???'s for my buk sing family

[hskwarrior]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mUyOfcgxAsQ


the above set was filmed in china, at first it gives off the impression this is going to be a chan family set, but after watching it i thought it was buk sing, and after reading the responses that it was buk sing.

i want to know if this is authentic buk sing or if someone got a hold of it and taught it to this kid. anyways, whoever posted the clip calls him a CLF prodigy. buk sing choy lee fut prodigy is what they should say.;)


hsk

[Eddie]

nope, we've had him on here before. I think its doc fei wong's student and was taken at their event in China recently.

Pretty cool for a kid. I think he is pretty good, but not 7 or 8. Theres no way.

:cool:

but other than that, i think that kids is pretty good

[hskwarrior]

it may be dfw's student, but it's definately a buk sing form, no doubt about that.

everything about it is buk sing.

[k-no]

...but what he's doing smells like Siu Ping Kuen.

k

[chasincharpchui]

nope, we've had him on here before. I think its doc fei wong's student and was taken at their event in China recently.

Pretty cool for a kid. I think he is pretty good, but not 7 or 8. Theres no way.

:cool:

but other than that, i think that kids is pretty good

sorry eddie

i dont see any dfw in that kid, he doesnt move like ppl from dfw school.
have a look at dfw's son doin a form and u'll know wat i mean

they both move alike

however wen it comes to the kid, i dont see anything that resembles dfw clf

[Eddie]

I simply asumed that, because it was at a DFW event in China.

not sure what to look for in buk sing that is differnent to other clf, al i see is good clf. The form bares allot of resemblance to some of the forms we do in LKH. But actually, CLF is CLF, isnt it? ;)

but to be honest, that kid is pretty good

[chasincharpchui]

well ur right clf is clf

but wen u look at chan family, hung sing and buk sing, the way we execute our sow chui is very different

still

wat u gotta look for is the opening of the form, we call it 'hoi jong' and its basically the salute, the form doesnt actually start until uve done ur salute. buk sing has a very distinctive salute

[hskwarrior]

the hung sing and buk sing branches have the same openings, but have some very identifiable points in the opening that reveals them as the buk sing lineage.

[Eddie]

the openining looks similar to openings done in our forms.

Is that form Buk sing then?

[hskwarrior]

right now i'm trying to put together a small youtube clip to show you what we mean.

when it's up i'll post it

[Infrazael]

That kid is pretty tight, and I see him to be a great CLF guy as he grows older. However the form was a bit "stiff" IMO. But great nontheless.

[Satori Science]

very interesting post!!

like ChasinChopChui said;

"wat u gotta look for is the opening of the form, we call it 'hoi jong' and its basically the salute, the form doesnt actually start until uve done ur salute. buk sing has a very distinctive salute"

the first seven movements are similar to mine but not similar enough to be from anyware near the same lineage. Each Bak Hsing family has a very distinctive opening "hoi jong" I've actually never seen a Bak Hsing form start this way before.

That said, from there on in about 60 percent of the movements are in my version of Sui Sup Jee Kuen with some marked differences. But certain sections are almost in the same order, except he uses gwa-palm and I use more gwa-chop. Also it seems as if the boy is using a closed fist when he punches and not the leapord hand position for chop choi.

Also he seems to bounce up a lot which we don't do in our CLF. It would make sense if his teacher also taught the northern style too, I've seen other Bak Hsing forms that incorperate some bouncing from Siu Lum Kuen.

Like K-no said we release our gwa sow chop distinctively, to me it looks pretty Bak Hsing with a few parts played fairly different. But the last 30% of the form doesn't look familiar to me.

[Infrazael]

How would you say you release your Gwa Sau? That is probably my favorite basic combo after a setup, so I am curious.

Thanks

[Steeeve]

Thats of ping kuen of bak sing CLF

very good this kid two thumbs up

sTeeve

[chasincharpchui]

How would you say you release your Gwa Sau? That is probably my favorite basic combo after a setup, so I am curious.

Thanks

learn off a buk sing master

[Infrazael]

learn off a buk sing master

There are no buk sing masters around me. Are you saying you can't describe it?

[TenTigers]

Hey, why are your forms so long?:) I always wondered that if Tarm Sarm was more interested in fighting than collecting forms,why are the forms still so long?
I do Hung Kuen, and our forms are notoriously long, but YOU GUYS-sheesh! Your forms are twice as long, at that's just the bow!:eek:

[k-no]

Infrazael,

It's difficult to describe such things, it's all so clinical. I am working with Sifu so we can efficiently put more videos out and hopefully if you haven't caught the differences yet, you will.

Ten Tigers

Hey brother, our forms are long to compensate (in technical content) for our lack of forms. I'm not a terribly huge fan of forms versus drilling/conditioning/sparring myself, but it's a whole hell of a lot easier learning our three long a55 forms than it is to learn like over 100 different regular forms. And yes, the bow is long and IS a pain in the a55 for my rehabbing ACL!

[k-no]

...seing the differences doesn't have anything to do with technical aptitude or lack of it.

Just to elaborate on what chasincharpchui and Satori Science were saying...

Many would say "Well A plays it Long while B plays it Short." But is that really a sufficient description? Even delving into it deeper with specific description isn't going to cut it. I guess we COULD do it this way and even then certain individuals in either camp would play it just a bit differently...

...However, the differences are more apparent with years of training and getting corrected on every aspect of your movements from your feet to your head position in specific ways. I can *attempt* to describe it but I'd rather not.

Obviously for explanation's sake we don't have years of training to spare, so if I had to do it on the fly, I would have to see you in person and watch your movements. I would then give them a bunch of little tweaks across the board until you see the difference. I couldn't tell you kinesthetically what goes on as I perform a movement, I just do it from several years of practice (and getting slapped around by Sifu lol)

Even these days, if you see me do a technique you probably wouldn't see any difference from the other guy. Then my sifu makes a minor correction. You probably couldn't see it either (off a video) though you might up close, especially if you see the correction.

I've worked with Hung Sing brothers before so I can see the difference, and I am assuming those that see the difference have some experience in this regard. To generalize the differences would do us both a disservice.

We are all CLF but let's accept the fact that we do some things differently. However that doesn't make one branch better than the other. As my Sifu would say "It doesn't matter what style you do, if the other guy hits you FIRST."

k

[Satori Science]

My Sihing Russel, alwyas talks about Sup Jee Kuen as the "encylopedia" form. Its like the Bak Hsing man's refrence guide for all the techniques in the style. Almost everything we do is in that form. Then the Jeen Kuen forms teach the student how to move, fight and employ all those movements from Sup Jee.

Sifu always says, past a certain level (bearing in mind their are always corrections to make) the main Bak Hsing practice is to build up gung on the moevements we already know. Think About Tam Sam, everyone knew he liked to use Chop Choi. When they fought him they new exactly what he would use and he defeated them anyway. That was because he had built up so much gung on that technique that it was unstoppable.

Those long forms are to build up the endurance and physical stamina. But in our lineage they are actually not taught right away. We teach the foundation first, then the Jeen Kuen fighting sets and then the long forms.

[TenTigers]

"Those long forms are to build up the endurance and physical stamina."
I understand that, and it has been explained to me that way as well. I just wondered why, if you want stamina, why don't you simply do it...again?
The dictionary makes more sense. Why learn more smaller sets. Just have one set that contains it all.
This thought came about when practicing with my Hung Kuen Sifu, whose only English consists of him saying,"Good!.....Again!":rolleyes:

[Satori Science]

I guess the awnser to your question ten tigers is that we do practice them more than once. Sifu has us practice sup jee kuen up to 10 times a day, in a row. After that, believe me you see improvement in your stamina.

We actually have a sui sup jee and a di sup jee but even the small frame is still twice as long as any of our short forms.

[Yen-Wang-Yeh]

After viewing the video, this is Sup Jee Ch'uan of Bak Hsing Choy Lee Fut. As has been said: "..Sup Jee Kuen as the "encylopedia" form. Its like the Bak Hsing man's refrence guide for all the techniques in the style. Almost everything we do is in that form. Then the Jeen Kuen forms teach the student how to move, fight and employ all those movements from Sup Jee."

It is a very long pattern and indeed is the encyclopedia of all Bak Hsing movements, and I thought of Choy Lee Fut in general...perhaps from a Bak Hsing perspective. I imagine depending on one's lineage, particulars will differ. The core of the pattern on YouTube is very very close to the way in which I had been taught...starting with the crane movements...there are differences, but that is to be expected.

Sup Jee Jeen Ch'uan distills specific application on a variety of movements. I always prefered Gai Boon Ch'uan myself...with a few modifications :cool:

Yen-Wang-Yeh