Ground Fighting/Defense Seminar

[ToraDojoNJ]

Ground Fighting/Defense Seminar

Who: Ismael Franco, Sensei of the Shinri-ryu Goshin-jutsu Seiki-kai

Where: Hosted by Green Cloud Kung Fu 5801 Sunrise Highway, Sunvet Mall Unit 38A Holbrook, NY 11741-4842

When: Sunday, December 2nd from 10am till 1pm $50 for the session (3 hours)

Contact: Gus Kaparos, Sifu @ Toll Free: (866) 915-9978 or email greencloudkungfu@msn.com

This seminar will cover the fundamentals of ground defense/fighting in practical self defense situations.

The seminar will focus on common martial arts movements that can be used to create strong holds, controls and reversals to overcome in a ground fighting/defense situation. The techniques covered will help a fighter regain a standing position as quickly as possible to get back to fighting his/her fight not a grapplers fight.

Rather than a “tap out or pass out” approach this seminar will take a “get out and get up” mentality, what’s the difference you ask? Its about getting about getting back to YOUR styles strong point not accepting the grappler’s mind set.

The material will be taught with a common sense approach to make the information easily usable for martial artists of any skill level and style.

No prior experience is necessary. For video samples please visit www.youtube.com/ToraDojoNJ

[banditshaw]

Sounds like it might be interesting.
One question. Will there be a skilled grappler/wrestler on hand to test these techniques?
One of the big problems I see is when stand up arts counter guys with no wrestling/grappling credentials.

thanks.

[Anthony_ATT]

That video looked alot like this one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=psnUAkUgSRo

[ToraDojoNJ]

Yes, I understand and its a valid point. Maybe my background will help.

About Franco Sensei a summary of training:

Franco, Sensei brings 20 years of experience to Tora Dojo Shinsei Budo. He began his martial arts training in 1987 under Nick DiNapoli,
founder of the Gen Lee Martial Arts Federation. After intensive study of the arts of jujutsu,karate, judo, aikido and savate, he was awarded
instructor certification in 1996.

He is now Kaicho (head instructor and president) of the Shinriryu Goshinjutsu Seikikai, an organization for the promotion of the martial arts
system founded by Nick DiNapoli, Ryuso.

Franco, Sensei continues to advance his training through the study of Daitoryu Aikijujutsu under Tim Tung, Suseki Shihan of the Daitoryu Aikijujutsu Bokuyokan, as well as, Muso Shindenryu Iaido, Japanese swordmanship, under Roger Wehrhahn, Shihan, Chief Instructor of the North American San Shin Kai. As well as, the study of Chen style taiji and Wudang taiji sword with Tung Teinchao Sifu.

Currently, Franco Sensei is teaching a series of Joint Locking/Manipulation Workshops with the emphasis on helping martial artists stylists explore their chosen systems to find and create joint locking and manipulation applications. These workshops came out of a long standing friendship with Pedro C. Yee of Yee’s Hung Ga, who through the years has traded and shared kung fu theory with Franco Sensei. It was Pedro C. Yee, Sifu who first encouraged Franco Sensei to create the workshops.

Other noteworthy accomplishments...
• Appeared in the documentary “The Search for the 20 Heroes of China” for Guangdong TV, China
• Appeared in a martial arts instructional video “The Hidden Secrets of Japanese Swordsmanship:Omori Ryu”
• Performed in martial arts demonstrations both here in the US, as well as in Hokkaido, Japan
• Second place in Shuai Chiao, which means “competing to throw” in Chinese, at the 9th annual Wong Fei Hung All Kung Fu Championships
• Conducted martial arts seminars for both non-martial artist and experienced martial artists

Please use tora.dojo.nj@gmail.com or call 973-808-1818 to contact Ismael Franco, Sensei.

[ToraDojoNJ]

That video looked alot like this one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=psnUAkUgSRo

FUNNY Stuff. I don't plan to be as sarcastic but he is making some valid points...if you stop giggling long enough to hear him out.
:D

[WinterPalm]

Like every kung fu guy should have a select few techniques he really really likes and does well, he should also be aware of at least a few tie-ups, takedowns, trips, and counters that he practices regularily.

I like the focus on getting up and out and into your desired range. Funnily enough, often times it is better to keep it on the ground as you can control the other person much more effectively than in the standing position. It eliminates many variables and makes joint locks a heck of a lot easier especially if you don't have the "kung fu grip" yet!:)

[ToraDojoNJ]

Like every kung fu guy should have a select few techniques he really really likes and does well, he should also be aware of at least a few tie-ups, takedowns, trips, and counters that he practices regularily.

I like the focus on getting up and out and into your desired range. Funnily enough, often times it is better to keep it on the ground as you can control the other person much more effectively than in the standing position. It eliminates many variables and makes joint locks a heck of a lot easier especially if you don't have the "kung fu grip" yet!:)

Yes, no way in a single seminar will they get enough info or training to become good grapplers but this is to get them some exposure to newaza. Hopefully, to get them thinking outside of their norms and get them aware of how dangerous a grappler/jujutsu person can be. They can't fight a grappler's fight but they need some exposure to get them started, an informal seminar provides that.

[Tai-Lik]

Sensei Franco, your focus on teaching how to get out of a grappling situation and get up from the ground is a great idea for those martial artist with predominently "stand up" skills.

Best of luck to you and your series of seminars.

Tai Lik

[Anthony_ATT]

FUNNY Stuff. I don't plan to be as sarcastic but he is making some valid points...if you stop giggling long enough to hear him out.
:D

I like your style!

If I was in the area, I'd come check it out. :)

[ToraDojoNJ]

Unfortunately because of a scheduling conflict, I have to cancel the seminar.

[monji112000]

Sensei Franco, your focus on teaching how to get out of a grappling situation and get up from the ground is a great idea for those martial artist with predominently "stand up" skills.

Best of luck to you and your series of seminars.

Tai Lik

I think its a great topic for a seminar. Allot of people don't have the basic skills for surviving a fight that gets "taken down". I would go to something like that if it was given by competent people. Three main areas should be avoiding, getting to a good position, standing back up. also drills!

[Lama Pai Sifu]

Is this the gentleman who was going to do the seminar??

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r7wK2_6kScY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8UUix6avaQ

Nothing of a personal nature as I have never met this man, but is it just me, or does anyone else have a problem with this?

Personally, I find the techniques in this clip completely unrealistic. I don't think he could pull them off, for real, at all. Not on non-resisting opponents.

The attempted choke and the grabbing of the digits? The anology of a weightlifter at the gym? I just don't see it. And blocking a hook or sweeping punch with an intercepting (inside, cross the body) block? Then, assuming the hand is going to stay in place, going from the inside of it, and rolling your hand around and pulling it across your body? How is this going to happen?

Again, not being a d1ck, I legitimately don't think that these would work. Any thoughts??

[ToraDojoNJ]

Yes, that's me.

[ToraDojoNJ]

Is this the gentleman who was going to do the seminar??

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r7wK2_6kScY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8UUix6avaQ

Nothing of a personal nature as I have never met this man, but is it just me, or does anyone else have a problem with this?

Personally, I find the techniques in this clip completely unrealistic. I don't think he could pull them off, for real, at all. Not on non-resisting opponents.

The attempted choke and the grabbing of the digits? The anology of a weightlifter at the gym? I just don't see it. And blocking a hook or sweeping punch with an intercepting (inside, cross the body) block? Then, assuming the hand is going to stay in place, going from the inside of it, and rolling your hand around and pulling it across your body? How is this going to happen?

Again, not being a d1ck, I legitimately don't think that these would work. Any thoughts??

What technique showed a choke with grabbing of digits? It was a two handed push that was followed up by a double wrist grab, The tricep pull down reference was to describe the motion.

As for the other technique...try it hit someone on the inside of the forearm and see it it doesn't stop the strike while causing pain. Don't think you are being a d1ck, just honestly stated your disagreement with the techniques, but look at them again. You described them incorrectly.

[WinterPalm]

The block that he says is no good is one that we do all the time! And yes, someone can come with the other hand but you usually strike as you block or expose their body and your other hand is around the centerline.

The block he says that is no good, the left arm up to block a right hook, if done properly, hand turner over to face the outside of the forearm into their arm, is very effective! Not only is it consistent with anatomy in regards to the strength of 90 degrees, it is also very painful if you throw a very, very hard punch and the person blocking has done a fair amount of iron arm training.

I'm not going to comment on the rest as I dont' know the system and that makes all the difference in the world to understanding and applying these techniques.

[Lama Pai Sifu]

Yes, you are right, it's wasn't the thumbs as so I thought, it was the wrists! I just don't think it's realistic. Works good on non-resisting guys in a demo, but not a real attacker. If he had actually grabbed you and you peeled his hands off...well...maybe....and still - THAT'S a very outdated application in my opinion...

And I don't have a problem with the block per se, not how I would choose to do it, but to each their own. My problem was what happened AFTER the block, how it was expected that the arm was just going to stay there in space AND how someone could circle to the outside of the arm and bring it across your own body. You banged it away, and then you bring it across your body? Not even the WHY WOULD YOU REALLY DO THAT, but more specifically HOW COULD THAT EVEN HAPPEN? You mentioned that the block would cause pain, and I'm sure it would (Only provided that you are big enough in comparision to your opponent), but don't you think the arm would surely MOVE after struck with such painful force??

On another note, you are already on the inside, and had superior position...why risk it they way you did and go to the outside?? You are assuming he doesn't do anything with his other hand?? He just hangs out and waits??

Again, not being jerky...I am trying to discuss theory and application. I am not attacking or bashing. I just don't see these techniques working outside of the classroom against resisting opponents or people who have MA skills.

On the other hand, I'm not above learning something new, so maybe I could understand you better through this discussion.

Peace and Respect.

[HOKPAIWES]

LOL. Those kids(students?) in the background don't have the mass it will take to stop that big fellows strikes and chokes like you may think.

[ToraDojoNJ]

That was a joint locking seminar so the technique that followed was a hyper extension of the elbow. The block would stop the arm long enough for the transition, its not intended to bang his arm away.

But, more important you make a good point if you are already on the inside then just lay into the guy. Joint locking was the seminar's topic, but if you get to the inside start hitting.

NO, I DON'T THINK joint locking is the end all be all in martial arts...its but a portion of the whole arsenal. If the guy is resisting at any time he gets hit. If he switches up, I in turn switch up.

I don't think you being a jerk, if I could not explain the thoughts behind the techniques then I would not be much of a martial artist/instructor. YOU DON'T have to agree with the applications or the thoughts.

[Lama Pai Sifu]

Fair enough.

:):):)

[cjurakpt]

Sounds like it might be interesting.
One question. Will there be a skilled grappler/wrestler on hand to test these techniques?
One of the big problems I see is when stand up arts counter guys with no wrestling/grappling credentials.

thanks.

I think this is about the most salient post on the topic; I don't know if it wasn't ansered purposefully or as an oversight...

in other words, while it sounds like a good idea to teach soone how to get back up after being taken down by a skilled grappler, isn't it useful to have them practice that skill set against someone other than a partner who's there for the same reason they are, which is that they have no or limited ground game? otherwise, they will come away with an overly inflated sense of their capabilities: I mean, theoretically, whatever they learned, there really should be no way that it would work for them against a skilled grappler at this point anyway, because a skilled grappler is skilled at keeping people on the ground who are trying to get up! so even if the techniques shown were valid, the differential in skill would be the deciding factor in favor of the grappler, right? furthermore, when / where are they going to get the opportunity to develop the skills they have learned against someone skilled? unless they went and practiced at least 2x/week for a good period of time, anything learned, especially if inherently valid, would require a lot of practice against the specific type of opponent they are looking to wok off of...

[Tai-Lik]

Banditshaw wrote:


Will there be a skilled grappler/wrestler on hand to test these techniques?

Toradojonj wrote:


YES, I understand and its a valid point



Cjurakpt wrote:


isn't it useful to have them practice that skill set against someone other than a partner who's there for the same reason they are, which is that they have no or limited ground game? otherwise, they will come away with an overly inflated sense of their capabilities: I mean, theoretically, whatever they learned, there really should be no way that it would work for them against a skilled grappler at this point anyway, because a skilled grappler is skilled at keeping people on the ground who are trying to get up! so even if the techniques shown were valid, the differential in skill would be the deciding factor in favor of the grappler, right? furthermore, when / where are they going to get the opportunity to develop the skills they have learned against someone skilled? unless they went and practiced at least 2x/week for a good period of time, anything learned, especially if inherently valid, would require a lot of practice against the specific type of opponent they are looking to wok off of...



Toradojonj wrote:


Yes, no way in a single seminar will they get enough info or training to become good grapplers but this is to get them some exposure to newaza. Hopefully, to get them thinking outside of their norms and get them aware of how dangerous a grappler/jujutsu person can be. They can't fight a grappler's fight but they need some exposure to get them started, an informal seminar provides that.

:)

[banditshaw]

Yes, no way in a single seminar will they get enough info or training to become good grapplers but this is to get them some exposure to newaza. Hopefully, to get them thinking outside of their norms and get them aware of how dangerous a grappler/jujutsu person can be. They can't fight a grappler's fight but they need some exposure to get them started, an informal seminar provides that.

Thanks....sorry for the late reply.

Makes sense. Sounds like a good intro for people who haven't much experience against grapplers.
It gives people the option to explore grappling in depth and eventually crosstrain if they wanted to.