Any Master Benney Meng students?

[leroyjnsn]

Hey out there! Any viewers out there train under Master Meng? Is anyone in the long distance training program? Where are you all located?


Best wishes,
Leroy
"Committed to not compromise".

[Ultimatewingchun]

Nowhere in particular...

It's about Time, Space, and Energy.

Master Meng's students could be located virtually anywhere in Space...at any given Time.

But unfortunately I don't want to expend the Energy necessary to persue his instruction.

...Because I've got an appointment back here on planet Earth. :rolleyes: :D

[leroyjnsn]

Thanks Ultmate for the disrespect. You know you have the right to say what you like but if we cant have a respectfull conversation PLEASE and I mean please dont reply to my threads, because I am a man of Martial arts, and I do mean man. I dont know what you have against this man but whatever it is you need to be a man and confront him with them. But since you want to act like "almighty forum ruler " I dont think that is going to happen. So again, any Master Meng students out there?

Best wishes,
Leroy
"Committed to not compromise".

[Nick Forrer]

Try the HFY108 forum. No doubt there will be many there to talk to if you are feeling lonely.:)

[Ultimatewingchun]

I have confronted him....both to his face and on this forum.

And yes...I have issues with him. Two in particular...his utter disrespect for and betrayal of both my wing chun sifus: William Cheung and Moy Yat.

And his pretense at being an "objective" curator of the Ving Tsun Museum is pathetic.

Any other questions?

[Tom Kagan]

And yes...I have issues with him. Two in particular...his utter disrespect for and betrayal of both my wing chun sifus: William Cheung and Moy Yat.

I do not know the details surrounding what may or may not have occurred or perceived to have occurred between Benny and William Cheung.

However, I do know (in far more intimate detail than any other person not directly involved should) any and all things which transpired between my SiHing and Moy Yat. In fact, I am the author of the agreement which put the Keun Kuit Chops on loan to the museum. And, I am the person Moy Yat consulted as to how to go about getting them back when he decided to do with Chops otherwise.

Moy Yat was certainly no saint; just a man... and a rather nasty one at that. This is regardless of his profound ability to bury this nature of his by behaving like a gentleman when needed. But, what he really cared about most was how a person treated him and how that same person treated others.

I can say unequivocally there was no "betrayal" by Benny to Moy Yat (as far as any stretch of the definition of that word can be made to fit).

Benny certainly has his issues and his excess baggage he carries with him. (That's no different than most people.) And, because of my position as author of the documents I mentioned before, I feel it would be improper for me to discuss much of the details surrounding Benny's and Moy Yat's relationship (at least not publicly). But, in this particular circumstance, you don't know what transpired (and continues to transpire, frankly). However, I DO!


I suppose if fate ever allows it and we ever get to know each other better (and you get me liquored up ;) ), I might discuss in more detail some aspects which I have no real problem going over one on one. But regardless, I can assure you none of it is anywhere near the "juiciness" of gossip some people have managed to build up to with each intervening year. If you ask me, It's downright boring and probably could not sustain a conversation longer than 2 or 3 sentences.


Although you only have my word, please trust me on this: What you discuss with regard to Willaim Cheung is your own business. It doesn't have to do with me, or my Kung Fu family. Those details are something with which you far more intimately familiar. However, when it comes to Benny's relationship with Moy Yat, just leave him out of this. Although I find it kind of endearing you still feel a need to "stick up" for Moy Yat, in this particular case, it really isn't necessary.

[Ultimatewingchun]

Quite frankly, Tom...without giving any details...how can you expect me (or a lot of other people) to just take you at your word on this matter?

You should lay the facts out as you know them (or think you know them) and then let others be the judge as to whether Moy Yat was betrayed/disrespected by Benny Meng.

[Ultimatewingchun]

And as for me "sticking up" for Moy Yat....let me tell you what that's about...

I certainly had my issues with Moy Yat also...(many of which I've never spoken about on a public forum)...but I've come to see in recent years just HOW MUCH wing chun I learned from him that is very valuable material.

Things that wouldn't work for me UNTIL I learned William Cheung's TWC system...(especially the footwork and the Central Line system)...and now I can go back and use what I learned from Moy Yat infinitely better than what I could do during those 8 years I spent as his student (1975-1983).

Things that, althought I know William Cheung also knew them - but William chose not to teach or emphasize them the way Moy Yat did.

So my overall understanding/skill level of wing chun is higher because I had Moy Yat as a teacher as well as William Cheung.

And so, over time, I have come to appreciate Moy Yat more than before.

[Chango]

Victor,
It's sad to see that you hold such anger etc... about things. I think what makes it even sadder is that you have second hand information. As "LeroyJnsn" said the personal feelings you have should be directed to the person that you have these feelings for. If you have "already done this" then you should have come to some sort of closure. If that's not the case. You should know that this forum is not a tool for you to seek this closure or bicker threat etc... It's a forum rule not to degrade things to such a poor discussion. Your spewing out rumors to a person simply looking for others in his/her lineage does not reflect well on you.

Being your Jr in the art and being a fellow Sifu I expected much more from you. Maybe you should take a second look. I hope you can move to a better place.



Chango

[Tom Kagan]

Just to be clear:

While I don't bother myself much with something as trivial to me as Benny, I don't have a problem if Victor wishes to discuss whatever concerns may or may not be at hand regarding his relationship with Benny. It doesn't concern me. And, it provides enough benign entertainment that a bowl of popcorn and some Twizzlers might be in order. :)

Still, regardless of whether Victor can or cannot let things go, it is clear to me that whatever concerns he has raised in his admittedly sometimes muddled posts are valid in the sense they deserve a real answer. If nothing else, at least it appears to me they are valid from Victor's perspective even if he cannot separate his own emotions from his concerns and posts his thoughts in a hostile manner.

However, the response to such concerns he repeatedly gets is what seems to me as Benny's resident "b1tch patrol" floating up from the depths of flotsam and jetsam and, instead of addressing Victor's concerns, would much prefer to launch an ad hominem attack on his character simply because of some perceived slight emanating from Victor's "tone" and/or specific "button pushing" words he uses to express his point of view. The responses attack the man and not any mistakes in his arguments.

An answer - any answer - can be as trivial as "Stop whining. I/We gave our response in [Thread link/Post# link]" So, while some say they expect more from Victor, I personally would like to see a hell of a lot more from people who seem to be so concerned with someone else's image that they can't just ignore Victor's posts and others like them. (You are not Benny; why should someone other than him care all that much, anyway? Is it pride, a vested interest in maintaining some "image" of Benny's, idle internet boredom, or something else? Just curious.)



If you are going to respond to Victor at all, at least include a real answer somewhere in the reciprocal vile spewed. Otherwise, STFU and stop pretending you are any different than those you attack. There is a clear distinction between a true moral superiority and arrogant smugness. Continuing to argue ad hominem fallacies because you think Victor is the biggest @ss this side of the Mississippi river makes it quite clear to anyone paying attention you are doing the exact same thing as what is perceived as objectionable in Victor's posts. While I find spotting such hypocrisy somewhat amusing, I have to say if you are going to try to raise the drama to your idea of highbrow theatre, you need to recognize just how "bad B movie" your responses are while trying to continue such meaningless internet flame wars.


('Nuf said. I've been up all night working. I need sleep ... or at least to be home when my family is awake.)

[Ultimatewingchun]

Okay...let me lay it all on the table....I don't like the way the VT Museum situation was handled by Meng (his becoming Gee's disciple and then turning the museum away from it's original mandate, ie.- honoring the Yip Man lineage...because he now wanted to give Gee and HFY top billing)...

I don't like the photograph I saw in some magazine with Meng posing outside of the funeral home where Moy Yat was laid out here in NYC...."Hey, look at me...here's another example of why I'm so friggin' important to the wing chun world...here I am outside Moy Yat's funeral"...(totally disrespectful)...

I don't like his rewriting of wing chun history AS FACT while offering zero verifiable evidence that HFY is the only real deal that traced it's roots back to the Shaolin Temple...

I don't like the fact that when I met him at that dinner with Miquel Hernandez, David Peterson, and the rest....Benny told me that he thought HFY "had more" than TWC...

and what none of you know UNTIL RIGHT NOW...is that I didn't know the whole story about Meng and TWC (and William Cheung) until the VERY NEXT DAY...as there was a William Cheung seminar in New Jersey...and when I told William who I met the night before...

then I got ALL the details I didn't know right from William Cheung....how Benny was SO impressed with him and with TWC when he went to his first TWC seminar....how Meng immediately invited William to come to Dayton to do a seminar there....how when William got there - after driving like 6-7 hours...there were like maybe 7 people at the seminar (Benny promised that at least triple that amount would show - and he had to be chased for William's money as his first check bounced)...

I don't like the fact that Benny was telling William (and all the other TWC people with William, ie.- Phil Redmond, for example)...how INCREDIBLE he thought this TWC system was...how he had never seen wing chun footwork like this before...how he wanted to be a part of the ASSOCIATION (and therefore be a student of William Cheung)...

AND WILLIAM TOLD ME THAT ALL THIS HAPPENED ONLY ABOUT 6 MONTHS AGO !!!

...Which means that Benny was already heavily involved with Garrett Gee/HFY - but not saying a word about it to William Cheung.

I hit the roof when I heard all this...and told William Chueng that I knew where Benny was staying in Brooklyn (at Miguel's house) and that I was going to go see him and teach him some respect - if you get my drift, Chango. :mad:

But William Cheung told me not to do it - and to just leave the a55hole alone.

...And then Meng tried to stack the deck in his favor by wanting to bring double the amount of HFY people to the Cleveland Get-Together in May, 2005...double the amount that any one lineage was going to be allowed to have there.

No...I don't like this guy.

I don't like him one bit.