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ghostexorcist
04-10-2007, 11:41 AM
(I contacted Gene Ching about this and he said that he would ask one of his acquaintances. He also suggested that I post a question here.)

I am trying to find someone who is willing to contact a martial arts master in China for me. My Chinese language and literacy at the moment is embarrassing to say the least, so I lack the skills necessary to conduct an interview with them. This person is Master Fan Keping ( 范克平) and he teaches so-called Wudang skills out of Nanjing. He is also known as a collector of rare kung fu manuals. You can read the following page for more details:

http://en.epochtimes.com/news/6-2-16/38268.html

The reason I want to reach him is because I've read that he claims some of his "golden bell" exercises were passed on from the Song Dynasty by Zhou Tong (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zhou_Tong_%28monk%29), the archery teacher of Gen. Yue Fei. There is even a set of instructional VCD's about said skills:

http://www.plumpub.com/sales/vcd4/coll_WDtaihe.htm

(This page latonizes Zhou's name: Zhou Tong = Tong Zhou.)

http://www.cn-wushuschool.com/xwzy.htm
http://www.cn-wushuschool.com/page13.htm
http://www.cn-wushuschool.com/page15.htm

(These Chinese pages present Zhou's name correctly and mention how the skills were passed along until the Ming, when a Daoist priest recorded them in a manual. There is, however, no historical evidence to support the claim that Zhou knew any kung fu at all, but I would like to record any legend of how Zhou came to be associated with Fan's gate.)

I've been corresponding with one of Master Fan's Chinese disciples who just recently immigrated to Toronto, Canada. He gave me the telephone number to Master Fan's kung fu school in Nanjing because I'm guessing he doesn't have an email account. The disciple explained to me that Fan of course doesn't speak English and so a person fluent in Chinese is needed to talk to him. He also cautioned that the person who speaks with him be knowledgeable about the martial arts and Chinese culture. This is not because Master Fan is arrogant and doesn't like Americans (he’s got an American student), it's because he doesn't like to explain the basics of either. I would ask the disciple to do it, but he is very busy trying to secure a job at the moment. Does anyone on here know a knowledgeable person that would be willing to correspond with Master Fan? I would pay for any and all phone charges incurred and possible packages needing to be shipped from China to the U.S.

Master Fan has an American disciple that teaches English in a local university near his school. The disciple in Canada didn't have the American's contact info though. Maybe a person could get his contact info from Master Fan? I would like to get his number myself because he should be able to explain everything I want to know clearly.

I asked Sal Cazonieri and he works with a woman who could translate any questions I have. The disciple would have to ask these questions to Master Fan over th phone, but, again, he just moved and is very busy getting situated in a new country. If no one answers here, I'll go with Sal.

I am currently gathering material for a research paper on Zhou Tong. It will analyze Zhou's mention in historical records, folklore, literature and martial arts legends. I will not publish it until my Chinese vastly improves and I've had time to do more in-depth research. I figure it will attract history buffs and martial artists enamored with Yue Fei and fans of the Water Margin novel (since wuxia novels and folktales cast Zhou as the teacher of the bandits Wu Song, Lin Chong, and Lu Junyi). Needless to say, that will not be for many years.

golden arhat
04-10-2007, 11:44 AM
epoch times is not a reliable source of information on anything except lies

if he is affiliated with falun gong or li hongzhi i would stay well clear

Shaolinlueb
04-10-2007, 11:51 AM
wow another chinese man who doesnt like americans and doesnt like to explain things. so nice. :rolleyes:

ghostexorcist
04-10-2007, 11:55 AM
epoch times is not a reliable source of information on anything except lies

if he is affiliated with falun gong or li hongzhi i would stay well clear

I've heard of them before. I really don't have an opinion on Falun Gong because that tends to be a very touchy subject. However, I am only interested in any info on how Zhou became associated with Fan's gate. If the claim about Zhou was made by any of Fan's previous masters (and not just by Fan himself), it's worth noting.

I have found minor evidence that the claim, which has no historical basis, is not an old one. Master Fan lives in Nanjing. There was a popular Yangzhou storyteller name Wang Shaotang who was famous for his tales on the Water Margin. He created one tale alternately called "Meeting Zhou By Chance" and "Swordplay Under The Moon" which talks about how the bandit Wu Song came to learn swordplay from Zhou Tong while in Kaifeng. This tale calls Zhou "Iron Arm, Zhou Tong" and mentions how he is able to concentrate his qi to various parts of his body to make it as hard as rock (hard qigong). Nanjing and Yangzhou are in very close proximity in the same province. It could be that Master Fan was influenced by the folktale and added Zhou as a master in his lineage. This is of course all speculation.

golden arhat
04-10-2007, 11:57 AM
why go to all this trouble for stuff that has been proven time and again does not work (or is taught wrong)
just go to an mma class


or do you just want an ego stroke ?

ghostexorcist
04-10-2007, 12:01 PM
why go to all this trouble for stuff that has been proven time and again does not work (or is taught wrong)
just go to an mma class


or do you just want an ego stroke ?

I've corresponded with martial researcher Stanley Henning and he has provided me with copious amounts of info that states "golden bell" exercises are unsubstantiated. I'm not trying to learn any kind of martial art from Master Fan, I'm only interested in info regarding Zhou.

ghostexorcist
03-02-2008, 02:39 PM
I have found minor evidence that the claim, which has no historical basis, is not an old one. Master Fan lives in Nanjing. There was a popular Yangzhou storyteller name Wang Shaotang who was famous for his tales on the Water Margin. He created one tale alternately called "Meeting Zhou By Chance" and "Swordplay Under The Moon" which talks about how the bandit Wu Song came to learn swordplay from Zhou Tong while in Kaifeng. This tale calls Zhou "Iron Arm, Zhou Tong" and mentions how he is able to concentrate his qi to various parts of his body to make it as hard as rock (hard qigong). Nanjing and Yangzhou are in very close proximity in the same province. It could be that Master Fan was influenced by the folktale and added Zhou as a master in his lineage. This is of course all speculation.

I recently found a paper by a folklore researcher that states Wang Shaotang did broadcasts of his tales on "Nanjing Radio" in the 1960's. So that makes the connection that much closer.

I know a translator that would give me a huge discount, but translating a chain of correspondence letters would be costly.

Shaolin Master
03-03-2008, 04:55 AM
I go to Nanjing every year or so, I should be there around May/June this year. If you wish I can go and visit, please advise clearly and specifically all the contact details (address/numbers/etc) and the questions that you wish to be responded.

Cheers
Wu Chanlong
____________________

http://www.satirio.com/ma/home.html

ghostexorcist
03-03-2008, 07:54 AM
I go to Nanjing every year or so, I should be there around May/June this year. If you wish I can go and visit, please advise clearly and specifically all the contact details (address/numbers/etc) and the questions that you wish to be responded.

Cheers
Wu Chanlong
____________________

http://www.satirio.com/ma/home.html

I was just posting my new findings. I didn’t think anyone was even remotely interested in helping me at all.

It took me awhile to look up the number that his disciple gave me almost a year ago. It’s 13905185287. His school's website has a street and email address and other phone numbers. But I do not know how current they are. See the very bottom of this page…

http://www.cn-wushuschool.com/xwzy.htm

I will send you a private message with the exact questions I want asked. Thank you very much.

Shaolin Wookie
03-08-2008, 12:12 PM
(I asked Sal Cazonieri and he works with a woman who could translate any questions I have. The disciple would have to ask these questions to Master Fan over th phone, but, again, he just moved and is very busy getting situated in a new country. If no one answers here, I'll go with Sal.
.

Oh, no! Not Sal! I saw The Decline of Western Civilization, pt. II: The Metal Years, and saw this chubby dude named Sal Canzonieri waxing the poetic on the subject of Heavy Metal!

Coincidence?

I think not....