9 Section Chain Whip and Real Usage Q

[TongLongJai]

I've heard the chain whip was used a bit by Bodyguards and Assassins and Warriors in ancient times and I was just wondering about the Real Useage of this weapon in real Combat?

I'm guess it was mainly the whipping/throwing into a stabbing thrust with the tip and maybe close range grappling type situations?

rather than the twirling swirling back flip cartwheeling pretty displays of Wushu and most forms i have seen (nothing wrong with that at all... but i doubt a butterfly kick into splits etc was used on a battlefield or asassination scenerio :P)

are their northern and southern forms (sets) of this weapon and can anyone point me to a clip of a southern style form... especially any hakka art (if this weapon exists within those curriculums

I'd like to hear more about the practical usage and techniques (well anything) of this weapon.

Interesting weapon

thank you

[cjurakpt]

"southern" style chain whip:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YKN_DsfGdVg

[Fighting_Lad]

"southern" style chain whip:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YKN_DsfGdVg

Great video, this guy is obviously really skilled. Shame about the music; the incessant drumming really irritated me!

[TongLongJai]

thanks for the clip link! and were a few more clips in related sectioon.

i actually like drumming hehe :P

i didn't think of CTS.. because i thought lama pai is northern system...

[Sicilian Tofu M]

Hung Gar chain whip.

http://www.wle.com/products/VHG24D.html

http://www.wle.com/products/VHG17D.html

[Fighting_Lad]

Hung Gar chain whip.

http://www.wle.com/products/VHG24D.html

http://www.wle.com/products/VHG17D.html

I wouldn't buy a DVD instructing you how to do a martial art - you'll probably just get hurt in the process; I'd search for a teacher in your area if I were you. If you're struggling to find one then just check ads in your local newsagent.

[Sicilian Tofu M]

I was just showing the vid the site has a lot, theirs no substitute for a real Teacher.

[Fu-Pow]

My understanding is that the chain whip was something that soldiers would keep tied around their waist. It was primarily used as a means of tangling up somebodies weapon so they couldn't use it anymore. Although you can use a chainwhip in an offensive manner I think it is more likely that the Fei Do (rope dart) was used for this purpose.

FP

[cjurakpt]

Great video, this guy is obviously really skilled. Shame about the music; the incessant drumming really irritated me!
and now you know how we are beginning to feel about your incessant posting...



i actually like drumming hehe :P
in the clip it was laid-over by Mike P. with some "generic" drumming when he uploaded the vid - the original live drumming "soundtrack" was provided by Sifu Y C Wong and it was amazing (but evidently didn't transfer well)


i didn't think of CTS.. because i thought lama pai is northern system...
not really; and anyway, the chain whip is a CLF set (the opening is the CLF signature)


I wouldn't buy a DVD instructing you how to do a martial art - you'll probably just get hurt in the process;
and he obviously speaks from experience vis a vis frequent blows to the back of his own head...


I'd search for a teacher in your area if I were you. If you're struggling to find one then just check ads in your local newsagent.
yes, try looking under Taoist Hermit Sage's For Hire to start with...

[TenTigers]

if it was a soldier's weapon,using it to tangle up a weapon is suicidal in terms of battlefield warefare. It was usually carried around the waist or folded up and is a last resort weapon, rather than a main weapon.
I prefer the forms that use the chain in a more martial sense, rather than
"the sitting on the floor sweeping it under your butt thechnique."
I know there are techniques put in a form that show "Mastery" of the weapon, but I would rather master fighting techniques than spend ao much time developing a useless skill. Besides, it just plain looks stupid. I think if you are going to do that, you may as well do it on a unicycle, balance some plates, and juggle.

[Eddie]

whats that move for actually? (hopping up and down on your butt and swinging the chain underneath you)

[TenTigers]

Heck if I know. If a guy came into my school and did that, I'd tie a dust broom to it and put him in the lobby.'Yeah, good Kung-Fu. Do my floors."

[TongLongJai]

I prefer the forms that use the chain in a more martial sense, rather than
"the sitting on the floor sweeping it under your butt thechnique."
I know there are techniques put in a form that show "Mastery" of the weapon, but I would rather master fighting techniques than spend ao much time developing a useless skill. Besides, it just plain looks stupid. I think if you are going to do that, you may as well do it on a unicycle, balance some plates, and juggle.

my thoughts actually and what im interested in .. thus this tread

besides hung gar and choy lee fut what other southern styles use 9 section chain whip?

any styles like ngo cho kune, lung ying, bak mei etc?

[Yum Cha]

Whip chain supposedly could break a blade, i.e. a sword.

Training whips are very light compared to the 'real' versions I've seen.

Its a bit of an esoteric weapon, but think of a biker gang fight with chains, and maybe it will make some sense.

On a battlefield, tangle a weapon while your pike guys do them in? dunno

Seems more of a one on one weapon to me. Nice against a knife, lots of range, easy to stash.

Pak Mei has a chain form, but I'm a believer that most weapons are generic.

[Sicilian Tofu M]

from what I know of HG uses a 3 section chain whip. Does HG use a 9 section?

[TongLongJai]

from what I know of HG uses a 3 section chain whip. Does HG use a 9 section?

http://www.wle.com/videos/VHG17D.wmv

http://www.wle.com/videos/VHG24D.wmv

sorry about that Tofu M my mistake.

Double chain whip video is indeed 3 section on closer viewing.

I alwasy thought 3 section was just shorter...

Single chain whip appears to be more sections one? 5 section?

[Sicilian Tofu M]

Will the number of sections on a chain whip effect a form to the point where its considered wrong, at least to Hung Gar.

TongLongJai it's all good, I only herd of a 3, 7, 9 section my self.

[stout]

Heck if I know. If a guy came into my school and did that, I'd tie a dust broom to it and put him in the lobby.'Yeah, good Kung-Fu. Do my floors."

V good point. The kung fu chains are worlds apart from the wushu chains. The latter is like paper clips bounded together. I imagine you have to be very good with the chain until you can match someone with a staff or sword.

[stout]

I prefer the forms that use the chain in a more martial sense, rather than
"the sitting on the floor sweeping it under your butt thechnique."


This CLF form seems pretty martial - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEXC34aFBdg

[CLFNole]

That is actually not a CLF whip set but rather a northern one.

[TenTigers]

"The kung fu chains are worlds apart from the wushu chains. The latter is like paper clips bounded together."

yep..when I was learning chain whip from Yu Shaowen, (Beijing Wu-Shu Champion) he took one look at my chain whip and said,"That's for war! Use mine, you'll kill yourself with that thing!"

[monkeyfoot]

yea there is a hell of a difference between the 2 types of whip. My wushu one could still punch a hole in your head, but the one I bought in china for my sifu is about double the weight and the dart on the end is about twice as big.

Dangerous stuff. Getting hit at high speed round the head with either one will result in serious injury. My friend was playing around slowly with one and caught his shin bone.....it left him with a huge black bruise the size of a tennis ball.....

craig

[stout]

That is actually not a CLF whip set but rather a northern one.

What is the difference between CLF whip set and northern whip set? You have any examples of a true CLF whip form?

[CLFNole]

Actually the CLF set that my sifu taught was kinda laim that is why he taught the northern version you saw in the video although the video is a bit different. The basics were similar however the northern set has a much better flow. A better CLF set is the double 3-sec whips.

[Vajramusti]

yep..when I was learning chain whip from Yu Shaowen, (Beijing Wu-Shu Champion) he took one look at my chain whip and said,"That's for war! Use mine, you'll kill yourself with that thing!"
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Yu Shaowen is a friend. You must have learned from him when he went east after he left Arizona. Later he moved to Portland. In his monkey staff form when he balanced himself on the staff- time seemed to stand still.

BTW an American Chinese sifu- shall go un-named..some years ago was doing the 9 sectional whip in front of a crowded audience,,, the last link came off and went flying and embedded itself ona wall. It could easily have been moider-if the fates were unkind.It pays to look at craftsmanship.

joy chaudhuri

[stout]

BTW an American Chinese sifu- shall go un-named..some years ago was doing the 9 sectional whip in front of a crowded audience,,, the last link came off and went flying and embedded itself ona wall. It could easily have been moider-if the fates were unkind.It pays to look at craftsmanship.

joy chaudhuri

I have not seen many wushu chains, the ones I have seen on sale seemed dodgy. Looked pretty home made.

Yeah, my kung fu one have came off in the handle link(more then once). I can't buy them here, I managed to get it fixed by a black smith. Everytime I use it now I check it or just stop using it whens there's people around. You would think they make these things better.

[southernkf]

This may have already been stated... I don't know the history of the chain forms but I was under the impression that this weapon is much like other weapons that were borrowed from other styles, atleast in Hung Gar. I wonder if there really a souther chain whip or if it is just variations on other outside influences?

YC Wong Sifu is sometimes associated with the chain whips. He seems to have a high level of proficiency with the weapon. So I guess this form is as good as any others. Here is a short scene at the end of this clip

http://youtube.com/watch?v=mnSMGBWO8N4

[Sicilian Tofu M]

WOW that was cool.