more buk sing clf

[hskwarrior]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7dlVhVY6yQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YAbNk1ZZQc&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzqI-gwwcvA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_PJd-X6YeA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=frkXDglwI5w

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fjh5kSzB7LM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gfWgHUGNJ4U&feature=related

[Drake]

A shame I can't watch youtube at work...

[hskwarrior]

i'd like to say something.......

We all know i talk about MY lineage (Lau Bun Hung Sing) and that we are the oldest in the U.S.........and since Prof. Lau Bun first arrived here until the arrival of Tat Mau Wong, we had seen NO OTHER CHOY LEE FUT. so there were no other outside influences to our gung fu other than our own developments.

anyways, watching buk sing, and ONE specific other lineage, I've come to see that MUCH of our YUEN HAI lineage CLF is found within the two mentioned.

With Yuen Hai being one of the older HUNG SING lineages, i can now sorta tell what may have been original hung sing from jeung yim. hell, it's found in alot of these videos.

although buk sing has modified their HOI JONG, it and the endings of their forms are as the Yuen Hai lineage does it.

In saying this, chan family no matter what the school is can obviously see their connection to their lineage, so can the Lee Koon Hung and Buk Sing.......But now i see who our family really is.

it is completely clear that there is NO connection with my lineage to Chan Family Choy Lee Fut at all. Lee Koon Hung's, much different than ours, we share the name, but there are things in their gung fu thats in ours.

However, for the Yuen Hai lineage, we know for sure now that fut san and buk sing CLF is more of what we do than the others.

[Drake]

LL Cool J?

[hskwarrior]

Run DMC?:confused:

[stout]

Who is Yuen Hai(Hung Sing/Buk Sing?)? Is he GM Lau Bun's teacher?

Yeah, I can see similarities between your forms and Buk Sings.

[hskwarrior]

Yes, Yuen Hai was Professor Lau Bun's Sifu. At the same time, Yuen Hai was one of Jeung Yim's original students. He actually goes as far back the early years of Jeung Yim's Hung Sing school. There were 3 students of that time that go all the way back.......yuen hai, lui chun, and Lee Yan.

The techniques are there stout, but the execution is a lot different than ours. we have this tendency to blend move into move. but when i first understood about looking at your form like a paragraph, the blending became more of like a run on sentence. so i have become a better writer so to speak now.

Buk Sing has developed their own type of flow. It takes a good eye to see where the essence between us.

so its like i said, after not being able to connect to folks like the LKH lineage, or Chan Family was ruff. But after looking closely at Buk Sing, we have the same openings and closings, and the same type of meat and potatoes........but not all in the same order as each other. So its real good feeling that we connect because of the Fut San Hung Sing Kwoon.

[Vilmore]

I dunno SF, I think you have to be a little carefull with those statements. Because I think most of the character of the movement is defined by the practitioner itself and the direct teacher instead of the lineage as a whole.
For example the first link, sui pin keun if I'm not mistaken, as far as the movements goe iets 70% identical en and the salute is about 100% indentical, but the character in the movement is slighly different, or at least it appears so. I sort of feel like they just do the movements really quicky, while the way I do it is more like imagining that every movement hit a bag or a target and you're trying to make every movement stand out a little bit more, instead of just blending them together but making them look weaker. It also goes together with the breathing, breat out on every move.

Do you understand what I mean? same form, same lineage, different character of movement (because of practitioner and teacher probably)

I'm not saying you're incorrect when you say that the lineages have alot in common, of course that's right. :)

[hskwarrior]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwWPUhNZ5vo

well, if you look at our sup ji jau da's hoi jong and compare it to buk sing's you'll see the same thing. just lightly different.

and yes each performer is different. i do the same, when i sow choy, i am really taking your head off your neck.

:D

[Satori Science]

Frank;
Thanks for posting these up,
probably wouldn't have seen them otherwise. I'm moving to Asia at the end of Feb (well after a few months in the west indies, gotta defrost from this canadian winter) I'm hoping to get to meet and train with lots of these people. They got me real stoked, and believe me its been hard to get fired up here the last few days, its been -53 Celsius in Regina the last two days....

but yeah, much appreciated :D

[nospam]

Performance of patterns seems to be an individual aspect that probably stems from one's instructor. In my estimation 95% of martial artists, especially those who would be classified as traditional perform their patterns with slow to medium speed and varying power and varying power displayed at key spots (often seen as pauses).

To me, speeding up the movements, which at some point will mean flowing one move into another then another, with proper form and power (often a missing piece of either practitioner or observer) is a natural and should be a natural progression of one's skill, understanding, and performance of their respective art.

I believe, as with much of Today's MAs, the tools and how they were meant to be used have been forgotten and thus limiting one's understanding of how to use said tool(s). This can be said to apply to both sides of the equation ie) to those that remain single-stepped performers and to those who simply speed through their patterns. There are incremental steps that need to be practised and corrected by a trained and knowing eye (teacher) before one begins the next step. It would be a funny world if no one or but a few ran, while the rest of us didn't know how as we never progressed beyond simply walking.

If patterns are techniques sequenced in applicable steps or movements to wit replicate an encounter or fight, then does it not make sense these steps through time and practise should mimic the action or movement (read: speed) of an actual fight? I know for me, as I come to understand a pattern, I am always envisioning my opponent and the why and how of the movement and/or sequence of movements.

There are many styles that teach many patterns and these patterns increase in difficulty and lead the practitioner down the 'sequenced path' by a different means. This is merely a diffferent method of teaching that many have failed (again) to come to understand either as observers, students, and/or instructors or the instructor opted not to teach the 'secret' that links the 30 patterns in their style...for many possible reasons.

One other method of instruction involves less patterns but understanding and performing these in different ways at different stages of the students learning. This could be no different in time frames from the style that teaches 30+ patterns. It is the student that sets the pace of learning, outside the structured cookie-cutter curriculum most MAs favour Today.

There are so many variables in Today's MAs as to why and what I strongly believe has been the downfall of MAs, especially gung fu! But...the last time I had a student run my errands, clean my floors, do as Master says to reap thy benefits...well, ended in divorce and nasty allimony payments.

To Each their Own, I say. If what one is learning makes them happy (such as colored belts and audienced tests with a lot of clapping) then who am I to say what that person is learning is garbage or watered down wushu? In the least these folks are paying for and acquiring good cardio workouts which hopefully will place less of a strain on our healthcare. Go for it. Do it I say. Some of us take 1st place at tournaments on a consistent basis for a reason, others are happy they had the experience to truly feel physically spent at the end of the round, knowing they tried their best. Is this not a driving force to go back to kwoon and train harder...? When bills need to be paid, Teacher is happy Student is rededicated :cool:

Time to go train~

nospam
:cool:

[Vilmore]

I am always envisioning my opponent and the why and how of the movement and/or sequence of movements.

jup that's key to me when I do my forms, dont know if I ever got told to do so, but I do it.
And I felt that that was a bit missing in some of the form.

But in my humble beginners level, I'd rather do every movement stronger and correct yet slower, and increase speed over time and training, instead of doing them more sloppy and fast and increase strengt and concious movement over time.
If you get what I'm saying?

[hskwarrior]

its always best to do things slow and methodical in the beginning. for one, you develop better habits, and won't develop the bad ones.

Practicing slow you have 3 levels of intent. Soft intent, hard intent, and intense intent. but based on each level, the mental part of training comes into play. For example, when i want my students to do something slow and soft, i always say "now lets try that tai chi speed"..........that doesn't mean lose the mentality of crashing through something in the meantime. it means even at tai chi speed, you are visualizing destroying something.

when doing it that way, not only are you physically developing "muscle memory" but you are also developing your "mental gung fu." the combination of both are incredible.

[hskwarrior]

satori,

no problem. thats what fam bam is for ;)

so whats making you move away?

[nospam]

Too many Bak Hsing folk concentrated in one area of Canada, so at the Canadian Bak Hsing Choy Lee Fut Association meeting, we held a contest of full contact fighting with nothing on besides head gear, nut strap, and bag gloves and the victor won the spot to venture forth, outside of Canada to propogate Bak Hsing CLF. You guessed it, Satori was the successful warrior having defeated all challengers...myself included.

We are proud of this young man and wish him well. He carries forth the heritage of our familia within his chop choy and understands to succeed means to remain humble yet strong in conviction.

Good luck Satrori! Keep the Faith~

nospam
:cool:

[hskwarrior]

satori the bak hsing savage.......i like that.

Well, dawg Gamn, good luck there sir. :D

[nospam]

I'm play'n ya'll :D

nospam
:cool:

[hskwarrior]

SHAME ON YOU NOSPAM......SHAME!!!!!!:mad:.............;):p

[Satori Science]

Naya, why ya gotta steal my thunder like that.... :eek:

much love & respect for the kind words though, (I'm startin ta tear up over hear..)I'll see you on the 15th for my seminar? Bringin the young man with ya I hope, family discount of course(free, lol...)

As far as my trip, I am going on a CLF walk about, nothing really prompted it expect my Sifu's request that I open a school. I decided that if I'm gonna go I have to do it now before I put down to many roots. I'll be back in a few years, with a few Chinese Sanda titles ;) and ready to mix it up in the ring on this continent, :cool:

I'm headed to the west indies to stay with family, eat for free and train to get into better shape, then off to Portugal to fight for a world title at the womma world MA games, then to France to train with Tam Sing's disicple and his studnets, I'm hoping to get back to NYC/B-more for a few months to see my mom and cheer my brother Tristan, Sifu Gus's disciple in his ring fight this summer . Hit the Wong Fei Hung in NJ, then I'm out,

I've had lots of luck making good contacts over the last few years, lots of brothers to see and train with in Asia. I'm planning to meet up with my mantis brother and his Xing I/Bagua teacher on the southern coast in Oct then on to HK and Taiwan. Hopefully a stop in australia before I come home,

thanks for all the love/interest people showed in PM's

And believe me, Naya is just a sore loser. The ten tigers all met up and had it out, I only won cause I got to fight him last though:D

[nospam]

Good on ya bro.

I best get your autograph now...might be worth sumthing on Ebay later :cool:

CYA soon.

Oh, next time...I fight with my eyes open. :D

nospam
:cool:

[jow yeroc]

Good luck. Safe travels!!

[WinterPalm]

Naya, why ya gotta steal my thunder like that.... :eek:

much love & respect for the kind words though, (I'm startin ta tear up over hear..)I'll see you on the 15th for my seminar? Bringin the young man with ya I hope, family discount of course(free, lol...)

As far as my trip, I am going on a CLF walk about, nothing really prompted it expect my Sifu's request that I open a school. I decided that if I'm gonna go I have to do it now before I put down to many roots. I'll be back in a few years, with a few Chinese Sanda titles ;) and ready to mix it up in the ring on this continent, :cool:

I'm headed to the west indies to stay with family, eat for free and train to get into better shape, then off to Portugal to fight for a world title at the womma world MA games, then to France to train with Tam Sing's disicple and his studnets, I'm hoping to get back to NYC/B-more for a few months to see my mom and cheer my brother Tristan, Sifu Gus's disciple in his ring fight this summer . Hit the Wong Fei Hung in NJ, then I'm out,

I've had lots of luck making good contacts over the last few years, lots of brothers to see and train with in Asia. I'm planning to meet up with my mantis brother and his Xing I/Bagua teacher on the southern coast in Oct then on to HK and Taiwan. Hopefully a stop in australia before I come home,

thanks for all the love/interest people showed in PM's

And believe me, Naya is just a sore loser. The ten tigers all met up and had it out, I only won cause I got to fight him last though:D

That is awesome! Just awesome!
Good luck to you and when I can, I'll be in your corner pumping you up to go for broke and feast on your opponents!


Nospam,
Were you allowed to wear clothes or just the aforementioned gear? If not, that is truly a kung fu battle of epic-epics!

[nospam]

...just a thin layer of baby oil.

nospam
:cool: