bit of a break. Not everyone does it, but it never hurts to ask.
Good luck,
Jake :)

It's not negative. I know plenty of people who have wasted a ton of $ in private lessons and not gotten much out of it.

As someone who gives private lessons, I think that you might be a little bit biased.

Anyway I give up. It's obvious that he doesn't want any advice from me.

[Three Harmonies]

Nice post Ngok!
Hell, any of the Gracies (or any BB in BJJ for that matter) are anywhere from $150-400 an hour!!!!! One guy locally (don't know him, just some average joe) paid BJ Penn to come here to Seattle for ONE day of training.....rumor has it $3500!!! For what it's worth.
Cheers
Jake :)

[lunghushan]

Nice post Ngok!
Hell, any of the Gracies (or any BB in BJJ for that matter) are anywhere from $150-400 an hour!!!!! One guy locally (don't know him, just some average joe) paid BJ Penn to come here to Seattle for ONE day of training.....rumor has it $3500!!! For what it's worth.
Cheers
Jake :)

LOL. Spoken like a true entrepreneur. Why don't you study with these guys, hinokata ... pay them all your spare cash, it must be worth it right?

[hinokata]

Anyway I give up. It's obvious that he doesn't want any advice from me.

So when does this go into effect?

[hinokata]

One guy locally (don't know him, just some average joe) paid BJ Penn to come here to Seattle for ONE day of training.....rumor has it $3500!!!

Pure craziness. I went ahead and scheduled an appointment for this evening with Mr. Olmstead, so hopefully that will give me a better idea of both the art and exactly what I am getting into. :) I'll let you know how it goes if you're interested. By the way, I checked out your website and if I'm ever in Seattle, I'll most likely swing by. :)

[Three Harmonies]

Good call. The best way to see about something is to experience it.

Thank you for the compliment on the site (wish I could take credit). You are always most welcome anytime!

Good luck with your journey.
Cheers
Jake :)

[cjurakpt]

A few points:

1) amazing how it takes someone who's only just come onto the forum only one post to figure out what the rest of us know, which is the Lunghushan is a real pill with a chip on his shoulder about, well, just about everything...

2) re: TCMA and privates; here's how it works with my teacher, maybe this will give you some useful info: when I first started at the school (actually his loft), group class was the only option - in my teacher's case, he generally doesn't do privates with beginners; of course, the "goal" was to get to the point where I could work one on one with him; after about a year of study, at the suggestion of a senior training sister, I asked him if I could study privately; he said it was fine, and suggested 2x a month; the rate, same 10 years ago as it still is today, is $85/hour, which is pretty good for NYC (not to mention that in the 10 years doing privates I have never felt that I have gotten less than at least twice my $$$ worth each and every time); one other "hint", it may help, it may not: when sifu asked me what I wanted to do the first lesson, I said "I don't know, whatever you think I should do." (this was at my senior training sister's suggestion) - let's just say that, what we ended up doing was way cooler than anything I could have thought of, and it was actually just what I needed to do at the time - nine times out of ten, when he asks this question, I give him the same answer - and I never regret it when I do; of course, this is predicated on the notion that your teacher actually has a direct interest in you the student as an individual, not just looking to take your $$$ (after so many years in the arts, I suspect you know the difference between genuine teaching and a con game though)

good luck, enjoy

[hinokata]

A few points:
1) amazing how it takes someone who's only just come onto the forum only one post to figure out what the rest of us know, which is the Lunghushan is a real pill with a chip on his shoulder about, well, just about everything...

I think Helen Keller would be able to spot that one :)



2) re: TCMA and privates; here's how it works with my teacher, maybe this will give you some useful info: when I first started at the school (actually his loft), group class was the only option - in my teacher's case, he generally doesn't do privates with beginners; of course, the "goal" was to get to the point where I could work one on one with him; after about a year of study, at the suggestion of a senior training sister, I asked him if I could study privately; he said it was fine, and suggested 2x a month; the rate, same 10 years ago as it still is today, is $85/hour, which is pretty good for NYC (not to mention that in the 10 years doing privates I have never felt that I have gotten less than at least twice my $$$ worth each and every time); one other "hint", it may help, it may not: when sifu asked me what I wanted to do the first lesson, I said "I don't know, whatever you think I should do." (this was at my senior training sister's suggestion) - let's just say that, what we ended up doing was way cooler than anything I could have thought of, and it was actually just what I needed to do at the time - nine times out of ten, when he asks this question, I give him the same answer - and I never regret it when I do; of course, this is predicated on the notion that your teacher actually has a direct interest in you the student as an individual, not just looking to take your $$$ (after so many years in the arts, I suspect you know the difference between genuine teaching and a con game though)

good luck, enjoy

Thank you for the useful information. I actually attended the class tonight (just got back actually), and well, I'm going to post another thread with my newbie questions because I have very mixed feelings about the class (and I'm hoping to get some more knowledgeable eyes than mine to look at the information I was provided), which I can't tell if it's from the lessons, or the fact that it is completely different than anything that I have studied prior.

[jon]

"I don't know, whatever you think I should do."
This is 'very' good advice, I follow this to the letter and it has always worked out for the best. If your going to learn from someone you know is better than you then respect their judgement.

[wujimon]

I would advise on seeking private instruction after you have learned the whole form. This way, the private lessons are targeted with detailed forms corrections and/or application training.

As for rate, the most common I hear is roughly $50/hr or around $100/hr. I think most of the touring masters charge around $150/hr. I've heard of a grandmaster charging $250/hr. So it really varies and would be quite beneficial if you knew exactly what you wanted from private lessons.

I'm sure someone would be very happy to teach you choreography and have you follow behind them for 1 hr and charge you $50 or so dollars. To me, this type of low level choreography can be learned in public classes in a pretty short amount of time. Plus, if you show the instructor you're serious, he/she may come over and either give you corrections in class or use as a 'demonstration partner'. This way, you'll get a sampling of their private instruction at public rates ;)

However, if a reason for seeking private lessons is due to time constraints, that's a whole other story..

Good luck.
w.

[8palmmojo]

I am in Taiwan now, but I was living in Sacramento, Ca. and studying Cheng-style Bagua privately with my teacher once a week, on Sunday afternoons. My teacher, during the day, is a physical therapist. So his medical knowledge of the body, its tissues, healing, etc. was also given in our time. We worked out for at least an hour and a half each lesson. If things were flowing well and there were no other students scheduled behind my time, we would work out longer. I never had to pay more for this time. I paid thirty dollars per meeting/lesson and I consider the instruction to have been very sincere and first rate. If I did not have the money one week I could defer to another week. His main point was that he wanted me there, money or not. I often paid more when I could just to say thanks but he only asked for thirty per lesson.
Prior to beginning this training I had spent eight years studying Chinese martial arts, the first four were spent in Shaolin/pigua and the second four were spent in Yi-style Tai Chi.
We incorporated useful elements of gongfu, tai chi, and xingyi but only as these were useful towards Bagua development. In our sessions we would spar, learn forms, knife fighting, stretching, do chi gong, etc. When necessary (my teacher only took five students total) he would bring another one of the five student's time to coincide with mine and teach the two of us together, instructiong from the side. These times were useful as well.
More than just a great teacher and martial artist I grew to include him as a great personal friend. The experience was very worthwhile and, were I not in Taiwan, I would still be studying with him each week.
I hope this info. is useful to you and that your search goes well.
Scott

[mawali]

That is why it is good to take public lessons first to see the attitudes of students, instructors, learn and be aware as much as you can then go the private lessons route. It is obvious that you do not just take any class! Loot at the best options and go from there.

[imperialtaichi]

Private lessons could be tricky....

On one hand, I have met very skillful teachers willing to teach and virtually not interested in money at all; on the other hand I have met a teacher who charges through the roof and DELIBERATELY teach you the wrong things so you could never develop the skills.

But the human instinct is sharp. What I find is if we do not get sucked in to the sales pitch and packaging and promises, it is easy to sense if someone has well intentions or if someone is trying to rip us off. I rather learn from someone less skilled but really cares about my progress, than someone skilled but trying to cheat me.

It is of course, fair for teachers to charge premium for their skills; Everybody needs to make a living and wants to have more in life. But when an honest person (teachers, used car salesmen, dentists) charges you $1000, he/she will give you at least a $1000 worth of products.

It is a misconception that it take forever to develop skills in Tai Chi; under proper instructions, one should develop skills very quickly. If after some lessons and you are not seeing results, run. Sure you may have lost some money, but at least you are not going to lose anymore.

Good luck with your search.
John

[lunghushan]

It is a misconception that it take forever to develop skills in Tai Chi; under proper instructions, one should develop skills very quickly. If after some lessons and you are not seeing results, run. Sure you may have lost some money, but at least you are not going to lose anymore.


That's why I was trying to tell him that he might want to try regular classes first to make sure the teacher had what he was looking before he spent money on privates.

I guess I didn't word it right though.

[ftgjr]

I'm an advocate of both classes and private lessons, as long as you have someone good teaching you. I have been taking private Tai Chi lesson for 6 years and am paying $150 per month for around 1 1/2 hrs each week ( a real bargain if you ask me.) During that time I have also taken classes in Hung Gar and Xingyi. I have also taken private lesson in Tae Kwon Do several years ago as well as classes. I think it is important to be able to work with other people beside your teacher. The more people you touch hands with, the better you will become. Try and see if there are any opportunities to work out with other students from time to time.

The best way to find out if your teacher is the right one is to commit yourself to a set time (like 3 months) and see if it is what you are looking for. Be honest and open minded though, because I know quite a few guys who have wasted years training with someone, both classes and privately.

[imperialtaichi]

I think it is important to be able to work with other people beside your teacher. The more people you touch hands with, the better you will become. Try and see if there are any opportunities to work out with other students from time to time.



Good call. I am constantly encouraging my private students to cross hands with other people, other schools, other styles, as long as they remain curteous and respect the other schools and not to show off.

Some of the more senior ones I also recommend them to do some teaching. It is amazing how much you can learn when students start asking you questions you have never thought of, and asking you to deal with techniques you have never encountered.

Cheers,
John

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

My private lessons are $45 for 1 hour and $60 for 1 1/2 hours.. if 2 people request a combined private lesson (it helps them review together later) it is $60 for 1 hour and $90 for 1 1/2 hours.. i prefer 1 1/2 hours, it just seems to fit the attention span ratio and we can detail the lesson with time for me to watch them "get it" on their own.. after an hour of detail, i watch as they work through it on their own.. offering assistance when they get really stuck.. i have found this to be useful in as much as if i am constantly leading the student they won't be able to work through the lesson on their own.. monitoring their progress before dismissing them assures me that they at least left with the appropriate tools to practice independently.. and it forces them to conceptualize the lesson, not just mimic my own movements..

Be well...

[qiphlow]

Greetings..

My private lessons are $45 for 1 hour and $60 for 1 1/2 hours.. if 2 people request a combined private lesson (it helps them review together later) it is $60 for 1 hour and $90 for 1 1/2 hours.. i prefer 1 1/2 hours, it just seems to fit the attention span ratio and we can detail the lesson with time for me to watch them "get it" on their own.. after an hour of detail, i watch as they work through it on their own.. offering assistance when they get really stuck.. i have found this to be useful in as much as if i am constantly leading the student they won't be able to work through the lesson on their own.. monitoring their progress before dismissing them assures me that they at least left with the appropriate tools to practice independently.. and it forces them to conceptualize the lesson, not just mimic my own movements..

Be well...

that sounds like good policy...

[mawali]

Private lessons was the norm. Only after getting a good foundation in the art/style that you are training would an instructor then arrange for 2 or more students to compare skills or simply drills.

Now for cost hell its the new millenium. The average going rate in most large cities is $100 and above. Most schools average tuition is between $85-200 a month (and thats for only 2 sessions a week).

If the teachers' only means of support is tai chi lessons then depending on where you are, lessons could be even higher. I have seen some teachers' lessons and some can charge as high as $10,000.00 a year if you really live in a high rent area plus the supply/demand equation!