Kungfu Lessons in Arnhem, Holland

[WhiteEarp]

I short advert for people from Holland:

Kungfu Lessons in Arnhem Velperpoort at Sportschool "kreijtz"

Styles: How Chuen, Lung Chuen

(monkey and dragon)

Every Wednesday at 17:00u.
First lesson is free.

Discription of the pictures:

The Pictures below are Sifu Decramer with his old master Sifu Tze.
The yellow/orange belts are kids during a lesson in Arnhem.
And the other is a photo with Sifu Decramer and older pupils during training in Arnhem.

Link to sportschool kreijtz: http://www.sportschoolkreijtz.nl/

Short description in Dutch:

Een leven vol Kung Fu
Als je Fred Decramer op de praatstoel hebt is het net of je in een spannend boek verzeild bent geraakt. De een na de andere prachtige anekdote geïllustreerd met heftige gebaren passeert de revue. Over zijn tijd in een klooster in Indo-China alwaar Fred, op 22 jarige leeftijd, zijn eerste ondericht kreeg het Kung-Fu. Of over zijn verblijf in Thailand als o.a. natuurgenezer en muzikant. Maar ook over de geschiedenis van het Kung-Fu in Nederland en
en-passant de historie van het Kenpo wat hij trainde bij o.a de legendarische Sifu Meijer.
Hoewel Fred Decramer meerder stijlen beheerst ligt de nadruk in zijn lessen toch het meest op de bewegelijke aapstijl (How Chuen). Wellicht is het door deze soepele stijl dat je hem zijn 63 jaren in leeftijd niet aanziet. Tijdens de lessen van Si-fu Decramer leer je naast een uitmuntende techniek ook allerlij trivia over de geschiedenis en land van herkomst van het Kung-Fu.

[Eddie]

Voorspoed met julle skool. Net een vraag. Hoekom dra julle karate pakke?

NS - as jy se monkey style, is dit moderne shaolin monkey?

[WhiteEarp]

Voorspoed met julle skool. Net een vraag. Hoekom dra julle karate pakke?

NS - as jy se monkey style, is dit moderne shaolin monkey?

Gegroet! En dank je wel voor je goede wensen!

De reden dat wij een "gi" dragen en een bandensysteem hebben is de volgende:
In Indonesie waar mijn leraar onderricht kreeg, waren zon 40 jaar geleden veel gevluchte Chinese meesters.
De beoefening van welke Chinese vorm dan ook was verboden door de overheid aldaar.
Dus wat ze deden was leerlingen "vermommen" als karate leerlingen, want Japanse vormen waren wel toegestaan.
Ik denk dat dit een traditie is en op deze manier in ere wordt gehouden.
En ook omdat De Jappaners de Gi eigenlijk weer hebben afgekeken van Chinese Monniken uit vroegere tijden.
Het is pas sinds het communisme dat mensen allemaal dezelfde kleding moesten dragen(de chinese pakjes met de knoopjes die je altijd ziet)van origine was dat niet zo.

De stijl is geen "moderne wushu" maar traditionele kung fu.
Geen hoge trappen/flikflaks en salto's en doen alsof je een aap bent.

Voor zover ik weet wordt het nergens anders gegeven behalve door een ex- leerling die 1e toan (een soort zwarte band) bij mijn docent heeft gehaald en toen zelf les is gaan geven in Houten(nabij Utrecht in Nederland).
Maar onze school staat compleet los van zijn school.

[David Jamieson]

lol.

eddie just had to encourage the blatant dutchness.

english guys or you'll p o everyone from the red states...or the blue ones, im not sure anymore. :p

[rogue]

I loved Arnhen, gigged there for about a week back in 80. We even had a really nice house that we rented for our stay.

[Yum Cha]

I'd love to come, but its just one bridge too far...

[SPJ]

I like the movie " a bridge too far", too.

Sean Connelly lead 10,000 men and ended up with 2000 men and had to get back across the river.

The SS panzer division was too strong and well positioned, the city was levelled out.

--

the 30th armor corp was only a mile away.

-

:(

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iXMc-I58lq0&mode=related&search=

[WhiteEarp]

I like the movie " a bridge too far", too.

Sean Connelly lead 10,000 men and ended up with 2000 men and had to get back across the river.

The SS panzer division was too strong and well positioned, the city was levelled out.

--

the 30th armor corp was only a mile away.

-

:(

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iXMc-I58lq0&mode=related&search=

LOL actually my teacher was an Extra during the filming of "a bridge too far" :D in his more younger days:p:D
sorry about the dutch but the south african guy was speaking in dutch.:o:rolleyes:

It's about kungfu lessons in the form of How Chuen or Houquan (the art of monkey) in Arnhem "Dojo/Sportschool Kreijtz" every Wednesday from 17:00uh.till 19:00h. (Dutch time:p)

[WhiteEarp]

Ohw yeah i forgot about the translation part:-).

Eddie was asking why we where wearing a "gi" and use a beltingsystem on the photos.
The explanation is quite simple(yet extensive):

My teacher first came to learn Kung Fu in Indonesia. At the time(after WWII)it was forbidden for Chinese imigrants to practice Chinese martial arts. The general concensus was that Chinese where lazy and a plague for society. Chinese at the time where very discriminated. However japanese martial arts like karate where allowed to be practiced.
So a few Chinese masters dressed themselves and their pupils in a Gi and began using a belting system to confuse people who came to "look" at the lessons(and possibly betray them to the authorities).
So to keep this tradition we still use the "gi"

Another reason is that Japanese warriors actually took alot from the monks in the early days. Who where actually allready using a sort of gradingsystem according to colours and a sort of "gi" with the "V" neck.

Yet another reason also is that during the communist time chinese we're obligated to all wear the same "poor" outfit, the suits with all the buttons so to speak. So kungfu schools began wearing "poor" outfits.
Again another reason is more practical, it's simple tough clothing and can take quite a beating/tearing.

About the belting system: they are to keep "western people" motivated. We all want to "accomplish" things. And strive towards another "Goal". If we don't have goals we cannot be motivated for such a difficult thing as Kung Fu(wich take years and years of practice, and then you still have tons to learn)When a master sees another master walk down the street and they look at eachother they know on what level someone is by his walk, attitude, body language etc. and feel a mutual respect towards eachother.
We western people don't have that, and that's why we use a belting system, to keep the respect for eachothers accomplishments among the students.

[Eddie]

:cool: sorry guys. Actually, I was typing in Afrikaans, which is close enough to Dutch for us both to understand. :D

Good luck white earp

[Eddie]

I'm still interested in the monkey part of your school.

Apparently, Sifu Chow Keung once taught someone from Holland. There isnt allot of monkey around.

[SanHeChuan]

Eddie was asking why we where wearing a "gi" and use a beltingsystem on the photos. The explanation is quite simple(yet extensive):.........We western people don't have that, and that's why we use a belting system, to keep the respect for eachothers accomplishments among the students.

All that is what the Shaolin Do people say. Hmmm.

[WhiteEarp]

All that is what the Shaolin Do people say. Hmmm.

Funny, the same old same ol' shaolin do thingy. "you do not do kung fu that's just karate"
For one: the school is not shaolin-Do(who thought of that name anyhow).
And yes the claims of shaolin-Do are correct(to a certain ammount that would explain there beltingsystem if they got from indonesia).
And now our techniques are nothing like karate(i know, because i have witnessed Ishin Ryu Karate and sparred with a kyokushin karate student)

How come that, as an example, Choy Lee fut and Hung Gar use colour sashes and gradings? ^^(and i know, i also studied Choy Lee Fut at some level) and why do shaolin monks wear similar Gi-like jacket and different colour sashes. Is that also not real kungfu? It looked just as effective and real to me as How Chuen.

And again, btw, on some old drawings/paintings you see monks with Gi Like jackets and coloured sashes.

If you can explain that to me it's all good.

[WhiteEarp]

I'm still interested in the monkey part of your school.

Apparently, Sifu Chow Keung once taught someone from Holland. There isnt allot of monkey around.

Well there is no monkey what so ever in all of holland. The only Monkeyteacher in holland i know is my teacher.
The monkeypart is "tall" monkey. (you also have the smaller versions with more tumbling and rolling, like Paulie Zink)
Well we do have one form where you roll over the floor but that's about it for the rolling part.
it's a lot of techniques you do not see in other styles.

Like duck and look back over you shoulder while kicking fast with your heel against your opponents knee.

I've never seen this in karate, Choy Lee Fut or Hung Gar.
There are a lot of fistforms(index finger, middelfinger, monkeyfist, claw)but the monkey likes to imitate other animals like crane or tiger so we also use the cranebeak and tigerclaw, but than the monkey retreats into his own "stances" a low catstance.

Well the best thing is if you ever come down for a vacation, you can drop me an e-mail if you want to join the training so you can see and experience it for yourself.(allthough i'm on vacation from 14 till 25th of july this year)

[Eddie]

i dont know any monkey forms. I dont do monkey. ;) I'd probably have to learn White Ape or Sasquatch style if I'd want to learn any sort of monkey style. Perhaps Guarilla style.

[WhiteEarp]

i dont know any monkey forms. I dont do monkey. ;) I'd probably have to learn White Ape or Sasquatch style if I'd want to learn any sort of monkey style. Perhaps Guarilla style.


LOL
White Ape, Tongbei Quan is very similar to what we practice.:)
Sasquatch style.??:confused:
How about Wookiestyle? :rolleyes:
With this style you can pull people's arms out of their sockets if you loose.
That would remind them to change there strategy, and let you win.:D

[FuYuan]

I also practised How Chuen Monkey Kungfu under the teachings of Fred Decramer. I started around 1987 or 1988 in Arnhem at sportschool Kreijtz as well.

I practised How Chuen Kungfu for a total of 9 or 10 years. With a small break in between.

The system is said to be a southern Shaolin martial art started with Su Kong Tai Jin a grandmaster of a sasquatch monkey system.

This is the lineage so they say from Su Kong to Fred Decramer:

10364

The system had 6 forms, Fred reffered to them as Jurus like in Pencak Silat. The system had around 200 or 250 fixed selfdefense techniques, meditation, qi qong and some Long Chuen dragon system that he learned from prince Dschero Khan a.k.a. Gerard Karel Meijers or Sifu Tze from Horst in the Netherlands.

I myself earned a brown belt in the system and we practised also kempo or Shaolin Kempo, i am.not sure how valid that system was. But me Douwe Geluk, Peter Hooy the number one student and many others had an awsome time training in it.

10365

This is an old How Chuen Monkey Kungfu certificate issued in 1992 at sportschool Kreijtz in Arnhem in the Netherlands.

Great Thread, even now Fred Decramer is still teaching in Bennekom village in the Netherlands.

[Orion Paximus]

That lineage is... well you know that's Shaolin-Do's right? Except it also isn't. Weird.

[bawang]

Lol at karate failures wanting to upgrade to southern shaolin when karate already is southern shaolin

[Orion Paximus]

Lol at karate failures wanting to upgrade to southern shaolin when karate already is southern shaolin

Yeah but with 900% more bowing.

[mrshungkuen]

I short advert for people from Holland:

Kungfu Lessons in Arnhem Velperpoort at Sportschool "kreijtz"

Styles: How Chuen, Lung Chuen

(monkey and dragon)

Every Wednesday at 17:00u.
First lesson is free.

Discription of the pictures:

The Pictures below are Sifu Decramer with his old master Sifu Tze.
The yellow/orange belts are kids during a lesson in Arnhem.
And the other is a photo with Sifu Decramer and older pupils during training in Arnhem.

Link to sportschool kreijtz: http://www.sportschoolkreijtz.nl/

Short description in Dutch:

Een leven vol Kung Fu
Als je Fred Decramer op de praatstoel hebt is het net of je in een spannend boek verzeild bent geraakt. De een na de andere prachtige anekdote geïllustreerd met heftige gebaren passeert de revue. Over zijn tijd in een klooster in Indo-China alwaar Fred, op 22 jarige leeftijd, zijn eerste ondericht kreeg het Kung-Fu. Of over zijn verblijf in Thailand als o.a. natuurgenezer en muzikant. Maar ook over de geschiedenis van het Kung-Fu in Nederland en
en-passant de historie van het Kenpo wat hij trainde bij o.a de legendarische Sifu Meijer.
Hoewel Fred Decramer meerder stijlen beheerst ligt de nadruk in zijn lessen toch het meest op de bewegelijke aapstijl (How Chuen). Wellicht is het door deze soepele stijl dat je hem zijn 63 jaren in leeftijd niet aanziet. Tijdens de lessen van Si-fu Decramer leer je naast een uitmuntende techniek ook allerlij trivia over de geschiedenis en land van herkomst van het Kung-Fu.


Fred Decramer his system is very unorthodox i never saw it elsewhere. His "How Chuen" Kungfu is only linked to him. Maybe a mix of Kuntao Kempo stuff maybe not a real Chinese Monkey system.

[mrshungkuen]

I also practised How Chuen Monkey Kungfu under the teachings of Fred Decramer. I started around 1987 or 1988 in Arnhem at sportschool Kreijtz as well.

I practised How Chuen Kungfu for a total of 9 or 10 years. With a small break in between.

The system is said to be a southern Shaolin martial art started with Su Kong Tai Jin a grandmaster of a sasquatch monkey system.

This is the lineage so they say from Su Kong to Fred Decramer:

10364

The system had 6 forms, Fred reffered to them as Jurus like in Pencak Silat. The system had around 200 or 250 fixed selfdefense techniques, meditation, qi qong and some Long Chuen dragon system that he learned from prince Dschero Khan a.k.a. Gerard Karel Meijers or Sifu Tze from Horst in the Netherlands.

I myself earned a brown belt in the system and we practised also kempo or Shaolin Kempo, i am.not sure how valid that system was. But me Douwe Geluk, Peter Hooy the number one student and many others had an awsome time training in it.

10365

This is an old How Chuen Monkey Kungfu certificate issued in 1992 at sportschool Kreijtz in Arnhem in the Netherlands.

Great Thread, even now Fred Decramer is still teaching in Bennekom village in the Netherlands.


I see when looking at the lineage chart of Fred Decramer his system 8 teachers taught him his kungfu. Maybe it is already evidence of an almagram of martial arts styles.

[mrshungkuen]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrNO5HkD5k8

[FuYuan]

In this video i show some How Chuen Monkey Kungfu:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vI-GvPxK2f8