Leg Checks!

[MasterKiller]

http://i27.tinypic.com/svgyzk.jpg

[diego]

http://i27.tinypic.com/svgyzk.jpg

LOOKS FUN, I WANNA TRY:mad:

[Lucas]

OMG THE SCIATIC NERVE !!!

:p;)

[HtownShaolinBum]

Did that guy twist his own foot backward from trying to kick the other guys' leg? What an idiot. This is why I do not fight professionally. I would probably do the same thing.

[shuaichiao]

no, he broke his leg.

[Ben Gash]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y07N4lRxGYs

[bakxierboxer]

no, he broke his leg.

There was another "better" version of that shot from the right side.... the way the guy's lower leg was flapping around was "disturbing"......

[bakxierboxer]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y07N4lRxGYs

Yeah, kind of like that one, but the video ran it over several times in slow motion...... I seem to remember the guy was wearing red trunks or black with a red stripe....

[sanjuro_ronin]

it can never be stressed enough:

DON'T KICK UPWARDS ON LOW KICKS !!!!!!

[bakxierboxer]

it can never be stressed enough:

DON'T KICK UPWARDS ON LOW KICKS !!!!!!

Actually, to me it looked rather like the cause was that he impacted with the flat of his shin....

[sanjuro_ronin]

Actually, to me it looked rather like the cause was that he impacted with the flat of his shin....

Which tends to happen when you low kick on an upward angle instead on INTO the leg or downward.
Can't count the times it is drilled into people when they do MT or Kyokushin ( or any art that stress low round kicks) that you don't angle the kick up because it exposes and makes contact with the weakest (flat) part of the tibia.

[bakxierboxer]

Which tends to happen when you low kick on an upward angle instead on INTO the leg or downward.
Can't count the times it is drilled into people when they do MT or Kyokushin ( or any art that stress low round kicks) that you don't angle the kick up because it exposes and makes contact with the weakest (flat) part of the tibia.

That's what I thought I saw.
I guess it's more of a worry for some of you guys, but in TCMA the way I learned it, we train and fight with our "street shoes"... in my case that meant boots.
When you "specialize" in something like that you get pretty good at using every advantage that said footwear offers.... and creating some additional ones. :D

[TaichiMantis]

That's what I thought
When you "specialize" in something like that you get pretty good at using every advantage that said footwear offers.... and creating some additional ones. :D


Righto! That's why heel kicks are so important when wearing spike heels!;)

[bakxierboxer]

Righto! That's why heel kicks are so important when wearing spike heels!;)

Hmmm.... not part of my wardrobe.
You know anyone who's got it down to a science?

[Becca]

That's what I thought I saw.
I guess it's more of a worry for some of you guys, but in TCMA the way I learned it, we train and fight with our "street shoes"... in my case that meant boots.
When you "specialize" in something like that you get pretty good at using every advantage that said footwear offers.... and creating some additional ones. :D
Your boots go up to you knees? :eek:




















'Cuase, you know, if they don't then the tip about not angling low kicks up is still vaild. My sifu calls it "floating the kick" and floating a kick will cause you to fail the kicking portion of a rank test.

[bakxierboxer]

Your boots go up to you knees? :eek:

Nope, maybe mid-shin.


'Cuase, you know, if they don't then the tip about not angling low kicks up is still vaild. My sifu calls it "floating the kick" and floating a kick will cause you to fail the kicking portion of a rank test.

When you're wearing what amounts to a multi-tipped/edged weapon, it's kinda silly to kick with anything other than that weapon.

[Becca]

You never miss? Or get checked?

[bakxierboxer]

You never miss? Or get checked?

I'm not at all sure what that has to do with anything.
But, I am human, and nobody's perfect.

I'm not in the habit of executing a technique with the expectation that it will miss or be checked.

It's generally a "better bet" when there is little/no chance of that happening.
So, I "choose my shots" and the fact that I have a few decades of experience helps me to "load" the odds a bit.

My approach to MA appears to be rather different than yours.

So how old is your SiFu? :cool:

[Becca]

mmmm.... about 4 months older than me. :D

His sifu is in his sixies and says the same thing, though.:cool:


The relevance is that an accidental hit on a shin is usually just as bad as a deliberate hit. bad technique's gonna brake your leg either way.

[bakxierboxer]

mmmm.... about 4 months older than me. :D

Nice non-answer.
I'm just trying to figure out if this guy you think I need a promotion from was even born when I was already a recognized instructor.


His sifu is in his sixies and says the same thing, though.:cool:

I don't particularly care what either one of them say.


The relevance is that an accidental hit on a shin is usually just as bad as a deliberate hit. bad technique's gonna brake your leg either way.

"break"
It's not at all relevant when you're kicking with a boot.
In fact, the boots are a rather effective purposeful counter-attack to an opponent's shins (or any other part of his leg/anatomy) at any time, and especially when they try to kick.

I consider it "bad technique" to even think of kicking with your shin.... of course, I also recommend that folks not try to actually fight bare-footed.

[Takuan]

My favorite part is when the other guy stands over the broken legged dude, spreads his arms and says "WHAT?! WHAT?!"

[sanjuro_ronin]

"break"
It's not at all relevant when you're kicking with a boot.
In fact, the boots are a rather effective purposeful counter-attack to an opponent's shins (or any other part of his leg/anatomy) at any time, and especially when they try to kick.

I consider it "bad technique" to even think of kicking with your shin.... of course, I also recommend that folks not try to actually fight bare-footed.

I don't recall TCMA ( or even JMA/OMA) having a round kick untill after they got exposed to MT and TKD.
I don't recall any round kicks in any of the traditional CMA, JMA, or Okinawan MA forms at all.
AM I mistaken?

[bakxierboxer]

I don't recall TCMA ( or even JMA/OMA) having a round kick untill after they got exposed to MT and TKD.

????????
BRAIN FADE at your age? :eek:
Whaddaya think "mawashi geri" stands for... the guy who drives the delivery truck for the local Japanese Laundry?
(overpriced fer sure, but their work is "meticulous" to say the least...)


I don't recall any round kicks in any of the traditional CMA, JMA, or Okinawan MA forms at all.

CMA? "not exactly"


AM I mistaken?

JMA/OMA?
(at least going back to the first years of the 60s....)
(I also remember seeing film footage of Leoning running an outdoor class at a park in the Palama Settlement kicking the BeeJeezus out of his entire class with them.... Kajukenbo "Iron Body" "stuff".... that would've been the 50s)
uh..... yes.

[sanjuro_ronin]

????????
BRAIN FADE at your age? :eek:
Whaddaya think "mawashi geri" stands for... the guy who drives the delivery truck for the local Japanese Laundry?
(overpriced fer sure, but their work is "meticulous" to say the least...)



CMA? "not exactly"



JMA/OMA?
(at least going back to the first years of the 60s....)
(I also remember seeing film footage of Leoning running an outdoor class at a park in the Palama Settlement kicking the BeeJeezus out of his entire class with them.... Kajukenbo "Iron Body" "stuff".... that would've been the 50s)
uh..... yes.

Mawashi geri was an "add on" and wasn't part of any of the "te" systems and you don't see any round kicks in any of the original karate forms.
Don't recall seeing them in any of the CMA I have seen, do you?
Which ones?

[David Jamieson]

drink your milk.

understand angles of attack.

be strict in your training.

and that could still happen to you. :)

[Becca]

drink your milk.

understand angles of attack.

be strict in your training.

and that could still happen to you. :)
Unless you are of an advanced, yet undisclosed, age and have a really cool screan name. And wear boots. ;):D

[Ben Gash]

Kicking up under-involves the hip, so it's fundamentally less powerful, also easy to check, easy to catch, if it's above mid thigh easier to spike. Your boot will also make a MUCH more significant contact if you turn your hip right over. Do you sleep in your boots? Wear them on the beach? Wear them jogging? No? Maybe you should practice better form then.

[sanjuro_ronin]

" these boots were made for walking..."

[bakxierboxer]

Mawashi geri was an "add on" and wasn't part of any of the "te" systems .....

As "history" has it, the early 60s (let alone the 50s) were before contact with TKD, or the even more recent contact with MT.


... and you don't see any round kicks in any of the original karate forms.

Of course not, and the reason is fairly obvious.... from the "proper perspective". :cool:


Don't recall seeing them in any of the CMA I have seen, do you?
Which ones?

It's that "perspective" thingie, again. :D

[bakxierboxer]

drink your milk.

Milk is for the unweaned... unless you're having a breakfast cereal.


.......
and that could still happen to you. :)

It seems to me that'd be kinda hard for it to happen if you don't use that particular type/kind of kick or target.

[bakxierboxer]

Unless you are of an advanced, yet undisclosed, age and have a really cool screan name. And wear boots. ;):D

Just to satisfy any latent curiosity, I'm 65 and haven't slowed down an iota.

Glad you think my screen-name is "cool". :cool:

I need a new pair of Justins.... and since I don't like going through metal detectors, I think I'll "pass" on the fiberglass shanks and "go" with the more traditional steel shanks.

[bakxierboxer]

Do you sleep in your boots? Wear them on the beach?

If you actually know how to practice while wearing footgear, it doesn't matter.


Maybe you should practice better form then.

For a move you would never even consider using?

[sanjuro_ronin]

As "history" has it, the early 60s (let alone the 50s) were before contact with TKD, or the even more recent contact with MT.



Of course not, and the reason is fairly obvious.... from the "proper perspective". :cool:



It's that "perspective" thingie, again. :D

Not going to do the which came first thing with you in regards to the first Japanese style to add on the mawashi geri, too much BS there to even bother.
Suffice to say that it wasn't there before.

As for proper perspective, the simple fact that ever systems has it now, speaks volumes.
The fact that the number 1 technique used by MT fighters VS the japanese and chinese was the round kick, both high and low, speaks volumes.
The simple fact that the fighters that fought the thais all added them to their repatoire, speaks volumes.

[bakxierboxer]

Not going to do the which came first thing with you in regards to the first Japanese style to add on the mawashi geri, too much BS there to even bother.

Now, why would that be? :cool:


Suffice to say that it wasn't there before.

Uh... don't look now, but neither were you! :D


As for proper perspective, the simple fact that ever systems has it now, speaks volumes.

You comparing it to fly sh1t?
("It's everywhere! It's everywhere!") :eek:


The fact that the number 1 technique used by MT fighters to KO the japanese and chinese was the round kick, both high and low.....

Yeah, do you actually know why?


The simple fact that the fighters that fought the thais all added them to their repatoire, speaks volumes.

Yup.
It means that their coaches didn't know why, either. :confused:

[sanjuro_ronin]

Now, why would that be? :cool:



Uh... don't look now, but neither were you! :D



You comparing it to fly sh1t?
("It's everywhere! It's everywhere!") :eek:



Yeah, do you actually know why?



Yup.
It means that their coaches didn't know why, either. :confused:

LOL !

You are so off on this one Pete.

Are you insinuating that the round kick was NOT in TCMA because it was ineffective?
If we are to believe that it existed in TCMA but was not included in forms, doe sit means the forms were not used ot teach techniques ? :eek:
It seems you may be insinuating that a kick considered by most (if not all) fighters as one of the best kicks to use, if not the best, the kick that has resulted in more KO's than any other, the kick used by Thai fighters to humble some of the best in the world before they added it to heir own arsenal, that this kick is ineffective?

Are you saying that?

[Lucas]

Oh lordy say it aint so!

[sanjuro_ronin]

Oh lordy say it aint so!

Nah, I doubt he is, I am just ragging on him :D

[Lucas]

Whats a roundhouse kick>?

Is that the Chuck Norris thing?

[sanjuro_ronin]

Whats a roundhouse kick>?

Is that the Chuck Norris thing?

HIYA biotch !!

[Lucas]

Say What?!?!

[bakxierboxer]

LOL !

You are so off on this one Pete.

Are you insinuating that the round kick was NOT in TCMA because it was ineffective?

Nope, I use it myself... ever since sometime back around 1962.


If we are to believe that it existed in TCMA but was not included in forms, doe sit means the forms were not used ot teach techniques ? :eek:

That "perspective" thingie... again.


It seems you may be insinuating that a kick considered by most (if not all) fighters as one of the best kicks to use, if not the best, the kick that has resulted in more KO's than any other, the kick used by Thai fighters to humble some of the best in the world before they added it to heir own arsenal, that this kick is ineffective?
Are you saying that?

Nope.
Now that's out of the way.....
What did I mean?

[diego]

I don't recall TCMA ( or even JMA/OMA) having a round kick untill after they got exposed to MT and TKD.
I don't recall any round kicks in any of the traditional CMA, JMA, or Okinawan MA forms at all.
AM I mistaken?

um low sweeps and tornado kick has all the muay thai round kick footwork...:) maybe not all of, but most of. Crescent kick is a round kick...if you want to hit his groin just use the ball of your foot and snap with a front kick motion...Chinese front kick and inside crescent kick= Kajukenbo round kick to groin with rear leg ball of foot.

[diego]

If you actually know how to practice while wearing footgear, it doesn't matter.



For a move you would never even consider using?

I like your POV...I've been saying this against a big guy maybe you will jab him and stomp his nuts or leg...Muay Thai is two champs of the same caliber breaking each other down with round kicks and elbows...you stupid if you walk up to a big guy and kick his thigh with your shin...lol that's like jump kicking him.

[Ben Gash]

No, it's smart to kick a big guy in the thigh, it keeps you mobile while sapping his mobility, and if you land two or three clean impacts he'll fall over (if he's untrained maybe after just one) :rolleyes:
If you're wearing boots then of course it's OK to kick with the foot, but the leg and hip action should be the same, because that's what generates the most power and exposes you to the least risk.

[bakxierboxer]

I like your POV...

Don't do me any favors.


I've been saying this against a big guy maybe you will jab him and stomp his nuts or leg...

:eek:
That's whacked! :confused:
Discriminatory as hell! :mad:
Pickin' on'em big peepul! :rolleyes:
What with you trying to play "Honest Injun" an' all, I'd have figured you'd be anything BUT prejudiced! :(

Me? I'm not in the least little bit prejudiced... I'm an equal opportunity nut-stomper. :cool:

OTOH, I've got no use for jabs, since the timing differential (for me) isn't enough to make it worth losing any power. :)


Muay Thai is two champs of the same caliber breaking each other down with round kicks and elbows...

I figure they're entitled to do whatever they like that gets them wherever it is they want to go.
Doesn't mean I'll ever play their game.
I didn't the last time I played one. :D


you stupid if you walk up to a big guy and kick his thigh with your shin...lol that's like jump kicking him.

Actually, what would really pîss me off would be having to jump up to hit him in the head.
Fortunately for all concerned, I'm not a head hunter.... at least not that kind.
But if the right lady asks....

[bakxierboxer]

No, it's smart to kick a big guy in the thigh...

If there weren't any better targets......


If you're wearing boots then of course it's OK to kick with the foot, but the leg and hip action should be the same, because that's what generates the most power and exposes you to the least risk.

Maybe even a little bit MORE leg and hip action along with a judicious use of weight transfer? :)

[sanjuro_ronin]

I like your POV...I've been saying this against a big guy maybe you will jab him and stomp his nuts or leg...Muay Thai is two champs of the same caliber breaking each other down with round kicks and elbows...you stupid if you walk up to a big guy and kick his thigh with your shin...lol that's like jump kicking him.

I take it you never saw Marco Ruas destroy that guys with low kicks, what was his name again?
I now it stared with a V...
Here you go:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GtLxxwzz86o

He takes out a few with leg kicks...

[Ben Gash]

OK, this is getting silly now, the source of this discussion was that you shouldn't kick up with a turning/roundhouse kick. Beyond risk of leg breaks, you shouldn't kick up because it doesn't involve the leg and hip enough!!! :rolleyes:
There are many better targets, but they probably won't be on offer as often as the thigh.

[Ben Gash]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5mzX_1Zcvcs

[sanjuro_ronin]

Anyone who has ever had their thigh kicked by a good solid round kick has not doubts on how well they work.