Chinese folklore - Flying Kung Fu Masters. Fiction or based on fact?

[MASTERforge]

While looking for something completely different I stumbled upon this youtube vid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-GsyL27wSH4

I was amazed at the acrobatics and thought they would be useful for assassins. Is it possible that the acrobatics they use, could have been used by the masters of old?

Could this be the basis on which the Chinese folklore of flying Kung Fu warriors came from?

If it is possible, then their level of skill must have been incredible and their training methods truly lost?

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

Could this be the basis on which the Chinese folklore of flying Kung Fu warriors came from?

Reply]
Probably.

If it is possible, then their level of skill must have been incredible and their training methods truly lost?


Reply]
They seem alive and well in France

[MASTERforge]

I would love to learn the jumping and climbing techniques but I think I already have enough training to do!

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

Take a gymnastics class.

My gut feeling is that all these Parkur guys all grew up in the gymnastics environment, and it's really just a natural extension of that.

My daughter was in a high level gym from the time she was 3, to the time she was 14, (Started actually at 2, is now 17 and will be competing in highschool this year) and she does stuff like this too, just not at that level. Gymnasts just naturally flip and run, and climb...they really can't help themselves. Give them a little bit of space, and they start doing some form of spontaneous gymnastics.

My daughter even has a Tshirt that says "Warning the person flips spontaneously" And another that says she flips automatically.

[Asia]

I was amazed at the acrobatics and thought they would be useful for assassins
LOL

Seriously you don't understand how an assasin works. You are thinking of movies and fiction. In real life an assasin main weapon is the ablity to fit in and not draw attention.

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

Seriously you don't understand how an assasin works. You are thinking of movies and fiction. In real life an assasin main weapon is the ablity to fit in and not draw attention.

Reply]
Agreed. The ancients probably did it for the same reason people do today...'cause it's just a fun activity.

[MASTERforge]

I quite fancy taking a few lessons in gymnastics. I think it would be fun.

I am 26 so not as stretchy or flexible as I would like. It would make for fun cross training though! I am in good shape but way off the fitness level of these guys.

With a few months harder training and stretching maybe I could? Is there an upper limit to gymnastics where its just not possible to train?

[street_fighter]

I quite fancy taking a few lessons in gymnastics. I think it would be fun.

I am 26 so not as stretchy or flexible as I would like. It would make for fun cross training though! I am in good shape but way off the fitness level of these guys.

With a few months harder training and stretching maybe I could? Is there an upper limit to gymnastics where its just not possible to train?

if you want to take gymnastics with 10 year old girls, enjoy yourself, but its not crosstraining. it has nothing to do with martial arts. And no, theres almost no way the "ancients" did Parkour/urban tricking. They didn't even have the environment for it. it kinda loses... everything it is, if its not "urban". I'm sure there were some acrobatics being done (not like this) but even so I doubt thats where the whole flying KF master came from. How long has that even been around???

[Jeong]

I quite fancy taking a few lessons in gymnastics. I think it would be fun.

Gymnastics is a lot like martial arts; anyone really good makes it look easy. Keep in mind the guy in this video probably has maybe 15 years practice.


I am 26 so not as stretchy or flexible as I would like. It would make for fun cross training though! I am in good shape but way off the fitness level of these guys.

With a few months harder training and stretching maybe I could? Is there an upper limit to gymnastics where its just not possible to train?

Gymnastics is really really hard on your body (there is a reason you never see even 30 year-olds in the olympics). Like MA you can start at anytime, but learning to flip and the such is a lot harder the longer you wait. If you're interested in trying it out I'd recommend it (I've been doing Gymnastics on and off for maybe 8 or 9 years now), but don't expect to turn into that guy. It'll be quite a while before you'll be able to flip at all, and quite a bit longer before you'll feel comfortable doing it on even a flat surface.

[Jeong]

Oh and also street_fighter is exactly right; gymnastics has pretty much zero combat-applicability. That doesn't make it not fun though :)

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

if you want to take gymnastics with 10 year old girls, enjoy yourself, but its not crosstraining.

Reply]
So go to a gym with a Men's team....


it has nothing to do with martial arts. And no, theres almost no way the "ancients" did Parkour/urban tricking. They didn't even have the environment for it. it kinda loses... everything it is, if its not "urban".

Reply]
Thta is kind of am ignorant statement. The Chinese are the oldest civilization there is. they had cities 2000 years ago.

Also, the Chinese people have allways been known for thier extreme acrobatic skills. Heck, the founder of my style was known to earn a living in his youth by doing public performances of acrobatic skill....that was in like the 940's AD. Knowing that, it stands to reason that they would have had this type of acrobatic skills being performed just by sheer human nature.

I'm sure there were some acrobatics being done (not like this) but even so I doubt thats where the whole flying KF master came from. How long has that even been around???

Reply]
I would say that it makes perfect sense that these types of acrobatics would have been around through out Chinese history, same as they are there today. This French Parkur is nothing new, and not something limited to the French. Several European/Anglo Saxon as well as Asian cultures have allways had stuff like this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFcp8Y_Hmt4

[MASTERforge]

It does have martial application!

If some guy is threatening to beat me up I could run up a wall and he would never catch me!:D

I think the circus has been around a long time in China so acrobatics would not be so new. But out in the villages, used in the street by martial artists it might look like magical powers to the peasants.

[BlueTravesty]

I think the idea of flying kung fu masters came from wuxia novels and folk tales. Which in turn, took place from a conversation like this taking place in Ming Dynasty China.

A: "Kung fu is cool!"

B: "Yes!"

A: "People who do kung fu are totally sweet!"

B: 'You are correct!"

A: "What can we top that with, in terms of sheer Coolness?"

B: "What if they flew?"

A: "OMG! Dude, that would be the best thing EVER! And they would have these swords that are like, really really flexible, but still somehow able to hold an edge and cut through metal."

B: "And there would be these movies where they're fighting all the time, and using kung fu, but you never see them training to be awesome assasins."

A: "What are 'movies?'"

B: "Why are we speaking English?"

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

My guess is this would have been an activity of Chinese acrobats, and not really martial artists...although basic gymnastic/acrobatic skills are often taught to martial artists in China, so who knows.

[Takuan]

B: "And there would be these movies where they're fighting all the time, and using kung fu, but you never see them training to be awesome assasins."
A: "What are 'movies?'"
B: "Why are we speaking English?"

I love you.

[LoneTiger108]

1. I was amazed at the acrobatics and thought they would be useful for assassins. Is it possible that the acrobatics they use, could have been used by the masters of old?

2. Could this be the basis on which the Chinese folklore of flying Kung Fu warriors came from?

3. If it is possible, then their level of skill must have been incredible and their training methods truly lost?

An interesting post! In answer to the original questions;

First heres a better clip http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Db461dcQSU

1. Used by Masters of old? No. Assassins? Yes. I would think they would up their chances of escape if they knew how to run up and over walls.

2. No I wouldn't think so. More likely the Parkour/Free Running craze was helped a little by the new Spiderman movies. Most 'legends' come for a legendary 'source', like Wudang.

3. Yes their skill was beyond the average mans comprehension, and very useful for the Martial Artist, but I think the knowledge was last seen on the streets of China and even Russia, resembling more Sport rythmic/paired/team gymnastics than modern day Free Running.

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

Modern day "Free running" is just human nature applied to gymnasts and acrobats. I am sure it has been around as long as everything else...we just didn't have Youtube in 960 AD to see it.

[Lucas]

RD, you must be forgetting your time lines.

BCE - Before Common Era

AD - Acristi domino

AYT - After Youtube

So, as you can see from this time line. AYT is the era we currently live in.

Any statements, technical, historical, or theoretical, must be backed up by Youtube, to be considered "real" in our current era; AYT.

:D

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

Lol!!!



..................

[Lucas]

dude, you know im right.

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

Yeah, I do! That's what is so funny about it!!

[Lucas]

Ill just start refering to anything after 2005 as AYT....

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

When did BC (Before Christ) Become BCE (Before Common Era)?

[Lucas]

When did BC (Before Christ) Become BCE (Before Common Era)?

the historian i work with is saying around the 70's or 80's

he said during the 50's religion was still really popular, but then after the all the stuff: civil rights, women rights....moving more towards secularism and the like.

iono, he knows everything about history pretty much.

[TenTigers]

Le Parkour was originally created asmethod for escaping enemy soldiers during Vietnam. So it would make sense to use these skills for an assasin to escape as well.
As far as legendary skills, if you take the world record high jump-8feet 1/2 inches,and running long jump-8.96 meters (about 30 feet), you can see what a conditioned athelete can accomplish. Over time these stories get exagerrated, and that's how legends are born, but there is usually a grain of truth.

Here's the kicker; every culture has legends of flying or levitation. From Martial Artists, to Brujos (Don Genaro in Carlos Castenaeda's books was able to fly by extending "tentacles" of his aura energy-sort of like Doc Oc) Again, there must be a grain of truth somewhere. As was stated on other threads, in Gung-Fu, there are people with tremendous skills that very few have seen. But they do exist, no matter what others might say to the contrary. To these people you simply ask, "Yes, but what have you seen?" Their actual experience ends up being extremely limited. I call mayself a "Hopeful skeptic." I want to believe, but I need to see it and in many cases, feel it. In doing so, I have met alot of people and experienced some wonderful, and sometimes frightening things. Oh, and an awful lot of bullsh1t, as well.

[sanjuro_ronin]

People that doubt things of the martial nature that they have not seen tend to be the ones that won't go to see it anyways.

Most legends are based on some truth, the 20 ft long jump becomes 50 and the beating of 2 people while the 3rd ran away becomes 10 people beaten without losing your hat.

Such is life.

[woodendumby]

LOL

Seriously you don't understand how an assasin works. You are thinking of movies and fiction. In real life an assasin main weapon is the ablity to fit in and not draw attention.

^^^^ what a d^ck....

[Lucas]

^^^^ what a d^ck....

Well, obvioulsy hes a real life assassin. You can tell by the way he speaks with authority on the subject. He must kill people very often for money.

I would be one to assume that the assassins skill set would be wholey dependent on what their task would be.

Ever hear of a Kunoichi?

Its the female assassin caste of Ancient Japan. Often times drawing attention is EXACTLY what they want to do.

You walk down the road and see a distraught woman in shambles and half naked on the side of the road crying, being the up right Samurai you are, you go to offer a helping hand, only to recieve a blade between your ribs.

IMO, nothing is so black and white.

And NO ONE here is a freaking assassin....

[KC Elbows]

Most legends are based on some truth, the 20 ft long jump becomes 50 and the beating of 2 people while the 3rd ran away becomes 10 people beaten without losing your hat.

Listen, Canadian, I'll not have you passing yourself off as a citizen of the world with your vague use of terms like "hat" and "bacon." We all know its ham and a toque you're talking about.

[RonH]

Much of what was done in the first video can be done by strengthening the legs and increasing your flexibility, especially in the foot-ankle region, so it can be easier to take the punishment of your weight landing on hard surfaces by stretching. In the vid, you see the guy sometimes landing, but immediately rolling forward or sideways. Running, weight training and tumbling lessons can let you do much of what was in the vid. Focus on increasing vertical jump distance and forward jumps from a standing position. Also, look to Jackie Chan's movies for inspiration for surrounding areas. He's done a lot of this type of thing.