Master Jerry Cook

[tattooedmonk]

Anyone have any opinions on this guy?

[Mas Judt]

Yes.

Bought a VHS in San Jose - 'Jerry Cook - Fukien White Crane'

What I got was an awful version of Hung Gar's Tiger & crane set, devoid of any of the Hung Ga 'flavor.' i.e. body methods and power.

If this is representative of what he teaches, it is best to be avoided.

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

Decide for yourself.

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Jerry+Cook&search=Search

[Jeffoo]

I met him in Phoenix a few years ago when I was with some members of the Beijing Wushu Team. His lineage wasn't that deep and many of his Hung Gar logos were some American name..like Smith Family Style Hung Gar or something. He's kind of close to Li Jingheng, so he likely has some contemporary training.

Skill wise he's not bad and is definitely a forms collector and freely admits it.

I have about a 6 hour video he gave me and his teaching methods aren't half bad.

I'm still a bit undecided about him, but then again I am big on lineage.

[Tiet Sow]

My brother (of the same mother) trained under him in AZ---I've seen my brother perform "forms" that looked pretty good-----Looked like alot of Fu Jow

[Jerry Cook]

I can see how you think it was Hungar. It is from the Hung family. It's not all powerful low stances, but contains the five elements and the five animals for use in Chinese medicine as the creator Wong Feihung was a traditional chinese medicine doctor. The exercises correlate to a yin and yang organs. If you look at youtube, it will give you the names, the exercises, the organs, and it's a treasure of Chinese kungfu that I wanted to share with my martial art brothers. I think traditional Hungar people may appreciate this variation. I collect 108 technique forms from Shaolin/Wudang styles, and this is one of them.

I'll post the applications and combat methods later.

Regards -- Jerry Cook

[David Jamieson]

I've seen stuff way worse than this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MqxDbwiKGik

right here in this forum.

I've seen worse stuff coming out of mainland china and hong kong too.

but, if you're a lineage tart and everything HAS to be Chinese to be real, then, well, whatever floats your boat I guess.

[Ben Gash]

I wouldn't describe myself as a complete lineage *****, but I'd rather not pay someone for something they learned from a book, which that 2 man sword routine obviously was (hint: the blades aren't supposed to touch).

[sanjuro_ronin]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ZiRZtEZYS0&feature=related

I don't know much about chinese sword work, but his Japanese sword work is utter crap, according to this video clip anyways.

First off, you always hold the Tsuba, always, Second the sword is loose inside the scabbard to faciliate the Batto technique ( simultaneous draw and cut) of the sword, no sword was ever "tight" in the scabbard.
The "chinna" moves he did to protect the sword were impractical and that is being kind.
The rest was just painful, plain painful.

[Lucas]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ZiRZtEZYS0&feature=related

I don't know much about chinese sword work, but his Japanese sword work is utter crap, according to this video clip anyways.

First off, you always hold the Tsuba, always, Second the sword is loose inside the scabbard to faciliate the Batto technique ( simultaneous draw and cut) of the sword, no sword was ever "tight" in the scabbard.
The "chinna" moves he did to protect the sword were impractical and that is being kind.
The rest was just painful, plain painful.

wait i didnt see the vid. but are you telling me he had his saya fit to the exact size of his blade.....i guess he never heard of iaido...:rolleyes:


oh btw SJ, im upset with you on your work on that thread.

read my reply here :mad: http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=49792&page=3

[sanjuro_ronin]

wait i didnt see the vid. but are you telling me he had his saya fit to the exact size of his blade.....i guess he never heard of iaido...:rolleyes:


oh btw SJ, im upset with you on your work on that thread.

read my reply here :mad: http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=49792&page=3

I have no idea what he did in regards to the saya, by the looks on the video he has that oversized "Musashi" Katana so I woudl assume its a "production line" Saya.

Dude, that sickness thread is warped.

[Mas Judt]

I can see how you think it was Hungar. It is from the Hung family. It's not all powerful low stances, but contains the five elements and the five animals for use in Chinese medicine as the creator Wong Feihung was a traditional chinese medicine doctor. The exercises correlate to a yin and yang organs. If you look at youtube, it will give you the names, the exercises, the organs, and it's a treasure of Chinese kungfu that I wanted to share with my martial art brothers. I think traditional Hungar people may appreciate this variation. I collect 108 technique forms from Shaolin/Wudang styles, and this is one of them.

I'll post the applications and combat methods later.

Regards -- Jerry Cook

Well, it wasn't Fukien White Crane - that is for certain (speaking about the tape I purchased.) And the gross choreography closely matched the hunga Fu kok. I can't speak to anything else - other than it resembled how the kenpo guys do that stuff.

Actually, I'd like a refund. It was kind of a bait and switch.

[Lama Pai Sifu]

I didn't like the youtube clips I saw. Let's just leave it at that.

[jow yeroc]

I only watched a couple clips. What i saw i didn't think was that bad. I agree
with Jamieson, it was better than alot of stuff i see i posted by others. I only
watched the 5 animal/5 element clip and the 4 swords demonstration. I thought
his gim work was decent. Just my opinion.

[tattooedmonk]

I am big on lineage. Why is this so important? I understand the basic reasons why, there must be more to it.
Just because someone comes form a strong lineage does not mean anything when it comes to teaching, practicing and using the arts.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Why is this so important? I understand the basic reasons why, there must be more to it.
Just because someone comes form a strong lineage does not mean anything when it comes to teaching, practicing and using the arts.

Lineage matters when you are making lienage based claims, other than that, its pointless and it tends to be used by people who's ability can't speak of itself.

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

Lineage shows weather or not you have the "Potential" to know what you are doing.

If you come from a bad lineage, then you don't have a source for the good stuff.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Lineage shows weather or not you have the "Potential" to know what you are doing.

If you come from a bad lineage, then you don't have a source for the good stuff.

One of the many problems of TCMA.

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

It's not limited to TCMA, it's everything.

If you have a BJJ guy who sucks or is mediocre, and he opens a school, he will be founding a substandard lineage. Everyone will know that by his schools competition record. The guys who are looking for a really good BJJ school will know to avoid it based on reputation....which is what lineage is, it's the reputation of the line.

You know that someone from that substandard BJJ lineage would not be good to study under because they don't have the goods. Someone who trained directly under Gracie himself would be better.

[sanjuro_ronin]

It's not limited to TCMA, it's everything.

If you have a BJJ guy who sucks or is mediocre, and he opens a school, he will be founding a substandard lineage. Everyone will know that by his schools competition record. The guys who are looking for a really good BJJ school will know to avoid it based on reputation....which is what lineage is, it's the reputation of the line.

You know that someone from that substandard BJJ lineage would not be good to study under because they don't have the goods. Someone who trained directly under Gracie himself would be better.

Skill is skill, period.

[Black Jack II]

One of the many problems of TCMA

No doubt man. No doubt.

[sanjuro_ronin]

No doubt man. No doubt.

In kyokushin I have fought and taken guys out that trained under 1st generation Oyama teachers and I trained under a 3rd generation one.

In terms of judo, even further down.

I have always offered the same linegae test to anyone that asks me :
Step onto the mat.

[monji112000]

It's not limited to TCMA, it's everything.

If you have a BJJ guy who sucks or is mediocre, and he opens a school, he will be founding a substandard lineage. Everyone will know that by his schools competition record. The guys who are looking for a really good BJJ school will know to avoid it based on reputation....which is what lineage is, it's the reputation of the line.

You know that someone from that substandard BJJ lineage would not be good to study under because they don't have the goods. Someone who trained directly under Gracie himself would be better.

honestly thats pure propaganda. Its something the Gracies try to tell people.. but its simply not true. They wish it were true. I been to a few "gracie" schools. I don't train at a place with a well known lineage. were I put my money shows what I think of the quality. People looking for a name, judge a gym or a teacher by his/her lineage.
With todays technology, and transportation lineage means nothing. This is the information age...

[MasterKiller]

honestly thats pure propaganda. Its something the Gracies try to tell people.. but its simply not true. They wish it were true. I been to a few "gracie" schools. I don't train at a place with a well known lineage. were I put my money shows what I think of the quality. People looking for a name, judge a gym or a teacher by his/her lineage.
With todays technology, and transportation lineage means nothing. This is the information age...

No, this is true, for the most part. Check out all the 'fake fighter' threads on MMA.tv.

Anyone claiming a BJJ lineage and rank better be able to back it up.

Now, you can be a great submission wrestler without BJJ, but that isn't what RD is talking about.

[sanjuro_ronin]

No, this is true, for the most part. Check out all the 'fake fighter' threads on MMA.tv.

Anyone claiming a BJJ lineage and rank better be able to back it up.

Now, you can be a great submission wrestler without BJJ, but that isn't what RD is talking about.

And are these "fake fighters" any good?
And does a "gracie lineage" guarantee a superiour fighter? or is there some secret uber deadly technique taught only to GJJ people ?

[MasterKiller]

And are these "fake fighters" any good? Not usually.

And does a "gracie lineage" guarantee a superiour fighter? No. But you can hedge your bets if someone has a purple, they know what they are doing.

or is there some secret uber deadly technique taught only to GJJ people ? No.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Not usually.
No. But you can hedge your bets if someone has a purple, they know what they are doing.
No.

Which are the issues the tend to permiate TCMA linage "wars".

[RD'S Alias - 1A]

And does a "gracie lineage" guarantee a superiour fighter? or is there some secret uber deadly technique taught only to GJJ people ?

Reply]
It's not about the lineage's guarantee, but thier reputation. If lineage "A" has a reputation for putting out top fighters, and Lineage "B" has a reputation for catering to the mainstream soccer Mom's, which lineage would a real fighter look for?

[Ben Gash]

SR, you're kindof not understanding what TCMA lineage is about. Teachers from a higher generation are respected for their age and experience, they are not deemed to be automatically more badass, and there's nothing wrong with training with a lower generation Sifu (this might be an issue more in Wing Chun circles, but they've got such a mass of political BS going on it's not even funny). The point is that there's a solid and verifiable link to the source. Bad lineage isn't a political or heirarchical thing, it's a QC issue.
The equivalent would be someone who'd wrestled a bit in high school, did 3 months at a Gracie barra school and done a couple of Eddie Bravo seminars setting up a school and proclaiming himself to be a black belt under Carlson Gracie, now that sounds proposterous, but you see this sh*t ALL the time in Kung Fu.

[monji112000]

No, this is true, for the most part. Check out all the 'fake fighter' threads on MMA.tv.

Anyone claiming a BJJ lineage and rank better be able to back it up.

Now, you can be a great submission wrestler without BJJ, but that isn't what RD is talking about.

sure you better not lie about who you train with. BUT, training under a "gracie" doesn't mean anything. I can train under a nobody, and still be pretty **** good.
JMO

[Black Jack II]

People use the word lineage to showcase off some sort of absurd purity when in the actual world, most if not all of these so-called pure styles are "broken mirror" systems.

Some think they can establish fighting credibility by claiming a specific lineage, to inherit some of their teachers reputation, whatever the hell fighting credibility even means in the non-larping, nine to five real world outside of the kwoon.

I wonder if people really think that the group of muggers or the college serial rapist actually gives a crap that some so-called great master actually beget's other great masters, and that this is some clear elucidation of their victims survival.

It's not about purity, its about skill progression and commonsense, seek out and learn from those that do it best, and yes often direct access is the best way, but only if you are honest about what you are really after.

[lkfmdc]

The idea of lineage is attached to the idea of standards. In theory, if you trained with a good teacher you learned good stuff and he held you to a high standard.

If you have a purple belt from a legit BJJ instructor, chances are you've got skills. Though, like all other things, this is beginning to change..... In fact, it used to be that "blue belt" was like an old "black belt", ie that you had done about 2 plus years and had the basics down and were proficient. Now, there are a lot of "schemes" that mean blue belt is often less than it was in the past.

Ultimately, it is the person. Or, as Royce Gracie says, the belt only covers 2 inches of your butt, you've got to cover the rest

[sanjuro_ronin]

The idea of lineage is attached to the idea of standards. In theory, if you trained with a good teacher you learned good stuff and he held you to a high standard.

If you have a purple belt from a legit BJJ instructor, chances are you've got skills. Though, like all other things, this is beginning to change..... In fact, it used to be that "blue belt" was like an old "black belt", ie that you had done about 2 plus years and had the basics down and were proficient. Now, there are a lot of "schemes" that mean blue belt is often less than it was in the past.

Ultimately, it is the person. Or, as Royce Gracie says, the belt only covers 2 inches of your butt, you've got to cover the rest

When I trained MMA with Fabiano, I did because he was the highest ranked BJJ guy in the area AND he and his bro kicked my sorry ass.
If they hadn't I wouldn't have trained there.
His lineage and even his belt were the reason I checked him out, yes, but it was his skill that convinced me.
We never once mentioned his lineage nor did they ever bring it up either.

[Golden Spider]

Based on what I've seen, I'll cast my vote against Master Cook.

But, if you're just starting out, and don't know much, you have to get started somewhere...

[Black Jack II]

All I know is, never hire a deranged burmese hooker to perform analingus on a out of shape shaolin monk.

A simple action of flatulation from one trained in the qi qong arts can turn into something else all together and it is a pain in the a$$ to hide a corpse in a K-Mart parking lot.

[sanjuro_ronin]

All I know is, never hire a deranged burmese hooker to perform analingus on a out of shape shaolin monk.

A simple action of flatulation from one trained in the qi qong arts can turn into something else all together and it is a pain in the a$$ to hide a corpse in a K-Mart parking lot.

You sir, have made me speechless.

[Golden Spider]

I just noticed that Maestro Cook has disabled comments and ratings for his YouTube videos. ~Tough luck.

[David Jamieson]

meh.

people are judgmental.

9 of 10 of those judgments are to the negative.

[Mas Judt]

Every martial artist gets sh!t on at some point on youtube. You can't blame him regardless of what you might think of what he teaches. He put himself out there, and he does not completely s@ck, so bully for him. I know guys who like him and say he is an honest guy and good for them.

Me, I just want my money back because the tape was sold as Fukien White Crane and it wasn't. :D

[marknthedark]

I can see how you think it was Hungar. It is from the Hung family. It's not all powerful low stances, but contains the five elements and the five animals for use in Chinese medicine as the creator Wong Feihung was a traditional chinese medicine doctor. The exercises correlate to a yin and yang organs. If you look at youtube, it will give you the names, the exercises, the organs, and it's a treasure of Chinese kungfu that I wanted to share with my martial art brothers. I think traditional Hungar people may appreciate this variation. I collect 108 technique forms from Shaolin/Wudang styles, and this is one of them.

I'll post the applications and combat methods later.

Regards -- Jerry Cook

I have known Jerry since 1994.I met him at the sacred mountain training in Flagstaff Arizona.I learned more from him in those 5 days than any other seminar i had been to.I have been studying since 1979.I started in the army with tai kwon do for 18 mo.Transferd to germany,met a chinese kickboxer named Michael Bimboe,studied with him for 12 mo.Went back to states,studied bagua&tai chi.in1989. I met David Simeone in1993,and absolutely loved what he had to teach.I was able to learn five animal fist wa lum style,shaolin fighting forms.But through all of this the one thing sticks in my mind is that a true martial artists would never have to fight,because he or she would never let the situation happen and if forced he or she would defend the weak and over come adversity.Jerry Cook is a MARTIAL ARTISTS.I have never seen his tapes, but knowing him and seeing him in action ten years ago was a great experiance.His knowlege of shaolin and wu dang is more extensive than most people can imagine