Bummed and confused

[woodendumby]

I need some advice...

I Started taking wing chun around 4 monyhs ago...I like it, and the teacher is cool...here's the problem: I'm taking this class on blind faith that it will be effective.
we are not allowed to spar, we are not even allowed to WATCH the advanced classes in which sparring takes place. Everything learned at this point is in slow motion...sparring / fighting is prohibited until blue sash, which is about 1 1/2 years away !

I understand that it's important to lay a strong foundation for this style before applying the principles...blah blah blah...but I'm not rich by any means. I scrape the bottom of the barrel to be able to do this, and it's frustrating to not even be allowed to see WC in action ( via the advanced classes etc. ) you know what I mean ?

To be clear, I'm not in this to learn an art so much as I am to be able to defend myself in a realistic situation. I'm not impatient for those skills...but at the same time my money and blind faith are starting to not mix too well.

What do you guys think ?

[yutyeesam]

Look on youtube for some videos of Wing Chun combat.

[Dan_chi_sau]

can i ask, how much are you paying for classes? Also, you get to see nothing?
That worries me, theres good wing chun, then theres **** wing chun, then theres people in pyjamas waving their arms about and claiming various links to historical figures. You just gotta figure out where you're at.
Do you do any simple sparring drills or anything? I'd ask to see an advanced class, just to sit in. They should understand, otherwise you might be with the wrong people. I say might, because i also might be way off track, I dont know your situation. Hope that helps, I'd talk to people at your class, junior instructors etc. find out where this is going, so you can set yourself goals for the future. If you dont even have goals, then chances are they're not playing fair.

[David Jamieson]

what are your own objectives? this is the first thing to ask, then once you can answer that, develop the framework for asking how your current situation can provide that.

if it cannot, then leave, if it can then stay. either way, other peoples experience will not be 100% relevant to your own.

[The Willow Sword]

When i was a teenger i joined this school here in austin( i wont say which, but it wasnt sd) anyway, it was the same thing you are currently experiencing. the beginner belts had to face the wall and was not allowed to see the higher ranks sparring or doing their forms. I think it is a bunch of ego BS and i see NO value in it.

I would start to look elsewhere for training. It is always good to start sparring right away to get your mind and body used to it. Yes you have to learn basics and yes you have to get the fundamentals, but you also need to get your sparring game going so you can start comprehending the fundamentals in a self defense situation.

Look for another school bro. one that doesnt do cr@p like what you are experiencing. I mean if a Teacher is wanting to hide aspects of the higher level forms and sparring from the beginners then He should be fukin smart enough to hold THOSE classes on different days. Its humiliating to have to sit there facing a wall listening to what is going on but you cant turn around to watch. Its stupid and your teacher should be told he is a douche nozzle for doing so.

Peace,TWS

[Baqualin]

I need some advice...


To be clear, I'm not in this to learn an art so much as I am to be able to defend myself in a realistic situation. I'm not impatient for those skills...but at the same time my money and blind faith are starting to not mix too well.

What do you guys think ?

If you really don't care about the art and only care about the above....leave and join a good MMA school that trains to fight....you will spar & have your a$$ slammed on the ground from day one.
BQ

[1bad65]

WC is a joke for fighting in my opinion. Watch the Boztepe/Cheung 'fight' and see two high level WC guys looking like kids in a playground fight. At my gym you can spar in ~6 months if you have no previous training, but you can watch the sparring from day 1. MMA gyms can be expensive, if money is an issue then boxing is usually very affordable and is a great style for striking.

Any gym that hides any aspect of training from students is to be avoided.

[woodendumby]

I apreciate the feedback...

The instructor does hold the advanced classes at a different time...it's closed to the public and even us less advanced students.

we do do some pak sau drills...things like that. I do'nt know...I hate to quit.

to answer the classes are 80/month...that's for 2 classes a week. I'm not sure if that's expensive or not compaired to other places...but I'm a broke @ss right now while my girl is finnishing college.

you know I have seen some advanced students doing chi sau (not sparring ) outside the school prior to their class...and it looked awesome. BUT what I want to do is throw on some head gear and gloves , act like the dumb a$$ at the bar, and come at them "street style" ...and hope they beat the **** out of me. But no-one has taken me up...or really it's not allowed.

It sucks, but I think I'll talk to the sifu once more, and if the school cannot demonstrate it's effectiveness I think I'll take my money elswhere.

I want to make it clear that I respect the sifu and the school, and appriciate the idea of learning an art that has been passed down for so long in a traditional way like it's being taught here.

[1bad65]

BUT what I want to do is throw on some head gear and gloves , act like the dumb a$$ at the bar, and come at them "street style" ...and hope they beat the **** out of me. But no-one has taken me up...or really it's not allowed.

It sucks, but I think I'll talk to the sifu once more, and if the school cannot demonstrate it's effectiveness I think I'll take my money elswhere.


If they won't demonstrate that it works on a newbie to MA, they themselves know deep down it does not work. Don't fall for the 'too deadly', or the 'respect the advanced guys' excuses. Either they can demonstrate it works in an 'alive' situation or they can't.

What city are you in by chance?

[woodendumby]

Arlington , TX....DFW area

[BruceSteveRoy]

the long and short of it is this. you are paying your money for goods and services. if the goods and services are not worth your money why would you keep paying? its like going to a restaurant and asking for a medium rare steak and they bring it out charred to a cinder and say "we only serve it this way." you wouldnt go back to that restaurant would you? if you want to fight/ learn to fight there are plenty of schools that will help you meet your goal for the same price. if you want to fight with wing chun there are plenty of WC schools that will oblige you. it sucks to change schools but you talk about being hard up for cash so why throw it away on a school that doesnt fullfill your expectation of service?

but yeah there are a lot schools that do this sort of thing. i guess you can compare it to the scene in the kung fu tv show where the children wait at the gates of shaolin and are told to go away and only the ones that remain long enough deserve the secret of kung fu. or whatever other bs schools feed their students. i jus think in modern society if you are going to pay your hard earned money for somethign you should be getting what you want as a consumer. if it were free and you were at the mercy of the school to learn then that would be different and they could cionduct themselves however they want.

[1bad65]

Arlington , TX....DFW area


That place is a jackpot for effective martial arts! Mohler BJJ, North Dallas BJJ, Felipe Espinosa's gym(the gym name escapes me), The Lion's Den, Saekson Janjira for Muay Thai just to name a few. I guarantee you will find quality, effective MA training at any of those places.

Check out TXMMA.com too. They have a forum as well a school listing by city.

[David Jamieson]

That place is a jackpot for effective martial arts! Mohler BJJ, North Dallas BJJ, Felipe Espinosa's gym(the gym name escapes me), The Lion's Den, Saekson Janjira for Muay Thai just to name a few. I guarantee you will find quality, effective MA training at any of those places.

Check out TXMMA.com too. They have a forum as well a school listing by city.

bias towards mma much? lol
i think you're in the wrong forum. :p

[1bad65]

He wants an effective, not too expensive gym. I provided examples of effective ones(and I hear Felipe works with people with $$$ issues). Instead of attacking me, maybe you could actually provide some advice or schools for the OP. Just a thought.

[David Jamieson]

attacking you? wrong guy. I'm just pointing out the obvious.
besides, what if he wants wing chun? you think it's ineffective because of two guys fighting from 20 years ago with not much intention?

anyway, here nor there.

wing chun's a good style if taught properly and traditional people will be the way they are. They eat their bitter in a different way. that's all.

[woodendumby]

It's not that I do'nt think WC is effective, only is this method of teaching it effective at my school...

Alot of ppl bring up that fight on youtube...but never bring up Bruce Lee, who was a fighting champion before even comming to America...long before his jeet kun do... and ofcourse his style was WC.

to be fair we cant judge a style by a bad fight . I watched a horrible MMA fight on "ultimate fighter" last night, it was as if watching a 6th grader being choked by a 7th grade bully.

I would'nt judge mma by this fight....or even the fighters themselves by this fight. It was just a poor fight.

I did however check into a couple mma style gyns last week, but their prices are around 120/week. But I did'nt check out the ones you mentioned.

[1bad65]

Felipe is supposed to be pretty good about working with people with money concerns.

http://www.dallasjiujitsu.com/


And fyi, I've never lived in or trained in Dallas. Just saying what gyms I know of up there and their reputations. I live in Austin.

Just noticed: 120/week! You sure it's not per month?

[woodendumby]

oh yea...lol, 120/month.

hey i appreciate the advice...I'll check it out