Please Ban This Guy

[Ultimatewingchun]

Something has to be done about Terence Niehoff, moderators.

It just doesn't seem right that one low life individual gets to hijack/ruin virtually every thread he posts on - which is just about every thread worth reading.

How can you let this go on for so long?

[LoneTiger108]

I'm concerned that it isn't just people like Terence. There has been some hostility toward myself from others also, who tend to like to throw stones from little glass houses...

[Ultimatewingchun]

Well here's something to consider, Lone Tiger...

Perhaps people are more prone to jump all over a newbie to the forum who posts some controversial stuff precisely because a guy like Terence has worn down their patience to the breaking point.

[LoneTiger108]

Perhaps people are more prone to jump all over a newbie to the forum who posts some controversial stuff precisely because a guy like Terence has worn down their patience to the breaking point.

Controversial stuff? Please enlighten me...

[sanjuro_ronin]

I have never been a fan of banning anyone unless they outright troll and add ZERO to a discussion or they commit slander, harrasement and such.

Terrence has his views and is entitled to them and to express them.
Wither he is closed minded and can't see past his own beliefs is irrelevant.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Controversial stuff? Please enlighten me...

Keep on topic please...

[Ultimatewingchun]

I don't think that would be productive, LT.

I'd rather not get into any debates with you at this time.

Right now I'd just like to focus on the issue of Terence Niehoff's hijacking of virtually every thread worth reading.

I'm almost at a point where I don't want to participate here anymore.

I'm just so sick of the guy and his crap.

I've called him out numerous times because of it - but he has no balls.

The only thing left is to complain to the moderators or to Gene Ching himself...

PLEASE BAN THIS GUY!

[YungChun]

It's a hard choice..

He has good points, if made over and over and over again. But he does troll as well... If only he could learn how to use some restraint and cut down on repeat posts, as well as how to stay on topic..

If he can't do any of these things then perhaps he should be relegated to a singular permanent topic like--"Why your WCK won't work"... This way he can post all he wants and those who want to debate with him can do so there.

[LoneTiger108]

I take it you've emailed Gene personally then, but still I don't think anything will happen.

As for ME changing the subject of the thread, well, okay I understand you here. Perhaps I will start another thread or you can pm me?

Good luck in the cause!:rolleyes:

[sanjuro_ronin]

I think you WC guys have enough "internal" problems to deal with, focusing on T is a wast of time.

[YungChun]

I think you WC guys have enough "internal" problems to deal with, focusing on T is a wast of time.
Well isn't T the one causing the focus of so many discussions to revert to himself, his views, his repeat posts and his crusade?

[Ultimatewingchun]

"I think you WC guys have enough "internal" problems to deal with, focusing on T is a waste of time." (sanjuro)


***But you see that's what the catch 22 is about with this guy.

It's virtually impossible not to focus upon him - precisely because he inserts himself and his I-want-the-notoriety-so-I'll hijack-everything-in-sight-with-the-same-old-dribble-that-I-repeat-all-the-time...

and then a whole bunch of people come on the given thread to refute him - and before you know, literally 2-3 pages of posts will appear that have nothing to do with the subject matter of the thread itself.

And calls for people to ignore/IGNORE him fall on deaf ears.

SOMETHING REALLY NEEDS TO BE DONE ABOUT THIS - it seems to me.

[AmanuJRY]

Sounds to me, Vic, like you're the one who can't ignore TN.....

a big hearty LOL! @ those who can't ignore an ignorant comment...I don't need a button, I don't need the person banned.....I just ignore stupid responses...period.:cool:

[Phil Redmond]

I have never been a fan of banning anyone unless they outright troll and add ZERO to a discussion or they commit slander, harrasement and such.

Terrence has his views and is entitled to them and to express them.
Wither he is closed minded and can't see past his own beliefs is irrelevant.
Well said,unless Terrence resorts to slander or harrasement he has the right of any person living in a Democratic society to his voice his opinions regardless of how unpopular they are. We all chose to be here so we have to deal with with all types of people.
Victor, the next time Terence makes a post you don't like remember this old saying. "It's better to keep your mouth closed and have people wonder if you're an idiot than to open your mouth and confirm that you are". ;)

[Ultimatewingchun]

I'm old school, Phil.

Guys like this just have to get their due, one way or the other.

Otherwise, it's time to move on.

I just don't want to start threads or even post on other people's threads anymore wherein this a55hole gets to ruin a perfectly good discussion.

Time-and-time again.

I'm so f u c k i n g sick of it.

In the old days a guy like this catches a beating and that's it. He either gets the clue about how to behave or he doesn't come back for fear of another beating worse than the first one.

Maybe it's me who should go.

I just don't want to put up with this s h i t anymore!

As I said, the guy has no balls - so he won't even back up his big, obnoxious mouth. He just runs, hides, or changes the subject - like a little girl!

Maybe it's just time to go.

I've been posting here 5+ years now.

Perhaps that's enough. It's just not worth the aggravation anymore.

[Phil Redmond]

I'm old school, Phil.

Guys like this just have to get their due, one way or the other.

Otherwise, it's time to move on.

I just don't want to start threads or even post on other people's threads anymore wherein this a55hole gets to ruin a perfectly good discussion.

Time-and-time again.

I'm so f u c k i n g sick of it.

In the old days a guy like this catches a beating and that's it. He either gets the clue about how to behave or he doesn't come back for fear of another beating worse than the first one.

Maybe it's me who should go.

I just don't want to put up with this s h i t anymore!

As I said, the guy has no balls - so he won't even back up his big, obnoxious mouth. He just runs, hides, or changes the subject - like a little girl!

Maybe it's just time to go.

I've been posting here 5+ years now.

Perhaps that's enough. It's just not worth the aggravation anymore.
That's why I stopped posting here for a while. Right now I'm at a full time school all day long. So between classes and my training I go to the office and get on the computer so I started posting again. It passes time until the next class.

[JGTevo]

I'm old school, Phil.

Guys like this just have to get their due, one way or the other.

Otherwise, it's time to move on.

I just don't want to start threads or even post on other people's threads anymore wherein this a55hole gets to ruin a perfectly good discussion.

Time-and-time again.

I'm so f u c k i n g sick of it.

In the old days a guy like this catches a beating and that's it. He either gets the clue about how to behave or he doesn't come back for fear of another beating worse than the first one.

Maybe it's me who should go.

I just don't want to put up with this s h i t anymore!

As I said, the guy has no balls - so he won't even back up his big, obnoxious mouth. He just runs, hides, or changes the subject - like a little girl!

Maybe it's just time to go.

I've been posting here 5+ years now.

Perhaps that's enough. It's just not worth the aggravation anymore.


:( :( :( Don't cry Keyboard Warrior, don't cry... :( :( :(

[nschmelzer]

I agree with Victor. It is one thing to allow open discussion and a democracy of ideas. But it is another thing to walk into crowded movie theatres and shout "fire." Even democracies restrain individuals that shout "fire" in crowded movie theatres when there is no fire. TN's rants and sermons are like shouting "fire" in a crowded theartre. The fact is TN would never say in person half the things he says on this forum. Forums enable those with strong opinions and less sense to make every thread a venue for their opinions. Personally, because of TN (and his constant infomercial interuptions into every thread), I will likely stop participating in this forum, and seek another (better moderated) forum (like www.hfy108.com) for my discussions.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Guys, its the internet and we all know what that means:

[JGTevo]

It's one thing for someone to walk into a movie theater and shout "Fire".

It's a whole different thing when people respond to it the second, third, fourth, fifth, sixth, times they do it.

Don't feed the trolls. If what they're saying bothers you so much, ignore it. If other people are responding to it, then it's promoting discussion - Eventually they'll learn to stop responding to that person, if they share the same complaint, and eventually that person will get bored and stop posting.

Voila.

There will always be people like that.

[Ultimatewingchun]

"Don't feed the trolls. If what they're saying bothers you so much, ignore it. If other people are responding to it, then it's promoting discussion - Eventually they'll learn to stop responding to that person, if they share the same complaint, and eventually that person will get bored and stop posting."


***GREAT THEORY. But it doesn't work in reality.

The "fire" analogy is more to the point - and more accurate.

The guy has to be stopped.

[JGTevo]

Except it does work in reality in every other forum I've ever been to, including my days of moderating the IGN.com forums, which are infinitely larger than these.

Ya know, even if it didn't and he kept posting his stuff, the more people disagree with it - and they will if it's simply "trolling" or not promoting discussion - more and more people would start ignoring him. Even if the occaisional person responded, the overwhelming majority would continue the discussion without him.

[sanjuro_ronin]

"Don't feed the trolls. If what they're saying bothers you so much, ignore it. If other people are responding to it, then it's promoting discussion - Eventually they'll learn to stop responding to that person, if they share the same complaint, and eventually that person will get bored and stop posting."


***GREAT THEORY. But it doesn't work in reality.

The "fire" analogy is more to the point - and more accurate.

The guy has to be stopped.

We can always send Ninjas, oh wait, they don't train alive, never mind.
:D

[Mr Punch]

I like his posts. Er, post.

He should maybe try another one once in a while though.

[Sihing73]

Hello,

Funny how things turn around eh ;) A while back I was accused of being too heavy handed by some. A general concensus showed that most people here felt that they were adult enough to post without heavy moderation. Now, we are back to someone who expresses an alternative viewpoint, albiet over and over again, who has upset others and now one person asking they be banned.

This is a public forum and as Phil has rightly pointed out, T has a right to post his views. If you do not agree with them then that is fine. However, at what point do we stop once censorship has begun? Consider that the ACLU has supported the right of the KKK to march, even though they may be diametricaly opposed in viewpoint. Once you begin censoring one person or groip you run the risk of censoring everyone with whom you do not agree.

You can not have it both ways; if you want the right to express your views then you have to accept the right of others to do the same.

As I have said before: THIS IS YOUR FORUM!! If enough people express a concern and do it properly then it will be addressed. I do find it interesting that rather than email or pm myself or Sandman or Gene, Vic opted to post a thread thus insuring that he obtained some exposure for his viewpoint. I also find it kind of amusing that Victor has once again threatened to leave or stop posting as he has done numerous times in the past.

Perahaps Victor, just as Terrence, is more in need of attention then he realizes. Both express their own viewpoints and seem to believe theri point of view is gospel. :rolleyes:

If the majority of people would like to have someone banned then they need to contact those who moderate this forum and express VALID reasons for such action. However, keep in mind that just because someone tends to tick you off or expresses another point of view which you do not agree with, this is not a sufficient reason to ban someone from this or any other PUBLIC forum.

As always, anyone wishing to discuss this matter further is more than welcome to contact me via email or PM.

Oh as to the fire analogy; this really does not apply as the main issue there is the potential for harm. Can anyone really say that posting on this or any other forum truly does anyone significant harm? Other than perhaps having our egos slapped.....

[chusauli]

Victor,

This is America, not China, not Sicily, or Italy. Its something I had to come to terms with years ago. I get a lot of crap on the internet - half truth stories, made up gossip and other nonsense, but I realize people don't really know me and are responding to this imaginary person on the internet, with inner reflections of their own imaginations.

Giving a beating to someone who has freedom of speech here is ridiculous and criminal. Someone might rant all they like on the internet, but if the factors of immediate threat, fear, aggression, intent and capability were in person, you'd have a major lawsuit on your hands. We're not teens anymore. Even as the 1st or 2nd generation here from the old world, we cannot act out old school in the USA. Parents can't even spank kids anymore!

If your ego is getting the best of you, better take the ego out. Things that happen are neither good or bad, they just happen. It is your mind that makes things "good" or "bad".

I'm not defending anyone, nor condoning anyone as right or wrong. Just trying to help everyone here.

Best regards,

[sanjuro_ronin]

Perahaps Victor, just as Terrence, is more in need of attention then he realizes. Both express their own viewpoints and seem to believe theri point of view is gospel.

We all crave attention, that's why we're here :D

I can understand Vic's frustration, hearing the same stuff over and over and over can be grating to say the least.

Truly i think that Victor would be happier with T on ignore, or at least find the humour in T's relentless attacks on all things TMA .

[YungChun]

Giving a beating to someone who has freedom of speech here is ridiculous and criminal. Someone might rant all they like on the internet, but if the factors of immediate threat, fear, aggression, intent and capability were in person, you'd have a major lawsuit on your hands. We're not teens anymore. Even as the 1st or 2nd generation here from the old world, we cannot act out old school in the USA.
Even in the USA there should be, such things as honor, integrity and general rules of conduct among reasonable people..

When fighters are involved and fighting is the subject, and one hands out insults left and right about other fighter's abilities you have to expect some reaction—is this appropriate behavior?

If folks are again and again accused of not having any real skill then it shouldn't be surprising when some of them offer to provide a personal demo to their accuser—not an assault, not an attack, a response to their accuser.

Perhaps extreme but not that surprising since in the end not everyone is equally skilled at shrugging off e-insults, nor should they really have to when/if reasonable adults are concerned.

[JPinAZ]

"Don't feed the trolls. If what they're saying bothers you so much, ignore it. If other people are responding to it, then it's promoting discussion - Eventually they'll learn to stop responding to that person, if they share the same complaint, and eventually that person will get bored and stop posting."


***GREAT THEORY. But it doesn't work in reality.

The "fire" analogy is more to the point - and more accurate.

The guy has to be stopped.

Actually, I have to disagree with you Victor. It probably would shut him up if he thought his words fell on deaf ears (eyes) and nobody responded. It's the attention that he craves, whatever way he can get it. If EVERYONE just ignored him, who would he have to talk to...

But I do agree, a good dose of 'reality' might do him a world of good too ;)
And not for the sake of satisfing one's own ego either, but everything here is just words. IMO, the only way to truely have a 'martial discussion' is with the hands, and maybe that's the best way to talk if words don't cut it.
Or, we just get over it an move on :)

[nschmelzer]

The moderator asked people to send him private messages regarding whether they wanted Terence moderated. I sent him one, here is what I said:

***

Terence is using every thread on this forum to express his opinions. I do not have a problem with his opinion. I do not have a problem with him expressing his opinion. But when he interjects his opinion into every single thread - it becomes a problem and prevents meaningful discussions. Terence is clever - so he says just enough to incite a response - but not enough to really get banned as a troll. You need to moderate Terence - or you will lose your experienced members to competing forums. Just my opinion.

***

The moderator responded that he would not moderate Terence, and he did not care whether members of this forum went to other forums.

Therefore, I recommend we change this thread to sharing of alternative forums. Here are some that I like - and that are moderated:

www.hfy108.com
www.wingchunfightclub.com

[Sihing73]

The moderator responded that he would not moderate Terence, and he did not care whether members of this forum went to other forums.

Therefore, I recommend we change this thread to sharing of alternative forums. Here are some that I like - and that are moderated:

www.hfy108.com
www.wingchunfightclub.com

Hello,

First of all it is inappropriate to repost PM's on the forum without the consent of both parties.

Secondly, I would appreciate it if you had posted my reply accurately. The gist of what I said was that I had edited posts of T in the past when brought to my attention and when the content was inappropriate and would continue to do so. I further stated that as long as T, or anyone else did not cross the boundaries with the content of their posts, that they would not be "moderated",

As to whether people people here went to ther forums my response was that everyone was free to post anywhere they wished and that neither myself nor this forum was in competition with any other forum.

Either of us would be able to post the ENTIRE content of the PM so please be sure to post accurately as to what is said. Seems to me that you wish to try to stir up trouble and not reflect accurately what is said. In this you would be little different than T. :rolleyes:

The entire content of my reply was as follows (since it was my reply I guess it is okay for me to post it :) : Perhaps you can explain the error of my response or where I indicate I do not care about members leaving this forum???
{Re: Terence

Hello Nick,

While I can appreciate your views, unless terrence steps over the line I can not "moderate" him. I have gone in and deleted or edited several of his posts when brought to my attention. Other than that, there is really no "fair" way to address this issue. As to the possibility of losing members to competing forums, I, and this forum, are not in competition with anyone else so all are free to post anywhere they wish.

Peace,

Dave}

[cjurakpt]

I think that the debate here is one of freedom of expression versus proper decorum, both of which can be highly relative, and ultimatley should not necessarilly be majority driven (well, at least not the first); while I think that banning someone for excessively belaboring their contrarian perspective is not the answer, at the same time it appears that there is some general consensus that Terrance is at the very least inadvertently alienating a respectible amount of his "consitutancy"; now, if he really is a troll, then probably his habit won't change; on the other hand, if he is at least a somewhat reasonable person who just has a large axe to grind, then the appropriate thing to do is take to take heed and modulate himself to the point where he can get his point across without it becoing quasi-troll-like;

just remember though: at one point Gurdjieff was approached by several members of his community, who complained bitterly about one guy in particular who was in general disagreeable, shirked his communal duties, and created general agita all around - they basically told Gurdjieff that this guy just had to go because he was disrupting the placid harmony of the community desired by all the other members; after listening to their harangue, Gurdjief said to them, "don't you guys get it? I was the one who put him here and told him to act this way; it's for all of your benefit that he is doing this..." :eek::eek::eek:

[sanjuro_ronin]

This all seems like an e-***** issue to me.
In which case there is only one thing left to do:

[t_niehoff]

Some of you guys are hilarious!

You don't see me saying "ban Victor" or "don't listen to Victor" or telling Victor to STFU or etc. I'm not trying to censor what people hear or what they think because I am not threatened by his views. I want people to hear his views. Not that they are particularly interesting -- and certainly not because they are sound -- but because they represent the standard, the typical, the establishment in WCK. And Victor, being a part of that establishment -- one which is authoratative in nature -- doesn't like his views being challenged. He doesn't like being criticized, being asked for evidence and reasons to support his views, having the flaws in his arguments pointed out, and so forth. You don't do that to sifus! ;) But as I said, I don't mind Victor giving his views, and I want him to give his views, because that is the only way they can be examined, discussed, criticized, etc. And in that way, they can be seen for what they really are and how valid they really are.

And, no one is holding a gun to Victor's head to force him to discuss anything, with me or anyone. If he doesn't want to respond to me, then don't.

On another note, one complaint I hear again and again (LOL!) is that I am being repetitious in my posts. Well, that's for the simple reason that many. many things in WCK turn on the same few things. And, from my perspective, I see those things that almost everyone here talks about as being repetitive too, just variations on the same theme. You guys don't see it as repetetive since you believe the variations
represent "differences". From my perspective, they don't -- it's just more of the same. And that same gets the same sort of response from me. What's really interesting to me is how the same persons who accuses me of being repetitious will then go on to completely misrepresent my views! For example, "you say such-and-such" when I've never said such-and-such. I wonder how it is they know I keep sayign the same thigns when they don't even seem to know what I'm saying.

[Ultimatewingchun]

Moderator that won't moderate.


The moderator asked people to send him private messages regarding whether they wanted Terence moderated. I sent him one, here is what I said:

***

Terence is using every thread on this forum to express his opinions. I do not have a problem with his opinion. I do not have a problem with him expressing his opinion. But when he interjects his opinion into every single thread - it becomes a problem and prevents meaningful discussions. Terence is clever - so he says just enough to incite a response - but not enough to really get banned as a troll. You need to moderate Terence - or you will lose your experienced members to competing forums. Just my opinion.

***

The moderator responded that he would not moderate Terence, and he did not care whether members of this forum went to other forums.

Therefore, I recommend we change this thread to sharing of alternative forums. Here are some that I like - and that are moderated:

www.hfy108.com
www.wingchunfightclub.com



***THANKS FOR SHARING ALL OF THAT, my friend...

And it saves me the trouble of having to explain in depth once again the real meaning behind Dave/Sihing 73's remarks somehow putting me and Terence on the same level: "Oh, they're both in need of some enlightenment." (Or something to that effect).

Bull.

Dave has his own agenda - hence the righteous position he takes while hiding behind the "I've gotta be fair to everybody" fig leaf. And his position is that he doesn't like many of the opinions I've expressed through the years on a number of issues regarding certain inadequacies within wing chun and it's training methods/crosstraining/sparring, etc.

But keep in mind the all-important word in that sentence...MANY.

With Terence it's ONE opinion expressed over-and-over again. Ad nauseum. And used to hi-jack every thread in sight.

AND WHAT'S INAPPROPRIATE, DAVE, IS YOU DENYING THE FACTS!

SO I'M OUTTA HERE.

I've had enough of wasting my time.

If anyone wants to stay in contact - you can reach me at:

wingchun@usa.com

[KimWingChun]

Seriously Victor, take control of your emotions and stop letting T bother you.
I mean what the he** is up with you??? You're twice my age and I don't let people get to me like that just because of their views! And you seem to be the only one on a personal crusade against him and over and over again try to sway the masses to team up on him, it's just ridiculous. Just ignore him! And let others make up their own minds. Please.

Sincerely,
Kim Elman

[donbdc]

You guys are funny,
What do you honestly expect from an attorney? Obnoxious, opnionated and he likes confrontation. It's his nature! His logic is circular but I have enjoyed my chats w/ him at times he has been helpful. But banning is wrong. Just ignore him, eat the meat and spit out the bones.
Don

[Sihing73]

But keep in mind the all-important word in that sentence...MANY.

With Terence it's ONE opinion expressed over-and-over again. Ad nauseum.

SO I'M OUTTA HERE.

I've had enough of wasting my time.

If anyone wants to stay in contact - you can reach me at:

wingchun@usa.com


Wow,

So I have my own agenda because Victor and I do not agree on everything. Despite whether or not I agree with Victor or not I have always supported his, and others, right to post their opinions. But I am not surrised by this post, seems unlikely that we will ever agree on everything. I even remember once when I was going to visit NYC I asked about visiting Victors school but at the time of my visit he was unavailable, now if I wanted to I could allude to something there, but I am sure that he just was not going to be around during my visit ;) However, I have visited with others, including Phil, and seems like my hidden agenda was not that big a deal to those others. Oh well, maybe I have everyone fooled after all :D

In any event to make my position clear: If someone posts something which is annapropriate and it is brought to my attention, and I agree, then that post will be edited or deleted. This goes for anyone, however, someone posting something which does not agree with anothers viewpoint or offends that person on a level of ego, is not likely to be moderated. If I truly had my own agenda then rest assured there would be many deleted or edited posts on this forum, that way I could use it as a platform to express my own views and put everyone else down........but wait a minute some seem to think that is what I am doing anyhow :p

In any event I am sure we will see Victor posting here again, I've lost track of the number of times he has left vowing never to return. Besides, I do think that Victor brings some value to the table even if it my not be my favorite dish.

[nschmelzer]

Hello,

First of all it is inappropriate to repost PM's on the forum without the consent of both parties.

Secondly, I would appreciate it if you had posted my reply accurately. The gist of what I said was that I had edited posts of T in the past when brought to my attention and when the content was inappropriate and would continue to do so. I further stated that as long as T, or anyone else did not cross the boundaries with the content of their posts, that they would not be "moderated",

As to whether people people here went to ther forums my response was that everyone was free to post anywhere they wished and that neither myself nor this forum was in competition with any other forum.

Either of us would be able to post the ENTIRE content of the PM so please be sure to post accurately as to what is said. Seems to me that you wish to try to stir up trouble and not reflect accurately what is said. In this you would be little different than T. :rolleyes:

The entire content of my reply was as follows (since it was my reply I guess it is okay for me to post it :) : Perhaps you can explain the error of my response or where I indicate I do not care about members leaving this forum???
{Re: Terence

Hello Nick,

While I can appreciate your views, unless terrence steps over the line I can not "moderate" him. I have gone in and deleted or edited several of his posts when brought to my attention. Other than that, there is really no "fair" way to address this issue. As to the possibility of losing members to competing forums, I, and this forum, are not in competition with anyone else so all are free to post anywhere they wish.

Peace,

Dave}

Dave -

First of all, I only posted my part of the PM. Nothing inappropriate about that. Funny how you are all over moderating me posting what I said to you privately. I should be able to waive my own privacy. It is inappropriate for me to waive your privacy - that is why I did not post your private reply verbatim.


Second, you publically asked for private message from people who wanted Terence moderated. You should have added (publically) that you had no intention of moderating Terence.


Anyway, your notion of "fairness" is really distorted. What about fairness to the majority that have to suffer through Terence's sermons in every thread? If you cared about members leaving, you would moderate.

You can keep Terence. I am not going to bicker with you. We are all turning into Terences. Terence wins. Terence gets his venue. Dave - you get your "fairness" - but at the cost of having a quality forum. I am moving on. No hard feelings. Have fun mates.

[Sihing73]

Dave -

First of all, I only posted my part of the PM. Nothing inappropriate about that. Funny how you are all over moderating me posting what I said to you privately. I should be able to waive my own privacy. It is inappropriate for me to waive your privacy - that is why I did not post your private reply verbatim.


Second, you publically asked for private message from people who wanted Terence moderated. You should have added (publically) that you had no intention of moderating Terence.


Anyway, your notion of "fairness" is really distorted. What about fairness to the majority that have to suffer through Terence's sermons in every thread? If you cared about members leaving, you would moderate.

You can keep Terence. I am not going to bicker with you. We are all turning into Terences. Terence wins. Terence gets his venue. Dave - you get your "fairness" - but at the cost of having a quality forum. I am moving on. No hard feelings. Have fun mates.

Hello Nick,

You made a statement that was biased in trying to say that I had said Terrence would not be moderated. Your not accurately posting my response was innapropriate. You also did not respond to my PM to express any further concerns.

As to fairness what exactly woudl YOU consider fair? Ban Terrence because that is what you and some others may want? So what happens to the next guy who gets on your wrong side? As to majority rule, what majority is it that wishes to have Terrence banned? Seems like there are those who say let him be so who has the majority?

Moderation is not an easy task and will never please everyone. However, censorship will also never please everyone. If you honestly believe that your vision of fairness is the right one then by all means stand by your belief. However, keep in mind that ones mans trash is another mans treasure.

[sleestack33]

If Terence was banned this forum would be B-O-R-I-N-G!!!

[sanjuro_ronin]

Can't we all just get along?

[anerlich]

The ignore list is there for a purpose.

You have to sign on before it kicks in, though.

[osprey3883]

Even in the USA there should be, such things as honor, integrity and general rules of conduct among reasonable people..

When fighters are involved and fighting is the subject, and one hands out insults left and right about other fighter's abilities you have to expect some reaction—is this appropriate behavior?

If folks are again and again accused of not having any real skill then it shouldn't be surprising when some of them offer to provide a personal demo to their accuser—not an assault, not an attack, a response to their accuser.


Well put Jim.
If we were debating each other about a sport or a game eventually you would expect to see some show of skill to answer the debate.
When you fight someone there is often a shared respect afterward, even if you still disagree.
The thing that IMO sucks about the internet is that there is no accountability for the energy people put out.

Matt

[donbdc]

What did martial artist do before the internet? Oh yeah, train!

[sanjuro_ronin]

What did martial artist do before the internet? Oh yeah, train!

Not according to T :D

[donbdc]

That was good. I personally think T trains hard. He just likes to argue. It goes w/ his job. It's ok to challenge people intellectually. If you disagree tell him and then ignore him. He does this stuff for a living. He wont quit until a judge tells him to.

[t_niehoff]

That was good. I personally think T trains hard. He just likes to argue. It goes w/ his job. It's ok to challenge people intellectually. If you disagree tell him and then ignore him. He does this stuff for a living. He wont quit until a judge tells him to.

If you ever make it back to St. Louis for any reason, you're always welcome to come and see what we do, how we train, etc. And I mean that in a friendly way. :)

[donbdc]

I want to go back. It's been since 1988 when I was training w/ Robert McFiield. There is a lot I want to see. I still can't grasp where your metro runs.
I hope to train w/ you. You are more than welcome to train w/ us in the DC area. I'd thinked you'd be suprised at the depth of CRCA wing chun. The ground and pound stuff that Randy came up w/ 20 years agohas evolved quite a bit.
Take care
Don

[sanjuro_ronin]

Randy Williams ?

[anerlich]

I personally think T trains hard.

I don't see how he could find the time and still continue his mission on KFO.

[anerlich]

belaboring their contrarian perspective

It isn't a contrarian perspective. It's highly derivative. If it were more complex, original and varied it might be interesting. But no.

[Tom Kagan]

What did martial artist do before the internet? Oh yeah, train!

I post between rounds and sets.