Racism & MMA

[GeneChing]

Here's a topic that might arouse controversy. Let's see if we can discuss this with some civility. I'd hate to have to close this thread later.


Racists Active in Mixed Martial Arts (http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?aid=898)
By David Holthouse

Melvin "Man-o-war" Costa has a classic Nazi eagle and swastika insignia tattooed across his chest and a prison gang spider web inked on his right elbow.

Costa, 26, also is a convicted felon, self-avowed white nationalist and currently the 10th-ranked light heavyweight fighter in King of the Cage, one of the most popular semi-professional "mixed martial arts" (MMA) combat leagues in America. MMA is the fastest growing sport in the country. Television ratings for its preeminent league, the Ultimate Fighting Championship, or UFC, routinely outdraw every other sport except NFL football among men aged 18-34.

Not surprisingly, this rapidly rising blood sport is likewise wildly popular among racist skinheads and other young extremists with a thirst for violence. Many white supremacist online forums have recently established discussion groups devoted specifically to MMA; skinhead gangs across the country are raising money by hosting illegal backyard tournaments; and retired white supremacist cage fighter Mike Buell runs a major MMA training school in Arizona whose logo is a Celtic cross (often used as a white supremacist symbol) and the phrase "Hail Victory" (the German equivalent is "sieg heil").

Costa, however, is the first openly white nationalist MMA fighter to become a Top Ten-ranked competitor in a sanctioned organization like King of the Cage, which is a proving ground for up-and-coming fighters, a select few of whom go on to fame and fortune in the Ultimate Fighting Championship.

"A swastika, as far as I hold it true to my own, it stands for the purity of my people's blood," Costa told leading MMA sportswriter Sam Caplan last October. "I do believe in the purity, security, and the survival of the white race. … When I come down that [fighter entrance] ramp and people see me, they know I'm white power." Costa did clarify, however, that he considers himself a white nationalist rather than a neo-Nazi because "[a] neo-Nazi holds Hitler's beliefs to be true down to a T. I don't. I believe in Hitler's point of view as far as racial consonance but I don't believe a lot of [his] things as far as controlling the economy."

By Costa's own account, he was frequently incarcerated for burglary and assault from the time he was 15 until his most recent release from prison in March 2006. His first King of the Cage fight occurred the following April. Costa knocked out his opponent at 1:06 into the first round.

"I don't feel pain. No ****in' brain, no pain!" he said then. Over the next six months he reeled off three successive knockout victories. Southern California skinheads in full dress — boots, suspenders, bomber jackets — began showing up at King of the Cage events in droves to cheer on the Aryan warrior, whose swastika tattoo, outspoken white nationalist ideology and growing skinhead fan base presented MMA promoters with a public relations dilemma.

Last Oct. 18, shortly after Costa's comments and pictures of his tattoos were republished widely on MMA fan websites, Gary Shaw, the live events president of the parent company that owns King of the Cage, issued this statement: "I try not to allow anyone to fight in the cage or the ring that has anything inappropriate either on their gear or tattooed permanently on their body. And that means either ethnic, or racial, or anything offensive to the general public. I was unaware of the situation but I'm in the process of handling it now. Hopefully, it will never happen again."

But it did, less than two months later. Costa fought in a King of the Cage event held last Dec. 18. For the first time, though, he lost. Davis, for his part, did not return two E-mails seeking clarification on his league's regulation of fighters with "inappropriate" tattoos.

Judging by online forum discussions, Costa's growing legions of white supremacist fans seemed far less concerned with his swastika or spider web tattoos than a third tattoo, circling his navel, that boasts, "I have a small *****." The common theory is that, as one fan said, "He might be going for a bit of sarcasm, depending on the actual size of his *****, given the false stereotype about us."

Be that as it may, Costa says, "At least God blessed me with a strong jaw and a big head."

[sanjuro_ronin]

Everyone has a right to be a fighter, if they want to and can pass the physical.
He can't be denied that right because he is an ignorant a-hole.
The type of personalities that fall into the "wannabe warriors" syndrome that effects MMA will love this guy or hate him, those more enlightened will realize how little he matters or how little the sport matters in this context.
Fans of most sports tend to be "wannabes", its not just MMA.
MMA may SEEM to attract these people, with their tattoos and their piercings and their small ****s, but the fact is they are everywhere, in pro Wrestling, in Boxing, in Hockey, in Football and even in soccer.
My sister-in-law has a BF that loves MMA, he loves for the UFC, he will leave a family gathering to go watch it, he talkes about how tough he is and how he beats people up, blah, blah, blah, does he compete?
No.
Does he belong to a gym?
No.
Does he train?
No.
Is he a typical wannabe?
Yes.
Is he a typical fan?
I don't know...

[Eddie]

Racism is everywhere. I live in a country where it is all out in the open (from both sides).

If a guy is a good fighter, and he sticks to the rules, fights clean and with the right compassion (not breaking the guy’s arm after he tapped out etc), he has just as much right to be in the ring as anyone else.

While his ideas about the purity of his bloodline may offend others, he still has the right to live and to compete. There are always someone who will be offended by another person’s conduct, clothes, hair style or whatever.

I’ve seen fights with some Hardcore leftist extremist where the fighters come up against a black fighter (for example), only to have the white guy being humbled by the skill of his black opponent. Theres a certain type of respect one has after being defeated.

Trust me, this sort of thing happens down here every single day. Im sure the problem isn’t as big as most people make it out to be. Though there is never any excuse for this type of thing, its part of life. Its MMA, not point sparring. You are going to attract some real bad azzes.

Just accept it and deal with it.

Nothing worse than people who always cry rasism when ever things arent going their way. Its old and tired.

[bakxierboxer]

Racism is everywhere. I live in a country where it is all out in the open (from both sides).
.......
.......
I’ve seen fights with some Hardcore leftist extremist....


It's "nice" to see that your Leftists (racists) are the same as ours... no matter how hard they try to sell themselves as being other than that.


Nothing worse than people who always cry rasism when ever things arent going their way. Its old and tired.

I'm sure that it is.... I feel that way about it.
But, if someone happens to be running into it all the time, and it's actually detrimental to their living a decent life, I think they've got a real complaint.

[Eddie]

I agree they have a real complaint, and probably valid on all accounts. Just, in the same way that they will allow lets say a Jew, a Black guy, a greek, a German or just about anyone else to compete, so they have to let a racist compete.

My point simply is, we cannot change those guys. But imagine the dissapointment and disgrace to him when he fights a black man and looses.

Trust me, these things have a way of sorting themselves out. Being politically correct only helps with the show.

In the morning I go to gym at the local health club. Theres thi sone elderly black man who always wear the same tshirt from one specific political party. Their slogan (printed on the back of the shirt) says " Kill the Boer" (boer refering to the White Afrikaans - Dutch- people of which I'm one). I've seen many white afrikaans people walking past the guy, slapping him on the shoulder and say ' howsit boet' (how are you my brother - a polite and informal way of greeting in SA). Them ignoring his blatand racist slogans on his shirt probably cooled the situation down and effectively rendered his poltical propaganda as worthless.

If we dont take offence to their slander, they have nothing on us.

Neo Nazi's and who ever else are only big in their own worlds.

[bakxierboxer]

.... Neo Nazi's and who ever else are only big in their own minds.

"Fixed that for ya..."

[SevenStar]

He has the right to compete just like anyone else. however, it was be funny as hell to match him up against black and hispanic guys that all beat him. I wonder what it would do to his pride.

[1bad65]

Boxing does not have clean hands either. Some good boxers were introduced to boxing in prison. Ron Lyle is one of the more famous ex-convicts to enter boxing.

Until 1975 Muhammad Ali was part of the Nation of Islam, a racist organization.

I won't give his name, but there was a fighter I met a few times backstage at fights who had SS lightning bolts tattooed on himself. He later covered it up.

[doug maverick]

I agree they have a real complaint, and probably valid on all accounts. Just, in the same way that they will allow lets say a Jew, a Black guy, a greek, a German or just about anyone else to compete, so they have to let a racist compete.

My point simply is, we cannot change those guys. But imagine the dissapointment and disgrace to him when he fights a black man and looses.

Trust me, these things have a way of sorting themselves out. Being politically correct only helps with the show.

In the morning I go to gym at the local health club. Theres thi sone elderly black man who always wear the same tshirt from one specific political party. Their slogan (printed on the back of the shirt) says " Kill the Boer" (boer refering to the White Afrikaans - Dutch- people of which I'm one). I've seen many white afrikaans people walking past the guy, slapping him on the shoulder and say ' howsit boet' (how are you my brother - a polite and informal way of greeting in SA). Them ignoring his blatand racist slogans on his shirt probably cooled the situation down and effectively rendered his poltical propaganda as worthless.

If we dont take offence to their slander, they have nothing on us.

Neo Nazi's and who ever else are only big in their own worlds.

there's an old saying that all the comedians and black people say that the most racist person(s) in the world are old black men. it looks like that holds true even in the mother land.lol

i think we all just need to keep ****ing each other till we become one color. but then we'll find something else to hate about each other. its sad really. i mean even amongst blacks there is heavy racism if your of a darker skin tone black people treat you worst then any white racist could dream off.

[Eddie]

I dont see racism as a colour thing only. Down here, even amongst different tribes from the same colour people HATE each other. Even yesterday i was told by one person (who is from one tribe) that the people from another tribe are not human. I asked this lady how could she be so blatendly racist, and she simply said " its not racism, its simply the truth".

But 7star, Ive seen that hapen so many times. Big bad racists who get beaten by a black man with ten times more skill and endurance than him.

Im going to make a racist comment now tho.

I think that black fighters usually have more endurance than white fighters. Mental and physical. Theres this real thing called African stubborness that is all to real. Black guys can probably take a little more than your avarage white dude.

i know this is a gross generalisation, but its something I can say from lots and lots of experience. Maybe its a physiological thing.

[doug maverick]

thats actually not racist. it's partially true, has to do with the way black absorb proteins in there body. read a book called black superman, which goes into detail about this. it was written by this swedish doctor i forget his name. but it was an interesting read.

[sanjuro_ronin]

If you two are refering to the genetic potential differences between races, it seems to be a by product of environment as much as the genes.

Kenyan distance runners for example, great runners because of the altitude training as well as the genes.

[BruceSteveRoy]

Racism is everywhere. I live in a country where it is all out in the open (from both sides).



racism in south africa? i find that hard to believe.

[BruceSteveRoy]

If you two are refering to the genetic potential differences between races, it seems to be a by product of environment as much as the genes.

Kenyan distance runners for example, great runners because of the altitude training as well as the genes.

also they are great runners bc they train for years barefoot and as a result learn nearly perfect form to avoid injury and to maintain efficiency. whereas runners from richer nations tend to have shoes that allow for poor form (i.e. heel striking and up right posture) due to artificial support and cushioning. either way it is environmental. there has been a point made in the US that after a few generations of selective breeding of slaves (to maintain the strongest and healthiest) that the african american decendantss tend to be more physically fit and better at athletics. now i personally don't know if this belief holds water. i don't think its necessarily true but at the same time i don't know. i personally tend to lean more towards the environmental factors when issues of race come in and less on the biological/evolutionary factors. but both play a part.

as for the racism in MMA. i am ambivalent. if i came to work wearing a, lets say tie, with swastikas on it i can expect to be fired. it creates a hostile working environment. this guy is doing pretty much the same thing. however, a hostile working environment is not necessarily a bad thing in his line of work. so is his behavior necessarily contrary to the mission or corporate culture that MMA has created? i don't think so. plus the 1st amendment protects guys like this just like it would protect me when i say these ppl are douchebags. so is my first amendment right worth more than his just bc his opinions are unfavorable to the majority of the population and my assessment of his douchbaggery is coorect? no. so while i see the PR nightmare it creates and potential for violence that occurs when this fighter loses to a black guy and his skin friends beat up a black dude in the parking lot (or some such thing). i have to side with the consitution. so morally i think its wrong but legally he is within his rights.

[monji112000]

Here's a topic that might arouse controversy. Let's see if we can discuss this with some civility. I'd hate to have to close this thread later.

its a free country say and believe what you want. Just keep it respectful in and around the cage/ring. Watch your back when you go to the parking lot.:rolleyes:

[Eddie]

I hear what you are saying Bruce, but I still think its more an issue of genetics. Kenyan runners aren’t the only ones who train barefoot, I mean down here that’s the shoe of choice (barefoot).

I hate this whole rao over the words racism. While I know it’s a reality and I understand the issues, I just think its seriously over done these days.

Cosmo Kramer was recently in court for some racist jokes he made in a comedy act. His closing speech was pretty good. I’ll try find it and post it here.

As for fighters, perhaps all that just adds to the entertainment value of the sport.

[mawali]

There is no racism in MMA! No one is prevented or forbidden from competing.

You are tough enough to fight then that is the main thing. What exists are people who bring negative racist ideology and spit them to the greater audience by written and other vehicle and this comes when major networks are planning to add MMA events to their programming.

The fighter either covers the 'offensive' material or does not participate!
The choices are clear if you want to reach the heights you want to achieve.
If one's ideology is more important then don't participate and go out and preach it.
If you are tough enough, cover up, and win to show superiority, then more power and supposedly more converts! If you end up losing by a big beatdown, then all the talk is cheap. Just another blowhard empty vessel!

What kind of supremacist is surname Costa! It takes all kinds.

[BruceSteveRoy]

What kind of supremacist is surname Costa! It takes all kinds.

lol that was one of the first things i noticed but i let it slide.

so here is the crux of the issue. can he be let go as a fighter from the organization for being racist and displaying it? racism is protected by the constitution as long as the racism does not turn to discrimination. but in essence couldn't a case then be made against the employer for discrimination against the racist if they don't let him stay on? if his right to be a racist protected and he gets fired than my guess is he would never have to fight again. after he sues the company and wins a large settlement he should be pretty set financially.

[Eddie]

Doesn’t your constitution allow for free speech, freedom of religion and freedom of association?

In the same breath, they should then tell other fighters to cover up their religious tattoos cause it might be offensive to non religious people.

I don’t think so. Perhaps you guys should chill a little.

[sanjuro_ronin]

The very nature of free speech is defending the views that you couldn't disagree more with.

[BruceSteveRoy]

Doesn’t your constitution allow for free speech, freedom of religion and freedom of association?

In the same breath, they should then tell other fighters to cover up their religious tattoos cause it might be offensive to non religious people.

I don’t think so. Perhaps you guys should chill a little.

thats what i am saying. this guy is protected even if what he is expressing is reprehensible. i don't know who you are directing the chilling out to. i have no emotional response to any of this. i am just looking at it from the perspective of the legal rights of everyone involved.

but your religion argument, while somewhat pertinent, is a flawed argument. religion on some level is a choice. a person can 'choose' to be atheist or not. when you are talking about being offended by a religious tattoo it can't compare directly to being offended by a racist tattoo as no one is given a choice of race. though that is just arguing semantics and is tangential.

i think the bigger issue is what are the actual rights of the empoyer to take any action against the fighter? as far as i can see his only recourse is to intentionally stack the guy up against fighters that are "better" than him so that he walks away with a losing record and use that as a justification to no longer carry his contract. of course that could completely blow up in his face and the guy could win a lot of really important fights and become the face of the organization. or the chest in this case. That would make things much worse from a PR standpoint. but who knows.

[MightyB]

From:
WHITE IDENTITY DEVELOPMENT: A PROCESS ORIENTED MODEL FOR DESCRIBING THE RACIAL CONSCIOUSNESS OF WHITE AMERICANS
by HARDIMAN, RITA, Educat.D., University of Massachusetts Amherst, 1982, 240 pages; AAT 8210330

"The White Identity Development Model described in this study consists of five distinct stages of consciousness and four transition periods that occur between the stages. These stages are named: (1) Lack of Social Consciousness which is characterized by a lack of awareness of racial differences and racism; (2) Acceptance, marked by the acceptance of White racist beliefs and behaviors and the unconscious identification with Whiteness; (3) Resistance, characterized by the rejection of internalized racist beliefs and messages and rejection of Whiteness; (4) Redefinition, marked by the development of a new White identity that transcends racism; (5) Internalization, marked by the integration of the new White identity into all other aspects of the identity and into consciousness and behavior."

Why so many white guys tell people they are Indians.

Personally I think stories and threads like this are designed to try to make white youth be ashamed of being white- ie white guilt- and that this type of story diverts attention from a major issue and cause of racism in America - i.e. black irresponsibility.

Now let the flaming begin my apologist friends.

[bakxierboxer]

Personally I think stories and threads like this are designed to try to make white youth be ashamed of being white- ie white guilt- and that this type of story diverts attention from a major issue and cause of racism in America - i.e. black irresponsibility.

Now let the flaming begin my apologist friends.

Heh!
I think you just smacked that snail on it's head.
(lots messier than just smacking a nail....)

[SoCo KungFu]

Started looking stuff up after reading this thread. Found this...

http://law.jrank.org/pages/12639/Brandenburg-v-Ohio.html

....thought it was interesting. Usually this legal stuff just gives me headaches though.

I guess what its saying is that for speech to be barred it would have to be deemed to incite criminal action.

If that's the case it'd be hard to say that a tattoo on one man is the cause of a bunch of retards going rampage outside a MMA event.

But promoters are free to sign whoever they want to a fight. Heck...Basketball players can be suspended for wearing shoes that aren't with team uniform. If they decided that they didn't want this guy fighting in their events anymore they don't have to have him. They aren't violating his free speech by dropping him because of his tattoos. Nor would they be if they made him cover them up or tell him to have them removed or he can't fight. Its their decision to promote whatever image they choose for their company. If he is still fighting, then its because they feel that the controversy he causes will bring in more profit than what they will lose from those that care not to see it.

Granted the military has its own set of laws in addition to civilian...but if I walked in with a swastika on any visible part of my body, I could get discharged. I find it hard to believe there would be too many of employers of any line that would tolerate such a thing.

[MightyB]

Granted the military has its own set of laws in addition to civilian...but if I walked in with a swastika on any visible part of my body, I could get discharged. I find it hard to believe there would be too many of employers of any line that would tolerate such a thing.

What if he is a Buddhist or an American Indian?

Free speech is for all. I'd like to see a lawyer take on the military with this issue.

oh yeah- for the uninformed who have questions about my thread: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2006/11/white_guilt_doesnt_help_blacks.html

[Lucas]

Would this even be an issue if it was "native pride" or "black power" ?

From the standing the guy explained he is working from, its not any different than having pride in your race, regardless of what race you are calling from.

He could be lying, but didnt he basically state his standing is not different than a chinese man or a japanese man. that being pride in his nationality and not wanting to mix with other ethnicities.

Why is it only a problem for white people to be proud of their heritage and to want to keep it the way it is?

I know plenty of viet, japanese, chinese, black, hispanic that just dont want to breed outside of their ethnicity.

Are they all hating race mongers?

I myself hail from a very mixed background, so I dont care because I cant be racist or I would have to hate myself. I have too much conflicting blood in myself.

Part of the reason I never understood this kind of crap.

BUT, from the way the fighter self describes his beliefes, it doesnt sound like racial hatred, but rather racial pride. Thats not to say he isnt a big lier, he may be, but if you take what he says in his interview, its not the same thing as racial hatred.

Its not his fault if nazi's and skinheads latch onto his image. He is there to fight.

[SoCo KungFu]

What if he is a Buddhist or an American Indian?

Free speech is for all. I'd like to see a lawyer take on the military with this issue.

oh yeah- for the uninformed who have questions about my thread: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2006/11/white_guilt_doesnt_help_blacks.html

Don't matter. Its detrimental to unit cohesiveness and thus mission success. Like I said the military has its own set of laws too. I would imagine a civilian attorney would have a hard time in a military court proceeding. If that one bothers you I guess I shouldn't tell you its also a violation to attend a rally in uniform or to talk $h!t about Pres. Bush at work.

But the issue is that they (King of the Cage) can promote or reject whatever image they feel. If they were worried about the image he presents then they would have removed him already.

Though I do think a lot of people misuderstand the whole free speech thing. You are free to speak so long as that does not violate another's right to liberty or happiness.

Is he doing that via his tattoos? As much of a douche as I think he is I don't think he really is. We can always turn off the tv. Or leave an event. I'm willing to bet there's more than one fighter that would be more than happy to tear him a new ********.

Now if I knew he was billed for a fight event in my town, would I go watch? Probably not. I'm not going to give my money to a company that promotes an image I disagree with. That is the issue that KotC has to deal with really. And I guess they've decided controversy is good for profit. Oh well....I can still go watch UFC pay-per-views for free at Buffalo Wild Wings or H o o t e r s :D

[Eddie]

i don't know who you are directing the chilling out to. i have no emotional response to any of this.

no no, not to you, just in general. I mean people (who calls racism for everything) in general.

I dont agree that he has a right to offend anyone with his tattoos either, but I'm just saying he has the right to freedom of speech.

We can get so pitty with this. He has the right of association and free speech, but I also have the same rights for him not to impose or offend my religious views etc.... aaaarrrgghhhh... this is sounding so typical south african ;)

point is, lets concern ourselves with his actual fighting ability instead of his personal views on things.

Costa is Greek isnt it?

[Lucas]

Costa is Greek isnt it?

Definition: Meaning "coast" or "riverbank," this surname denoted a person who lived by a river or the sea.

Surname Origin: Italian, Spanish, Portugese

Alternate Surname Spellings: DA COSTA, DI COSTA, DE COSTA

[BruceSteveRoy]

Costa is Greek isnt it?

Costas is Greek.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Costas is Greek.

I knew a greek girl, she love to...er...um...nevermind..

[Lucas]

I knew a greek girl, she love to...er...um...nevermind..

Pics...or it didnt happen. ;)

[sanjuro_ronin]

Pics...or it didnt happen. ;)

That's right, it didn't happen !
You didn't see anything ! * circles hands in the air*

[Lucas]

what...what was going on?

[Seppukku]

Personally, I think there's a lot of white supremacist rhetoric being bandied about in this thread, and I find it disturbing.

The question is not: "Doesn't he have the right to say..........?"

It's: "Yeah, he has the right. But don't we have the responsibility to weed out the problem, sequester it, and cast it out to the pigs (and by pigs, I mean white supremacists)?"

BTW Mighty B: thank you for quoting a racial psychology study performed in 1982, such as society has not progressed since then and we're still dealing with the same racial demographics and the same political environment. Thank you, sir.

*In case you couldn't tell, I was being sarcastic.

One of the many advantages whites enjoy in America is a relative freedom from the draining obligation of racial inversion. Whites do not have to spend precious time fashioning an identity out of simply being white. They are white. The biggest racial demographic? White. They do not have to self-consciously imbue whiteness with an ideology, because their ideology is the Constitution, the Capitalist Economy, and Judeo-Christian ideologies. They don't have to look to whiteness for some special essence, or divide up into factions and wrestle over what it means to be white. Their racial collectivism, to the extent that they feel it, creates no imbalance between the collective and the individual. This, of course, is yet another blessing of history and of power, of never having lived in the midst of an overwhelming enemy race.

Poor, poor white people, that they now have to contend with immigrant populations, the influx of foriegners, and a new "PC" language. Poor, poor white people, that their little self-containing bubble must burst, and they have to actually deal with other races as equals.:eek:

For millenia, the white race has treated foriegn populations as inferior--from Alexander and Aristotle to the Colonials, to the US founders, to the "White Man's Democratic Burden" of the Bush era.

So if a white supremacist convict gets tossed out of an MMA tourney because he has propaganda tattooed across his chest, and clearly is using (evidenced by no lack of quotes) his 15 minutes to forward a racist platform--well, that would only show that MMA has something that it has never shown before.....


Class.

[Seppukku]

BTW, if he is allowed to compete, he should only be able to use "White" martial arts, such that the Brazilians, Thais, Japanese, Chinese, etc. are all inferior to his supreme "White" martial arts of the motherland.

*In case you couldn't tell, I was being really sarcastic in that last line.*

So I guess that leaves him with old-school Irish boxing (without the African American and Hispanic modifications that really made the sport/art what it is), and Greco Roman wrestling. I don't know, does Savate count as a white art? It's kind of like kickboxing, only with that effete French influence.

[Seppukku]

The question is not: "Doesn't he have the right to say..........?"

It's: "Yeah, he has the right. But don't we have the responsibility to weed out the problem, sequester it, and cast it out to the pigs (and by pigs, I mean white supremacists)?"


Before the White Supremacy pundits revv their engines, I should clarify: I don't think the government needs to regulate free speech. But, as is the case, we the people do. It's why we can say "****" on cable television after 10 PM, but not on this website. It's a matter of what is proper for the context. The government need not pass a law, but why doesn't the commission that oversees MMA? Is it proper to propagate white supremacist agendas in MMA, which is essentially "Mixed Foriegn Martial Arts", Anglocized by the UFC (which stole it from Brazilian Vale Tudo and Japanese Pride)?

[Three Harmonies]

Freedom of speech should never be taken away from anyone, regardless of their words nor stance on any issue.
On the flip side if all of us ignore stupid *******s, and throw up our arms saying "just ignore it" racism will never go away.
Shame on KOTC for promoting such idiots, and their ideas. Shame on those who buy tickets to see this fighter (or any other racist) fight. People will argue with me, but in the end you are all helping to perpetuate the problem.
If I ran an organization I would tell him to remove the tat's or he does not fight with my organization. Simple. People aren't really interested in making the world a better place if they can make money. Period. Sad.
Jake :cool:

[Shaolin Wookie]

Aw, you two are being too harsh. Come on, give the guy a chance......if he's good enough for parole, he's good enough to roll.:p

[Gets on phone with Kimbo to set up a match and teach that white boy some manners]

[Three Harmonies]

I would give him a chance. He has a chance to at the very least, remove the propoganda bull**** from his body. I would love to see Silva, or Evans, Jackson, or Randleman crush a fool like that who "is showing his pride for his race!"

[GeneChing]

'A bad-ass line of apparel' indeed. I have this Shaolin swastika tie clasp. It's a small red circle with a gold swastika. I've never worn it and probably never will. It's all about context.

December 14, 2009 | 2:21 pm
Neo-Nazis in mixed martial arts? (http://www.jewishjournal.com/thegodblog/item/neo-nazis_in_mixed_martial_arts_20091211/)
Posted by Brad A. Greenberg

Is it fair that some people associate mixed martial arts with racist groups? Probably not in general. But what individual mixed martial artists that sport Hoelzer Reich gear, which features iron crosses and SS symbols and is being attacked by some fans as a neo-Nazi branch of UFC?

A UFC spokesman said the group had “no affiliation with any right-wing groups or ideology.

“The head of UFC UK, Marshall Zelaznik, is Jewish and as a company we would have absolutely nothing to do with anything antisemitic at all.

“Our fans and our fighters are into heavy metal and heavy rap whether they are black, white, Jewish, Japanese or Chinese. We have fans all over the world. Their lifestyle is tattoos, heavy metal and rap.”

Hoelzer Reich’s website states the company has no links to political organisations.

On the site, owner Jed Colvin writes: “Our interest in German imagery comes from a historical and ancestral standpoint. For many years, we have collected German memorabilia.

“We chose the name Hoelzer Reich, not only because it reflects Strength and Honour, but because it is part of our family history. We started this company using a family name, our love for apparel and design, and a desire to create a bad-ass line of apparel.”

[Lucas]

racism of course is wrong. but i dont think that brand of clothing is racist. too many people see any thing german and instantly associate that with hitler and nazis. which simply is kind of stupid, it would be like, well anything distinctly american being associated with the massacre of the native tribes.....

some things are just, well, german. and, last time i checked, being german itself does not mean you are racists. lol

the iron cross isnt just a racist image. it was actually developed before world war 2. its fashioned after the crosses that the Teutonic Knights used in the 14th century.

now dont go thinking i sport iron crosses or are some nazi, because im not, and dont dress with that style. but facts are facts.

the original german iron cross is intended to carry with it the same message as any other religious cross.

god forbid, dont wear any red white and blue or you may be one who supports rabid genocide...:rolleyes:

[MasterKiller]

'A bad-ass line of apparel' indeed. I have this Shaolin swastika tie clasp. It's a small red circle with a gold swastika. I've never worn it and probably never will. It's all about context.

Holzer Reich is out of the MMA clothing business because of the uproar. This is old news.

[Wayfaring]

Where's the issue? Either you are a skinhead or you get the chance to knock one out. It's a win/win.

[goju]

i say let him fight im sure theres plenty of guys in mma that would like to get a crack at rearanging a neo nazis face:D

[Yum Cha]

Where's the issue? Either you are a skinhead or you get the chance to knock one out. It's a win/win.

Best case scenario, two skinheads kicking the sh1t out of each other....just sayin...

[Lucas]

Best case scenario, two skinheads kicking the sh1t out of each other....just sayin...

rofl! esp if the ref wasnt white! haha, just dont stop the fight, let em break each other.

[bawang]

well the anti religion anti tradition and promiscuity used to be shocking in the old days
the only way to be counterculture is to be even more extreme

[uki]

Here's a topic that might arouse controversy. Let's see if we can discuss this with some civility. I'd hate to have to close this thread later.LOL... neo-nazi tough guys... if they want to keep themselves that pure, all they have to do is have sex with white women only. duh... those guys's are effing ****s. seriously, nazi wanna-be's are retards. :)

[bawang]

how comes theres no yellow supremacists in america?
lol

[Lucas]

how comes theres no yellow supremacists in america?
lol

lol, start a group. you can commit your first hatecrime against me

[bawang]

seriously speaking the most racist people are minorities who think theyre white
freaky sh1t bro

ive had someone saying to me "that guy looks weird" "oh never mind its a chinese" and he was a 5 foot dark skinned indian midget with a jerry curl

theres no one more racist than a middle easterner/indian who thinks hes white roffl

[Lucas]

he was a 5 foot dark skinned indian midget with a jerry curl

theres no one more racist than a middle easterner/indian who thinks hes white roffl

hahahaha, dude. why you gotta trash talk your homeboy like that?

[uki]

hahahaha, dude. why you gotta trash talk your homeboy like that?i bet he's like 12. :D

[Pork Chop]

how comes theres no yellow supremacists in america?
lol

actually i don't know that this is necessarily true

on the same token i don't agree with seppukku's statement that white people never have to deal with being labeled solely by their race

there are a-holes of all creeds and colors, it's not just a white thing
there are plenty of areas in the country where white folks are uncommon & stand out as such

[mawali]

Would this even be an issue if it was "native pride" or "black power" ?

It would not be an issue because 'white power" only allowed itself to take root by force of law (de jure) and by practice and it forbade others from expressing that belief (of their own heritage).
"Native power" and 'black power" have never passed laws abrogating the rights of citizens or preventing them from voting or otherwise so when someone spouts the words "white power" people recall the era in which that type of exercise was only for them and no one else.

[uki]

god forbid, dont wear any red white and blue or you may be one who supports rabid genocide...them colors are gang colors homie!!!

[TenTigers]

White Supremists are a parody of themselves. Imagine a White Supremist named Costa! Conjures up Dennis Hopper's speech to Christopher Walken in, "True Romance."
What's funnier still is the White Supremist movement in the US.
Imagine these hicks fighting for a "Pure White America." WTF? They're originally NOT even from this continent! There are no Pure White Americans-unless you're an albino Navajo.
I would think Native Americans find this hysterical.
(if it weren't for the atrocities they've sufferred)
I don't think you could find a better definition of stupidity.
The sad thing is, ignorant "white america," makes up the majority of the country's voting population. You go 50 miles outside the city limits, any city, and you're in Kentucky.
These people were basically bred (inbred) to be ruled. The Gov't. depends on them, as they are the true sheeple. They believe propaganda. They believe whatever they are fed. And yet, these are also the ones who create militias.....go figure.

[Dragonzbane76]

You go 50 miles outside the city limits, any city, and you're in Kentucky.
These people were basically bred (inbred) to be ruled. The Gov't. depends on them, as they are the true sheeple. They believe propaganda. They believe whatever they are fed. And yet, these are also the ones who create militias.....go figure.

wow dude just wow. couldn't get more stereotypical could you?

So your saying that 'all' everyone in rural america are imbred and that they led by the nose of the govt. to vote any platform that the center has?

people sometimes make me mad that they just kinda throw anyone not in a city into deliverance standards. Talk about racist views. :cool: I find more racist people in cities than in the outer.

[Iron_Eagle_76]

White Supremists are a parody of themselves. Imagine a White Supremist named Costa! Conjures up Dennis Hopper's speech to Christopher Walken in, "True Romance."
What's funnier still is the White Supremist movement in the US.
Imagine these hicks fighting for a "Pure White America." WTF? They're originally NOT even from this continent! There are no Pure White Americans-unless you're an albino Navajo.
I would think Native Americans find this hysterical.
(if it weren't for the atrocities they've sufferred)
I don't think you could find a better definition of stupidity.
The sad thing is, ignorant "white america," makes up the majority of the country's voting population. You go 50 miles outside the city limits, any city, and you're in Kentucky.
These people were basically bred (inbred) to be ruled. The Gov't. depends on them, as they are the true sheeple. They believe propaganda. They believe whatever they are fed. And yet, these are also the ones who create militias.....go figure.

The problem with your little theory TT is the fact that your statement represents the kind of steriotypical slander you seem to be speaking out about. I am from a predominately rural area where there are plenty of rednecks and racists, this I will give you. But the thing is there are just as many of these types along with hate groups found in the urban population as well. I get sick of people lumping country folks all into this melting pot of ignorant, racist, toothless, inbred, blah, blah, blah, simply so you can continue to push your Biased agenda because you feel you are so enlightened, coming from an urban area and all:rolleyes:

I remember visiting some friends in San Diego, CA a few years ago, and when I met their friends, the ones who grew up and lived in CA their entire lives, they were shocked that someone from a redneck state like West Virginia had all their teeth, had a college education, and wasn't married to their sister. I wish I could say I was exaggerating, but I am not. People such as yourself are hypocrits and no better than idiotic white supremicist trash who hate minorities. Why, because you spew the same kind of ignorant, unsubstantiated BS about people you really know nothing about as they do. Do us all a favor and stop making blanket statements that make you look like a fool, because right now, you do.

[TenTigers]

wow dude just wow. couldn't get more stereotypical could you?

So your saying that 'all' everyone in rural america are imbred and that they led by the nose of the govt. to vote any platform that the center has?

people sometimes make me mad that they just kinda throw anyone not in a city into deliverance standards. Talk about racist views. :cool: I find more racist people in cities than in the outer.

just exaggerating to make a point. don't take everything so literal. Of course not everyone outside the city limits is from Kentucky. That;s just silly.
Some are from N. Dakota...

ignorant stereotypes are why there is so much hate.
And yes, you are right, there is alot of ignorance in the most "cosmopolitan" of cities. There are flipsides and extremes to everything. Staunch republicans,liberal democrats, and everything in between.
In my neck of the woods, NYC, and LI, there are people that think they are so sophisticated that they are blinded by their ignorance and self-righteousness.
BTW_ the Church of the Creator has a large contingent right here in Long Island, NY-scary sh1t, huh?

[Dragonzbane76]

didn't know if you were just being absolute literal on your statement. I agree there are on both sides ignorant racist. Just didn't know if you were being totally committed to that statement though. internet=Lack of tone. ;)

[TenTigers]

back on topic,
So, the fact that Costa is a white supremist, and is a hero of sorts to young, impressionable youth-due to the fact that he is a MMA fighter on the circuit, does bother me.
I think the promoters should be aware of the impact and influence the sport has, especially on the youth, and should have a responsibility to show MMA in a better light.

yeah, right. Wishfull thinking. Promotors are in business to make money.
Besides, this could become another angle to draw in more crowds.
People love to hate.
They could parlay this into a fortune. You will have the haters on one side, paying just to see him get a beating, and supporters on the other, rooting for their homeboy.
Violence is sure to erupt in the stands, only creating more media attention and hype.
I tell ya, this boy's a goldmine! $$$$
So..as a jew, is it a bad thing for me to want to invest in this guy's career?:eek::D

[TenTigers]

when he retires, he can play the lead in "Springtime for Hitler."

[TenTigers]

and back, off-topic...

I agree there are on both sides ignorant racist.
Racism exists everywhere.
My family's Russian jewish, and my father told me that many Russian Jews from his region, hate "Glitzies." Jews from Galitzia. His mother used to say, "A Glitzie can go in a revolving door in back of you, and come out in front of you"
My mom hates Germans. (my best friend for over thirty years is German, but since he was adopted, my mom tolerates him :-) She wasn't too thrilled about me dating a German girl, and was relieved when we broke up and I began dating a Chinese girl. "Well, at least she's not German." oy-vey....:rolleyes:
Many Chinese hate Japanese. Many Guongdong-yan hate Hakka-yan.
I believe Chusaulei once related a story to me where he was treated with racism by a group of Chinese, due to his origin being from another province.
Many Northerners hate Southerners. I had a Northern Chinese family walk out of my school when they found out I taught Hung-Ga, a Southern system.
My ex's mom hates Northerners-she still refers to them as Chings.
it truly amazes me.

[TenTigers]

it's all very confusing. I'm not sure who to hate....

[Pork Chop]

wow dude just wow. couldn't get more stereotypical could you?

So your saying that 'all' everyone in rural america are imbred and that they led by the nose of the govt. to vote any platform that the center has?

people sometimes make me mad that they just kinda throw anyone not in a city into deliverance standards. Talk about racist views. :cool: I find more racist people in cities than in the outer.

You'll have to forgive him, he's a new yorker
They have no concept of life outside of their metro area
My relatives think it's a short drive from California to Texas (or Baltimore to NYC for that matter), but heaven forbid you ask them to make the drive from Newark to Yonkers.

funniest thing to me is that the only time i ever stumbled into anyone from the KKK (specifically a house in the back woods sporting various flags like the stars & bars) was when i got lost driving around baltimore (in the heart of the "enlightened" east coast).

[Lucas]

i live in portland or, you have no idea how many people ask me if we are all farmers here...dude its a city with a couple million people. likewise a lot of hte people that live here have no idea where say, washinton DC is located. some know nothing besides whats on the west coast. geographical retardedness is rampant all over the states.

i just love it when people go up to mexico or down to canada....what are they from australia?

[TenTigers]

i live in portland or, you have no idea how many people ask me if we are all farmers here...dude its a city with a couple million people.
wow, that's alot of freakin farmers. How do you guys survive?:p:D

[TenTigers]

You'll have to forgive him, he's a new yorker
They have no concept of life outside of their metro area

uh...wha? You mean..you can go outside? Past the toll booths? No one's ever done that....I've heard stories...horrible stories..NO! Don't venture beyond the BOOTHS! YOU'LL DIE!!!


funniest thing to me is that the only time i ever stumbled into anyone from the KKK (specifically a house in the back woods sporting various flags like the stars & bars) was when i got lost driving around baltimore (in the heart of the "enlightened" east coast).

like I said, the World Church of the Creator, a really nasty White Supremist group has a contingent right in central Long Island. It's out there.

[Lucas]

wow, that's alot of freakin farmers. How do you guys survive?:p:D

we grow organically :p

[TenTigers]

Lucas, it's the same thing with people from other states, when they find out I'm from NY. They always ask me if I carry a gun and a knife. LOL!



well, actually, I do.
But that's besides the point!

[TenTigers]

Lucas, this would go great with your sig:
"I'm the antichrist. You got me in a vendetta kind'a mood.
You tell the angels in heaven, you never seen evil so singularly personified as you did in the face of the man who killed you."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXdzGi9_8s8

[Lucas]

Lucas, this would go great with your sig:
"I'm the antichrist. You got me in a vendetta kind'a mood.
You tell the angels in heaven, you never seen evil so singularly personified as you did in the face of the man who killed you."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXdzGi9_8s8

hell ya that quote is awesome! last night i was watching a c. walken SNL compilation, so its kind of funny to see that.

you mean to tell me you dont get mugged and then saved by the ninja turtles weekly over there?

[GeneChing]

""It's about family history," she told FoxNews.com. "It's not about Nazis at all."' That's a slippery slope there. All of our family histories might contain links to racism. That's how the world was. And now, we endeavor to rise above that.

Martial Arts Organization Defends Ban on Nazi-Like Apparel (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,580573,00.html)
Friday, December 18, 2009
By Joshua Rhett Miller

The most popular mixed martial arts organization in the United States is laying down the law: You can fight with us, you can bleed for us, you can shout till you're hoarse for us ... but under no circumstances can you walk into an eight-sided ring looking like a Nazi.

Zuffa LLC, which owns World Extreme Cagefighting and the Ultimate Fighting Champioship, is standing by its decision to ban apparel made by Hoelzer Reich, a California apparel company, due to the "offensive" images on the clothing that invoke symbols of Nazi Germany.

World Extreme Cagefighting general manager Reed Harris told FoxNews.com the decision was a "no-brainer" after a Dec. 5 bout in which UFC fighter Joe Brammer wore a Hoelzer Reich shirt featuring an iron cross.

"We felt there was a possibility that some of their clothing, some of their symbols could be offensive," Harris said. "Once we looked into it, we immediately made the decision to not allow them into our events. It was a no-brainer, it really was."

The "shocking" images found on some Hoelzer Reich apparel, Harris said, will be permanently banned from all WEC and UFC fights.

Jamie Vine, owner of Hoelzer Reich, has apologized for "any controversy and the excessive media attention it has brought to Zuffa," but she defended the symbols on the clothing, saying they predate the Third Reich by centuries.

"The imagery that we reference dates back hundreds of years before Nazi Germany, and we did not realize that the brief association some of the imagery had with Nazi Germany over 70 years ago would still be so sensitive to so many people," the company said in statement issued earlier this month.

"Bottom line: we NEVER meant to offend ANYONE. We do not support the Neo Nazi 'cause,' nor do we promote any racist ideologies."

Other images found on Hoelzer Reich apparel include depictions of the Prussian/German war helmet and flaming skulls surrounding the iron cross.

Vine said she was "not at all surprised" by the controversy surrounding her company's apparel, but she was adamant that Hoelzer Reich garments do not contain images of swastikas or SS bolts.

"It's about family history," she told FoxNews.com. "It's not about Nazis at all."

She declined to indicate whether the shirt Brammer wore into the ring will be discontinued.

According to its Web site, Hoelzer Reich translates directly to "Lumberjack Nation" or "Lumberjack Empire."

"We chose the name Hoelzer Reich, not only because it reflects Strength and Honor, but because it is part of our family history," the Web site reads. "We do not have any Political affiliations with any organizations, nor specific views of any controversial parties. Our interest in the Iron Cross and German history comes strictly from a historical and ancestral standpoint."

Calls to Brammer seeking comment were not returned Tuesday.

Ardy Arani, managing director and CEO of Championship Group Inc., a sports marketing firm based in Atlanta, said the move by Zuffa to ban the controversial apparel is proof that the company is serious about regulation.

"The UFC is attempting to regulate themselves like any other legitimate sport does," Arnai told FoxNews.com. "What this points out if they're serious about it. They're saying, 'Hey guys, we're running a sport here. We get to write the rulebook.'"

Rick Burton, a sports marketing professor at Syracuse University and former chief marketing officer of the United States Olympic Committee, said Zuffa was right to ban the clothing.

"These are some of the most offensive images in history," Burton said. "So I think the organization is obviously not wanting that association with their product and with their brand."

[couch]

""It's about family history," she told FoxNews.com. "It's not about Nazis at all."' That's a slippery slope there. All of our family histories might contain links to racism. That's how the world was. And now, we endeavor to rise above that.

Interesting. For years, I skateboarded on Independent Trucks and thought nothing of it. The company is still going strong after all these years:

http://www.nhsfunfactory.com/brands/independent/2/Trucks/

[Lucas]

Interesting. For years, I skateboarded on Independent Trucks and thought nothing of it. The company is still going strong after all these years:

http://www.nhsfunfactory.com/brands/independent/2/Trucks/

yep, i rolled independants too, or grind kings. depending on what was cheaper at the shop after i broke or ground my old ones to death.

if people educate themselves and think about things without being rapped up in emotions, they would realize the iron cross in itself is not racist.

suppose the nazis had just used a regular cross....boy what a clusterfuk that would have turned the world into.

its just a holy cross from a different culture and its been around a long ass time.

[couch]

yep, i rolled independants too, or grind kings. depending on what was cheaper at the shop after i broke or ground my old ones to death.

if people educate themselves and think about things without being rapped up in emotions, they would realize the iron cross in itself is not racist.

suppose the nazis had just used a regular cross....boy what a clusterfuk that would have turned the world into.

its just a holy cross from a different culture and its been around a long ass time.

Great post, bro.

[Pork Chop]

what i always thought was interesting about the nazis is that they were pretty anti-Christian; yes they had a whole lot of emphasis/obsession over the holy grail; but I think it's pretty well documented that they were interested in promoting a revival of the pre-Christian pagan religion of northern europe. so the idea that they would sequester a cross (of all things) for a representation of their regime, it's almost... ironic?

[Lucas]

what i always thought was interesting about the nazis is that they were pretty anti-Christian; yes they had a whole lot of emphasis/obsession over the holy grail; but I think it's pretty well documented that they were interested in promoting a revival of the pre-Christian pagan religion of northern europe. so the idea that they would sequester a cross (of all things) for a representation of their regime, it's almost... ironic?

lol ya. those strange bastids.

the thing about me is that i dont feel bad defending germans in regards to NOT all of them being nazis because while part of my blood is german, im not a full blooded white man. so its not possible for me to be a white supremisist. the funniest thing is i usually hold that information until someone says im a racist or a white supremisist, then i make em look like ignorant retards.

hell germans now days are just huge partiers. they really know how to get down, probably has something to do with the whole world hating them for half a century.
:D

[Lucas]

Great post, bro.

;)

independants are the ****. big hardcore heavy and tough as nails. like the longest lasting trucks. i still have a few pairs that are ground down so the axles are exposed. but you could still ride em!

i was a big fan of Zero for my boards.

[Pork Chop]

remember having a gator 2 with independents and slimeball wheels back in the day.
my lil brother had a vision psycho stick; definitely the cooler board of the 2, but don't remember what else he had on it.
neither of us could really skate for cr@p though.

[Lucas]

i was one of those annoying guys that liked to ride small hard wheels. i was all about spitfire until my later years then i switched over to the jellys for the smooth riding.

man brings back memories.

swiss bones bearings ftw

:D

[Pork Chop]

i picked up a board with the small wheels in college (a full decade or so after my initial attempt at being a skater) and i hated that thing, kept flying off the board at every little pebble. The original monster truck boards were less about tricks and more about riding around town.

[Lucas]

oh ya for sure, it all started with the sidewalk surfing, its funny because skating has kind of come full circle, starting off with the long sidewalk surfing boards, now they are totally back in style. lots of long boarders out there.

dogtown and z-boys is a cool documentary about the whole rise.

i was decent. i could take 8 stairs and hand rails. that was my biggest though, so def not pro lvl. i ended up quitting when i got more obsessively serious with kungfu.

i like to think i quit while i was ahead. i never broke a bone skating, i forget how many ive busted with kungfu lol

[uki]

i rode venture-feather lites... big wheels... i was a speed demon big stair/big gap guy. kickflip down 13 stairs... no prob... busted my a$$ many times though. LOL i skated the better part of 8 or 9 years when i was younger.

[Lucas]

good times. there is nothing like it really. things come close but nothing quite like it. my most prideful moments were skating lol

out of curiosity, ever break any bones from skating? i count myself lucky that i never did. lots of sprains, scrapes and bruises though. i skated from 14-17 then started again at 20-24.

im 30 now, been thinking about picking up a longboard...i still have the last board i rode, still in nice condition i use it to hold my computer to taunt me.

[karateguy]

In reality, he loss! That speaks for itself..

But another thing to look at is the fact that his career will be handicapped due to his tats.. He can believe what he wants, but when you broadcast those beliefs, It will become an issue for him..

[MasterKiller]

good times. there is nothing like it really. things come close but nothing quite like it. my most prideful moments were skating lol

out of curiosity, ever break any bones from skating? i count myself lucky that i never did. lots of sprains, scrapes and bruises though. i skated from 14-17 then started again at 20-24.

im 30 now, been thinking about picking up a longboard...i still have the last board i rode, still in nice condition i use it to hold my computer to taunt me.

I have a Classic Caballero deck with Independent trucks and Slimeball wheels. I still ride it from time to time. I can still olie curbs, which is about as fancy as I get these days.

http://www.skateone.com/images/products/big/DCPASCSGD.jpg

[KC Elbows]

Free speech arguments usually have nothing to do with free speech.

What is portrayed and said at a King of the Cage event is a matter of free speech for King of the Cage, not each person appearing there. They can edit out anything they want, it has no constitutional bearing whatsoever.

What fighters say and do there is a matter of contract, contracts they signed to be there. Again, no constitutional argument whatsoever.

There is nothing in the constitution that says that we don't have to honor reasonable contracts.

If I sign a contract that says "I'll work at this job, while understanding that I cannot bring an AK to work and am here to work, and thus am not here to promote my political or religious views" I contractually will have to honor that, because I agreed to it, and it's perfectly reasonable. Again, no free speech issue.

There is no one working at any major company on this forum who has not made this same general agreement.

He has every right to say what he wants at his own events or in his own time, if he can find cameras that want to catch him saying it. His right to free speech remains untouched.

[Lucas]

I have a Classic Caballero deck with Independent trucks and Slimeball wheels. I still ride it from time to time. I can still olie curbs, which is about as fancy as I get these days.

http://www.skateone.com/images/products/big/DCPASCSGD.jpg

that board is so legit it makes me tear up. steve caballero is true old school. i was totally amazed at the **** he could do even as he got older.

[Yung Apprentice]

Would this even be an issue if it was "native pride" or "black power" ?
Why is it only a problem for white people to be proud of their heritage and to want to keep it the way it is?

There is no problem with it. White people do this all the time, without looking or sounding like racists. Look at Marcus Davis, when he walks into the ring with a kilt. Or Allesio Sacarro with his red, white, and green trunks. I'm irish-german-mexican-american. I have as much pride in my irish heritage as my mexican heritage. (nothing against being german, just not as familiar with that culture or part of my heritage. My german grandmother lived in a predominately irish neighborhood and adopted many irish traditions prior to meeting my irish grandfather so a lot of that culture was never presented to me)

[Kevin73]

it's all very confusing. I'm not sure who to hate....

It's easy. Spend about 10-15 minutes with each person you meet. In that time you can find something WAY more valid to dislike them for than just their skin color or nationality. LOL

[Kevin73]

The problem with the "iron cross" is that it has been adopted by racists groups. Just like the American Indians and certain Chinese groups used the Swastika. It's meaning has been transformed.

St. John's cross (aka the iron cross) is one of those symbols that were used by the Nazis (even though others used it before dating back to the crusades. Hitler was awarded an iron cross during WWI when he served) and it has been adopted to represent racist ideals. Ever notice that Harley Davidson does NOT use the Iron Cross on their apparrel? They know that it is meant to represent outlaw biker gangs (Hells Angels first used it back in the 60's) and that is is used along with white supremacy ever since.

The problem is that now the symbol has become so popular with the mainstream many people don't know what it was meant to represent in this country. It is illegal to wear the symbol in Germany still, so to claim "family history" is kind of a sidestep of the issue.

On the other side of the coin, why is this an issue? Sports are filled with racist people and it only is a story if the person doing or saying it is white. I was watching either Shane Mosley or Mayweather the other day during a recent white. The black fighter was fighting a hispanic fighter, and in between rounds the black fighter's trainer tells him to hit him so hard that you knock the grease off him. Huh? If a white fighter's trainer said that, there would have been a big deal made of it. What about Mayweather's comments about MMA being made by white people because they couldn't box? Where is the big outcry of Cain Valsquez coming in with his "Brown Power" tattoo across his chest in the UFC?

I just wish that things would be equal across the board, if someone makes a racist comment they should be held accountable for it, or anyone should be able to express their opinion in that venue.

[GeneChing]

This one is a little more dramatic than the Iron Cross. Dude looks like a villain in a bad kung fu flick.

‘Neo-Nazi‘ fighter pulled from martial arts show as media, sponsors protest (http://www.radio.cz/en/section/curraffrs/neo-nazi-fighter-pulled-from-martial-arts-show-as-media-sponsors-protest)
16-05-2013 15:35 | Rob Cameron

The organisers of a martial arts show in Prague have bowed to pressure from the media and sponsors and cancelled an appearance by a Hungarian fighter who’s covered from head to toe in Nazi tattoos. Attila Petrovszki, a Mixed Martial Arts fighter from Hungary, had been due to appear at the event - his tattoos covered in a T-shirt - on Friday; now organisers are looking for a replacement.

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Attila Petrovszki, source: RomeaAttila Petrovszki, source: Romea

Friday’s Heroes Gate martial arts tournament offers an evening of pumped up aggression for those looking to blow off a little steam. A combination of Mixed Martial Arts (MMA), kickboxing and boxing, Heroes Gate is the tenth such event, heavily advertised and held under the auspices of the Prague 9 district council.

This year however organisers found themselves with a little too much publicity; the Roma news agency Romea.cz reported that one of the MMA fighters on the bill, Attila Petrovszki, was a Hungarian neo-Nazi. Photos of the semi-naked fighter seemed to confirm this; his chest features large tattoos of Hitler and a swastika, and the words ‘Death of the Jews’ is scrawled across his abdomen. The photo quickly made the transition from Romea to Facebook and then the mainstream media, and Attila’s fate was sealed.

The event’s promoter, Ladislav Kutil, told Radio Prague the fighter’s appearance had been cancelled due to ‘media pressure’ on Heroes Gate and its sponsors, which include gyms, car dealerships and even Pepsi. The poster also carries the logos of the City of Prague and Czech Television; both categorically denied supporting the event, and some sponsors who did threatened to withdraw their support. Former journalist Josef Bouška is an expert on the Czech neo-Nazi scene.

“Let me tell you one thing. The main problem isn’t whether the guy has a tattoo or not. The main problem is that they knowingly invited a Nazi guy to compete. They would have provided him with money, that basically equals support of neo-Nazism. On the other hand, there are a number of Nazis in Mixed Martial Arts circles, at least here in the Czech Republic. They’re promoted on the websites of the gyms, they do training. So I think there’s a deeper connection between these two worlds, and it’s not going away too soon I think.”

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Josef Bouška, photo: archive of Josef BouškaJosef Bouška, photo: archive of Josef Bouška

We should stress that you can be a fan or even a fighter of Mixed Martial Arts or kickboxing and not have any Nazi sympathies at all. I think the organisers said previous Czech tournaments had featured Romany and Vietnamese fighters. So I guess it’s not the exclusive preserve of the neo-Nazi underground is it?

“No, no, no, it’s absolutely not. I believe the vast majority of fighters and gyms are OK and they have no inclination towards neo-Nazism. The problem is that they know there are a number of Nazis among them, some of them very prominent, and they don’t consider it to be a problem. They just don’t care, and I believe that sets a very bad example.”

Heroes Gate has since released a statement claiming that Attila Petrovszki’s Hungarian agent had assured them the fighter was no longer an active neo-Nazi, that the tattoos were the result of a troubled youth and he was now – through kickboxing – taking his life in a new direction, which, said the promoters, was what martial arts was all about.

A cursory glance at Mr Petrovszki’s Facebook page, however, would suggest otherwise. There he’s pictured in a T-shirt of the British skinhead band Skrewdriver, whose leader Ian Stuart co-founded the violent neo-Nazi movement Blood and Honour.

[GeneChing]

Fascist fight clubs: how white nationalists use MMA as a recruiting tool (https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2018/sep/11/far-right-fight-clubs-mma-white-nationalists)
Far-right groups across Europe and North America are using mixed martial arts to swell their numbers, spread their ideology and fight their enemies
Karim Zidan
Tue 11 Sep 2018 05.00 EDT Last modified on Tue 11 Sep 2018 08.21 EDT

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Many groups, including RAM, view their MMA gyms as training grounds for upcoming race wars. Photograph: Antonio_Diaz/Getty Images/iStockphoto

“You will not replace us.”

This was one of the slogans chanted during a rally in Charlottesville, Virginia on the night of 11 August 2017. Approximately 100 young white men – most of whom brandished tiki torches to intimidate watchers and light up their path – marched through the streets in scenes reminiscent of the Ku Klux Klan rallies that once blighted the southern Unites States. By 10pm that evening, the group of white supremacists — now chanting “Jews will not replace us” along with the Nazi phrase “blood and soil” – had reached the University of Virginia campus, where counter-protesters awaited them with banners and slogans of their own. By the end of the weekend one of the counter-protestors would be killed, struck by a car.

While some may have been under the impression that the rally was a random gathering of racists, it was actually the conjoining of several distinctive and dangerous groups of white supremacists, including Vanguard America, Identity Evropa, League of the South, and The Daily Stormer. One of the most prominent groups present that night were the Rise Above Movement (RAM) — a white supremacist group that refers to itself as the “premier MMA (mixed martial arts) club of the Alt-Right.”

Based in southern California, RAM boasts over 50 members and fashions itself as a fight club. Its members train in various combat sports such as MMA and boxing, which they later apply during street fights and protests. The group has been spotted in Santa Monica, where RAM members tried to disrupt a Committee for Racial Justice meeting, and in San Bernardino, where they took part in an “anti-Sharia law” protest with signs such as “RAPEFUGEES stay away NOT WELCOME.” They engaged in physical violence during protests in Huntington Beach, Berkeley and Charlottesville.

Under the leadership of boxer Robert Rundo and Benjamin Daley, whom ProPublica identified as the owner of a southern California tree-trimming business, RAM members infiltrate protests and disrupt proceedings by fighting with those opposing their ultra-nationalist ideology. They conceal their identities using skull masks and goggles, while wrapping their hands with tape in preparation for physical altercations. They then glorify their antics in propaganda videos posted on social media. RAM also appear to have their own gym, though the location remains a secret.

So why are white supremacist groups forming fight clubs and MMA promotions? The answer lies in the violent nature of the sport and their ability to thrive within it. Over the years, fighters with links to the far-right have been involved in some of the world’s most recognizable promotions, including the Ultimate Fighting Championship (UFC) and Strikeforce. UFC fighter Donald Cerrone and former fighter Joe Brammer were sponsored by Hoelzer Reich, a far-right brand known for propagating extremist symbols. The brand was banned by the UFC in 2009. Four years later, welterweight Benjamin Brinsa was accused by German media of maintaining ties to extremist groups in his native country, while his gym was accused of sheltering neo-Nazi fighters. He was later released by the UFC before making his official debut but did not struggle to find professional fights in Russia.

RAM’s violent ideology coupled with its penchant for MMA and underground fight clubs distinguishes it from various other white supremacist groups in the United States. It has also helped RAM expand beyond the borders of the US, recruit new members, and network with a host of other neo-Nazi groups dabbling in MMA around the world. This is evident in the group’s recent ‘Europe Tour,’ which saw RAM visit several countries across the Atlantic to “bridge the gap between the two nationalist scenes”.

What ensued on the tour was a large-scale networking event that emphasized the growing trend of fascism in mixed martial arts.

Shield and sword

On 23 April 2018, approximately 1,000 neo-Nazis and white supremacists descended on Ostritz, a small German town near the Polish border, to attend the Shield and Sword far-right festival. Held in honor of Adolf Hitler’s birthday, the two-day event featured far-right merchandise, heavy metal concerts, political speeches and an MMA tournament with competitors from some of of the most notorious white supremacist groups involved in the fight scene. Among those present were members of the Rise Above Movement.

The MMA promotion responsible for the tournament goes by the name Kampf der Nibelungen. “To live is to fight,” Kampf der Nibelungen stated on its official website. “At all times it was fighters who defended their clan, their tribe, their homeland.”

Over the past few years, Kampf der Nibelungen has held its events in secret, attracting small groups of neo-Nazis and soccer hooligans to their shows. However, the number of attendees at their events are reportedly swelling. While their inaugural show in 2013 brought in 150 guests, that figure had quadrupled by 2017. The Shield and Sword festival in April was the promotion’s first public appearance. Reports suggest that Rundo, one of the pivotal figures of RAM’s leadership, actually competed in the show.

Members of the far-right hope to use MMA to pull in young people. “It’s a question of fashion,” Sword and Shield’s organiser Thorsten Heise told Vice News. “We’re seeing lots of young people in Europe not interested in drugs, they’re interested in fighting – in the ring, with rules. Especially in the nationalist scene, it’s the style – to be fit, to have a nice body. We love that, and the MMA fighters all love this also.”

Ostritz was just one of many European cities that RAM members visited over the past few months. The group also met members of CasaPound, a fascist party in Italy. However, the highlight of their trip took place in Ukraine, where they met one of the leading figures of the far-right movement in sports.
continued next post

[GeneChing]

White Rex

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Anastasia Yankova fought at a White Rex event and promoted their clothing but denies sharing their ideology. Photograph: Pacific Press/LightRocket via Getty Images

A week after the Sword and Shield festival, Rundo and Daley’s European tour arrived in Kiev, where they met with Denis Nikitin, the founder of a Russian neo-Nazi MMA, White Rex. The company sells clothing emblazoned with neo-Nazi symbols and racist slogans, including “Zero Tolerance”, “Angry Europeans”, and “White Rex Against Tolerance”.

Nikitin, a former soccer hooligan turned entrepreneur, uses his business to spread his far-right agenda. In interviews, Nikitin speaks openly about his ideology as a white supremacist. “If we kill one immigrant every day, that’s 365 immigrants in a year,” he told the Guardian this year. “But tens of thousands more will come anyway. I realised we were fighting the consequence, but not the underlying reason. So now we fight for minds, not on the street, but on social media.”

After spending several years in Germany, Nikitin returned to Russia, where he founded White Rex in 2008. He was one of the first people who combined the MMA subculture with far-right political ideologies, and has since established affiliates in countries such as Germany, England, France, and the United States, making him a pivotal figure on the far-right.

Through violent sports such as MMA, Nikitin is able to target disenfranchised youth and promote an alternative lifestyle through nationalist fervour. White Rex uses models with blonde hair and blue eyes to promote their clothes – another strategy to help sell the brand to the young men inclined to join their cause.

While White Rex operates under the guise of a clothing brand, Nikitin also uses his brand to organize MMA events. From 2011 to 2015, White Rex hosted multiple MMA shows, some of which featured several notable Russian fighters, including Bellator star Anastasia Yankova (Yankova has denied she shares White Rex’s ideology). White Rex also hired former Bellator middleweight champion Alexander Shlemenko to train its fighters ahead of one of their shows in 2013. Though White Rex held its final event in 2015, the clothing brand continues to gain popularity.

RAM’s meeting with Nikitin was several months in the making. They regularly posted links to White Rex’s shows and clothing on their social media accounts. More recently, however, RAM has begun selling White Rex clothing on their apparel website, Right Brand Clothing, which suggests a growing relationship between the two entities. It also means that White Rex – a clothing brand that promotes hate, Islamophobia, and nazi ideology – is now available in the United States.

“RAM saw all these well organized groups in Europe and beyond that were outspoken,” Bryan Schatz, an investigative journalist for MotherJones who penned The Terrifying Rise of Alt-Right Fight Clubs, told the Guardian. “They had gyms. They had events that drew a lot of people. I think [RAM] found a lot of inspiration in how successful these groups were able to be so they wanted to import that model to the United States.”

A quick search on the Right Brand Clothing website highlights several White Rex items of clothing, including a t-shirt that features Nazi symbols, such as the SS bolts. The description reads: “From the infamous European clothing brand White Rex this shirt is 100% cotton. Made in Europe. Wear this shirt with pride. Features sleeve patch. This is a European cut, we suggest buying a size up.”

Naturally, White Rex is not the only far-right MMA brand that has caught RAM’s attention. Another group mentioned on RAM’s social media pages is Agogé, a white nationalist boxing gym founded by Generation Identity. According to the extreme right-wing group, the gym is a place for “patriots and identity in Lyon.”

Generation Identity has hosted training camps in France for over six years. Promotional videos show dozens of young men and women working out wearing t-shirts bearing slogans such as “Defend Europe”. Following their success in France, the group has attempted to expand into Canada, particularly the francophone region of Quebec. It has also spurred similar movements from groups like Atalante Quebec, who opened up a secret fight club in Quebec for its members to train in. Despite the fact that a potentially violent “identity boxing club” had been established in Quebec, the local police department had no plans to intervene or monitor the secret club.

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Members of RAM were present at the far-right marches in Charlottesville in 2017. Photograph: Mykal McEldowney/AP

On 24 May 2018, six members of Atalante Quebec – some wearing masks – barged into the Montreal offices of Vice Media, where they proceeded to insult reporters, throw leaflets and clown noses around, and intimidate those present in the office. They left before police arrived on scene. However, the group’s leader was arrested the following month and was charged with criminal harassment and intimidation. Their MMA fight club continues to operate despite their well-documented intimidation tactics.

“The alt-right and the analogous identitarian movement are encouraging their members to get off the computer and network in real life,” Evan Balgord, executive director of the Canadian Anti-Hate Network, told the Guardian. “They want their members to take real world actions. Ultimately, they want to establish a white ethnostate by any means necessary. In the case of Atalante [Quebec], they probably view opening a martial arts school as a way to prepare for street clashes with anti-fascist activists or actions they believe are necessary to bring about a white ethnostate.”

***

Mixed martial arts provides a unique platform for white supremacists to promote their ideology and recruit new members. It allows far-right extremists to draw parallels between their training regimens and the appropriation of faux-medieval culture and history to suit their racist aims. Many such groups, including White Rex and RAM, view their MMA gyms as training grounds for upcoming race wars. They use Roman and Germanic mythology to romanticize their nationalist fervour, while brainwashing youth into “defending” their homeland against a common threat.

“As far as I can tell, it is basically this idea that they need to come together – essentially like an army – to protect their race, which they see as being attacked.” Schatz explained.

RAM is not the only group in the United States engaging in MMA and street fighting. A group of young, pro-Trump white men recently formed the Fraternal Order of Alt Knights (FOAK) and announced that it would serve as the “tactical defensive arm” of the Proud Boys, a far-right men’s organization started by Vice co-founder Gavin McInnes. Kyle Chapman, the founder of FOAK, revealed that his group plans to “protect and defend our right-wing brethren when the police and government fail to do so.” Other similar groups have since sprouted in Italy, the Czech Republic, and Poland.

It is likely that white-nationalist fight gyms will continue to sprout across North America and Europe for the foreseeable future. Their ability to not only operate in the open, but to also establish a worldwide network of violent, well-trained white supremacists, emphasizes the extent of the problems facing Western society.

I hear that there are also a white supremicistcells within European Martial Arts (Armored combat: HEMA, HMB, IMCF, SCA, et.al) (http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?68492-European-Martial-Arts-(Armored-combat-HEMA-HMB-IMCF-SCA-et-al)).

[GeneChing]

RAM’s revival and the ongoing struggle against MMA's far-right fight clubs (https://news.yahoo.com/ram-revival-ongoing-struggle-against-090046171.html)
The Guardian
Karim Zidan
,The Guardian•November 27, 2019

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Photograph: Steve Helber/AP

In October 2018, the FBI arrested four members of the Rise Above Movement (RAM), a US white supremacist group that trains in mixed martial arts, on rioting charges related to their participation at the infamous Unite the Right rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, in 2017. The four men, including RAM co-founder Ben Daley and UCLA doctoral student Michael Miselis, pled guilty and were sentenced for their crimes.

The prosecution was a contrast to another case the previous month against RAM members accused of rioting at a rally in Huntington Beach, California, in 2017. A district judge dismissed the charges against RAM co-founder Robert Rundo, Aaron Eason, and Robert Bowman, claiming that the federal statute used to prosecute the members infringed upon their First Amendment rights to free speech. Tyler Laube, who had pled guilty in a separate hearing, withdrew his guilty plea and had his case dismissed. The US government is in the process of appealing the case, though it appears that the damage has already been done.

“RAM has definitely gotten a second life thanks to the court rulings that have cleared their members on federal criminal charges,” AC Thompson, an investigative reporter for ProPublica, tells the Guardian. “The group was absolutely on the verge of collapse, with its leaders and key members locked up – and new recruits scared off by fears of going to federal prison. When you look at the history of the white supremacist movement in the US you can see many instances in which white power groups survived prosecution and came out the other side stronger and even more hardcore.”

Prior to the string of arrests, RAM boasted more than 50 members and marketed itself as the “premier MMA club of the alt-right.” Founded in 2017 by Daley and Rundo, RAM members trained in various combat sports such as MMA and boxing, which they later used during street fights and protests, including Charlottesville. Dressed in skull masks, RAM members specialized in attacking protestors who opposed their ideology. They would then glorify their antics in propaganda videos posted on social media.

With the dismissal of the Huntington Beach charges, RAM has been handed a lifeline. Armed with a new lease on life, one of the most dangerous white supremacist groups in the United States is set to retake its place among a growing international network of far-right fight clubs.

RAM’s revival
In the days and weeks following the California judge’s decision to dismiss the charges against Rundo and his associates, the group took to social media to drum up support for its cause and to reestablish its base.

Using an account on far-right social media platform Gab, RAM posted pictures celebrating the charges being dismissed against its “wrongfully imprisoned” members. One of the posts boasted a new hype video under the title Keep the Flame Alive, while another showed Miselis flexing beneath the caption, “They can lock us up, they can lie about us but they can’t stop a idea whos [sic] time has come.”

To monetize its cause, RAM reached an agreement with far-right clothing store Our Fight Clothing Co to feature several of its branded t-shirts, the proceeds of which it claims will “go directly to our legal defence.” RAM also used the far-right clothing store as a personal blog to promote its violent ideology. Shortly after his charges were dismissed, Rundo posted a lengthy essay, titled Combat Sports for the Future of Nationalist, to the store’s website in which he espoused the importance of MMA as a “weapon” for white supremacists, as well as a way of building a community of like-minded individuals. “The nationalist movement was never built on idle talk but on those with iron will who didn’t back down,” he wrote. “In a time of weak men it only takes some effort to rise above all. Combat sports is that way up.”

Instead of simply releasing training montages and hype videos as it did in the past, RAM is now carefully articulating its message in an attempt to create unity amongst members. These posts also verify that right-wing fashion, propaganda, and MMA are the basis of white supremacist recruitment and mobilization tactics – a topic that has been reported on extensively by the Guardian.

“RAM hold a unique place in the white supremacist scene in the US. They are really emulating the European groups who blend together racist politics and combat sports like MMA and boxing,” Thompson says. “They have a pretty mainstream aesthetic –they aren’t LARPers or cosplaying as Nazi soldiers. And they aren’t as nerdy as a lot of the alt-right guys. The RAM approach has the potential to grow in the US.”

Beyond RAM’s homegrown efforts to recapture its peak in 2017, there is a growing concern that the group will attempt to strengthen ties with white nationalist groups in Europe, including old allies such as Russia’s White Rex and Ukraine’s Azov Battalion.

I hear white supremacy groups are also impacting Armored Combat leagues. (http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?68492-European-Martial-Arts-(Armored-combat-HEMA-HMB-IMCF-SCA-et-al)) :(

[Djuan]

:mad: Fiya burn that! One Love to one and all!

[GeneChing]

How Germany’s Extreme Right Seized on the Martial Arts Scene (https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/17/world/europe/germany-far-right-mma.html)
To increase their ranks, neo-Nazi groups in Germany and across Europe are using the sport as a training and recruiting tool.

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An image from an undated video from the YouTube page of “Kampf der Nibelungen” or “Battle of the Nibelungs,” a far-right combat sports tournament that was moved to Hungary after it was banned in Germany.Credit...via YouTube

By Catie Edmondson
Reporting from Berlin

Sept. 17, 2023

Sign up for The Interpreter newsletter, for Times subscribers only. Original analysis on the week’s biggest global stories, from columnist Amanda Taub. Get it with a Times subscription.
A professional mixed martial arts fighter based in Berlin, Niko Samsonidse, has added a ritual to his tournament prep in recent years: vetting the event to ensure it is not organized by far-right extremists.

Urging other fighters and trainers to do the same, Mr. Samsonidse has become outspoken in his efforts to call out attempts to exploit the growing martial arts scene to advance extremist ideologies.

Mixed martial arts, or MMA, “is getting way more popular in Germany, and mostly they’ve got nothing to do with extremism,” said Mr. Samsonidse, a social worker who wrote his thesis on fighting extremism in combat sports.

“But most of the people, they are not aware what’s happening beside of them,” he added.

Neo-Nazi groups in Germany and across Europe have worked to co-opt martial arts as a training and recruiting tool — hosting high-profile combat sports festivals and offering local opportunities to practice the sport — to try to broaden the groups’ appeal, experts say.

It is part of a larger strategy to make the face of extremism more mainstream. Festivals or tournament organizers market their events in a way that makes them hard to distinguish from normal combat sports tournaments. They then use the events as a gateway to soften up potential recruits to their ideology.

The festivals — which are often declared political events, making them harder to ban and ensuring that any profit will be tax-exempt — typically feature a right-wing extremist speaker or seminar, according to Hans-Jakob Schindler, the Berlin-based senior director of the Counter Extremism Project. And while mixed martial arts tournaments in Europe typically feature fighters from different racial groups, these events allow only white fighters to take part.

“They’re trying to broaden the capture area,” Mr. Schindler said. “You get people to buy the T-shirt, you can get them to come to one of the festivals. And you slowly begin speaking them to them about how the political system is bad. And so you draw them in a bit more subtly than you did in the past.”

But the message underpinning the events, said Alexander Ritzmann, a senior adviser at the Counter-Extremism Project, is clear: “that whites are under threat on all kinds of levels.”

Some of the participants have openly cast their efforts to learn martial arts as preparation to fight back against those they see as threatening white European identity, the Frankfurt Roundup newspaper reported, quoting a martial arts fighter who took part in the Battle of the Nibelungs, Germany’s most notorious far-right combat sports tournament.

“In this day and age, it’s so obvious that our people have their backs against the wall, and we all have concerns about our survival,” the unidentified fighter said on a far-right podcast in 2015, adding that the day would come when “we have to put ourselves in a ring with all these multicultural people.”

In Thuringia, an area in the former East Germany, four men between 21 and 25 are facing charges of assaulting law enforcement officers during protests against coronavirus lockdowns.

Federal prosecutors say the men led a far-right martial arts group called Knockout 51 and “attracted young, nationalist-minded men, deliberately indoctrinated them with right-wing extremist ideas and trained them for physical confrontations with police officers, members of the left-wing political scene and other people considered worth fighting.”

The group, prosecutors said, led regular martial arts training sessions at the local office of the National Democratic Party — Germany’s neo-Nazi political party — as well as “ideological training” that included patrolling the neighborhood to scout for political opponents. They sought to kill individuals associated with “the left-wing extremist scene,” according to prosecutors.
In one episode in 2020, according to prosecutors, members of the group kicked a police officer in the stomach at an anti-lockdown protest in Berlin, and months later at a protest in Leipzig, a member threw a bottle at officers, injuring a bystander.

The lead defendant’s lawyer, Steffen Hammer, has sought to have the trial dismissed, asserting that prosecutors forced his client to give information in a separate case that bolstered the current charges against him.

Mr. Hammer, formerly a singer in a far-right rock band, has denied that his client led a neo-Nazi group, arguing that the martial arts group was apolitical and the victim of overzealous prosecution, Der Spiegel reported.

Large-scale martial arts organizations and events have proliferated for years in Germany, chief among them the Battle of the Nibelungs, which attracts hundreds of right-wing extremists from around Europe and the United States. The name is a reference to the 13th-century German heroic epic poem called, “Song of the Nibelungs,” a text that was often venerated and referenced in Nazi propaganda during World War II.

The Battle of the Nibelungs, which moved to Hungary after it was banned from the German city of Ostritz in 2019, is organized “by young Germans who are united by the dedication and enthusiasm for ‘their’ sport and who do not want to be subject to the yoke of the prevailing mainstream,” according to the group’s YouTube page.
In an effort to crack down on such groups, German law enforcement has conducted extensive raids on members of the martial arts clubs and, in some cases, has banned the clubs or events themselves. The four men associated with the group Knockout 51 currently facing charges in Thuringia were arrested after 800 police officers raided the homes of 50 suspected right-wing extremists in April.

MMA groups with a far-right bent are spreading across Europe and the United States. Mr. Ritzmann said 23 active far-right martial arts clubs already operated in France alone.

“This does not mean that they’ll all turn into neo-Nazis,” he said. “Many, I guess, might drop off at some point. But really mainstreaming this combat sports approach could be a game changer.”

In Germany, leaders in the martial arts community have sought to push back on their own.

Daniel Koehler, the director of the German Institute of Radicalization and De-radicalization Studies, a nonprofit group, founded a network of martial arts schools against violent extremism that seeks to monitor for signs of radicalization in their studios and keep their students away from extremist environments.

Several years ago, Mr. Koehler said, he remembered that studios in his network “regularly” had discussions about members of their gyms whom they later learned had far-right tattoos or clothing.
“They would have to decide, is this someone who’s been with us for a long time; we need to initiate an intervention,” he said. “Or, is this someone who just recently showed up, so we can move the person out?”

His network tries to ensure that participating gyms would “not by coincidence take part in a tournament that, for example, the far right would benefit from,” Mr. Koehler said.

Mr. Samsonidse, the professional mixed martial arts fighter, said that programs giving young adults the opportunity to practice combat sports and impart positive values could be an important way to prevent the rise of far-right extremism in his sport.

“There’s a big potential in martial arts itself, to share good values — respect, controlling your emotions — which could be really useful in work with juveniles,” he said. “But it can also be misused.”


Catie Edmondson is a reporter in the Washington bureau, covering Congress.
I love Wagner but detest how myths that he spotlighted like the Nibelungs has been appropriated.