i got assaulted and robbed tonight

[ไRui_Jingδ]

My girlfriend dropped me off 1 block away from my apartment. We had just gotten back from dinner. It was about 7:30 and dark out. I get out of her car and kiss her goodbye. Drives away. I start walking towards my apartment when all of a sudden 7 black kids (juveniles, all under 18) jump me (came out of the alley) and just start beating me up. I told them I didn't have any money. I didn't have my wallet or cellphone, just my keys. I start screaming for help while they are pounding me. Mostly my face. I couldn't see ****. Everything is just a blur. I just remember feeling punches from all directions. I'm screaming "help help" and then they finally run off. I get up and run and into this guy and he calls 911. Cops show up. I tell them what happened. They catch them all and I had to id them. I am a ****ing *******. I could only recognize 2 of them. So they only arrested 2 and let the rest go. All under 18. My face looks like ****. Mostly just bruising, no cuts.

I am not in pain. I am just ****ing ****ed off. I felt so helpless and couldn't do anything. My body didn't react. More than 5 years of martial art training just a waist. My legs wouldn't move. My girlfriend was driving so I wore these ****ing sandals because it was nice out. I froze. I curled up on the ****ing ground as 7 people just pounded on my face.

I am just so ****ed off. It caught me completely off guard. I never thought this could happen to me. I wish I had ran after them and just beaten the **** out of them. But I couldn't. My body froze and my mind went blank.

Unsuccessful night for them I guess. I didn't have my wallet or any other things.

Have you ever been assaulted? Robbed? How do I get over this. My heart is still racing and I can't seem to fall asleep. This was just on the side street on my apartment.

Thanks.

God I cannot fall asleep...

[Ultimatewingchun]

Very traumatic, indeed.

But the first thing you've got to do is forgive yourself. For just freezing up when under such an attack. 7/1 is very traumatic and scary.

Drink some red wine...or some warm milk...and try to get some sleep.

Tomorrow you can begin to work on training under the stress of multiple opponents with your buddies and classmates.

Don't be afraid or ashamed to tell them what happened. They'll empathize with you and want to help - if for no other reason than the realization that it could someday happen to them.

And of course your instructor.

But if he's not responsive - search out some Tony Blauer type training (and he's just one of many good examples - Geoff Thompson is another).

In fact you should google Thompson's name and read some of his articles about real life stressful violent encounters and how to deal with them. Also check out the street/reality fighting forum on this website.

It's about stress training first and foremost - and then with working the best possible scenarios against multiple attackers (ie.- run...try to manuever so that the guy in front of you is blocking out the guy behind him - don't get surrounded...which kinds of techniques work best against multiple guys, etc.)

But mostly it's about handling the stress emotionally. You need this kind of training more than anything else.

And as soon as you can. Don't let grass grow under your feet.

Jump back into the pool as soon as you can kinda thing.

But it all starts with forgiving yourself.

[Wayfaring]

Good advice from UWC. Isolation is your enemy. Talking about it helps you grieve, recover, get past it.

It's just an event to get past. No reflection on you, your training, your martial arts work. Anyone can get surprised. In most tougher neighborhoods, nobody is out on any street w/o 6 or 7 friends.

[Wu Wei Wu]

Given the circumstances I think you did really well. At least you are still around to tell the tale. (It could have been considerably worse).

I respect you for posting an account on this forum. You are probably suffering the effects of PTSD. Although it is a good idea to analyze what went wrong and how to prevent this from happening again, you must try to do so without 'reliving' the stress of the incident. By reliving the incident you may end up magnifying the emotions triggered by the memory of the event and creating an even bigger trap of fear. I hope this makes sense! In other words try to be objective when you think about the incident otherwise you may end up reconfirming the stress that is associated with it.

Focus on the fact that:

a) you survived
b) it could have happened to anyone
c) anyone would have problems with recalling faces after the incident
d) martial arts do not make you invincible

Something that really helped when I started delving deeper into the psychology of violence was a superb book called Strong on Defense:

http://www.amazon.com/Strong-Defense-Sanford/dp/0671535110

I can provide you with quite a few suggestions in terms of resources regarding violence/martial arts, But I'm not sure if that is what you are looking for. If you are interested PM me.

Suki Gosal

[Mr Punch]

Man, good luck to you.

As people said, get back into the swing of things, don't get the funk when you're out at night, don't dwell on it too much: you'll get over it.

I've had a few muggings and **** in the past. The PTSD thing is about right - and nothing to be ashamed of. The first time took me a wee while to get over, as did the time when I was so whiskied up I couldn't remember anything of it (that one really shook me up, and I totally modified my attitude to drinking since). You get used to it.

As for multiple attacker training I find a lot of it sucks and doesn't help in the situation: all-out aggression drills will probably serve you as well. Animal Day type stuff; in your face shout and be shouted at drills; whaling on a bag like a ****ing maniac; destroying some pads... that kind of thing.

[k gledhill]

where was this ?

[Seppukku]

Taking on the odds of 7-1 with only 5 years of MA training is too much for anyone except Bas Rutten.:(

Honesly, there's not much you could have done. It wasn't a straight-up fight. It was an ambush from behind. Unless you study combat ninjitsu, there's really no way to prepare for that kind of scenario. It's not that your marital arts training is useless....far from it. There were 7 guys, none of whom has a lick of courage or skill, whose only means of overwhelming you is through superior numbers---note: not skill. So, you need to take it easy on yourself.

Don't beat yourself up over it. You've got to heal, get stronger, and train harder (not so much so you can get revenge [PM me if you're out for bloody vengeance], but so that you can work yourself through this ordeal). Talk to everyone you can trust about the issue. People who get attacked and bottle it up develop psychological issues. You need to talk about it with family and friends. Also, move to a new apartment.

Seriously, I'm just glad your girlfriend wasn't with you at the time. Things could have been worse.

Oh, and if you see one of those little punks on the street, call up seven of your buddies and choerograph a little tap dance.

[Mr Punch]

Seriously, I'm just glad your girlfriend wasn't with you at the time. Things could have been worse. The troll has a point.


Oh, and if you see one of those little punks on the street, call up seven of your buddies and choerograph a little tap dance.:D LOL

[YungChun]

But the first thing you've got to do is forgive yourself. For just freezing up when under such an attack. 7/1 is very traumatic and scary.

It's about stress training first and foremost - and then with working the best possible scenarios against multiple attackers (ie.- run...try to manuever so that the guy in front of you is blocking out the guy behind him - don't get surrounded...which kinds of techniques work best against multiple guys, etc.)

{snip}

But mostly it's about handling the stress emotionally. You need this kind of training more than anything else.

And as soon as you can. Don't let grass grow under your feet.

Jump back into the pool as soon as you can kinda thing.

But it all starts with forgiving yourself.
Amen....

Well said Victor.

This kind of experience can take you out of the game or make you stronger... Work toward the latter.

[UKBBC]

Glad to hear you survived, at least none of them packed a knife. Guys have gotten killed from senseless group attacks before.

Maybe a little vigilantism is a good thing when those little sh*ts enjoy the privilege of being too young to be charged....sucks that it's right outside your apt.

Kind of reminds me to carry something on my person at night

All the best

[Phil Redmond]

. . . I start walking towards my apartment when all of a sudden 7 black kids (juveniles, all under 18) jump me (came out of the alley) and just start beating me up. . .
I'll assume you're not black since you mentioned their race.

[T.D.O]

some one once said to me: "f**k it, whats a beating" and i think it's a point if you think about it

at least if it happens again you know you'll at least beat the **** out the leader while his mates are beating you lol;)

take it easy on your self bud, laugh about it (sounds stupid but it works)

[Chuan fa]

Where exactly did all this take place? Why did you have your girlfriend drop you off one block away from your home? Im also curious as to why you mentioned their race, if it was one block from your home maybe these guys are your neighbors? You havent posted again so I am also assuming youre just trolling.

[ไRui_Jingδ]

Where exactly did all this take place? Why did you have your girlfriend drop you off one block away from your home? Im also curious as to why you mentioned their race, if it was one block from your home maybe these guys are your neighbors? You havent posted again so I am also assuming youre just trolling. thanks for your help

[ไRui_Jingδ]

I'll assume you're not black since you mentioned their race.

Why can't I mention someone's race as one of the few characteristics I remember about them? If they were Asian, I would say Asian. If they were Latino, I would say Latino. I have no problem if someone wants to describe me as a white guy.

I'm not a racist. I happen to go to a college that is in a city where there are quite a few black people, I work with a few black guys and I enjoy listening to jazz. :p

[Ultimatewingchun]

Naming who it is who attacked you is not "profiling" - it's simply naming who it is who attacked you. Duh! :rolleyes:

What is he supposed to do? Tell the police that 7 guys attacked him - but not say what they looked like? For fear of "profiling"?

Makes no sense, right?

So if he can tell police what they looked like - why can't he tell us? :cool:

[YungChun]

My girlfriend dropped me off 1 block away from my apartment. We had just gotten back from dinner. It was about 7:30 and dark out. I get out of her car and kiss her goodbye. Drives away. I start walking towards my apartment when all of a sudden 7 black kids (juveniles, all under 18) jump me (came out of the alley) and just start beating me up. I told them I didn't have any money. I didn't have my wallet or cellphone, just my keys. I start screaming for help while they are pounding me. Mostly my face. I couldn't see ****. Everything is just a blur. I just remember feeling punches from all directions. I'm screaming "help help" and then they finally run off. I get up and run and into this guy and he calls 911. Cops show up. I tell them what happened. They catch them all and I had to id them. I am a ****ing *******. I could only recognize 2 of them. So they only arrested 2 and let the rest go. All under 18. My face looks like ****. Mostly just bruising, no cuts.

I am not in pain. I am just ****ing ****ed off. I felt so helpless and couldn't do anything. My body didn't react. More than 5 years of martial art training just a waist. My legs wouldn't move. My girlfriend was driving so I wore these ****ing sandals because it was nice out. I froze. I curled up on the ****ing ground as 7 people just pounded on my face.

I am just so ****ed off. It caught me completely off guard. I never thought this could happen to me. I wish I had ran after them and just beaten the **** out of them. But I couldn't. My body froze and my mind went blank.

Unsuccessful night for them I guess. I didn't have my wallet or any other things.

Have you ever been assaulted? Robbed? How do I get over this. My heart is still racing and I can't seem to fall asleep. This was just on the side street on my apartment.

Thanks.

God I cannot fall asleep...

Hey bro.. You might check this out..
http://rmcat.com/index.html?fresh=1

Best of luck,

[reneritchie]

Horrible circumstances and best wishes for a speedy and healthy recovery.

Post traumatic stress can be a problem, so if you need help, make sure you get (qualified) help.

You survived, that's the important thing.

[冠木侍]

It seems that the main issue of this post has gotten lost IMO. This person got jumped and now he needs time to recover. From what I can remember from his original, he felt that his martial arts training had failed him in his time of need. That is a hard thing to say for someone who has trained for the amount of time he did (five years). Since this is a martial arts forum, maybe we should focus on what he could have done or what he can do if he runs into a similar situation. This may be an opportunity to learn something or to evaluate our own self defense tactics. Just a few suggestions.

Let's please not cloud it with another issue altogether. He pointed out who his attackers were and that is natural. He came to this forum because he probably felt he could talk to us about it. Let's show some compassion and hope that nothing like this happens to any of our loved ones.

**You shouldn't respond to any more comments regarding this controversial topic. If you didn't mention anything about the attackers, I'm sure someone here would probably have asked you sooner or later.**

Don't be too hard on yourself. The street is relentless and maybe its time to step your training or branch out into different styles to better improve your self defense. I'm sorry that you were attacked but at least your girlfriend was away from the danger.

[t_niehoff]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rOQLg7Kc8So

Something worth a listen -- here's a world class fighter in a similar situation, just trying to survive (he even used the guard in a fight with multiple, armed opponents!).

Your training didn't fail you. No amount of training would help. A pack of wolves (each wolf weighs 100 lbs) can bring down a bison (that weighs a ton). No one beats multiple attackers except in the movies. The best you can hope to do is survive. It's like the crash of an airplane, if you walk away with only minor injuries, that's the best result possible.

[Liddel]

The question is: if they were white would you have said '7 white guys attacked me'? No. It's completely natural to mention their race (BECAUSE it is different to yours). It's also racist.

Mate this is complete PC brigade BS. No offence to you though.

Racism is assuming something, anything based on race. Stereotyping.

Example- If i said....

90% of my countries prison population is made up of 10 % of the total population.
Which are Polynesian. that is a fact, its true.

If i said they were in jail because they were polynesian, its blindingly obvious thats racist.

I took it like he stated a fact, he was painting a picture for us, im not sure his real intentions cause i dont know him. But if it happened to me and i was attacked id say the same thing with NO racism intended. It is what it is.

Its such a touchy subject to some and some people dont want to offend others. but lets not get to politically correct.....

It can get so rediculous to the point that i could say calling/stereotyping a guy as being racist cause hes white refering to others as being black......is racist in itself........towards white people.

Just for the record im not saying you are. But do you get my point ?

Im a member of a mixed colour family, ive had these discussions before :o

Now Seppukus call about Jazz - that was freaking racist and i think he needs a beating....if not from me, then from the Mods (internet style of course)

DREW

[naja]

The question is: if they were white would you have said '7 white guys attacked me'? No. It's completely natural to mention their race (BECAUSE it is different to yours). It's also racist.

If you were talking to the police, it wouldn't be racist: they need to know. We don't. If you were putting in some socio-economic context it may be relevant. You weren't.

He was relating the story to us, AFTER he talked to the cops. Give him a break, situations like this require time for a person to readjust and it appears that he made the post shortly after it happened. He probably only mentioned their race because it was brought up in his description to the cops, and it was fresh on his mind. I happened to work at a law enforcement facility and this type of "profiling" happens all the time by the victims of crimes. Regardless of whether or not the assailants are of the same race as the victims. If it had been seven white guys, then his mind would be trying to place them in a different social level as himself. Victims of violent crimes need to separate themselves from their perps in various ways. Race and social levels happen to be the easiest, and therefore most common ways.

[Liddel]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rOQLg7Kc8So
Something worth a listen -- here's a world class fighter in a similar situation, just trying to survive

Its an even more amazing story after you watch his highlight reel.
The guys a machine !

[Mike Sheng]

Regardless of what race they were,You are okay and you can start with the healing and use it as a learning tool so it can't happen to you again.I'm Half and Half,Chinese Black guy its hard to offend me,But we are fellow Gung Fu man and that enough for me.A lot of us think that just because we practice a martial art that it makes use invincible(However we all can be victims at some point)10 years ago one of my fellow martial art female friends was sexually assault,just putting her groceries in her truck and someone walked up and she became victim.All i can tell you my friend is work through it,get better and don't let it rule your life style.I'll keep you in my prayers

[t_niehoff]

Everyone should take this test:

https://implicit.harvard.edu/implicit/

and then read what the research has shown.

Then you will better understand where Phil is coming from.

[FooFighter]

Rui_Jingδ,

I am sorry to read about your mass attack and hope you are recovering from this traumatic event. I do a lot research on stress and there is a book about trauma by DR Peter Levine called, "Walking the Tiger". http://www.traumahealing.com/store_waking.html I would recommend that you try to remember the events in your mind and then go run it off on the treadmill or outdoor. This will help you release the physical and mental trauma. I hope this book will help you.

Seppukku,

Please send my regards to Master Soto. Tell him his old student named "Tran" from NYC bows to his old teacher. I believe I was youngest to achieve a first degree black belt in his dojo in midtown manhattan. Yup, when I was a teenager (13-16) I spent my nights not in front of the TV but in the dojo training.

[Mr Punch]

Mate this is complete PC brigade BS. No offence to you though.Fair enough. That's another distinct possibility! :)


Racism is assuming something, anything based on race. Stereotyping.Nah. That definition of racism doesn't cover it. Racism can also be transmitting stereotypes. The fact that they were black means it's not the OP making black people look bad: they did that themselves, and yes, they are represntatives of their racial type even more so than say, George Bush is a representative of white people world over because that's the way it is with the inherent racism in predominant western views propagated through the news. The fact that he chose this fact to tell us (he didn't tell us previously they were wearing hoodies - just as relevant to criminal profiling, or that he suspected that they were from a bad neighbourhood) is indicative of racism. I don't mean he meant to be, hence the part of my post you quoted, I'm just saying it was.

This kind of racism is natural I think: it's the fear of the unknown and the different in any species. I do it too. But it's something we should be aware of, and challenge in ourselves IMO. I used to think I was colour blind till I got to know a couple of black people, and found myself very occasionally saying things like, 'My black friend...' and often realising that his colour had **** all to do with my story! It was a little disturbing! (It was also interesting to see that nobody ever pulled me up on it: I'm an educated white guy so I guess everybody's default stance is that this is OK to say - not just among my Japanese friends but the foreigners here too...)

In general, apart from the test of whether he would say, 'I was attacked by seven white guys...' (of course, if he stressed the word white... this would also be racist! :eek: :D ), there's the test that if he were speaking to his black friends, would he tell the story in the same way: i.e. saying 'I was attacked by seven black guys...'? I don't think so. Why? Because it shouldn't really be acceptable.


It can get so rediculous to the point that i could say calling/stereotyping a guy as being racist cause hes white refering to others as being black......is racist in itself........towards white people.LOL, yeah, that's a reasonable point!


Now Seppukus call about Jazz - that was freaking racist and i think he needs a beating....if not from me, then from the Mods (internet style of course)
Yeah, but he's a frigging troll just here to wind people up, and as such I thought that was quite funny!

Naja, great post and I agree. But I still think that that kind of profiling is something we need to minimize. If I live in an area where particularly black violent crime is endemic, that kind of mental profiling is not racist as much as a survival technique. He doesn't. Is he going to be concerned next time he sees a group (gang?) of blacks at night? Yes. Is he right to be? Maybe so. But he just needs to make sure that he counts the times he's seen groups of black people who haven't attacked him too!

Man, I lived in a truely multicultural high-crime area and have had the **** beaten out of me by whites, blacks, Asians, mixed race, d amn, you name it! He needs to get out more! :D

This'll be my last longwinded BS on this thread - I do hear what he's saying and it's no fun getting rolled... I know!

[sanjuro_ronin]

Everyone should take this test:

https://implicit.harvard.edu/implicit/

and then read what the research has shown.

Then you will better understand where Phil is coming from.

Interesting test, I didn't care much for how many negative words were "associated" with African Americans though.

[TaichiMantis]

Interesting test, I didn't care much for how many negative words were "associated" with African Americans though.

Including the term "African American"...it drives some of my black friends nuts, especially if they are from Canada, Africa, the Caribbean...:rolleyes:

[Phil Redmond]

Naming who it is who attacked you is not "profiling" - it's simply naming who it is who attacked you. Duh! :rolleyes:

What is he supposed to do? Tell the police that 7 guys attacked him - but not say what they looked like? For fear of "profiling"?

Makes no sense, right?

So if he can tell police what they looked like - why can't he tell us? :cool:
Now when I post about training, sparring, meeting, fighting, etc., some one I'm going to have to write their ethnicities. So when I speak of my Sicilian/Calabrez, Irish/Scottish, English/ Welsh, Jamaican/Chinese, Filipino/Irish/Italian, white-African-American, etc., friends I'm going to have to type even more? Jeesh, thanks Victor. . . ;)

[Ultimatewingchun]

What he said in his opening post was not profiling, Phil.

He was simply stating facts.

Jeez...:rolleyes:

[Black Jack II]

Train for mass situations all you want, adrenal stress training is a good thing, but it's in circumstances like this that a legally or for that matter a illegally carried firearm or weapon can become your best friend.

Traumatic moments like this are dangerous and very frightening, they can leave very lasting impressions on you and how you will now view the world from then on.

It's important to share your feelings actually, who really gives a **** if their racist or not, that is far besides the point, it's not about being judged or punished but to understand that the feeling you may be having, of self blame is normal.

Some ideas to help you pass the time as you run the event in your mind, to help take the legs out of the emotional stress, is to keep working out, maintain some regular physical exercise. Also, don't be afraid to take some time to be alone from your martial training, work on another hobby to not reinforce your thoughts on the failure of such and such "system."

Most of all, make sure to talk it out, when you need to with buds.

[Phil Redmond]

What he said in his opening post was not profiling, Phil.

He was simply stating facts.

Jeez...:rolleyes:
I sent you an email so that we can keep this off of this thread.

[ไRui_Jingδ]

not worth it.

[Ultimatewingchun]

I can tell you unequivocally that Phil is not a rascist. We know each other very well for around 25 years now, and although we occasionally have our quarrels, it's never over race and we always remain friends in the end.

So you see, Phil...it's better of we discuss this publicly.

I'm Italian-American, and you're a Black-American.

And my position is this:

We do a great injustice to the innocent vistim of a violent cirme if we try to forbid them from telling us - publicly or privately - exactly who it was who assaulted them.

AT THE VERY MOMENT WHEN THAT VICTIM NEEDS OUR SUPPORT THE MOST.

And that's not fair.

It's not fair to the white guy who gets assaulted by 7 black guys - and it's not fair to the black guy who gets jumped in Bensonhurst, Brooklyn, for example, by 7 white Italian guys.

The victims of violent crimes need to be able to fully identify their attackers. Otherwise we, as society, are not doing right by them at the very moment when they need our support in a big way.

Profiling is a whole other matter entirely.

Profiling is the assumption that because you're black your probably guilty in the first instance....

and the assumption that you're probably guilty if you're Italian-looking in the second instance.

[Mr Punch]

Train for mass situations all you want, adrenal stress training is a good thing, but it's in circumstances like this that a legally or for that matter a illegally carried firearm or weapon can become your best friend.

Traumatic moments like this are dangerous and very frightening, they can leave very lasting impressions on you and how you will now view the world from then on.

It's important to share your feelings actually, who really gives a **** if their racist or not, that is far besides the point, it's not about being judged or punished but to understand that the feeling you may be having, of self blame is normal.

Some ideas to help you pass the time as you run the event in your mind, to help take the legs out of the emotional stress, is to keep working out, maintain some regular physical exercise. Also, don't be afraid to take some time to be alone from your martial training, work on another hobby to not reinforce your thoughts on the failure of such and such "system."

Most of all, make sure to talk it out, when you need to with buds.Excellent post!

Word of warning though: an illegally carried weapon will get you killed if you're not trained enough to prevent them taking it off you, and will get you put away if you use one on kids, whatever the situation, in your land of legal ****bubbles.


not worth it.Sorry man, I'm butting out of your thread.

[Coyote1911]

You guys should be ashamed of yourselves. This man was assaulted by 7 people and all you can do is argue over whether his post is racist or not!? Have some compassion, if he was your brother or someone you knew you wouldnt be pulling this nit-picky pc junk.

Anyways, I thought I would tell you about my situation to make you feel better. I used to be a security guard at a bowling alley with two (thats right two!) bars attached to both ends. It was a rough place, and there were four security guards there every night to keep the peace. Anyways my first violent encounter with a very drunk individual I froze up too! And there were 4 of us against 1! Thankfully the other guys were more experienced and they took care of him pretty quick and no one really noticed that I had frozen up but I did. I think it was because of the stress of the situation and because I had never really been exposed to violence much in my life. Well, it was traumatic for me but after that first time I got alot more used to it and I didnt freeze up again at least, my heart still raced and I was scared as **** but at least I could move. You really shouldnt beat yourself up. I mean there were seven guys! SEVEN heck even two or three would have been alot. But I bet you that if you ever ran into that situation again you would be much better prepared to handle it. Anyhoo just my .2 cents.

[Seppukku]

You guys should be ashamed of yourselves. This man was assaulted by 7 people and all you can do is argue over whether his post is racist or not!? Have some compassion, if he was your brother or someone you knew you wouldnt be pulling this nit-picky pc junk.

He's not my brother. And I think his profiling made that abundantly clear.

BTW, there are plenty of women on this board. What makes you think you're adressing "guys"? I think you should have said something like "folks" or "y'all" or "you women and men".

That is, unless you advocate the use of sexist language.

[冠木侍]

not worth it.

Well stated. Seemingly, it is difficult for people to stay focused here.

[Matrix]

I believe we are all prejudice in one way or another. Whether it be race, gender or even from a WC perspective; lineage. We are limited in our ability to understand others due to our limited life experience. I think we all need to understand that we see the world through a lens that filters the information based on our narrow point of view. Where's the love brothers and sisters?:(

[SAAMAG]

You know, I read through this thread hoping to hear some good news from it, that the gentleman involved was ok and the people who attacked him were brought to justice. Which BTW--I'm sorry to hear about what happened.

My two cents:

What I just read is beyond pathetic. People on all sides need to grow up and stop perpetuating negative aspects of society. Does it really matter is someone typed the word "black" or addressed people as "guys" when the intention was simply to I.D. a group of attackers and to address a group of people? BTW the english language is a superflous entity wherein words can have different connotations...people seem to forget that.

So please, give the PC **** a ****ing break. This is the exact reason why I stopped coming to forums online...they're 90% idiocy and 10% useful conversation.

[duckabolo]

wow you've survived the attack by so many people, you have a great story to tell in the future. i probably would have died.

Good of you to share your incident, we all need to be vigilant

Duck

[Drake]

You aren't going to beat 7-1 odds. If you had fought back, they likely would've really caused some damage. Your reaction was completely natural. The only other course of action for you would've been to run, but that still runs a risk in itself.

[sanjuro_ronin]

You aren't going to beat 7-1 odds. If you had fought back, they likely would've really caused some damage. Your reaction was completely natural. The only other course of action for you would've been to run, but that still runs a risk in itself.

Bah, for just $399.99 Euros I can show you how to defeat up to 10 people ( more than that wil cost you an additional $299.99 Euros).
I once kicked a man's head right off his neck, so I know what I am talking about !

[Seppukku]

My two cents:

What I just read is beyond pathetic. People on all sides need to grow up and stop perpetuating negative aspects of society. Does it really matter is someone typed the word "black" or addressed people as "guys" when the intention was simply to I.D. a group of attackers and to address a group of people? BTW the english language is a superflous entity wherein words can have different connotations...people seem to forget that.

So please, give the PC **** a ****ing break. This is the exact reason why I stopped coming to forums online...they're 90% idiocy and 10% useful conversation.

It starts as I.D.-ing a group of attackers, or addressing a group of people, and soon it becomes racialized discourse, institutional hatred, discrimination, and then expurgation.

The English language has nothing to do with this. Black is an adjective that denotes color. We're debating exactly what he was connoting by the use of "black". Put this in another context for me. Was he talking about the "blackness of their hearts? Or perhaps an adumbration of "blackguard"?

[Matrix]

This is the exact reason why I stopped coming to forums online...they're 90% idiocy and 10% useful conversation.
We're up to 10%?!?!
That's great news. Thanks.:D

[Ultimatewingchun]

"It starts as I.D.-ing a group of attackers, or addressing a group of people, and soon it becomes racialized discourse, institutional hatred, discrimination, and then expurgation." (Seppukku)

***THIS is truly a load of "politically correct" crap. And needs to be pushed back against every time it rears it's head. People HAVE to be able to identify their attackers - and WILL always be able to identify their attackers.

And there's Nothing that any amount of politically/racially agenda-ized pandering will be able to do about that.

There is no "soon becomes" this or that. There are too many steps and societal/legal safeguards involved in-between A & Z for people to buy into this nonsense way of thinking.

[Seppukku]

"It starts as I.D.-ing a group of attackers, or addressing a group of people, and soon it becomes racialized discourse, institutional hatred, discrimination, and then expurgation." (Seppukku)

***THIS is truly a load of "politically correct" crap. And needs to be pushed back against every time it rears it's head. People HAVE to be able to identify their attackers - and WILL always be able to identify their attackers.

And there's Nothing that any amount of politically/racially agenda-ized pandering will be able to do about that.

There is no "soon becomes" this or that. There are too many steps and societal/legal safeguards involved in-between A & Z for people to buy into this nonsense way of thinking.

Perhaps we should drop all PC labels, revert to racial epithets, segregation, and the recall of voting ammendments?

PC doesn't mean "Politically correct". It means "I won't tolerate your miscegenation through nuanced racial/sexual judgments."

[Seppukku]

For instance: I'm a Japanese American. This is my nationality, not my race. But it describes something that race doesn't--my cultural context. Race makes no distinction between cultures. Hence, if you said: "Africans are closer to our human origins than white people", this wouldn't make any sense because there are lots of white people in Africa.

So, am I a yellow-american? Are you going to lump me together with the Chinese, Thais, Cambodians, Rangoons, Burmese, Vietnamese, or....God forbid...the Koreans?!!!:mad: I sumbit, I'm none of the above. There is a world of difference between myself and the full-fledged Japanese; there's a difference between myself and a Chinese person. We have very different cultural perspectives. Or maybe I'm just Asian--as if we're "all the same, and look the same".:rolleyes:

Now, when you say someone is "black" rather than "African American", you are in fact linking behavioral aspects (in this case criminality) with skin color. It's a judgment, a blanket statement.

Think about your language UltimateWingChun, and I think you'll agree.

Had he said: "They were African American youths", I wouldn't have so much of a problem, because he's identifying them by their cultural context. And if they were African Americans with a Caribbean accent, he could say: "And they sounded like they were from the Caribbean, because of their accent. Maybe Haiti or something...."

Or, if they have an identifiable slang, or dialect, this could help locate them.

Tagging "black" onto them as a marker of who they are is problematic.

[Seppukku]

Black is so general, it isn't even a good marker of what a policeman should be looking for. What is black? Is it Puerto Rican or Hispanic? Does it include darker-skinned Indians? Are these all the same? Just how tan does someone have to be before he or she's black? Are really tanned caucasians black?

If you have a very freckled caucasian assailant, (a ginger), is he a half-black?

Your answer will be: of course not.

Therefore, "black" is not a good label, and should be abandoned. It is just the new "Negro". And "Negro" was just a polite way to say what I will not say, because it's going way too far.

[Seppukku]

Let's say we have an African American who has spray-painted himself white and commits a crime.

When you describe him to the police, how do you describe him?

When someone says: "He was black, mr. officer", he's only describing the person adjectively. Why not choose to do so with more substance? Why not: "He was African American? He was Chinese American? He was a Chinese American with a Chinese accent? He was an African American with a Caribbean accent?"

Imagine the chaos if you said: "He was white, mr. officer. And he said he was from Compton, and belonged to the Rollin' Sixties".

Every officer in LA would be looking for a white Crip.

[Seppukku]

I think this demonstrates what a superior rhetorical tactician I am.

[Phil Redmond]

Let's say we have an African American who has spray-painted himself white and commits a crime. . . . . .
I know a white African-American and and white African-Canadian. A white African who obtains American citizenship could be labeled as an African-American just like an Irish-American or any other hyphenated immigrant.

[Seppukku]

Actually, no. He would be a Nigerian living in America, or a South African living in America, or an Ethopian living in America. He would only be an African American if he was ethnically African.

You're confusing nationality with ethnicity--a common mistake. For instance--persons like myself are Asian. We are from the continent of Asia. However, I'm Japanese-American in terms of my nationality. You could call me Asian-American for my ethnicity. But in ethnic terms, I'm Asian. It's a very broad category.

Africa is not a country, it's a continent. When describing ethnicity, we make use of continents because that's the most accurate way to describe racial distribution throughout the earth. "Whites"=Caucasian/European. "Blacks"=African-....... "Yellows"=Asians. "Reds"=Amer-Indians. "....."=Arab/Indian.

This isn't being "PC". It's about accuracy. If I say I'm a Japanese-American, it's because I see that I don't identify with the whole *friggin' continent of Asia.

*Hey, did you know that in the seventeenth century "Frigging" was the word they used for "masturbation"?

I bet you didn't. I think this demonstrates how learned I am.

[tjwingchun]

*Hey, did you know that in the seventeenth century "Frigging" was the word they used for "masturbation"?

I bet you didn't. I think this demonstrates how learned I am.


I knew even before hearing the Ian Drury track "Frigging in the rigging", I also know what a merkin is as well as the use of pickled nutmegs related to prostitutes in Victorian times.

I am a Geordie living in Majorca so what does that make me.

[Seppukku]

I knew even before hearing the Ian Drury track "Frigging in the rigging", I also know what a merkin is as well as the use of pickled nutmegs related to prostitutes in Victorian times.

I am a Geordie living in Majorca so what does that make me.

I have the world's most valuable collection of merkins, and rent them out for a small fee. (Don't worry, we martinize them).

For those who don't know, a merkin is a kind of jerkin for the place where men do their squirtin' for a birthin'....

[SAAMAG]

Holy crap man. I know you're trying to show how socially adept you are with your bantering; but seriously, the only reason we're debating this is because Phil mentioned something about it (ever so subtly).

It's no different than Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson--it's simply pulling the race card to propogate that we're all still racist. **** man. I get sick of hearing the ****. I've got friends of every race, creed, and color. NONE of them get mad when I use the word black, or yellow or whatever...it's ****ing semantics man. Get over it. It's not the word--it's the intent of the speaker using the word.

I'm white, vietnamese, and chinese. People use all sorts of terms when they talk about my races, do I give a rats ass? No...why? Because I know the intent isn't malicious--and I'm an adult who doesn't need to pull the race card all the time.

Sep', your soapbox is getting wrinkled and mishapen because you've been standing on it much too long.

[SAAMAG]

We're up to 10%?!?!
That's great news. Thanks.:D

No worries! :D

[Matrix]

It's not the word--it's the intent of the speaker using the word.

I'm white, vietnamese, and chinese. People use all sorts of terms when they talk about my races, do I give a rats ass? No...why? Because I know the intent isn't malicious--and I'm an adult who doesn't need to pull the race card all the time.
Recently my brother and a distant cousin were working on our family tree. I had always thought of myself as Irish/Scot based on my limited view of my own history. It turns out there's also a lot of German and French and believe it or not - black (Cuban). I was surprised, but also thrilled to hear this news. I'm happy I don't fit nicely into some little WASP box. I think we're slowly moving to understanding that we're all just people. This evolution seems to be moving at glacier-like speed, but it is moving.

I don't know if you saw this story on 60 minutes (http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/10/05/60minutes/main3334427.shtml). but I found it to be interesting. It goes to show you that your self-image may not match reality.

Of course we should also keep in mind that racism is real and should not be trivialized. Let's not turn it into a witch-hunt.

[bakxierboxer]

I have the world's most valuable collection of merkins, and rent them out for a small fee. (Don't worry, we martinize them).

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=martinize

An earlier definition had it that the term referred to the methods of one Jimmy Martin,
who would masticate dirty laundry (women's underwear, to be more specific) to remove "certain stains".

Jimmy was "homeless" but drove a recent model Cadillac on the theory that:
"You kin sleep in yo' cah, butchu cain't drive yo' house!"

As for "personal hygiene", he'd simply buy new clothes whenever the old ones began to stink... possibly due to the lack of wardrobe space in his Cadillac/house.
OTOH, this is merely a point of conjecture for anyone who happens to care.... if any such person actually exists.

[Phil Redmond]

Holy crap man. I know you're trying to show how socially adept you are with your bantering; but seriously, the only reason we're debating this is because Phil mentioned something about it (ever so subtly). . . . .

Thank you. I'm glad somebody got it. I only asked because I wanted to know if the guy attacked was Asian or white, or Filipino beacuse he mentioned that the guys were black. I in no way even thought that because he said they were black that he was being racist. Some one here jumped the gun so I decided to let it go. Maron, I even have an Italian friend name Victor Parlati so I can't be racist. . . . . :D
Get a grip, (and a sense of humor), guys. . . . lol

[Phil Redmond]

Actually, no. He would be a Nigerian living in America, or a South African living in America, or an Ethopian living in America. He would only be an African American if he was ethnically African.

You're confusing nationality with ethnicity--a common mistake. For instance--persons like myself are Asian. We are from the continent of Asia. However, I'm Japanese-American in terms of my nationality. You could call me Asian-American for my ethnicity. But in ethnic terms, I'm Asian. It's a very broad category.

Africa is not a country, it's a continent. When describing ethnicity, we make use of continents because that's the most accurate way to describe racial distribution throughout the earth. "Whites"=Caucasian/European. "Blacks"=African-....... "Yellows"=Asians. "Reds"=Amer-Indians. "....."=Arab/Indian.

This isn't being "PC". It's about accuracy. If I say I'm a Japanese-American, it's because I see that I don't identify with the whole *friggin' continent of Asia.

*Hey, did you know that in the seventeenth century "Frigging" was the word they used for "masturbation"?

I bet you didn't. I think this demonstrates how learned I am.
You used the term African-American. I've had South and Central Americans call me North American. ;)
And yes I know that Africa is a continent. I speak a few other languages other than English unlike most of my countrymen and I'm very aware of geography. Based on what you wrote the term African-American is invalid as well since Africa is a continent. I guess we should use Chad-American, Liberian-American, or maybe Yoruban-American . . . ;)

[bakxierboxer]

.... I even have an Italian friend name Victor Parlati so I can't be racist. . . . . :D

OTOH, the ability to "discriminate" http://www.answers.com/main/ntquery?s=discriminate&gwp=16
is not all bad. :eek:
(what DOES this have to do with having an "Italian friend"?) :cool:


Get a gripe, (and a sense of humor), guys. . . . lol

Gripes they've got..... :rolleyes:
Whether or not they've "got a grip" may depend on the MA they train or their (sometimes tenuous) relationship with what constitutes "reality". :D

[Phil Redmond]

OTOH, the ability to "discriminate" http://www.answers.com/main/ntquery?s=discriminate&gwp=16
is not all bad. :eek:
(what DOES this have to do with having an "Italian friend"?) :cool:
Uh, that was also a joke. Victor got it. btw, I even have some black friends :D



Gripes they've got..... :rolleyes:
Whether or not they've "got a grip" may depend on the MA they train or their (sometimes tenuous) relationship with what constitutes "reality". :D
I made a typo. You got me.

[bakxierboxer]

Uh, that was also a joke. Victor got it. btw, I even have some black friends :D

???? :confused:
I was joking, too.....
I can safely say that I've got a number of friends whose ethnicity I don't know (or care) about.
People are..... people?
Give'em a chance and they'll show you what they are.


I made a typo. You got me.

Nope, that was supposedly another "joke"/"play on words"
(I even turned into a "two-fer").... :(

I don't play "gotcha" with guys that seem to be habitual straight-shooters. :D

[tjwingchun]

My girlfriend dropped me off 1 block away from my apartment. We had just gotten back from dinner. It was about 7:30 and dark out. I get out of her car and kiss her goodbye. Drives away. I start walking towards my apartment when all of a sudden 7 black kids (juveniles, all under 18) jump me (came out of the alley) and just start beating me up. I told them I didn't have any money. I didn't have my wallet or cellphone, just my keys. I start screaming for help while they are pounding me. Mostly my face. I couldn't see ****. Everything is just a blur. I just remember feeling punches from all directions. I'm screaming "help help" and then they finally run off. I get up and run and into this guy and he calls 911. Cops show up. I tell them what happened. They catch them all and I had to id them. I am a ****ing *******. I could only recognize 2 of them. So they only arrested 2 and let the rest go. All under 18. My face looks like ****. Mostly just bruising, no cuts.

I am not in pain. I am just ****ing ****ed off. I felt so helpless and couldn't do anything. My body didn't react. More than 5 years of martial art training just a waist. My legs wouldn't move. My girlfriend was driving so I wore these ****ing sandals because it was nice out. I froze. I curled up on the ****ing ground as 7 people just pounded on my face.

I am just so ****ed off. It caught me completely off guard. I never thought this could happen to me. I wish I had ran after them and just beaten the **** out of them. But I couldn't. My body froze and my mind went blank.

Unsuccessful night for them I guess. I didn't have my wallet or any other things.

Have you ever been assaulted? Robbed? How do I get over this. My heart is still racing and I can't seem to fall asleep. This was just on the side street on my apartment.

Thanks.

God I cannot fall asleep...
Just to get back to the point :rolleyes:

The old adage that "time heals" comes to mind and knowing that to be best prepared is the only answer to the questions that reality throws at us, which is one of the reasons I have continued to train and develop over 30 years teaching professionally.

Wing Chun is all about the "if´s, but´s and maybe´s" that we can face in violent confrontations, how we survive a fight depends as much on luck as our expertise, how we grow from defeat depends upon our honesty, acceptance that we are not invincible and willingness to learn.

[Seppukku]

You used the term African-American. I've had South and Central Americans call me North American. ;)
And yes I know that Africa is a continent. I speak a few other languages other than English unlike most of my countrymen and I'm very aware of geography. Based on what you wrote the term African-American is invalid as well since Africa is a continent. I guess we should use Chad-American, Liberian-American, or maybe Yoruban-American . . . ;)

We're talking about origins, Philip. Ethnic Africans were indigenous to the continent of Africa. Amer-Indians were indigenous to the American continents. Caucasians were indigenous to the region of the Cacasus (including northern Africa, West Asia, and parts of western India), although they were most prominent in Europe. As for Hispanics, they're tied to Central/South America by history, even though their ethnicity is a largely diverse one. Asians were indigenous to, you've guessed it....Asia!

This is a broad analysis, not taking into consideration the "migrations" that preceded these particular categories. (The reason they don't take these "migrations" into account is they have no relevance to modernity....and that everyone comes from either Africa or Japan anyways [More people swing for the former, but if you ask me, we're all Japanese]. But making some stupid statement like: what's the point? We all come from Africa....that's a stupid statement. We've all evolved according to our relationship "with the land"). From an anthropological standpoint, these categories do describe where these particular ethnicities established themselves "with the land", created their cultures, adapted their cultures to the climates, and took root "with the land". And more, evolved "with the land".

It's why Africans don't have melanin (warm climates); why Anglo-Saxons were hairy thugs (cold climates); and why Koreans eat baby children (Communist climates).

[Phil Redmond]

. . . .It's why Africans don't have melanin (warm climates); . . . . .
Maybe you were joking when you wrote this. But in case you weren't:
http://www.answerbag.com/q_view/341565