The challenge Match a hollywood script

[PhilDunlap]

My Hollywood script

Ok after seeing the videos and reading the comments I really want to thank everyone for the entertainment. Hollywood could not write this script. I was actually trying to figure out how I could explain this to someone and without the evidence they would never believe it.

I have no dog in this fight I consider myself both a TMA guy (Burmese martial arts) and a sport fighting guy my only experience with the principles is with JFS who is a raving lunatic to begin with…

The participants.

Annatrocity -- Amateur female kickboxer/MMA fighter not much experience
Osiris – a tkd guy with limited experience in BJJ

Omar—a Chinese martial arts student who got upset people made fun of his videos on the net. Omar also deems his skills high enough to accept challenges
JFS—a self proclaimed Kung Fu master who challenges everybody in the world to a fight and has obvious mental problems.


Omar decides that of anyone who may want to fight he the person to agree to go with is a female. Wise choice as it backs him into a corner there is no way to win. Lies about his size in an effort to punk her but it doesn’t work. He will be training in Maryland with JFS so the fight is scheduled for a parking lot as this is going to be a “real Street fight” tm (as we all know street fights are always scheduled weeks in advance)

Several threads are started on several forums about the horrible things everyone is going to do to each other. Just is case someone gets hurt we make sure there is no mistaking the intent.

Anna and her friends hop in a car for a 10 hour trip. The list is checked. Talk to probation officer about traveling through several states in an attempt to commit assault after having threatened the parties involved. Bring handgun along to make sure we are violating federal gun laws. Bring hallucinogens just in case.

Both sides show up in parking lot. JFS sizes everyone up and thinks he can punk them with size if he gets aggressive and goes on full puff mode. He plays Billy badass for awhile commits a little assault and is enjoying the feeing of power so much he can’t help it , he pushes too far and forces Osiris to finally man up and expose the fact JFS can’t fight his way out of a paper bag and is nothing more than a blowhard. Osiris lets him up and he goes back to tough guy mode.

Anna decides she may have put herself in a bad situation legally and is faced with an unbalanced idiot who outweighs her by 100 lbs and finally starts to use whatever brain cells still work after the drugs. She is faced with the reality of the situation and actually does the smart thing in trying to make this a more “sporting” affair but it’s too late for that.

Osiris watches as JFS threatens everyone and bullies Anna around and does nothing probably thinking to himself this guy is really big and really insane. He realizes he is going to have to do something prepares and launches the most hilarious attack in fighting history. He gets up takes JFS down and discovers Billy bad ass can’t fight. JFS asks to end it and he gets off him.

Omar as the focal point does the biggest tuck in the history of martial arts. He found someone to fight his battle for him. Near the end of it he realizes what a punk he looks like and one of his testicles tries to drop and he decides to shove Anna too.


The aftermath…. Everyone goes to the forum to spin things…

Anna and Osiris are still reasonably young and will one day look back on this and say …that was one of the dumbest things I have ever done.

Omar and JFS should have known better and deserve everything they got as they claim to have higher ideals and chose this BS.

The few people on bullshido who are actually proud of this. I have to think you are in the minority but this is the type of behavior you are associating yourselves with. Exposing fraud is good but this is not the way.

The people on TMA forums defending this need to get a grip if this is what you are about the people who criticize TMA’s are right you should be distancing yourselves from these 2 idiots as fast as possible not defending them.

A last comment anyone who still things JFS can fight either in the street or in the ring has lost their mind. If Osiris had not gotten off it would have gotten uglier. He did nothing to mount and offense or effective defense. He can insult sport fighting all he wants but it’s not like he was fighting a very skilled MMA guy either.


Hollywood turned me down they say it’s not believable. It would never happen.

Is this what Martial Arts has become?

[sanjuro_ronin]

Yes, yes this is what it has become.

[PangQuan]

LOL dude, you nailed it right on the head. That is some funny stuff right there.

Sometimes standing outside looking in isnt a bad deal. :eek:

[Fu-Pow]

Omar—a Chinese martial arts student who got upset people made fun of his videos on the net. Omar also deems his skills high enough to accept challenges


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhyGvlX0_Pw

Is this the video to which you refer?

[PhilDunlap]

I don't know nor do I really care I was just commenting on what a sad state of affairs.

It's funny out of curiosity I posted this to both Bullshido and No BS in Martial Arts -- at bullshido while they did not like it and I got several threatining pm,s they didn't ban me and No BS in Martial Arts did. I find it funny that the "supposed" children don't remove something questioning them and the "adults" do.

"Sifu" Abel chose to add an insult to his mail

[unkokusai]

"Sifu" Abel chose to add an insult to he mail




Not surprising. He is the third stooge, along with the crazy all-talk old racist and 'hero' Omar who had to hide behind someone else because he was so afraid of the girl he agreed to fight. Quite a crew there... :rolleyes:

[Black Jack II]

"Sifu" Abel chose to add an insult to he mail

Does not sound like anything that would suprise me.

[PhilDunlap]

I guess they got made fun of at bullshido and decided to start their own lttle club house so they can ban anyone who doesn't agree with them

[PangQuan]

i get a picture of the small town mentality in a big city with people drinking really cheap bear, eating halucinagens, peeing on the sidewalk huffing anything in a metal can and eating glue.

real class

[PhilDunlap]

And fighting in the parking lot of the local masonic temple

[cjurakpt]

you got banned for posting that?!? for simply summarizing the obvious truce which any intelligent, independent observer came up with (c.f. - my own "summary" on the topic here:
http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?p=778131#post778131 - I think they are very much in line with your own comments)? especially as you have a pretty good rep for "keepin' it real"...

what kind of drugs are they on over there?

it's amazing how, inlight of the irrefutable evidence, there can stll be spin; the next thing, there will be Trotsky-like edits of the film, with people dissapearing, replaced by other, maybe even subliminal messages ("JFS is your friend") added in...

anyway, I'd like to option a buy-in on the script...

[PangQuan]

anyway, I'd like to option a buy-in on the script...

I'd like to get in on that.

[PhilDunlap]

It's funny but this reminds me of the Jerry springer show. Everytime I think it can't be real I am proved wrong..

Aboout a year ago JFS threatened to come up to my school rip my eyballs out and smear my blood all over the walls in a thread about children in Burma fighting in Burmese Boxing being better than their life alternatives.... When I gave him the address, and schedule and told him the rules were acceptable he changed his mind... That forum defends his behavior

[cjurakpt]

Aboout a year ago JFS threatened to... smear my blood all over the walls

so he has background in interior design, does he? and obviously trains the combat aspect of Feng Shui...

[PhilDunlap]

It's funny I am not big on the color red so I was actually quite relived he would be removing my eyes first

[PangQuan]

It's funny I am not big on the color red so I was actually quite relived he would be removing my eyes first

lmfao.....thats just funny

[Knifefighter]

Aboout a year ago JFS threatened to come up to my school rip my eyballs out and smear my blood all over the walls

Funny thing is, he is supposed to be some kind of master at eye gouging and supposedly has trained his fingers to rip through flesh. I've seen a couple of clips of him training his finger strikes.

You can see him trying to go for the eyes when he was mounted and all it got him was his finger bitten. I guess maybe he forgot to train his fingers against teeth. I think he is lucky that that Osiris guy didn't chomp down and bite it all the way off.

[Knifefighter]

Speaking of eye gouging, I had a great uncle who was involved in what was known as Rough and Tumble fighting back in the 1800's in some of the eastern and southern areas of the U.S. The goal of these fights was to gouge your opponent's eyes out. He showed me some of the nasty methods they would use for actually scooping the eye out of the socket. They used the thumb rather than the fingers... pretty gross.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Speaking of eye gouging, I had a great uncle who was involved in what was known as Rough and Tumble fighting back in the 1800's in some of the eastern and southern areas of the U.S. The goal of these fights was to gouge your opponent's eyes out. He showed me some of the nasty methods they would use for actually scooping the eye out of the socket. They used the thumb rather than the fingers... pretty gross.

Too many Steven Seagal movies...;)

[Knifefighter]

Too many Steven Seagal movies...;)

Look it up. Do a search on Rough and Tumble. It was real. People would carry their opponent's eyeballs around as trophies.

[PangQuan]

Speaking of eye gouging, I had a great uncle who was involved in what was known as Rough and Tumble fighting back in the 1800's in some of the eastern and southern areas of the U.S. The goal of these fights was to gouge your opponent's eyes out. He showed me some of the nasty methods they would use for actually scooping the eye out of the socket. They used the thumb rather than the fingers... pretty gross.

well to me the thumb actually makes more sense IMO.

to me trying to get a eye gouge is the same as trying to break somene nose, except harder because you have to be precise as well as get past defense.

with the thumb method you actually can make it easier by going into a grapple. all you need to do is get your hands on the sides of your opponents head.

structurally speaking thats easy as its a natural position for the human body.

and thumbs are tough SOB's

[Knifefighter]

well to me the thumb actually makes more sense IMO.

to me trying to get a eye gouge is the same as trying to break somene nose, except harder because you have to be precise as well as get past defense.

with the thumb method you actually can make it easier by going into a grapple. all you need to do is get your hands on the sides of your opponents head.

structurally speaking thats easy as its a natural position for the human body.

and thumbs are tough SOB's

They would also sharpen their thumb nails:

http://xroads.virginia.edu/~UG97/albion/asport.html

"The border sport of bragging and fighting was also introduced to the American backcountry. where it came to be called "rough and tumble." Here again it was a savage combat between two or more males (occasionally females), which sometimes left the contestants permanently blinded or maimed. A graphic description of "rough and tumble" came from the Irish traveler Thomas Ashe, who described a fight between a West Virginian and a Kentuckian. A crowd gathered and arranged itself into an impromptu ring. The contestants were asked if they wished to "fight fair" or "rough and tumble." When they chose "rough and tumble," a roar of approval rose from the multitude. The two men entered the ring, and a few ordinary blows were exchanged in a tentative manner. Then suddenly the Virginian "contracted his whole form, drew his arms to his face," and "pitched himself into the bosom of his opponent," sinking his sharpened fingernails into the Kentuckian's head. "The Virginian," we are told, "never lost his hold . . . fixing his claws in his hair and his thumbs on his eyes, [he] gave them a start from the sockets. The sufferer roared aloud, but uttered no complaint." Even after the eyes were gouged out, the struggle continued. The Virginian fastened his teeth on the Kentuckian's nose and bit it in two pieces. Then he tore off the Kentuckian's ears. At last, the "Kentuckian, deprived of eyes, ears and nose, gave in." The victor, himself maimed and bleeding, was "chaired round the grounds," to the cheers of the crowd"

[sanjuro_ronin]

Look it up. Do a search on Rough and Tumble. It was real. People would carry their opponent's eyeballs around as trophies.

I wasn't doubting per say, just making fun that Seagal does it in hsi movie, Marked for Death comes to mind.

[Knifefighter]

Here's an interesting read:

"Gouge and Bite, Pull Hair and Scratch:" The Social Significance of Fighting in the Southern Backcountry

http://ejmas.com/jmanly/articles/2001/jmanlyart_gorn_0401.htm


"The emphasis on maximum disfigurement, on severing bodily parts, made this fighting style unique. Amid the general mayhem, however, gouging out an opponent’s eye became the sine qua non of rough-and-tumble fighting, much like the knockout punch in modern boxing. The best gougers, of course, were adept at other fighting skills. Some allegedly filed their teeth to bite off an enemy’s appendages more efficiently. Still, liberating an eyeball quickly became a fighter’s surest route to victory and his most prestigious accomplishment. To this end, celebrated heroes fired their fingernails hard, honed them sharp, and oiled them slick. "’You have come off badly this time, I doubt?’" declared an alarmed passerby on seeing the piteous condition of a renowned fighter. "’Have I,’ says he triumphantly, shewing from his pocket at the same time an eye, which he had extracted during the combat, and preserved for a trophy."

[banditshaw]

Sounds like something right out of this show....watch for the eye gouge at the end.

Rough and Tumble sounds brutal.....this is probably as close as a representation you could find...in a dramatised sense.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Blki-DISUis

[Black Jack II]

As a amatuer fan of western methods I have a few articles here at the house of what was called southern "rough and tumble" and cutlegging matches.

Nasty stuff.

As for eye gouging, I prefer to just think of it as capturing the mind of the attacker, setting up the flinch reaction, instead of the mythos of being able to pop someone's eye's out as easy as buying a soda at MacDonalds.

If you really want to gouge someone's eye's out you better think about incorporating grappling skills. A lot of these old south matches had a LOT of groundfighting and vertical grappling.

[PhilDunlap]

I have fought in Hkyen matches in Northern Burma and Eyegouging is legal. If someone wants to fight with eyegouging fine by me hall if they want biting cool too just say so before hand. In a fight the better fighter usually ends up winning no matter the rules. Biting and eygouging are like any technique for them to work they must be prcticed in a live fashion.

[Black Jack II]

Phil,

How do you simulate biting in a "live" fashion, you mean by using a softer bite or folded back lip type method or using the chin to act as the bite?

[Knifefighter]

Phil,

How do you simulate biting in a "live" fashion, you mean by using a softer bite or folded back lip type method or using the chin to act as the bite?

Fitted mouthpiece over the top and bottom teeth.

[PhilDunlap]

Softer bite

These are from a seminar Bites

http://s93079986.onlinehome.us/BITE1.wmv

http://s93079986.onlinehome.us/NECKSLIDE.wmv

basic eyepoke with the finger or thumb

http://s93079986.onlinehome.us/EYE%201.wmv

[xcakid]

Fitted mouthpiece over the top and bottom teeth.

That's a darn good idea!!!

[Black Jack II]

Fitted mouthpiece over the top and bottom teeth.

You know Knife, that is a great idea.

Phil,

Nasty stuff, head control to a nose bite, ouch. Talk about maiming.

[sanjuro_ronin]

They would also sharpen their thumb nails:

http://xroads.virginia.edu/~UG97/albion/asport.html

"The border sport of bragging and fighting was also introduced to the American backcountry. where it came to be called "rough and tumble." Here again it was a savage combat between two or more males (occasionally females), which sometimes left the contestants permanently blinded or maimed. A graphic description of "rough and tumble" came from the Irish traveler Thomas Ashe, who described a fight between a West Virginian and a Kentuckian. A crowd gathered and arranged itself into an impromptu ring. The contestants were asked if they wished to "fight fair" or "rough and tumble." When they chose "rough and tumble," a roar of approval rose from the multitude. The two men entered the ring, and a few ordinary blows were exchanged in a tentative manner. Then suddenly the Virginian "contracted his whole form, drew his arms to his face," and "pitched himself into the bosom of his opponent," sinking his sharpened fingernails into the Kentuckian's head. "The Virginian," we are told, "never lost his hold . . . fixing his claws in his hair and his thumbs on his eyes, [he] gave them a start from the sockets. The sufferer roared aloud, but uttered no complaint." Even after the eyes were gouged out, the struggle continued. The Virginian fastened his teeth on the Kentuckian's nose and bit it in two pieces. Then he tore off the Kentuckian's ears. At last, the "Kentuckian, deprived of eyes, ears and nose, gave in." The victor, himself maimed and bleeding, was "chaired round the grounds," to the cheers of the crowd"

Sounds like a good ol fun time at the local Shriners Hall.

[PangQuan]

IMO biting is a skill that we train daily as we eat.

if a body part gets near your teeth, employ the skill you have honed since you first started teething.

IMO fighting to position yourself specifically to bite is retareded. Knowing how to bite is something we all can claim.

The instinct/intent/drive to bite when an opportunity presents itself is all I think we can really train to benefit ourselves from the biting aspect.

[Knifefighter]

IMO fighting to position yourself specifically to bite is retareded. Knowing how to bite is something we all can claim..

Train to position yourself to avoid being bitten.

[Lama Pai Sifu]

I only saw the first video. Can someone please post up the second one? the one with the actual JF Springer fight? How bad was he, really? 'Cause he threatened to kick my ass as well..lol

Please - someone post it...

[PangQuan]

Train to position yourself to avoid being bitten.

ahhh touche

[Momjoe]

Speaking of eye gouging, I had a great uncle who was involved in what was known as Rough and Tumble fighting back in the 1800's in some of the eastern and southern areas of the U.S. The goal of these fights was to gouge your opponent's eyes out. He showed me some of the nasty methods they would use for actually scooping the eye out of the socket. They used the thumb rather than the fingers... pretty gross.

Good Lord, this crap is no different than a TCMA guy running his mouth about what the "Masters" used to do back in the old days.

[Knifefighter]

Good Lord, this crap is no different than a TCMA guy running his mouth about what the "Masters" used to do back in the old days.

I definitely don't go for "deadly old masters" B.S. I was only about 10 or 11 when he told me about this stuff and he died shortly thereafter.

Here's what I do know:
- He had some scars on his face and arms where he said he had been bitten.
- He showed me the "eye pluck" technique on a pig's head and it was smooth. He used to do it when fishing too.
- The accounts of using the thumbs and attacking the eyes squares with the historical accounts of Rough and Tumble fighting.

Was he making it up? I don't know for sure, but I doubt it. He also taught me some some of the most effective knife techniques that I have ever seen, even after years of FMA training.

[PangQuan]

interesting site. tons of images from his book....

http://www.roughandtumblefighting.com/

http://www.roughandtumblefighting.com/books/wesbrown/pages/pg22.htm

[banditshaw]

Very interesting....kudos for the links Pang.

[Black Jack II]

I have the Wesley Brown book, plus his Navy Combatives Manuel, he trained in his wrestling and police work in my neck of the woods even, and have worked material out of both with other players. The material Wesley shows in this book is not the same "Rough and Tumble" that was used by South and Backwood rollers who fought to settle scores.

There may be a some connection to a bit of the grappling/gouging material, I can not say for sure, as 25-b and 25-c look like that sort of material, but what Rough and Tumble meant back then was an Americanized format of close combat or Pier Six style fighting.

Anything under the kitchen sink, stripped down, applied with aggressive and not defensive intent, dirty tricks handed down from grandpa to pa to son, material handed down from hand to hand combat instructor to student, methods handed down from boxing or wrestling or savate coach to pupil, combat judo/jujitsu and karate all mixed into a blender depending on who it is.

Wesley was a judo/jujitsu cat, mixed in with some wrestling and old navy boxing, tossed in with dirty tricks and served up warm.

[PangQuan]

Thanks for the info.

Hey go to wikipidia (i know lame) and do a search on Rough and Tumble.

it tells you that RAT was created in south africa or some such...

[Black Jack II]

Pang,

Wow, I have no idea what that system is, but it tends to fall into what rough and tumble may mean, I have no idea what that system is though.


The martial arts and fighting systems that influenced RAT in its early stages were: western boxing, Chinese Kung Fu (Gung Fu), Japanese jujutsu, Zulu and Southern Sotho stick fighting Nguni stick fighting, and taekwondo. Later influences include amateur wrestling, Hsing-i (Xing Yi), and eskrima.

A large hybrid for sure. I know that the South Afircan criminal subculture down there invented a knife system called Piper I believe. Here is an example.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhpAsE8z6JI

[boshea]

I only saw the first video. Can someone please post up the second one? the one with the actual JF Springer fight? How bad was he, really? 'Cause he threatened to kick my ass as well..lol

Please - someone post it...

Here you go:

1. Initial trash talking (http://youtube.com/watch?v=s3b1ropoUEs)
2. Clip with the JFS-Osiris fight (http://youtube.com/watch?v=xZEl6Jpvuy0)

At least now you'll know what you're up against.

[Lama Pai Sifu]

HOLY SH1T!!!!!!!!!!

WTF was that???

What's with the shirt off and the smoking?

JFS is one of the lost village people!

WHAT A FU(KING JOKE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[CFT]

I definitely don't go for "deadly old masters" B.S. I was only about 10 or 11 when he told me about this stuff and he died shortly thereafter.

Was he making it up? I don't know for sure, but I doubt it. He also taught me some some of the most effective knife techniques that I have ever seen, even after years of FMA training.You've got a very good memory!

[Black Jack II]

You've got a very good memory!

A lot of people can remeber details from when they were five. 10 or 11 should be cake, even more so with an event that sticks out like that.

[Knifefighter]

You've got a very good memory!

He taught me principles more than techniques. Things that were different enough to really stick out in my mind... like how to grab a knife blade without getting cut, using two blades instead of one, mixed grips, etc.

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

A lot of people can remeber details from when they were five. 10 or 11 should be cake, even more so with an event that sticks out like that.

Reply]
I can remember all sorts of things from that age...couldn't tell you what i did yesterday though!! :o