Lau Gar anyone?

[brainwars]

How do people ! only just joined this website just poking around to see if there are any Lau Gar practioners here. Also wanted to find out the general feeling towards Lau Gar. Peace!!!

[B-Rad]

Which Lau Gar you talking about? I like the Lau Gar I've seen from China. Looks very strong and energetic. Haven't seen the other Lau Gar (which is popular in Brittan, I think).

[brainwars]

Thanks for the reply. The Lau Gar i refer to is the style being taught in britain but to be honest i thought it was the same. Do you know where i can find footage of the chinese Lau Gar sounds good.

[banditshaw]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2EuCH1AKV6s

Guandong Lau Gar

Five Animals set.

[DaveTart]

I'm a UK lau gar guy... where abouts/with whom do you train?

[brainwars]

I am doing my training in north wales. are you any where close? Maybe we should have a fight !:D lol peace!

[B-Rad]

Another Lau Gar vid (about .55 in)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgLITXrsjN0

[B-Rad]

Is there any good footage of the UK Lau Gar? I've never seen it before :)

[brainwars]

Is there any good footage of the UK Lau Gar? I've never seen it before :)

There are plenty of examples on youtube (not Lau Gar Kuen) , but; (in my own opinion) there are non that really do the style justice.
i can paste a few links to different uk Lau Gar sites so you can indulge in the art:D, these sites can draw you a more informed picture than i.

http://www.veiramartialarts.co.uk/
Here is one with a little background story and a little footage, but there are lots of sites, too many to choose.

[B-Rad]

Cool, thanks :-)

BTW, anyone know the name of that Lau Gar teacher in China or have a general history of their system?

[B-Rad]

Just read that the main Lau Gar teacher in mainland China is Xiao Yong Ding (Siu Wing Ding) from somewhere in Guangdong province.

And one thing about the UK website


To this day it is impossible to find a teacher in China who teaches only Lau Gar. The sets of Lau Gar were incorporated long ago into the Hung Gar syllabus and it is here one has to look, to find a Chinese Master of Lau Gar.

The Lau Gar in Hung Gar is not related to the Lau Gar system. Acording to the Hung Gar people, it's a form from Mok Gar that was introduced by a student of Lam Sai Wing who happened to be named Lau (and the Lau Ga staff form was from a southern mantis guy also named Lau, according to wikipedia). And there's also the current Lau family Hung Gar family which is pretty famous. ? for Hung Gar guys: Are they related to Lam Sai Wing's student, or are they yet another Lau family that's become involved in Hung Gar's development? It's easy to see how people can get confused about Lau Gar, lol.

[B-Rad]

The wikipedia entry:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lau_Gar

From a discussion I read on another forum there was some question/confusion as to whether the UK Lau Gar actually came from the famous Chinese Lau Gar, or something else.

[brainwars]

Cheers for the link! there are some interesting points in there, the best being that Master Jeremy Yau IS the head of Lau Gar Kuen as i thought it was a completely different style to the Lau Gar i am learning. I feel like a bit of a tit now but cheers for not pointing that out:D. If you know of any other sources that can give me correct info:rolleyes:,it would be much appreciated.

[Su Lin]

Is there any good footage of the UK Lau Gar? I've never seen it before :)

In general the answer is "no".There is really bad UK Lau Gar on the web.

[Su Lin]

And I do Lau Gar (but not BKFA) , just started MMA too though :D Are you training? If so who under? I'm presuming it will be Brian Nelson if you are north wales?

[Laukarbo]

The Lau family from the hung gar side comes from Lam Sai Wing ...

[Su Lin]

Yes, I think he is referring to Lau Gar in the UK, which,from various peices of research appears to bear little similarity to the Lau Family Hung Gar or the Lau Gar Hung Gar form.

I may be entirely wrong though :)

[Su Lin]

there are some threads over here and on Martial Arts Planet about Lau Gar and its history but I'm tired of discussing/arguing about its dodgy origins these days. :D

[PM]

more info on Lau ga kyun at http://www.hungkyun.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=233

[brainwars]

there are some threads over here and on Martial Arts Planet about Lau Gar and its history but I'm tired of discussing/arguing about its dodgy origins these days. :D

You have a good point. I have been trying to learn more about the style but there are so many contradicting storys about i never know if the info i am getting is right. apart from that which comes from the sifu ofcourse. And as it seems that the chinese Lau Gar is a different style again, its up to us uk Lau Gar people to learn the history so we can put the world straight:) and i need to learn alot:D

[Su Lin]

I know the feeling! Where you based if you don't mind me asking? To be honest,I got so fed up with all the arguing and bickering about lineage I just put my head down and concentrated on trianing. However,my classes are virtually non existent at the moment,so I'm back to being a keyboard warrior :D

[brainwars]

I am going to classes in wrexham and also oswestry held by Brian Nelson, but i would love to do more.
Are you still able to train without going to classes? I find it hard without someone pushing me.

[DaveTart]

You have a good point. I have been trying to learn more about the style but there are so many contradicting storys about i never know if the info i am getting is right. apart from that which comes from the sifu ofcourse. And as it seems that the chinese Lau Gar is a different style again, its up to us uk Lau Gar people to learn the history so we can put the world straight:) and i need to learn alot:D

Short History Lesson:
Jeremy Yau started teaching in the 70's, before that Lau Gar was unknown in the UK (or pretty much anywhere for that matter).
The BKFA state:
"Lau Gar Kuen is derived from a form of boxing practiced at Kuei Ling Temple situated in Kong Sai (Guangxi) Province in west China. It was learned from a monk on retreat from that temple by Master Lau Sam Ngan, "Three Eyed Lau", a tiger hunter, whom we honour as founder of our style."

The idea that "3-eyed lau" is the founder of Lau Gar seems to be supported elsewhere, though there are other people who could fit the bill.

From a Combat magazine article about the history of Lau Gar:
"There are differing accounts of who might be the founder of this system. One source claims the style, was founded by Liu QingShan. However, the most commonly accepted version is that it was founded by Liu Sheng of the Qing Emperor QianLon period (CE 1736). Liu was also known as Liu SanYan (Three Eyes) because of an eye-like scar between his two eyes."

So I think we can assume that, to our best knowledge, 3-eyed Lau is the likely founder.

The BKFA also state:
"The British Kung Fu Association was set up in 1973 and Master Jeremy Yau, being the keeper of the Lau Gar style, was invited to be the Chief Instructor"

This is, however, only claimed by the BKFA. I have not seen one shred of evidence to support this. Though that said, how does one prove your lineage?

Jeremy Yau has stated in an interview:
"First, let me say that there are no DIFFERENT kinds of Lau Gar. What has happened is that, later, people have claimed that they are Lau Gar because it was one of the lesser known of the Shaolin styles. The practice of Lau Gar was restricted. It was only taught to a limited amount of people. Now, Lau Gar originated in Shaolin, obviously, but our specific founder was a man named Lau Sam Man, "Three-Eyed" Lau, from the Kongsi Province. My grandfather actually went into China to learn it"

Again, this is only claimed by Jeremy Yau. Do all the searching you like, and it keeps coming back the Jeremy Yau's claim.

It seems quite clear that there is an authentically recognised Lau Gar school in China, that claims the same lineage (ie it one of the 5 family southern styles) as the UK Lau Gar, but looks totally different; see the video's already posted.

So in short, what we have is:
1) a style that appeared in the 60's/70's with no other evidence apart from Jeremy Yau's word that it is the southern family style Lau Style.
2) another style in china claiming the same thing, with a newspaper article supporting the idea that Xiao Yong Ding is the holder of the style.

I think it's clear to see they are different styles. What is pretty much impossible to say is if one goes back to 3-eyed lau, and the other doesn't. And if so, which is which!

[brainwars]

wow you have definately done your homework:) but i'm still in the same position man where can i get a definitive answer ( if there is any).Looks like you ,me and a hole bunch of other practitioners are going round in circles trying to get answers. Also there seems to be no footage on youtube (other than bad), whats going on?:confused:.

[DaveTart]

The BKFA are (apparently) in the process of producing some definitive/up-to-date syllabus DVD's - so until then, there isn't going to be any stuff on youtube. Which makes commerical sense I guess.

You might like to see Jeremy Yau in action though, here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0VuuBcLjzQ

As for a definitive answer, I seriously doubt you are going to get one unless you go to China.
It seems to me that the idea that UK Lau Gar is THE southern family is flimsy at best, however:

One problem is, I think, how much evidence you need to support a claim to a lineage. AFAICS Jeremy Yau seems to say as much (and as little) as most people who teach in the UK. One thing I keep meaning to do is look at other schools and see what paperwork/evidence they have to support whatever lineage claim they have, and compare that to what Jeremy Yau has.

[Wong Ying Home]

Lau Gar Hong Kong

I know from Jeremy Yau's cousin that here is still one person teaching Lau Gar as taught by Jeremy Yau's grandfather in Hong Kong. He is very low key, and I dont know much more than that. But it is still in Hong Kong.

[DaveTart]

Now that would be extremely interesting to know more about!

I know a few people in HK, so we could check it out.

Be amazing to know more about him. The annoying thing with all of this is that it's never concrete stuff, it's always someone who knows someone who said something...
This goes both ways; for rumours that Jeremy Yau made it all it, and for his lineage being the true one. All very annoying!

[brainwars]

Lau Gar Hong Kong

I know from Jeremy Yau's cousin that here is still one person teaching Lau Gar as taught by Jeremy Yau's grandfather in Hong Kong. He is very low key, and I dont know much more than that. But it is still in Hong Kong.

Are you talking about the Lau Gar branch in Foshan? if so, coach Xia is a student of master Yaus'! I read this on the official BKFA website. There is a few paragraphs on this under 'chinese connection' on the BKFA site.
i don't know any more than what i have read on that site. What do you reckon?

[Wong Ying Home]

No definately not Foshan, the guys I spoke about are in Hong Kong, and are students direct from SiFu Jeremy Yau's grandfather

[DaveTart]

Are you talking about the Lau Gar branch in Foshan? if so, coach Xia is a student of master Yaus'! I read this on the official BKFA website. There is a few paragraphs on this under 'chinese connection' on the BKFA site.
i don't know any more than what i have read on that site. What do you reckon?

It's not really a Lau Gar school there though is it? It's a wushu school that the BKFA see once a year, and teach some LG to.
Makes you wonder why no-one from the BKFA goes to find the mainland Lau Gar guy (Xiao Yong Ding) whilst they are over there... That said, i'm guessing GoungDong is a pretty huge place.

[DaveTart]

No definately not Foshan, the guys I spoke about are in Hong Kong, and are students direct from SiFu Jeremy Yau's grandfather

Can you get the name/contact details for these guys? Or put us in contact with someone who can?
I know a Lau Gar guy (ormskirk BKFA) who is going to go to HK on holiday, so would love to meet them if possible.