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badfrog666
05-01-2008, 10:31 AM
I am finding it very hard to believe that CLF, or any other kung fu style, could win a fight against a good MMA practitioner. Does anyone have any opinion on this? Just curious.

stout
05-01-2008, 10:35 AM
look at Cung le's MMA fights. just need to be **** hot in your stand up skills. Cung le fractured his last opponent's arm. No reason why can't do that with a Sau Choi. Can you spend 4 hours+ a day training though?

sanjuro_ronin
05-01-2008, 10:41 AM
I am finding it very hard to believe that CLF, or any other kung fu style, could win a fight against a good MMA practitioner. Does anyone have any opinion on this? Just curious.

:eek:


look at Cung le's MMA fights. just need to be **** hot in your stand up skills.

:eek::eek::eek:

lkfmdc
05-01-2008, 10:42 AM
I am finding it very hard to believe that CLF, or any other kung fu style, could win a fight against a good MMA practitioner. Does anyone have any opinion on this? Just curious.

you're right, now one in MMA uses chaap (straight punches), so (long hooks), kup (overhands) or jong (forearms). Kicks never work, and can never break an arm. blah blah blah

(we need better trolls, really, we should set up a school or something)

sanjuro_ronin
05-01-2008, 11:06 AM
you're right, now one in MMA uses chaap (straight punches), so (long hooks), kup (overhands) or jong (forearms). Kicks never work, and can never break an arm. blah blah blah

(we need better trolls, really, we should set up a school or something)

Quality control is the issue, maybe an ISO for Trolls.

kung fu fighter
05-01-2008, 06:16 PM
How does choy lee fut swinging looping punches and defense fare against western boxing tight defensive and punching structure?

k-no
05-01-2008, 08:12 PM
How does choy lee fut swinging looping punches and defense fare against western boxing tight defensive and punching structure?

I don't stick to one way of defending, whatever works.

But as a CLF fighter that cross trains in Western Boxing/Muay Thai from time to time, on a particularly long streak of Thai Boxing training, I had my guard up boxing style and got KTFO by a Sow Chui that came out of nowhere. Went right around my guard and like my Sifu teaches, came crashing downward (as opposed to completely horizontally) and sent me to queer street.

So what I'm trying to say is, it works pretty well against a boxing guard.

k

Yao Sing
05-01-2008, 08:17 PM
CLF looks like it's all long and they generally the impression everyone gets by watchng it but anyone who's trained know different.

It's one of those assumptions that will catch you off guard.

cerebus
05-03-2008, 04:17 PM
and sent me to queer street.

Dayum! Getting punched can turn a person gay?! :eek:
Imma hafta stop sparring..... :(

kung fu fighter
05-03-2008, 05:14 PM
I don't stick to one way of defending, whatever works.

But as a CLF fighter that cross trains in Western Boxing/Muay Thai from time to time, on a particularly long streak of Thai Boxing training, I had my guard up boxing style and got KTFO by a Sow Chui that came out of nowhere. Went right around my guard and like my Sifu teaches, came crashing downward (as opposed to completely horizontally) and sent me to queer street.

So what I'm trying to say is, it works pretty well against a boxing guard.

k

No disrespect intended but,

Bruce lee even said that western boxers had the best hands by far, He even went as far as to say that western boxers would distroy most kung fu guys when it came to fighting.

So if there are CLF techinqies which works better than western boxing why haven't professional boxers adapted them in the ring? or why haven't there been any CLF fighters that's holds a a boxing title? considering the amount of money they would make, i think they would definately compete if they thought they had a chance.

Yao Sing
05-03-2008, 06:27 PM
Actually I don't think they're allowed in Boxing. I've heard that at one time the backfist was part of the Boxing arsenal. Maybe someone familiar with the history can fill us in.

cerebus
05-03-2008, 07:27 PM
In boxing, any blow landed with the front padded area of the glove (not the back), to a valid target area would be valid. So, no backfists or hammerfists, but all the other closed-fist strike (Sao, Pao, etc) would be fine.

And yes, boxers pretty much DO have the fastest, most efficient and powerful hand strikes in the martial arts. They HAVE to, it's their entire arsenal.

k-no
05-03-2008, 07:30 PM
No disrespect intended but,

Bruce lee even said that western boxers had the best hands by far, He even went as far as to say that western boxers would distroy most kung fu guys when it came to fighting.

So if there are CLF techinqies which works better than western boxing why haven't professional boxers adapted them in the ring? or why haven't there been any CLF fighters that's holds a a boxing title? considering the amount of money they would make, i think they would definately compete if they thought they had a chance.

Actually, it's occasionally worked pretty well for Chuck Liddell in the UFC. In the street, you're not wearing 16 oz pillows on your hands. Bare knuckle sparring is a lot different than sparring with boxing gloves on, and if you say different, you're lying.

For that matter, playing CLF short for close range is the closest I've seen Kung Fu to boxing so it works for me...someone quoted that once, but I forgot. No one said boxing techniques (and other styles for that matter) aren't effective. If they weren't I wouldn't cross train in them. Likewise, I wouldn't train CLF at all if it hasn't worked for me in real-world situations.

k

kung fu fighter
05-03-2008, 08:02 PM
Actually, it's occasionally worked pretty well for Chuck Liddell in the UFC. In the street, you're not wearing 16 oz pillows on your hands. Bare knuckle sparring is a lot different than sparring with boxing gloves on, and if you say different, you're lying.
k

I completely agree about chuck lidde and abut the 16 oz pillows, i always thought his punches were from CLF, but weren't sure. Did Chuck ever trained CLF?

But even chuck was defeated with boxing by way of Quinton Jackson. Quinton took full advantage of chuck's wide punches by covering up and then punching chuck when he exposed himself, knocking him out.

Yao Sing
05-03-2008, 08:25 PM
Every fighting style can be countered. It's just a matter of time before someone finds the answer to Rampage. That's just the way it is, you can't escape reality.

And the answer can come from almost anywhere, maybe even CMA.

Havick01
05-03-2008, 09:52 PM
I am finding it very hard to believe that CLF, or any other kung fu style, could win a fight against a good MMA practitioner. Does anyone have any opinion on this? Just curious.

I think it depends on your training, if you look at all the aspects of CLF it as grappling as well as great stand up. If you are frighting in the street 80% of the fights end up on the ground so that means you need a good ground game aswell. You must remember that CLF is a MMA style and it has great stand up and great ground game you just have to disect the style and train hard!:)

Eddie
05-03-2008, 11:58 PM
I am finding it very hard to believe that CLF, or any other kung fu style, could win a fight against a good MMA practitioner. Does anyone have any opinion on this? Just curious.

It doesn’t matter what style you do, if your focus isn’t fighting, you wont be able to fight anyone really.
Same breath, there are some MMA players who also just do it for recreational reasons who will probably never have a real fight or a tournament fight, just the same as there are CLF players who would have the same.

And Havic, I don’t agree with you that 80% of all fights end up on the ground. That’s one statistic that grapplers usually throw around that has not yet been proven. If your theory is right, it would mean 80% of all fights (across the world in every culture). While this may be true in the usa, where you guys have wrestling in school etc, this might not be true in a country such as England where street fighting may look slightly different to other places.

But I also agree that good ground skills are very necessary.

If you train to fight, while keeping everything in mind, you should become proficient in fighting in a short time. Don’t let style vs style keep you occupied. There are plenty of unconditioned, well trained MMA fighters out there, and in the same breath there are plenty of untrained, well conditioned street fighters out there.

nospam
05-06-2008, 04:58 AM
I agree with Eddie's comments above.

Training CLF or any MA isn't the same as training specifically for sports fighting unless that's your thang. If you want to fight professionally..then you need to train like a professional in all areas of that sport. It isn't a 3x's per week deal.

For those that train and apply fighting..then it's all good when they mix it up with those that don't. Yes..plz throw that devastating AxE kick to my clavicle, then we'll see just what happens.

100% of all fights end up on the ground..for one person anyways :D

nospam
:cool:

Havick01
05-06-2008, 09:02 PM
I agree with Eddie's comments above.

Training CLF or any MA isn't the same as training specifically for sports fighting unless that's your thang. If you want to fight professionally..then you need to train like a professional in all areas of that sport. It isn't a 3x's per week deal.

For those that train and apply fighting..then it's all good when they mix it up with those that don't. Yes..plz throw that devastating AxE kick to my clavicle, then we'll see just what happens.

100% of all fights end up on the ground..for one person anyways :D

nospam
:cool:

Everbody has diffrent ways of training, im not here to say my way is the only way.
From my experience being a pro fighter and street fighter there are many was to mix it up. If i fight on the street my methods are going to be diffrent then the ring,nospan and eddie you both make good points. I still think its how you train and disect the art.;)

nospam
05-09-2008, 06:25 AM
I still think its how you train and disect the art.

..dam skippy. If you only practised 3 techniques..snap kick, ping chop and gwa..and learned how to use these in a variety of situations, and trained these in a free form method, you'd probably be able to open a can of whoop @ss dam near every time you needed.

If your practise and training methods aren't optimum..adding in an entire system is paying your teacher's bills. But hey..MA equipment don't come cheap!

It's all good.

nospam
:cool:

Norman Conway
05-11-2008, 09:30 PM
I think the real question is if choy li fut whiping arms could be used effectivly with combos in mma. Most of the time we see only western boxing style punching, a bit of upper cuts, over fists, hammer fists (choy li fut's very good at those).
There's also the question of boxing style, choy li fut trains you to hold your shoulders parallel to the opponent, then to twist your shoulders in whiping movements to strike at the longest range possible. It reminds me of bruce lee's idea of savate/fencing, it'd never be the perfect theory, yet it seems like an overall style you could train hard in.
I'd pay money to see a guy who really does kung fu win some mma. He'd have to hold himself like a scientist.

Eddie
05-12-2008, 01:29 AM
modern san shou (IWuF) only has a small curriculum of a few punches, few kicks, few throws and plenty of drills and variations.

its not about quantity, its all about quality

nospam
05-12-2008, 03:54 AM
..choy li fut trains you to hold your shoulders parallel to the opponent, then to twist your shoulders in whiping movements to strike at the longest range possible.

Sorry - not the CLF I do.

It's all good.

nospam
:cool:

Eddie
05-12-2008, 04:45 AM
MMA is much more sport orientated and fighters are athletes more so than martial artists. To enter an MMA fight, you will need to have some ground fighting skills, even if you arent planning on going to the ground. We know that most kung fu styles don’t really do ground fighting, so it would mean that the kung fu guy who wants to enter an MMA fight, needs to do some additional training in ground fighting…. Perhaps BJJ. By doing this, he becomes a cross trainer …. Someone whos more open minded than your usual traditionalist, and therefore he would be considered a mix martial artists (as he mixes his kung fu with his ground fighting), albeit just for that fight.

I’m sure there are plenty of MMA fighters who did kung fu at some point or another in their fighting career. Some probably still use some of their stuff but don’t even realize it. Point is just, the very nature of MMA pretty much indicate that it’s a mixture of various styles……

Hence the name MMA ?

WinterPalm
05-12-2008, 09:18 AM
MMA is much more sport orientated and fighters are athletes more so than martial artists. To enter an MMA fight, you will need to have some ground fighting skills, even if you arent planning on going to the ground. We know that most kung fu styles don’t really do ground fighting, so it would mean that the kung fu guy who wants to enter an MMA fight, needs to do some additional training in ground fighting…. Perhaps BJJ. By doing this, he becomes a cross trainer …. Someone whos more open minded than your usual traditionalist, and therefore he would be considered a mix martial artists (as he mixes his kung fu with his ground fighting), albeit just for that fight.

I’m sure there are plenty of MMA fighters who did kung fu at some point or another in their fighting career. Some probably still use some of their stuff but don’t even realize it. Point is just, the very nature of MMA pretty much indicate that it’s a mixture of various styles……

Hence the name MMA ?

Exactly...but I'd say more than a little BJJ is necessary...just like more than a little striking skill is necessary.
Realistically, as martial artists, any style that helps us fill in holes in our abilities makes us better. Even if we never use said skills, most Judoka use two or three techniques in competition but practice 60 or so...it's good to have variations and to know what to do.
Unless you get lucky or have an equally skilled opponent on the ground, chances are you will have trouble there.

To me it isn't about MMA vs. CLF or whatever style, who cares about styles anymore? Do what you do and learn some more! There is a lot out there, more than any man can learn, comprehend, or utilize, but closing your mind and refusing to grow and expand into other systems is silly.
Take your base, say CLF, and expand upon it with other skills but keep that your focus.
There is no CLF Vs. MMA...there is only two martial artists and in the end, one is better prepared. Once people give up their desperate deathholds onto one system and learn to see what else there is, martial artists will stagnate.

At any point in time you have to ask yourself, in what situation am I vulnerable? Then learn what to do in that position: even if you don't compete and haven't had a "fight" since grade school, most of us haven't, and we train for the love of martial arts.

Sadly, there are politics in martial arts but there are none in fighting...you either win or you lose.

Eddie
05-12-2008, 09:50 AM
There is no CLF Vs. MMA...there is only two martial artists and in the end, one is better prepared. ....


.....Sadly, there are politics in martial arts but there are none in fighting...you either win or you lose.

What he said!!!! That deserve to be signatureized!

HardWork8
05-15-2008, 07:51 PM
Dayum! Getting punched can turn a person gay?! :eek:


Yea, just take a look at some of the "functionally" trained martial artists who frequent these forums:D

lianweizhi
05-22-2008, 06:04 PM
To me it isn't about MMA vs. CLF or whatever style, who cares about styles anymore? Do what you do and learn some more! There is a lot out there, more than any man can learn, comprehend, or utilize, but closing your mind and refusing to grow and expand into other systems is silly.


I'm cherry picking your statement here out of context, but only because I think some people may misinterpret what you've said.

You follow up this statement by saying to use a particular style as your core and then add to it as needed. The problem is not every style is complementary to your core style. Recently, I visited a Chang Quan school and while several techniques shared similar principles to CLF, there were some that were in direct conflict as well. In another example, power generation in Tae Kwon Do differs quite a bit from that in CLF - most CMAs are aware of the differences in executing kicks in CMA and several other martial arts, but even punching is executed with minimal waist turn to promote speed.

On the flip side, there are several arts that could be construed as complementary. Wing chun, for instance, is very different but I think several of the techniques in wing chun can be practiced/executed without conflicting with basic fundamentals of CLF. In these cases, the other arts provide some additional tools that my help to complete your game a little more.

The point is, however, that many styles differ from their very core and by diversifying too much you may end up not being particularly good at either style or even degrade your performance in one or the other. I believe in cross training can be good, but a practitioner should be wary of conflicting fundamentals that may disrupt their balance and detract from their bread and butter.

HardWork8
05-25-2008, 07:46 PM
I'm cherry picking your statement here out of context, but only because I think some people may misinterpret what you've said.

You follow up this statement by saying to use a particular style as your core and then add to it as needed. The problem is not every style is complementary to your core style. Recently, I visited a Chang Quan school and while several techniques shared similar principles to CLF, there were some that were in direct conflict as well. In another example, power generation in Tae Kwon Do differs quite a bit from that in CLF - most CMAs are aware of the differences in executing kicks in CMA and several other martial arts, but even punching is executed with minimal waist turn to promote speed.

On the flip side, there are several arts that could be construed as complementary. Wing chun, for instance, is very different but I think several of the techniques in wing chun can be practiced/executed without conflicting with basic fundamentals of CLF. In these cases, the other arts provide some additional tools that my help to complete your game a little more.

The point is, however, that many styles differ from their very core and by diversifying too much you may end up not being particularly good at either style or even degrade your performance in one or the other. I believe in cross training can be good, but a practitioner should be wary of conflicting fundamentals that may disrupt their balance and detract from their bread and butter.

Great Post! I wish I could take it and PM it to every knucklehead on this forum but somehow I don't think the message would sink in as god knows I have tried.

Thanks again.

lianweizhi
05-26-2008, 07:07 PM
Great Post! I wish I could take it and PM it to every knucklehead on this forum but somehow I don't think the message would sink in as god knows I have tried.

Thanks again.

Thanks for the kind words! I never really posted much in forums because no one ever seemed to respond to my posts. I've joked on some other forums that I am the "thread finisher", because any thread I posted on always seemed to end after I posted!

HardWork8
05-26-2008, 09:19 PM
I've joked on some other forums that I am the "thread finisher", because any thread I posted on always seemed to end after I posted!

Maybe they were good posts.

After posting here for a while I believe that there are elements here in the forums that would not know how to respond to an intelligent post.

Other times they will gang up on you and tell you how wrong you are in going against, for example, the modern crosstraining practices, such as a person training in everything at the same time in order to overcome perceived shortcomings in his core art which he has not even practiced properly to be aware of any shortcomings, to start with.:confused::rolleyes:

So if you are ignored it is probably because you were right and there was no one able to argue with you or there was no one who could add to what you had said.


No worries.:)

SoCo KungFu
05-27-2008, 07:53 AM
Yea, just take a look at some of the "functionally" trained martial artists who frequent these forums:D

Speaking of trolls....
Seriously, you are like that monkey that just keeps throwing his poo at everyone. Do you really have to $h!t everywhere you go? You can't even make one contributive post in this thread. 3 and they are all trash talk. Its funny though, because you have been shown to be a bona fide moron.


MMA is much more sport orientated and fighters are athletes more so than martial artists.

Its kind of like back in the day, when all swimmers ever did was swim. Then somebody had the genius idea that hey, we can lift weights too! And all of a sudden they were swimming more strongly, and knocking out times that were making jaws drop. Now its common practice that a swimmer has to also build strength and flexibility to get the most of out each stroke. Look at soldiers. They are professional fighters. Just in another light. I'm not talking about the guy that flies the office desk, but the guys crawling in the sand. Now there are some slobs, but most of those guys are in some pretty good shape. The ones that aren't don't make it out too far. That or they do something dumb like pull the plates out of their vest so its lighter but wonder why they got shot half to death...

The only real thing is MMA guys are more "honest" in their training. What I mean is, if they suck at their training...they...and really everyone that watches them...know they sucked in their training. You get out what you put in. They know they are going to fight. They also know that fighting is a physically arduous activity, so they prepare themselves for that. At least most do, and when they don't its obvious. Look at BJ Penn. When he actually puts in the effort, he's about unbeatable. But (and he's the first one to admit it) there was a while that he was a lazy @$$ and he lost fights because he wasn't training for them. Now I'm not saying TMA don't know this. But well most barely ever, if at all, step foot in the gym. They know they should work out harder, but just don't. Its like when I have a patient come in with COPD, Hypertension, etc. They know they should quit smoking and eat better. Do they change? No...

You know my first kung fu teacher told me, "You need to think of yourself as an athlete and you need to train like one." Chi gung is great. I like doing Iron mountain. I like stone warrior. I like IP (though to honest I think most people that practice it, it won't really make much difference since they can't hit with it anyways.) But that being said. I'm a small dude. I push 155 on my best day. I will never be able to match up strength wise with even just the naturally big if I don't put in some time on a good strength training routine. And lets not get into cardio. Ugh....I wish they had a pukey smily face to put here...

That in mind, I wouldn't say MMA is more sport oriented. I mean yeah we all know the UFC venue and all that. But that sport vs street concept is laughable at best. I'd go so far to say that most MMA (remember, most care very little to be in UFC and all that) are more martial artist (and more athlete) than most TMA. It just goes back to being honest in your training.



The point is, however, that many styles differ from their very core and by diversifying too much you may end up not being particularly good at either style or even degrade your performance in one or the other. I believe in cross training can be good, but a practitioner should be wary of conflicting fundamentals that may disrupt their balance and detract from their bread and butter.

Differences aren't really as glaring as you might think. There might be some aspects that don't mesh. But lets be real. There's a lot of crap in even just a singular system that really should just be done away with. Trim the fat and all that....
That said, there might be a different goal in mind. Like say you might be trying to dominate the center while I might like to close it. Or even difference in technical preference. But in physical manifestation the differences are finite. There is only one human body. We have some variation with body mass, some elasticity. But they only teach one anatomy in A & P. That's why afterall we have standards of practice in kung fu. For example...stances. If I do a dan san ma with a punch in mantis or a bow and arrow stance in hung gar, guess what...they are exactly the same. Why? Because I haven't mysteriously grown a third leg. (Ronin don't even go there :D) Structure is simply the meeting between physical law and intent of motion.
This not coincidentally is why I think people need to minimize the amount of time they spend on forms for more live training. Let your fighting tell you what is technically correct. At the end of the day either it worked or it didn't.

In my opinion the issue isn't so much of style X and style Y don't mesh well. I think the real issue is that 90% of the people don't train either in any realistic light. They sucked all around and were close minded to the realistic demands of training it takes to really be a functional and more important a proficient fighter. Because well, sometimes you only got one chance to get it right...

And that's what crosstraining is about. Its not about mixing a dozen different systems like some people like to think while flailing their arms in the air and ham handing their keyboard because they have a spasm over the fact that everybody disagrees with them...ahem...hardwork8.....
Its about taking what you are good at, being HONEST with what both you and your core system lack and finding the most efficient way to correct that weakness (who would you get advice from about how to make money? That rich businessman or the homeless drunk in the corner asking said businessman for change? So are you going to waste years of your life looking for the nonexistent kungfu ground fighting or are you going to go to the bjj gym across the street?). And testing it with live feedback to ensure it is both functional and efficient, not just theorizing about it. That's why kung fu has so much fat now. People making up moves cause they sat in their nice homes and not fighting. When people actually did fight, the systems were much simpler.

lianweizhi
05-27-2008, 09:09 AM
Speaking of trolls....
Seriously, you are like that monkey that just keeps throwing his poo at everyone. Do you really have to $h!t everywhere you go? You can't even make one contributive post in this thread. 3 and they are all trash talk. Its funny though, because you have been shown to be a bona fide moron.



Its kind of like back in the day, when all swimmers ever did was swim. Then somebody had the genius idea that hey, we can lift weights too! And all of a sudden they were swimming more strongly, and knocking out times that were making jaws drop. Now its common practice that a swimmer has to also build strength and flexibility to get the most of out each stroke. Look at soldiers. They are professional fighters. Just in another light. I'm not talking about the guy that flies the office desk, but the guys crawling in the sand. Now there are some slobs, but most of those guys are in some pretty good shape. The ones that aren't don't make it out too far. That or they do something dumb like pull the plates out of their vest so its lighter but wonder why they got shot half to death...

The only real thing is MMA guys are more "honest" in their training. What I mean is, if they suck at their training...they...and really everyone that watches them...know they sucked in their training. You get out what you put in. They know they are going to fight. They also know that fighting is a physically arduous activity, so they prepare themselves for that. At least most do, and when they don't its obvious. Look at BJ Penn. When he actually puts in the effort, he's about unbeatable. But (and he's the first one to admit it) there was a while that he was a lazy @$$ and he lost fights because he wasn't training for them. Now I'm not saying TMA don't know this. But well most barely ever, if at all, step foot in the gym. They know they should work out harder, but just don't. Its like when I have a patient come in with COPD, Hypertension, etc. They know they should quit smoking and eat better. Do they change? No...

You know my first kung fu teacher told me, "You need to think of yourself as an athlete and you need to train like one." Chi gung is great. I like doing Iron mountain. I like stone warrior. I like IP (though to honest I think most people that practice it, it won't really make much difference since they can't hit with it anyways.) But that being said. I'm a small dude. I push 155 on my best day. I will never be able to match up strength wise with even just the naturally big if I don't put in some time on a good strength training routine. And lets not get into cardio. Ugh....I wish they had a pukey smily face to put here...

That in mind, I wouldn't say MMA is more sport oriented. I mean yeah we all know the UFC venue and all that. But that sport vs street concept is laughable at best. I'd go so far to say that most MMA (remember, most care very little to be in UFC and all that) are more martial artist (and more athlete) than most TMA. It just goes back to being honest in your training.




Differences aren't really as glaring as you might think. There might be some aspects that don't mesh. But lets be real. There's a lot of crap in even just a singular system that really should just be done away with. Trim the fat and all that....
That said, there might be a different goal in mind. Like say you might be trying to dominate the center while I might like to close it. Or even difference in technical preference. But in physical manifestation the differences are finite. There is only one human body. We have some variation with body mass, some elasticity. But they only teach one anatomy in A & P. That's why afterall we have standards of practice in kung fu. For example...stances. If I do a dan san ma with a punch in mantis or a bow and arrow stance in hung gar, guess what...they are exactly the same. Why? Because I haven't mysteriously grown a third leg. (Ronin don't even go there :D) Structure is simply the meeting between physical law and intent of motion.
This not coincidentally is why I think people need to minimize the amount of time they spend on forms for more live training. Let your fighting tell you what is technically correct. At the end of the day either it worked or it didn't.

In my opinion the issue isn't so much of style X and style Y don't mesh well. I think the real issue is that 90% of the people don't train either in any realistic light. They sucked all around and were close minded to the realistic demands of training it takes to really be a functional and more important a proficient fighter. Because well, sometimes you only got one chance to get it right...

And that's what crosstraining is about. Its not about mixing a dozen different systems like some people like to think while flailing their arms in the air and ham handing their keyboard because they have a spasm over the fact that everybody disagrees with them...ahem...hardwork8.....
Its about taking what you are good at, being HONEST with what both you and your core system lack and finding the most efficient way to correct that weakness (who would you get advice from about how to make money? That rich businessman or the homeless drunk in the corner asking said businessman for change? So are you going to waste years of your life looking for the nonexistent kungfu ground fighting or are you going to go to the bjj gym across the street?). And testing it with live feedback to ensure it is both functional and efficient, not just theorizing about it. That's why kung fu has so much fat now. People making up moves cause they sat in their nice homes and not fighting. When people actually did fight, the systems were much simpler.

Nicely played, SoCo. I definitely agree with you that most TMA simply don't train to fight. Heck, I'll be the first to admit that I don't do enough live sparring. And I pretty much don't do any hard contact or sanshou anymore - I can't be a very good engineer if I get busted in the head too many times!

To dispute the MMA talk, I have done live sparring with practitioners of varying degrees of skill, and can attest to having been busted up pretty badly as well as shown dominance. My brother is quite adept at joint locking (and not from a non-resisting situation - I mean catching the strike right out of the air during sparring - although he only has about a 30% success rate at this currently) and has excellent fighting endurance and vitality, having practiced sanshou with our sifu for over an hour and a half straight on a daily basis - mind you, not in 2-3 minute rounds, but literally straight time - and he's had a lot of body conditioning as well, I can fire an ideal side kick directly at his midsection and it won't faze him, and I've swung a wooden sword into his forearm block - trust me when I say TMA training can be functional. I'm a little guy myself at 155 pounds, my brother, not so much (he's over 200 pounds), but we both make it a point to build strength in the weight room and we both easily rep over 200 pounds. I guess my point here is that MMAists' aren't the only people that train hard.

As for "fat" in TMA, there is probably a bit of it, I won't deny that. But as far as my CLF is concerned, we've spent some time in analyzing moves and their applications and it does in fact become second nature to use many of the applications in sparring with and without gloves. The moves make sense when you practice them enough with the right intent and understanding, and very importantly, with someone to try it on as well. From personal experience (on both the giving and receiving end), I know that all ten seeds of CLF work - and if you think about it, why shouldn't they? They are "simple" enough.

That said, I stick with my original statement that some fundamentals of style X really don't mesh well with style Y. If you've worked hard at style X and know it's concepts very well, it's easy to see differences that aren't just stylistic but actually compromise your mechanics. Using your olympic sports analogy, why are distance runners no good at sprinting and vice versa? Because the fundamentals of the sports are different. There is almost no way for a sprinter to be a good marathon runner without compromising his skill as a sprinter. Similarly, there is no way to be excellent at two conflicting types of martial arts. That said, as I mentioned before, there are elements in other arts that complement each other and are good to "fill in the blanks".

Anyhow, I think I've rambled on enough about this. I don't really have anything against MMA, but TMA and in particular TCMA can definitely be done right, but you are definitely right about being honest in your training and your purpose.

HardWork8
05-27-2008, 09:23 AM
Speaking of trolls....
Speaking of the devil...LOL!


Seriously, you are like that monkey that just keeps throwing his poo at everyone. Do you really have to $h!t everywhere you go?
Well, if you bother to take your head out of the intellectual toilet then you wont get hit!


You can't even make one contributive post in this thread.
My contribution in this thread so far has been to agree with another poster whose views I share.


Its funny though, because you have been shown to be a bona fide moron.
False and Misleading statement. In my opinion a "bona fide moron" would best describe a person such as yourself who claims to practice traditional kung fu but somehow thinks that forms are an outdated mode of training. Someone who would not recognize the kung fu internals,even if they fell on his thick skull and hence makes jokes about "chi f@rts" etc.

Now that is a "bona fide moron"!

Now, enough digression and lets stick to the thread subject!

cjurakpt
05-27-2008, 06:50 PM
That said, I stick with my original statement that some fundamentals of style X really don't mesh well with style Y. If you've worked hard at style X and know it's concepts very well, it's easy to see differences that aren't just stylistic but actually compromise your mechanics. Using your olympic sports analogy, why are distance runners no good at sprinting and vice versa? Because the fundamentals of the sports are different. There is almost no way for a sprinter to be a good marathon runner without compromising his skill as a sprinter. Similarly, there is no way to be excellent at two conflicting types of martial arts. That said, as I mentioned before, there are elements in other arts that complement each other and are good to "fill in the blanks".

I don't know - UI think that it's not so much conflicting types of martial arts per se, but task specific parameters - for example, your runner / sprinter analogy deals with two types of human movement: running over time and sprinting, meaning that the neuromuscular system adapts to context specific types of movements (not to mention the aerobic / anaerobic demands being vastly different for each); meaning that, in theory, it could be just as difficult for a CLF guy to adapt to aikido as it could be for him to adapt to badminton: it's not that aikido conflicts w/CLF per se, but that they are just different enough skill sets to make transfer irrelevant; of course, w/the Olympic analogy you are talking about a degree of specialization that essentially precludes transfer, whereas a "non-Olypmic" CLF guy wouldn't necessarily be that specialized

however, here's what I think: I think that a CLF guy might have a better shot at aikido than another at that is similar to CLF to the point where some of the stuff overlaps, where others don't - that's because w/the aikido, it's so completely different, the body doesn't go into "CLF mode" when trying to acquire the skill; on the other hand, if you took, for example, two different CLF branches, the pattern of the guy's so choih might be similar enough to the other branches so as to cause confusion and actually make it harder to change from one version to another; the analogy is that if you speak German, it's easier to learn French than Dutch, because in Dutch a lot of the sounds are similar / same, but the meanings are not, leading to confusion (true story, from a German prof in college)

as a counter argument though, a WC guy may have no trouble picking up bok mei because the tend to work in the same range, but on the other hand he might get stuck on the subtle differences between the way they work in that range - so it's not clear cut, IMHO (and therefore, don't think we can necessarily draw any conclusions about a given art's compatibility with another per se)

the other thing to consider is that certain individuals might have affinity for similar arts: for example, a TKD guy might have no trouble picking up Northern Shaolin, whereas a a WC guy might work easily into an arnis system: the movements are very different in both, but they share many commonalities that might speak to an individual's innate skills and affinities

so, to summarize: I do agree that people can have trouble picking up different arts, but I don't think it's because "art A" is not inherently compatible w/ "art B", it's in context of how individual practitioners acquire, retain and transfer motor skills; otherwise, if we want to back up an argument that an art w/certain characteristics is not compatible with another, we'd have to come up with some sort of principle that would be predictive: take two arts at random, analyze them for content, structure, etc., then run an experiment to see if the theory holds: I mean, just to say arts are incompatible isn't really enough: you'd have to et specific and then provide evidence to substantiate that, right?

cjurakpt
05-27-2008, 06:53 PM
And that's what crosstraining is about. Its not about mixing a dozen different systems like some people like to think while flailing their arms in the air and ham handing their keyboard because they have a spasm over the fact that everybody disagrees with them...ahem...hardwork8.....
Its about taking what you are good at, being HONEST with what both you and your core system lack and finding the most efficient way to correct that weakness (who would you get advice from about how to make money? That rich businessman or the homeless drunk in the corner asking said businessman for change? So are you going to waste years of your life looking for the nonexistent kungfu ground fighting or are you going to go to the bjj gym across the street?). And testing it with live feedback to ensure it is both functional and efficient, not just theorizing about it. That's why kung fu has so much fat now. People making up moves cause they sat in their nice homes and not fighting. When people actually did fight, the systems were much simpler.
that just about sums it up...

HardWork8
05-27-2008, 07:09 PM
So are you going to waste years of your life looking for the nonexistent kungfu ground fighting.....

That statement has proven once and for all that you don't know j@ck Shiet about kung fu. And anyone who agrees with that statement knows even less than you, if such a phenomenom is at all possible.

unkokusai
05-27-2008, 11:13 PM
Oh brother, Basement Boy strikes again... :rolleyes:

HardWork8
05-28-2008, 11:07 AM
Oh brother, Basement Boy strikes again... :rolleyes:

At just about now, you should be getting a PM from Sanjuro Ronin or one of his forum kickboxer boyfriends, telling you to ignore me.

You see, if you ignore me then I might just go away and stop embarassing the pseudo kung fu-ist kickboxers who have been going around these forums for a long time, pretending to "know kung fu", giving advice on the kung fu while all the time hiding their lack of kung fu knowledge behind technical scientific jargon (a common tactic used by SUPERFICIAL FAKES in whatever area of life and for centuries at that), doing their best to project a false high tower of kung fu "widom".

Without any exception non of these kick boxers have any solid understanding of the kung fu internals.

Most of these people practice nothing but glorified kickboxing and their comments("no groundfighting in kung fu"; "forms are out-dated";"internals don't exist and/or are fantasy";"traditional kung fu is not functional";etc,etc,etc.) reflect this and they have been EXPOSED and their sore rear ends are the proof.

As somebody who doesn't even practice kung fu you may find the above statement hard to relate to but then you are a young man with plenty of time and you don't even pretend to be a kung fu expert.

However, the problem is that many of these Kung Fu kickboxers DO or at least imply that they are experts!

There you go now.

sanjuro_ronin
05-28-2008, 11:20 AM
so much (he's over 200 pounds),
That said, I stick with my original statement that some fundamentals of style X really don't mesh well with style Y. If you've worked hard at style X and know it's concepts very well, it's easy to see differences that aren't just stylistic but actually compromise your mechanics. Using your olympic sports analogy, why are distance runners no good at sprinting and vice versa? Because the fundamentals of the sports are different. There is almost no way for a sprinter to be a good marathon runner without compromising his skill as a sprinter. Similarly, there is no way to be excellent at two conflicting types of martial arts. That said, as I mentioned before, there are elements in other arts that complement each other and are good to "fill in the blanks".
.

True, but that sprinter ( or marathon runner if we take the opposite view) can pick up something that may make him a better sprinter.
Thing is, the majority of systems compliment each other far more than they don't.
Heck look at Kyokushin and Taiji for example, two totally different systems and pathways but I assure you they compliment each other quite nicely.
Our good friend Dale Dugas has done Uechi ryu and know does Bagua, two very different systems and yet I am sure there is some "uechi" still in him.

It really doesn't take much to "tailor" a system, after all, that's what the old time masters used to do, tailor a system to each student.

HardWork8
05-28-2008, 12:07 PM
As for "fat" in TMA, there is probably a bit of it, I won't deny that. But as far as my CLF is concerned, we've spent some time in analyzing moves and their applications and it does in fact become second nature to use many of the applications in sparring with and without gloves. The moves make sense when you practice them enough with the right intent and understanding, and very importantly, with someone to try it on as well. From personal experience (on both the giving and receiving end), I know that all ten seeds of CLF work - and if you think about it, why shouldn't they? They are "simple" enough.

From you description of how you approach your kung fu training I would say that you train in what is rarity nowadays and that is, an authentic kung fu school that teaches real kung fu that is combat oriented. You must realize that most people nowadays are not so lucky. See the Mcdojo/Kwoon phenomenom.

That is why a lot of martial artists go around thinking less of kung fu as opposed to other more modern MAs.


That said, I stick with my original statement that some fundamentals of style X really don't mesh well with style Y. If you've worked hard at style X and know it's concepts very well, it's easy to see differences that aren't just stylistic but actually compromise your mechanics. sprinter......there is no way to be excellent at two conflicting types of martial arts.

Agreed 100%. The key phrase there is "if you've worked hard at style X..." presumably meaning that you have gained deep/deeper understanding. I find that people with superficial understanding of a profound system are more likely to go and search answers in irrelevant systems.


That said, as I mentioned before, there are elements in other arts that compliment each other and are good to "fill in the blanks".

Following this same point of view, I would fill in the blanks by training in other kung fu styles as these are more likely to share common ground with my core art.

lianweizhi
05-28-2008, 12:08 PM
True, but that sprinter ( or marathon runner if we take the opposite view) can pick up something that may make him a better sprinter.
Thing is, the majority of systems compliment each other far more than they don't.
Heck look at Kyokushin and Taiji for example, two totally different systems and pathways but I assure you they compliment each other quite nicely.
Our good friend Dale Dugas has done Uechi ryu and know does Bagua, two very different systems and yet I am sure there is some "uechi" still in him.

It really doesn't take much to "tailor" a system, after all, that's what the old time masters used to do, tailor a system to each student.

Most definitely! There are definitely things that you can learn from other systems that will enhance your CLF ability. Also, what Cjurakpt said about similar styles being harder to assimilate is pretty much what I was trying to say about styles conflicting. As in my example with Chang Quan and CLF, both are styles with quite a few long range attacks, but how you drive those moves and execute them are quite different. Also, Cjurakpt's statement about specialization is right on the head as well - I don't think the struggles to adapt would really manifest themselves unless your muscle memory and understanding of your initial art is pretty well ingrained - it's at this point that doing something differently will cause dissonance. If you weren't very used to doing things that way to begin with, then it won't hinder you as much to do things a different way. But then it comes full circle because by doing things the different way, you'll probably never be good at the first way.

Anyhow, as I've said before, I'm not opposed to cross training - but just trying to cook up a mishmash of stuff might not be the end-all either. Actual MMA as we know it today isn't really a mix of everything out there, if you think about it. It's fundamental striking, throws, and grappling, but very refined from hard practice. As many posters have mentioned before on this forum, that's probably what CMA used to be as well, and still can be, if we work at it in an honest way and with the proper guidance and direction!

sanjuro_ronin
05-28-2008, 12:49 PM
Agreed, most people I know that cross train in one thing or another tend to do cross train on something that is "missing" or something that "catches" their eye or they believe will compliment what they do.
Most are very intelligent about it.

cjurakpt
05-28-2008, 01:16 PM
what Cjurakpt said about similar styles being harder to assimilate is pretty much what I was trying to say about styles conflicting. As in my example with Chang Quan and CLF, both are styles with quite a few long range attacks, but how you drive those moves and execute them are quite different. Also, Cjurakpt's statement about specialization is right on the head as well - I don't think the struggles to adapt would really manifest themselves unless your muscle memory and understanding of your initial art is pretty well ingrained - it's at this point that doing something differently will cause dissonance. If you weren't very used to doing things that way to begin with, then it won't hinder you as much to do things a different way. But then it comes full circle because by doing things the different way, you'll probably never be good at the first way.
well, yes and no - again, when you want to talk about acquisition of a novel motor skill, you have to look at the factors that are centered on the individual: intrinsic ability to process information, be it visual, auditory and / or kinesthetic is probably the most important (some people's neuromuscular systems are just more adept at motor skill acquisition in general); within that, is the ability of the individual to learn a skill that is relatively similar or dissimilar to what they had done previously: so some people are going to have any easier time doing CLF and learning bagua, some won't, for precisely the reason that the skills are dissimilar; likewise, some CLF people may thrive on the similarities of their CLF branch and another, otheres may be confused by this similarity;

therefore, it's probably more about how a "style" is taught to someone that makes a bigger impact than the actual parameters of a given style: meaning that, if you gave me two different MAists, I will have to adapt the way that I teach them taiji based on what I am able to discern is the manner in which each learns best - personally, I don't care if they have done TKD, bagua or western fencing, I will tap into whatever strengths they have and utilize them - meaning that for someone who is good at lateralizing, I might compare how the taiji is similar to what they have done, so they could draw on their past skill; for others, it might make more sense to contrast how it is different, so that they do not bring in the patterns they used from their old style, which might interfere with the new inormation;

so while I did state before that the specific parameters of a given style might make it easier or harder for a given individual to learn based on their intrinsic ability and past experiences, I don't believe that any two given styles are inherently incompatible: for that to be the case, one would have to demonstrate specifically why this is so and then derive a general principle based on that which would be reproducible

lianweizhi
05-28-2008, 06:30 PM
well, yes and no - again, when you want to talk about acquisition of a novel motor skill, you have to look at the factors that are centered on the individual: intrinsic ability to process information, be it visual, auditory and / or kinesthetic is probably the most important (some people's neuromuscular systems are just more adept at motor skill acquisition in general); within that, is the ability of the individual to learn a skill that is relatively similar or dissimilar to what they had done previously: so some people are going to have any easier time doing CLF and learning bagua, some won't, for precisely the reason that the skills are dissimilar; likewise, some CLF people may thrive on the similarities of their CLF branch and another, otheres may be confused by this similarity;

therefore, it's probably more about how a "style" is taught to someone that makes a bigger impact than the actual parameters of a given style: meaning that, if you gave me two different MAists, I will have to adapt the way that I teach them taiji based on what I am able to discern is the manner in which each learns best - personally, I don't care if they have done TKD, bagua or western fencing, I will tap into whatever strengths they have and utilize them - meaning that for someone who is good at lateralizing, I might compare how the taiji is similar to what they have done, so they could draw on their past skill; for others, it might make more sense to contrast how it is different, so that they do not bring in the patterns they used from their old style, which might interfere with the new inormation;

so while I did state before that the specific parameters of a given style might make it easier or harder for a given individual to learn based on their intrinsic ability and past experiences, I don't believe that any two given styles are inherently incompatible: for that to be the case, one would have to demonstrate specifically why this is so and then derive a general principle based on that which would be reproducible

Well said! I can't argue with that!

The only thing I have left to say is that in order to cross train properly then, you probably have to have a teacher as good as yourself who can identify ways to help your secondary style complement your core. Frankly, I'd say that the majority of "cross trainers" who haven't dedicated themselves to one style and simply dabble in anything until they decide that "this is no good" will bother with finding that good teacher or even getting good at anything enough for it to make a difference anyway!

I had to laugh when you commented that "some people's neuromuscular systems are just more adept at motor skill acquisition in general"... it's funny cuz it's true...

unkokusai
05-29-2008, 06:16 AM
At just about now, you should be getting a PM from Sanjuro Ronin or one of his forum kickboxer boyfriends, telling you to ignore me.




Probably a good idea, you ridiculous troll. Go back to your basement and STFU, idiot.

sanjuro_ronin
05-29-2008, 06:26 AM
Probably a good idea, you ridiculous troll. Go back to your basement and STFU, idiot.

BAAWWAHHHH !!!!
Even on ignore his post still irritate me, like a crap hanging on to the skin of my balls !!
LOL !!

Ah dude, anyone that believe anything that buttwipe says after he has been proven to be full of it, over an dover, deserves to wallow in his crapulence !
:p

I love this ignore button !

HardWork8
05-29-2008, 08:22 AM
Probably a good idea,
In that case you should direct your retarded brain towards the ignore button and save us all a headache.;)


you ridiculous troll.
You don't know how ironic that statement seems, coming from you unkokusai.:rolleyes:


Go back to your basement and STFU, idiot.

Hey, hey you shouldn't swear. Don't they teach you anything in that mental institution.
Now be a good boy and wipe that retard drool off your mouth and while you are at it go and wipe Sanjuro's balls as I think that he has not been taught proper bathroom manners.

And don't forget to that ignore button now ya hear!

unkokusai
05-29-2008, 08:40 AM
In that case you should direct your retarded brain towards the ignore button and save us all a headache.



You have been told several times about insulting handicapped people with your failed attempts at put-downs, troll. Knock it off.

As for the ignore button, I don't think so. I think I'll keep the option open of finding every instance where you misrepresent yourself in transparent attempts at aggrandizement and letting people know what a fraud and a LARPing loser you are.


F.U.

HardWork8
05-29-2008, 08:41 AM
Ah dude, anyone that believe anything that buttwipe says after he has been proven to be full of it,

You are Lying yet AGAIN! that is it, go on trying to discredit me for exposing you for what you are and that is a GLORIFIED KICKBOXER!


over an dover,
:confused:


deserves to wallow in his crapulence !
:p

I know that you are upset with me but there is nothing wrong about being a kickboxer, as long as you don't go around advising on and pretending to be a kung fu expert. That is all!

Oh, I almost forgot and LYING! you should not lie about posters with the intention of giving false and misleading impressions of their character, that is all!

Now, be a good boy and go and buy some toilet paper as Unkokusai will be visiting you soon to help you with your toilet training.


I love this ignore button !
Maybe you should call it the "bury your head in sand" button.;)

HardWork8
05-29-2008, 09:04 AM
You have been told several times about insulting handicapped people with your failed attempts at put-downs, troll. Knock it off.

I WAS NOT insulting handicapped people. I was insulting YOU, but you were just too "handicapped" to see it.

As always, if I have insulted any handicapped people by associating you with them then I am sorry.


As for the ignore button, I don't think so. I think I'll keep the option open of finding every instance where you misrepresent yourself in transparent attempts at aggrandizement and letting people know what a fraud and a LARPing loser you are.

Fraud? You mean like a wrestler who hangs aroud the Kung Fu forums, of all places, dishing out his advice and insults to people who actually practice kung fu?

That is what this forum needs ********challenged wrestler policing the threads.

Very funny!:rolleyes:

Why don't you hang around some wrestling forums? Don't you feel secure enough to hang around your own peers?

That is ok keep singing along to Sanjuro's LIES, you have a lot in common as you both seem to posess the same lack of knowledge regarding REAL kung fu and same LACK OF MORALS as well.

By the way Sanjuro is waiting for you with a new batch of toilet paper so that you can help him with his toilet training, as this is an area he has forgotten to "crosstrain" in and anyway he is used to spewing crap from the upper end of his body. This means that you should be a little forgiving, while you are helping him wipe his balls.



F.U.

You forgot the K.U.N.G. :D

PS. The ignore button is your friend or should I ignore you? As sooner or later you or Sanjuro are going to accuse me of derailing this thread.

unkokusai
05-29-2008, 10:05 AM
I WAS NOT insulting handicapped people. .



Are you really so thick? Do you honestly not get it? :confused:

Lucas
05-29-2008, 10:17 AM
Sanjuro's lies?

lmao....the only lies that he might be spouting are those links to all those hot chicks he keeps telling me he gets to "give driving lessons to"

sanjuro_ronin
05-29-2008, 10:22 AM
Sanjuro's lies?

lmao....the only lies that he might be spouting are those links to all those hot chicks he keeps telling me he gets to "give driving lessons to"

Of course I lie, I mean I give out my name, my style(S), teachers names, where I live and train, who I train with, I post video clips, etc, etc.
If that's not lying man, what is ?!?!?

And by the way:

Lucas
05-29-2008, 10:36 AM
she can advance my calculus anyday

sanjuro_ronin
05-29-2008, 10:38 AM
she can advance my calculus anyday

You don't have the chi !!

Lucas
05-29-2008, 11:05 AM
BLASPHEMY!!!

I eat a double helping of Chitoes ever day!

sorry for derailing the thread lol

sanjuro_ronin
05-29-2008, 11:07 AM
BLASPHEMY!!!

I eat a double helping of Chitoes ever day!

sorry for derailing the thread lol

It was derailed as soon as groin ache started with his crap, whatever it was.
Much like the man that taps dances in sourkraut, one must rejoice in the mayo !

HardWork8
05-29-2008, 03:30 PM
Are you really so thick? Do you honestly not get it? :confused:

:rolleyes:

HardWork8
05-29-2008, 03:32 PM
Of course I lie, I mean I give out my name, my style(S), teachers names, where I live and train, who I train with, I post video clips, etc, etc.
If that's not lying man, what is ?!?!?

And by the way:

:rolleyes: You have lied about me. I couldn't care less who you are or what you do, nor about your "kickboxing" clips. As far as I am concerned you are just another knucklehead pretending to know about kung fu.:rolleyes:

unkokusai
05-29-2008, 07:09 PM
. As far as I am concerned



= absolutely nothing

HardWork8
05-29-2008, 07:14 PM
= absolutely nothing

:rolleyes:

unkokusai
05-29-2008, 07:17 PM
Its funny though, because you have been shown to be a bona fide moron.



Right on the money.

HardWork8
05-29-2008, 07:24 PM
Right on the money.
:rolleyes:

lkfmdc
05-30-2008, 08:26 AM
:rolleyes: You have lied about me, just as all Jews do. I couldn't care less who you are once I know your faith. As far as I am concerned you are just another Jew pretending to know about kung fu.:rolleyes:

I am pretty sure Paul isn't Jewish? :confused: But I am again amazed that moderators allow this raving anti-semites to roam the boards without any consequences :mad:

sanjuro_ronin
05-30-2008, 08:45 AM
I am pretty sure Paul isn't Jewish? :confused: But I am again amazed that moderators allow this raving anti-semites to roam the boards without any consequences :mad:

Wow, I have never been so glad that I have this fool ( and hate monger) on ignore.
And Ross is right, I am not jewish and I have no idea where pencil neck geek got that idea, probabaly where he gets most of his lies and dilusions.
Like I said before, if anyone wnats to pay attention to this loser, knock yourselves out, I have learned that ignoring trolls is the best way to deal with them (short of banning of course).
And if anyone wants to take anything this guy says seriously than good luck in life !
LOL !

HardWork8
05-30-2008, 09:26 AM
I am pretty sure Paul isn't Jewish? :confused: But I am again amazed that moderators allow this raving anti-semites to roam the boards without any consequences :mad:

I am amazed how even an idiot like you would CHANGE the contents of my post to project a racist image of me.

Go and get a life and GROW UP!

HardWork8
05-30-2008, 09:28 AM
Wow, I have never been so glad that I have this fool ( and hate monger) on ignore.
And Ross is right, I am not jewish and I have no idea where pencil neck geek got that idea, probabaly where he gets most of his lies and dilusions.
Like I said before, if anyone wnats to pay attention to this loser, knock yourselves out, I have learned that ignoring trolls is the best way to deal with them (short of banning of course).
And if anyone wants to take anything this guy says seriously than good luck in life !
LOL !

And Sanjuro_ronin, with his IQ of 2, fell for Ikfmdc's prank!:rolleyes:

lkfmdc
05-30-2008, 09:35 AM
I am not surprised how even a Jew like you would try and CHANGE the contents of my post to defend another of your kind.



Yeah, yadda yadda, we know, giant conspiracy, same cabal, etc etc

Well, we know that a violent racist with paranoia can't be taken serious, don't we by now?

sanjuro_ronin
05-30-2008, 09:42 AM
Well, here we have a guy that spews crap that goes against common sense more often than not, that makes claimes he never backs up, doesn't say who his sifu is, where he trains, claims that his sifu and his sifu's sifu beat all sorts of people in DOCUMENTED fights but has no proof or can even mention one name, and all they other crap he spews and call other people that give out all their info, liars.
I mean, how can one NOT see BS for what it is?

HardWork8
05-30-2008, 10:00 AM
Well, here we have a guy that spews crap that goes against common sense more often than not, that makes claimes he never backs up, doesn't say who his sifu is, where he trains, claims that his sifu and his sifu's sifu beat all sorts of people in DOCUMENTED fights but has no proof or can even mention one name, and all they other crap he spews and call other people that give out all their info, liars.
I mean, how can one NOT see BS for what it is?

Can someone please PM Sanjuro_ronin, the forum idiot, and tell him about Ikfmdc's prank before he puts his foot in it even further.:rolleyes:

lkfmdc
05-30-2008, 10:06 AM
Can someone please PM Sanjuro_ronin, the forum Jew idiot, and tell him that fellow JEW Ikfmdc's has put his Kosher foot in even further.:rolleyes:

I am not sure what that even means? I think maybe he's having a break down or something? :confused:

sanjuro_ronin
05-30-2008, 10:09 AM
I am not sure what that even means? I think maybe he's having a break down or something? :confused:

LOL, hey dude, ever see that movie "little big league" ?
"coming apart like a bad stucco job" !
LOL

sanjuro_ronin
05-30-2008, 10:31 AM
And to further add to this highjacking :

cjurakpt
05-30-2008, 10:52 AM
I am not sure what that even means? I think maybe he's having a break down or something? :confused:

wow - I mean, Hardwork8 and I have had our disagreements in the past, and had even managed (thanks to my persistent encouragement) to achieve a sort of "live and let live" detente; but now I really am saddened by his having to resort to racist hate-mongering in order to confront his detractors; as strange as it may seem, I had somehow expected more of him; most unfortunate; I only hope he stops before it gets too out of control and he gets banned just like Kemo Martin and the Preacher did when they took a turn onto the same downward-spiraling path...

lkfmdc
05-30-2008, 10:59 AM
Chris, I am sad to see what he said about you, and to attack your mother like that was completely unacceptable :mad:

But it's still better than the stuttering PM he sent me, quoting "Mein Kampf"? :confused: :eek:

I'm afraid he's lost it, really!

cjurakpt
05-30-2008, 11:07 AM
Chris, I am sad to see what he said about you, and to attack your mother like that was completely unacceptable :mad:

But it's still better than the stuttering PM he sent me, quoting "Mein Kampf"? :confused: :eek:

I'm afraid he's lost it, really!

sad, indeed...<shakes head>

sanjuro_ronin
05-30-2008, 11:10 AM
Obviously the strain of keeping his uber-secret identity and that of his Uber-Deadly sifu and their secret training hall, from us ninjas, has gotten to the man.
He deserves are sympathy !

Here it is:

cjurakpt
05-30-2008, 11:14 AM
Obviously the strain of keeping his uber-secret identity and that of his Uber-Deadly sifu and their secret training hall, from us ninjas, has gotten to the man.

actually, I think that his secret identity (http://africawithin.com/farrakhan/louis_farrakhan.jpg) may have been compromised

lkfmdc
05-30-2008, 11:15 AM
Via PM I think we've "outed" our newest resident troll... and no surprise, he has direct ties to a major fascist/racist organization

I want to post the link I was just sent, but afraid of the consequences? I will have to get Gene to approve the link, but when he does, WOW! You'll be shocked to see the true face of this troll :eek:

sanjuro_ronin
05-30-2008, 11:18 AM
Via PM I think we've "outed" our newest resident troll... and no surprise, he has direct ties to a major fascist/racist organization

I want to post the link I was just sent, but afraid of the consequences? I will have to get Gene to approve the link, but when he does, WOW! You'll be shocked to see the true face of this troll :eek:

You mean this guy?

cjurakpt
05-30-2008, 11:21 AM
Via PM I think we've "outed" our newest resident troll... and no surprise, he has direct ties to a major fascist/racist organization

I want to post the link I was just sent, but afraid of the consequences? I will have to get Gene to approve the link, but when he does, WOW! You'll be shocked to see the true face of this troll :eek:

hmmm; that link was most distressing: I can see why you are hesitant to post it publicly and are wise to seek Gene's approval, given the undertones in terms of it's assessment of Asians;

despite my entreaties on another thread that he belay his trolling activities, it seems that my reasoned voice has fallen on deaf ears; that will teach me to try to see past the face of evil and reach out to a soul in torment;

I can only imagine how he's going to post all incensed, claiming that this is all a fabrication; the only thing sadder than a racist is a backpeddling-racist...

lkfmdc
05-30-2008, 11:22 AM
You mean this guy?

think more black shirts, leather boots and high stepping marches... scarry what this forum seems to attract :mad:

I tell you one thing, one more PM threatening me with his goons and this is going to change in nature :mad:

lkfmdc
05-30-2008, 11:24 AM
the only thing sadder than a racist is a backpeddling-racist...

I doubt he'll deny it, he seems PROUD of it :confused:

sanjuro_ronin
05-30-2008, 11:27 AM
No wonder he keeps his name private, where he trains private and his Sifu's name private.
If he were my student I would dump him in the nearest dumbster for spew out trash like that !
I think unkokosai is right, he probably does "train" in his basement, beating up his ethnic coloured training dummies and blow up dolls.

cjurakpt
05-30-2008, 11:28 AM
I doubt he'll deny it, he seems PROUD of it :confused:

I don't know - he has a habit of being caught in a lie (e.g. - when he totally disrupted Vankuen's thread "Question About Internal Blocking" (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=50925) being one great example) and denying it explicitly...

sanjuro_ronin
05-30-2008, 11:38 AM
I don't know - he has a habit of being caught in a lie (e.g. - when he totally disrupted Vankuen's thread "Question About Internal Blocking" (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=50925) being one great example) and denying it explicitly...

Lying is what he does best, he lied about his training, lied about who his teacher is, lied about his teachers teacher beating all sorts of people and bjj guys in real fights, DOCUMENTED fights that is, he lied about NOT training in a S&M basement with the gimp and lied about not knowing that she was a he in Thailand.

Lies, lies, lies...
:D

lkfmdc
05-30-2008, 11:41 AM
lied about not knowing that she was a he in Thailand.



The aforementioned link, which I am not posting until I think it is safe, does mention "the deception of the inferior Asian racial type" (which Chris already alluded to). I wonder if perhaps the troll's experiences in Asia or with Asians have contributed to his utterly dismal world view?

But more importantly, the child sex allegation may be why he's keeping a low profile?

cjurakpt
05-30-2008, 11:42 AM
Lying is what he does best, he lied about his training, lied about who his teacher is, lied about his teachers teacher beating all sorts of people and bjj guys in real fights, DOCUMENTED fights that is, he lied about NOT training in a S&M basement with the gimp and lied about not knowing that she was a he in Thailand.

Lies, lies, lies...
:D
he seems awfully quiet on this point: guess that guilt has a powerful sedative effect on the tongue...

unfortunately, it's only a matter of time before he shows up ranting and raving about how he is the one being maligned, how he is the one who everyone is lying about, and how he is the only one who understands "true" kung fu as opposed to all the other "knuckleheads" here (interesting that he uses that word all the time, considering that the German translation of the word is slang for "racially undesireable"...)

sanjuro_ronin
05-30-2008, 11:45 AM
And calling all the people that have more TCMA training than him, "kick boxers".

Sad really, truly sad.

SimonM
05-30-2008, 11:51 AM
No disrespect intended but,

Bruce lee even said that western boxers had the best hands by far, He even went as far as to say that western boxers would distroy most kung fu guys when it came to fighting.


Well I guess if Bruce Lee said it than it must be true. ;)

sanjuro_ronin
05-30-2008, 11:52 AM
Bruce also said "be like water", I tried that and almost drown !!
That ******* !!
He's luck he's dead or I'd kick his ass !!

(and his butt too ! )

kfman5F
05-31-2008, 06:25 PM
Hardwork8,
What do you have against Jews? You should be banned from this forum!

HardWork8
05-31-2008, 06:49 PM
Hardwork8,
What do you have against Jews? You should be banned from this forum!

I have nothing against the Jews. You have walked into a prank that I am supposed to be a victim of.

Please go to the last post of page 4 of this thread and you will see my original post. Then go to the next page (5) and post number 5 by the forum member called "Ikfmdc" and you will see him quoting that same post, but edited to be racially offensive.

It is all there. It is a prank and in a very poor taste.

PS. It seems that a few of the forum loosers are in on it as they seem to have all gone blind mysteriously and have not "registered" the prank.

BruceSteveRoy
05-31-2008, 07:28 PM
you're right, now one in MMA uses chaap (straight punches), so (long hooks), kup (overhands) or jong (forearms). Kicks never work, and can never break an arm. blah blah blah

(we need better trolls, really, we should set up a school or something)

and yet when we have a perfectly viable troll (seppuku) you want him gone. i mean he isn't great but he is the best i have seen here. maybe if you gave a little troll love we could employ some with actual skills. just a thought.

unkokusai
05-31-2008, 08:17 PM
Hardwork8,
What do you have against Jews? You should be banned from this forum!



He also thinks belittling the handicapped is just funny as hell. He is a piece of human waste.

lkfmdc
05-31-2008, 08:59 PM
Hardwork8,
What do you have against Jews? You should be banned from this forum!

Not just the Jews, a link to his web site has offensive remarks about Asians and Catholics as well. He also has some fascination with "Aryan spelling"? :confused:

HardWork8
05-31-2008, 09:45 PM
He also thinks belittling the handicapped is just funny as hell. He is a piece of human waste.
:rolleyes: Knowing the limits of your attention span, I am not even going to attempt to ask you to read the relevant posts which would enlighten you the fact that this is a prank orchestrated by Ikfmdc and probably a few other kung fu pretenders in these forums.

Of course, I am not discounting the fact that you may even be part of this group and in the know, specially knowing that your low intellect is an exact match to theirs.

There now, have your fun until Gene steps in.

HardWork8
05-31-2008, 09:46 PM
Not just the Jews, a link to his web site has offensive remarks about Asians and Catholics as well. He also has some fascination with "Aryan spelling"? :confused:
:rolleyes:

kfman5F
06-01-2008, 01:10 AM
Harwork8's original post on page 5:
Can someone please PM Sanjuro_ronin, the forum idiot, and tell him about Ikfmdc's prank before he puts his foot in it even further.

lkfmdc's post immediately after that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HardWork8
Can someone please PM Sanjuro_ronin, the forum Jew idiot, and tell him that fellow JEW Ikfmdc's has put his Kosher foot in even further.

I couldn't find the original post Hardwork8 made in regards to all this BS but it does look like lkfmdc HAS CHANGED YOUR QUOTE and I must say in very bad taste. He is looking like the rascist idiot and is very offensive and NOT funny at all. All this hatred makes me sick. It's OK to disagree but the name calling, threats, inflated egos and tasteless comments have made these ignorant people and this forum an embarrassment.

unkokusai
06-01-2008, 01:28 AM
specially knowing that your low intellect is an exact match to theirs.



You know, you might want to give up mentioning "intellect" all the time. You have proven yourself an idiot here time and time again, and trying to pretend "intellect" is something in your 'plus' column is just making you look even more ridiculous.

cjurakpt
06-01-2008, 04:54 AM
It's OK to disagree but the name calling, threats, inflated egos and tasteless comments have made these ignorant people and this forum an embarrassment.
exactly what you don't want to see...

lkfmdc
06-01-2008, 07:09 AM
name calling, threats, inflated egos and tasteless comments have made these ignorant people and this forum an embarrassment.

I guess he doesn't see the irony :rolleyes:

HardWork8
06-01-2008, 07:18 AM
You know, you might want to give up mentioning "intellect" all the time. You have proven yourself an idiot here time and time again, and trying to pretend "intellect" is something in your 'plus' column is just making you look even more ridiculous.

:rolleyes:

lkfmdc
06-01-2008, 07:27 AM
I love how Hardwork is now jumping from thread to thread to try and CONFUSE people about what he said and didn't say

The new comment on the other thread about how his job is "secret" is classic troll material (secret agent man!)

He needs to apologize for his offensive posts

HardWork8
06-01-2008, 07:51 AM
Harwork8's original post on page 5:
Can someone please PM Sanjuro_ronin, the forum idiot, and tell him about Ikfmdc's prank before he puts his foot in it even further.

lkfmdc's post immediately after that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HardWork8
Can someone please PM Sanjuro_ronin, the forum Jew idiot, and tell him that fellow JEW Ikfmdc's has put his Kosher foot in even further.

I couldn't find the original post Hardwork8 made in regards to all this BS but it does look like lkfmdc HAS CHANGED YOUR QUOTE and I must say in very bad taste. He is looking like the rascist idiot and is very offensive and NOT funny at all. All this hatred makes me sick. It's OK to disagree but the name calling, threats, inflated egos and tasteless comments have made these ignorant people and this forum an embarrassment.

Thanks for taking the time to check out what is really happening. In real life I would sue every one of them as this kind of accusation could land one in real deep water.

My original/first post that was later miss quoted by Ikfmdc is the last post on page 4 of this thread (MMA vs CLF). Ikfmdc's version of that same post is post number 5 on page 5 (the following page).

He has also made up other quotes that I have supposed to have sent to his private mail box.

Of course, you can also see that a few idiots here KNOWINGLY played along with the story and other idiots just kept quite. These people that include Sanjuro_Ronin, Cjurakpt and unkokusai have a few things in common.

1.They don't think that traditional kung fu is functional (actually unkokusai doesn't even practice kung fu, he is a wrestler and the purpose of his existance in this forum is still a mystery to me, but the fact that him and his idiotic and abusive presence/comments is embraced by this bunch speaks volumes).

The rest of the bunch seem to be cross trainers which is meant to compensate their perceived short comings as far as kung fu is concerned, which in itself is not a fault except when they start pretending to be kung fu experts! LOL! Ignoring the fact that all the years they have spent training in a dozen arts or so will be just about enough to master and understand one single style of kung fu in ALL ITS ASPECTS.


2.They lack common morality which is very obvious to whoever reads this thread.

3. They possess belove average intellect, even if one or 2 of them do their best to hide this fact by the excessive use of technical jargon, see cjurakpt, who is an "interesting" character, even if he is not the brightest star in the galaxy, if you know what I mean;).

Their above qualities have resulted in many forum clashes with me and has left them with sore rear ends and this was their "Revenge" and I am sorry that you had to walk into it and god knows how many others have done the same and did not bother(as was intended) to check out my side of the story.

Thanks again for taking the time to search for the truth (and you have probably seen the other vile stuff I was accused of doing as well).

HardWork8
06-01-2008, 08:03 AM
I love how Hardwork is now jumping from thread to thread to try and CONFUSE people about what he said and didn't say

The new comment on the other thread about how his job is "secret" is classic troll material (secret agent man!)

He needs to apologize for his offensive posts
:rolleyes:

unkokusai
06-01-2008, 08:08 AM
3. They possess belove average intellect, even if one or 2 of them do their best to hide this fact by the excessive use of technical jargon, see cjurakpt, who is an "interesting" character, even if he is not the brightest star in the galaxy, if you know what I mean;).



What did I tell you, idiot? :rolleyes:

HardWork8
06-01-2008, 08:30 AM
What did I tell you, idiot? :rolleyes:

Exactly: idiot or rather idiots, that is you and your forum "conspirators".

Thanks for you help in clarifying that.

unkokusai
06-01-2008, 08:33 AM
Thanks for you help in clarifying that.





Look out belove! :rolleyes:

cjurakpt
06-01-2008, 08:59 AM
In real life I would sue every one of them as this kind of accusation could land one in real deep water.
LOL, I am pretty sure that a prerequisite for a libel suit is that the allegedly slandered individual actually has to have an identity; as far as Mr. Troll's publiuc personna is concerned, Mr. T. has no name, no teacher, no current style, no job, no address, etc. - in otherwords, the only "person" being allegedly slandered is an anonymous "screen name"; real grounds for threatening legal action there:rolleyes:
Troll Grade: D-

now it was nice of Mr. T. to reiterate the typical points that Mr. T. belabors over and over, because it's a good chance to review and grade Mr. T.'s progress:

1.They don't think that traditional kung fu is functional (actually unkokusai doesn't even practice kung fu, he is a wrestler and the purpose of his existance in this forum is still a mystery to me, but the fact that him and his idiotic and abusive presence/comments is embraced by this bunch speaks volumes).
The rest of the bunch seem to be cross trainers which is meant to compensate their perceived short comings as far as kung fu is concerned, which in itself is not a fault except when they start pretending to be kung fu experts! LOL! Ignoring the fact that all the years they have spent training in a dozen arts or so will be just about enough to master and understand one single style of kung fu in ALL ITS ASPECTS.
LOL, despite what Mr. T. says, some of the people who take issue with his bizarre pronouncements have at least 10+ years experience in one single style of "traditional" kung fu; now, I would mention specifics, but then Mr. T. would cart out his tired accusation of "d1ck waving"; it's a cute tactic: accuse others of having no credentials in terms of what they do, and when they provide substantiation, accuse them of "di(k waving"; which, given his vast experience in TCMA (all of 3 years supervised in struction in one style, 4 years training on his own in that same style, and lately participation in a "secret" school of TCMA) is about all Mr. T. can do
Troll Grade: C-


2.They lack common morality which is very obvious to whoever reads this thread.
this from an individual who consistently mischaracterizes what others do, and who constantly makes derogatory references to people's mental capacity, their understanding re: TCMA etc. simply because they do not agree with his TCMA fantasy-land perspective;
Troll Grade: C


They possess belove average intellect, even if one or 2 of them do their best to hide this fact by the excessive use of technical jargon, see cjurakpt, who is an "interesting" character, even if he is not the brightest star in the galaxy, if you know what I mean;).
I'm guessing he means "below"; which is simply a baseless qualification, since Mr. T. has no evidence to support this at all, and simply uses it because it suits Mr. T.'s agenda to paint anyone who disagrees with Mr. T.'s perspective as such;
Troll Grade: C-

as for the constant references to my using "jargon", if Mr. T. means anatomical / physiological / biomechanical / motor learning terminology that I use every day as part of my profession, well, ok, I guess you could call it that; of course, Mr. T.'s tactic is to play it off as if I use the "jargon" without knowing what it all really means, as a way to cover up my lack of intelligence - which is strange, since, if I was really that dumb, how exactly would I manage to use all that "jargon" correctly? notice, Mr. T. never argues my poiints on their merits, just makes comments about how I am using "jargon";
Troll Grade: D-


Their above qualities have resulted in many forum clashes with me and has left them with sore rear ends and this was their "Revenge" .
LOL - the Lone Stranger as the victimized victor, as if there is some sort of group plot against it: fact is, anyone who takes even a little time to do any research on Mr. T.'s posts will notice that almost without exception Mr. T. alienates pretty much anyone with whom Mr. T. engages because of his TCMA fantasy-land perspectives and every time Mr. T. is actually confronted by a reasoned argument against Mr. T.'s absolutist perspective Mr. T. resorts to name-calling, derision, and misdirection; in Mr. T.'s sad little mind, Mr. T. creates the conflict, and then resolves it in Mr. T. 's favor, characterizing everyone else as "sore butted", as if Mr. T. has yet again taught everyone a lesson;
Troll Grade: D

see, overall Mr. T. uses a cute little mechanism: if someone argues that a given TCMA system is incomplete, lacking, etc., Mr. T. responds that they just haven't spent enough time studying it, and that their conclusions are premature, based on an incomplete understanding of that system; however, if that person has spent a long time with that one particular system and still has that opinion, then Mr. T. argues that they obviously just didn't get it, that they weren't taught right, that their teacher is holding stuff back, etc.; whatever justification Mr. T. has to provide to maintain his own world view of TCMA, Mr. T. will do, plain and simple
Troll Grade: F

that should keep Mr. T. well-fed for a while (guess I am just in a troll-feeding mood today)

Seppukku
06-01-2008, 11:28 AM
Look out belove! :rolleyes:

Beloved are those who do not point out the typos of others.

unkokusai
06-01-2008, 11:37 AM
Why? Is that hitting belove the belt? I'm not so proud that I consider it belove me to point out some idiot's spelling errors. It may be unfair considering that English is not his first language, but when his ability to communicate falls belove a certain level I feel obligated to point out where he's gone wrong.

Seppukku
06-01-2008, 11:40 AM
Why? Is that hitting belove the belt? I'm not so proud that I consider it belove me to point out some idiot's spelling errors. It may be unfair considering that English is not his first language, but when his ability to communicate falls belove a certain level I feel obligated to point out where he's gone wrong.

Well, when you obviously can't spell "below" correctly on three occasions in your last post, then I don't consider you any kind of acutorite on grammer.

Sic probo.

lkfmdc
06-01-2008, 12:01 PM
Let's review

1. Hardwork8 is a self proclaimed expert in Chinese martial arts who
REFUSES TO IDENTIFY HIMSELF
REFUSES TO STATE WHAT STYLE HE PRACTICES
REFUSES TO NAME HIS TEACHER
and says his job is a "secret" :rolleyes:

Should I mention that he claimed that his teacher engaged in all sorts of matches against BJJ, Kickboxers, MMA fighters etc that he supposedly beat but then refused to give any details :rolleyes:

2. Hardwork8 was OWNED for similar claims on another forum. Literally embarassed and caught red handed in LIES

3. Unable to debate with the "big boys" (some of those who have called him out have over 20 years experience in the arts), he has resorted to calling people idiots and claiming to be a superior intellect

all the while mispelling words, misquoting people, claiming people who are against him are actually supporting him, aqnd generally slaughtering the English language

CONCLUSION: hardwork8 is a newbie with no practical experience, living in fantasy land and having fits from behind his keyboard that people are ruining his fantasy

HardWork8
06-01-2008, 03:24 PM
Look out belove! :rolleyes:
:rolleyes: Too late now as the prank has happened already, but thanks for the warning anyway.

By the way, it is beloved and not "belove".

HardWork8
06-01-2008, 03:27 PM
Let's review

1. Hardwork8 is a self proclaimed expert in Chinese martial arts who
REFUSES TO IDENTIFY HIMSELF
REFUSES TO STATE WHAT STYLE HE PRACTICES
REFUSES TO NAME HIS TEACHER
and says his job is a "secret" :rolleyes:

Should I mention that he claimed that his teacher engaged in all sorts of matches against BJJ, Kickboxers, MMA fighters etc that he supposedly beat but then refused to give any details :rolleyes:

2. Hardwork8 was OWNED for similar claims on another forum. Literally embarassed and caught red handed in LIES

3. Unable to debate with the "big boys" (some of those who have called him out have over 20 years experience in the arts), he has resorted to calling people idiots and claiming to be a superior intellect

all the while mispelling words, misquoting people, claiming people who are against him are actually supporting him, aqnd generally slaughtering the English language

CONCLUSION: hardwork8 is a newbie with no practical experience, living in fantasy land and having fits from behind his keyboard that people are ruining his fantasy
:rolleyes:

lkfmdc
06-01-2008, 03:51 PM
wow, troll boy is speechless :rolleyes:

SifuAbel
06-01-2008, 04:03 PM
Whatever your reasons , dave. You playing the religion card to paint someone as a racist is way low even for you.

Please correct me if I'm wrong and direct me to your motivation for beginning this disgusting avenue of conversation.

HardWork8
06-01-2008, 04:28 PM
YOU HAVE BEEN CAUGHT PARTICIPATING IN AN UGLY AND RACISTS PRANK AND IS THIS THE BEST YOU CAN DO TO COVER YOUR RETARDED @SS?


LOL, I am pretty sure that a prerequisite for a libel suit is that the allegedly slandered individual actually has to have an identity; as far as Mr. Troll's publiuc personna is concerned, Mr. T. has no name, no teacher, no current style, no job, no address, etc. - in otherwords, the only "person" being allegedly slandered is an anonymous "screen name"; real grounds for threatening legal action there:rolleyes:
Troll Grade: D-

And that is why I said that if it was real life I would sue Ikfmdc. Why don't you ask Unkokusai for some of his retard medication?

Retard Grade: A


[QUOTE=cjurakpt]now it was nice of Mr. T. to reiterate the typical points that Mr. T. belabors over and over, because it's a good chance to review and grade Mr. T.'s progress:

LOL, despite what Mr. T. says, some of the people who take issue with his bizarre pronouncements have at least 10+ years experience in one single style of "traditional" kung fu; now, I would mention specifics, but then Mr. T. would cart out his tired accusation of "d1ck waving"; it's a cute tactic: accuse others of having no credentials in terms of what they do, and when they provide substantiation, accuse them of "di(k waving"; which, given his vast experience in TCMA (all of 3 years supervised in struction in one style, 4 years training on his own in that same style, and lately participation in a "secret" school of TCMA) is about all Mr. T. can do
Troll Grade: C-

If you knew anything about TCMAs then you would know that quantity does not necessarilly make QUALITY!

Retard Grade: A



this from an individual who consistently mischaracterizes what others do, and who constantly makes derogatory references to people's mental capacity, their understanding re: TCMA etc. simply because they do not agree with his TCMA fantasy-land perspective;
Troll Grade: C
Any statetments that I have made about people have been based on their post/statements. AND YOU HAVE ALWAYS KNOWN THAT!

Retard Grade:A



I'm guessing he means "below"; which is simply a baseless qualification, since Mr. T. has no evidence to support this at all, and simply uses it because it suits Mr. T.'s agenda to paint anyone who disagrees with Mr. T.'s perspective as such;
Troll Grade: C-
Yes "he" does mean below. The evidence is all over this thread. The fact that you chose to participate in this UGLY and TASTELESS prank proves that your intelligence is BELOW AVERAGE.

Retard Grade: A+


as for the constant references to my using "jargon", if Mr. T. means anatomical / physiological / biomechanical / motor learning terminology that I use every day as part of my profession, well, ok, I guess you could call it that;
It is that! and you use it to sound "intelligent" to hide your below average intelligence (and I am being kind here), which was proved by you being stupid enough to participate in Ikfmdc's RACIST prank.

Retard Grade: A+


of course, Mr. T.'s tactic is to play it off as if I use the "jargon" without knowing what it all really means, as a way to cover up my lack of intelligence
It is irrelevant wether you know or don't know what it means. The fact is you use your jargon to give an impression of an intellectual capacity that you have no hope of possessing, actually it is rather funny and sad, at the same time.



- which is strange, since, if I was really that dumb, how exactly would I manage to use all that "jargon" correctly?
Using a dictionary? But as I stated before, it is irrelevant wether you know or don't know what they mean. You just use them to come across as something that you are not and that is intelligent.

THIS A MARTIAL ARTS FORUM AND NOT A MEDICAL ONE, your use of medical jargon make you come across as a bigger idiot than you are (not an easy task, by the way)!

Retard Grade: A


notice, Mr. T. never argues my poiints on their merits, just makes comments about how I am using "jargon";
Troll Grade: D-

When I see merits then I argue on them and when I don't then I don't!

Retard Grade: A



LOL - the Lone Stranger as the victimized victor, as if there is some sort of group plot against it: fact is, anyone who takes even a little time to do any research on Mr. T.'s posts will notice that almost without exception Mr. T. alienates pretty much anyone with whom Mr. T. engages because of his TCMA fantasy-land perspectives and every time Mr. T. is actually confronted by a reasoned argument against Mr. T.'s absolutist perspective Mr. T. resorts to name-calling, derision, and misdirection; in Mr. T.'s sad little mind, Mr. T. creates the conflict, and then resolves it in Mr. T. 's favor, characterizing everyone else as "sore butted", as if Mr. T. has yet again taught everyone a lesson;
Troll Grade: D

But you ARE sore butted and unfortunately in your case it seems that it is something that you take pleasure in.


see, overall Mr. T. uses a cute little mechanism: if someone argues that a given TCMA system is incomplete, lacking, etc., Mr. T. responds that they just haven't spent enough time studying it, and that their conclusions are premature, based on an incomplete understanding of that system; however, if that person has spent a long time with that one particular system and still has that opinion, then Mr. T. argues that they obviously just didn't get it, that they weren't taught right, that their teacher is holding stuff back, etc.; whatever justification Mr. T. has to provide to maintain his own world view of TCMA, Mr. T. will do, plain and simple
Troll Grade: F

Given the McKwoon/dojo phenomenom gripping the traditional martial arts scene, combined with some MA-ists obsession with cross training that gives them relatively little time to understand any kung fu style that they practice, then some of my comments are not that out of this world.


that should keep Mr. T. well-fed for a while (guess I am just in a troll-feeding mood today)

Luckily for you I am in a Retard-feeding mood today. And you have averaged A's on this latest outing and I bet Unkokusai is going to give you some very jealous looks from now on.

NOW WOULDN'T IT HAVE BEEN EASIER FOR YOU TO JUST APOLOGIZE FOR PARTICIPATING IN THIS TASTELESS PRANK RATHER THAN COMING OUT AND ATTEMPTING TO COVER YOUR SORE BUTT WITH THAT PATHETIC ATTEMPT?

THAT PRANK WAS IN A VERY POOR TASTE AND EVENTHOUGH IT WAS MEANT TO FALSELY SHOW ME IN POOR LIGHT IT MANAGED TO DEGRADE THE WHOLE FORUM. SO WHY DON'T YOU DO THE DECENT* THING AND APOLOGIZE?

*Cjurakpt, do not look for the meaning of "Decent" in your medical dictionary. Try a normal one and repeat read it for a while until you come to understand the meaning of decency.

HardWork8
06-01-2008, 04:29 PM
wow, troll boy is speechless :rolleyes:
:rolleyes:

HardWork8
06-01-2008, 04:57 PM
Whatever your reasons , dave. You playing the religion card to paint someone as a racist is way low even for you.

Please correct me if I'm wrong and direct me to your motivation for beginning this disgusting avenue of conversation.

I would take any "reasons" he gives you for acting in such an immoral way with a pinch of salt. Or at least I would double and triple check everything he states.

I don't know if there is anything that he will be able to say that will stop him looking like the dirtbag that he is!

By the way cjurakpt and probably Sanjuro(together with a few other silent "partners"), were playing along with the prank all the way.

HardWork8
06-01-2008, 05:01 PM
Why? Is that hitting belove the belt? I'm not so proud that I consider it belove me to point out some idiot's spelling errors. It may be unfair considering that English is not his first language, but when his ability to communicate falls belove a certain level I feel obligated to point out where he's gone wrong.

What was your first language again? :rolleyes:

lkfmdc
06-01-2008, 06:01 PM
"secret agent man, living in his basement, doing secret kung fu" :rolleyes:

did you forget the other thread where you made the ridiculous claims, got caught, and got OWNED? :rolleyes:

Your secret sifu who beat all those fighters in what you called "documented matches" but when asked for you to prove it you had 101 excuses why it was "secret" :rolleyes:

Even what you actually practice is "secret"

You're a troll, and an idiot, and you've been exposed. You can whine and cry and carry on, you can scream "conspiracy" or maybe, just MAYBE, wonder why your only ally in this is a guy who the entire forum also thinks is a clown :rolleyes:

HardWork8
06-01-2008, 06:05 PM
"secret agent man, living in his basement, doing secret kung fu" :rolleyes:

did you forget the other thread where you made the ridiculous claims, got caught, and got OWNED? :rolleyes:

Your secret sifu who beat all those fighters in what you called "documented matches" but when asked for you to prove it you had 101 excuses why it was "secret" :rolleyes:

Even what you actually practice is "secret"

You're a troll, and an idiot, and you've been exposed. You can whine and cry and carry on, you can scream "conspiracy" or maybe, just MAYBE, wonder why your only ally in this is a guy who the entire forum also thinks is a clown :rolleyes:



















:rolleyes:

lkfmdc
06-01-2008, 06:06 PM
the more you do that, the more you prove my point, ie you have nothing to say and can't back up your points....

hey, here's an idea, if you don't like the way the board is treating you, go and post on another board! Go to Rudy's board, sounds like he'll welcome you with OPEN ARMS

HardWork8
06-01-2008, 06:12 PM
the more you do that, the more you prove my point, ie you have nothing to say and can't back up your points....

hey, here's an idea, if you don't like the way the board is treating you, go and post on another board! Go to Rudy's board, sounds like he'll welcome you with OPEN ARMS




:rolleyes:

lkfmdc
06-01-2008, 06:24 PM
LOL, do you think you're gonna distract people with your nonsense? Should I really dig up all your old posts. Some of the classics

1. A discussion of whether Sonny Chiba the actor had better kung fu that Bruce Lee

2. A discussion on how TCMA cant' be taken down by double legs (oh, wow, that one has really held up over time since MMA started!)

3. Wing Chun's "secret" ground fighting :rolleyes:

4. How a Tai Chi master can certainly defeat any external martial artist

To quote the movie "you come on like a comic book"

I have no trouble believing you are still living in mom's basement at 45 :rolleyes:

HardWork8
06-01-2008, 06:30 PM
LOL, do you think you're gonna distract people with your nonsense? Should I really dig up all your old posts. Some of the classics

1. A discussion of whether Sonny Chiba the actor had better kung fu that Bruce Lee

2. A discussion on how TCMA cant' be taken down by double legs (oh, wow, that one has really held up over time since MMA started!)

3. Wing Chun's "secret" ground fighting :rolleyes:

4. How a Tai Chi master can certainly defeat any external martial artist

To quote the movie "you come on like a comic book"

I have no trouble believing you are still living in mom's basement at 45 :rolleyes:









































:rolleyes:

unkokusai
06-01-2008, 07:07 PM
What was your first language again? :rolleyes:




Are you really this thick? Is that even possible?

kfman5F
06-01-2008, 07:17 PM
Hardwork8,
Suggestion: Quit wasting your energy with these troublemakers. They are not worth replying to. These people find fault in everything. You are entitled to have an opinion. They do not have to like yours and vice versa. These forums were meant as a discussion board and to be informative, not mud slinging. Sounds like politicians. The more you reply, the more they will egg you on. Ignore them. I'm sure they will find someone else to pick on.

cjurakpt
06-01-2008, 07:58 PM
These forums were meant as a discussion board and to be informative, not mud slinging.
I strongly encourage you to go and read Mr. HW8's history of posts; feel free to note the condescending attitude and derisive monikers he distributes so freely to those whose opinions do not mesh with his own, and the conclusions he draws repeatedly about other people's intellectual capabilities even when they attempt a discourse with him in good faith; ever stop for a moment to consider why his presence evokes the response it does? better yet, ask him some questions, like who his teacher is, what he currently studies - maybe you will have more success then others getting answers, but I doubt it...

HardWork8
06-01-2008, 08:10 PM
Are you really this thick? Is that even possible?

:rolleyes:

B-Rad
06-01-2008, 10:50 PM
:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

cjurakpt
06-01-2008, 11:04 PM
THIS A MARTIAL ARTS FORUM AND NOT A MEDICAL ONE, your use of medical jargon make you come across as a bigger idiot than you are (not an easy task, by the way)!
hmmm, yes, I guess that anatomy, physiology, biomechanics and motor learning have nothing to do whatsoever with martial arts; if I am an idiot, then you must be Lord of the Idiots - all hail...


When I see merits then I argue on them and when I don't then I don't!
you wouldn't recognize a "merit" if it walked up and smacked you on the head with a sledgehammer; which is what has been happening to you since the first day you posted here, only you are so thick that you still haven't noticed that the ringing noise is from your tiny brain pin-balling around inside your vacuous head (say, actually, writing this way is kinda fun - now I understand why he likes to do it...)


But you ARE sore butted and unfortunately in your case it seems that it is something that you take pleasure in.
LOL, sorry, whatever gerbil-related pass time you have been engaging in, don't go projecting it onto anyone else - maybe you are so sore-butted the whole time yourself that you think everyone must be that way? you know, I have a friend who is a colo-rectal specialist (sorry, was that too jargony for you? he's a "sore butt doc") maybe he could translate your moronic ramblings for the rest of us, considering that he is used to dealing with aszholes like you all day long...


Given the McKwoon/dojo phenomenom gripping the traditional martial arts scene, combined with some MA-ists obsession with cross training that gives them relatively little time to understand any kung fu style that they practice, then some of my comments are not that out of this world.
what it boils down to is that when you have been presented with a perspective contrary to your own that you can't address directly, you simply call the poster names, accuse them of "knuckleheadedness" and dismiss them as not having learned something real; hasn't it sunk in yet that all your posting generate the same types of responses? do you honestly think that everyone on here is just completely clueless and that you are the only one with "authentic" kung fu knowledge? or that you are incapable of engaging in a discourse without condescending? but you do know that, of course - it's your MO; and then when people respond by substantiating their claims or call you on it, they are "di(k waving" or just can't "take a joke"; but that's the troll in you - you just can't help yourself;


Luckily for you I am in a Retard-feeding mood today. And you have averaged A's on this latest outing and I bet Unkokusai is going to give you some very jealous looks from now on
LOL, don't worry, we all know that you have a big man-love crush on Unko, I won't try to steal him from you - but I think that you are maybe not his type, so why don't you run along and find some of your fellow kung-fu "classmates", maybe a unicorn, or a leprechaun...

SifuAbel
06-01-2008, 11:27 PM
...theres not much left.



the more you do that, the more you prove my point, ie you have nothing to say and can't back up your points....

hey, here's an idea, if you don't like the way the board is treating you, go and post on another board! Go to Rudy's board, sounds like he'll welcome you with OPEN ARMS

Wow, you are a ****ing ugly disgusting loser. Turning this into a fake anti semitic witch hunt is appalling.

For as much as you want to debunk this guy, you've cross a line.

This is beyond the pale, even for you.

unkokusai
06-01-2008, 11:57 PM
...you are a ****ing ugly disgusting loser.


LOL! That's about as funny as you calling someone fat (and for the same reason).

sanjuro_ronin
06-02-2008, 04:40 AM
I do love the ignore button, but wish that people wouldn't quote ****-head.
For those of you how may not know it, one of "Mr.Tolerances" first post on this forum was accusing Master Jon Blumming of being a racist with ZERO proof based on a youtube interview where Mr.Blumming used the word "japs".
Now, considering Mr.Blumming's age, the era he was from and the decades he lived in japan, it would be viewed the same as a someone saying the word "***".
Yet that was enough for Mister "I do the real wing chun but I can't tell you under who, where or how it works", to call him a rascist on a public forum.

The rest of this impotent losers history is well know and documented.

lkfmdc
06-02-2008, 05:51 AM
For those of you how may not know it, one of "Mr.Tolerances" first post on this forum was accusing Master Jon Blumming of being a racist with ZERO proof



I can't be bothered cutting and pasting all of hardwork8's posts but if you go back and look his entire approach is to throw out insults to anyone who doesn't agree with him and acts like he has some sort of secret knowledge :rolleyes:

He's a troll, and quite a few of the board realized that already, the rest I guess will see what they want to see :rolleyes:

sanjuro_ronin
06-02-2008, 05:55 AM
I can't be bothered cutting and pasting all of hardwork8's posts but if you go back and look his entire approach is to throw out insults to anyone who doesn't agree with him and acts like he has some sort of secret knowledge :rolleyes:

He's a troll, and quite a few of the board realized that already, the rest I guess will see what they want to see :rolleyes:

Well, I am washing my hands of this whole thing, its pretty clear what kind of troll this guy is, if people choose not to see it, their problem.
If people wanna take the view of Mr Unknown because they like to live in la-la land, fine by me.
If people wanna be they guy that other talk about that after years of MA gets his butt kicked by someone that can't even throw a decent punch, so be it.
* washes hands*

lkfmdc
06-02-2008, 06:06 AM
Well, I am washing my hands of this whole thing, its pretty clear what kind of troll this guy is, if people choose not to see it, their problem.
If people wanna take the view of Mr Unknown because they like to live in la-la land, fine by me.
If people wanna be they guy that other talk about that after years of MA gets his butt kicked by someone that can't even throw a decent punch, so be it.
* washes hands*

a nice conclusion to this episode on internet trolling

SimonM
06-02-2008, 08:22 AM
CONCLUSION: hardwork8 is a newbie with no practical experience, living in fantasy land and having fits from behind his keyboard that people are ruining his fantasy

I'd offer an alternate conclusion: hardwork8 is yet another troll in the fine tradition of Mega Fist and most likely never gets closer to martial arts than the front row of the local cineplex to watch Forbidden Kingdom.

HardWork8
06-02-2008, 08:36 AM
I'd offer an alternate conclusion: hardwork8 is yet another troll in the fine tradition of Mega Fist and most likely never gets closer to martial arts than the front row of the local cineplex to watch Forbidden Kingdom.

Here is another conclusion, you have fallen for their tasteless antisemetic prank as was intended. Go and read the whole thread!

HardWork8
06-02-2008, 08:46 AM
Hardwork8,
Suggestion: Quit wasting your energy with these troublemakers. They are not worth replying to. These people find fault in everything. You are entitled to have an opinion. They do not have to like yours and vice versa. These forums were meant as a discussion board and to be informative, not mud slinging. Sounds like politicians. The more you reply, the more they will egg you on. Ignore them. I'm sure they will find someone else to pick on.

Hello kfman5F,

Your advice is appreciated.

I will just point you the main root of my problem with these intellectually challenged individuals. I train in traditional kung fu. Traditional training encompasses forms, chi kung, sparring in its various forms, Iron Palm, etc.

I have had issues with some of these individuals whenever any of them have denegraded traditional training approaches in favour of some modern "stuff". I have heard comments such as, "forms training is outdated", others that refer to "chi ****s" and "fantasy MA's" when I have discussed the internals and so on.

Now, it is a free country and they can do what they want but my problem has been that some of these individuals claim to practice authentic/traditional kung fu :eek: and of course they go on to give their silly advice to any newbe who happens to come into these forums for kung fu advice.

I like to answer their posts for a while and give them a good taste of their own medicine as well as exposing their lies about my person. I know that eventually I will have to ignore these cognitively challenged individuals.

Take care.

lkfmdc
06-02-2008, 08:59 AM
I will just point you the main root of my problem with these intellectually challenged individuals.



Note his "tone", people who point out he is wrong must be "intellectually challenged" :rolleyes:




I train in traditional kung fu.



Which system he REFUSES to say :rolleyes:




I have had issues with some of these individuals whenever any of them have denegraded traditional training approaches in favour of some modern



TRANSLATION = when people who know more, have practiced longer, and have practical experience challenge his fantasy land he freaks out :rolleyes:




my problem has been that some of these individuals claim to practice authentic/traditional kung fu



"claim" :rolleyes:

Dude, sorry to burst your bubble, the people owning you all have WAY MORE EXPERIENCE and depth in their training than you can ever hope for

Basement boy, give it up, you're done here :rolleyes:

MasterKiller
06-02-2008, 09:05 AM
HardWork= DooWai

unkokusai
06-02-2008, 09:08 AM
I will just point you the main root of my problem with these intellectually challenged individuals.



You keep saying things like this as if you really don't understand how profoundly stupid you are. I suppose you keep saying "intellect" because you are rightly insecure about your lack of physical acumen, but there is no amount of typing that you can do that will convince anyone that you are anything more than a complete moron and every time you try to refer to "intellect" you only further reinforce the point.

In other words: STFU and stop digging, idiot.

lkfmdc
06-02-2008, 09:09 AM
HardWork= DooWai

LMFAO, unfortunately, probably not.... the sentence structure and train of thought, as off as it is, isn't THAT FAR OFF!

Maybe a student of the mystical kitty cat king :D

HardWork8
06-02-2008, 09:22 AM
hmmm, yes, I guess that anatomy, physiology, biomechanics and motor learning have nothing to do whatsoever with martial arts; if I am an idiot, then you must be Lord of the Idiots - all hail...

Yes they have everything to do with the martial arts and so does physics and even chemistry if you go deep enough. This doesn't mean that we need people here using physics and chemistry jargons, in a futile attempt, to come across as intelligent. Idiot!



you wouldn't recognize a "merit" if it walked up and smacked you on the head with a sledgehammer; which is what has been happening to you since the first day you posted here,

That may be because I have been exposed to the "merits" of glorified kickboxing rather than those of KUNG FU, by people such as yourself!


only you are so thick that you still haven't noticed that the ringing noise is from your tiny brain pin-balling around inside your vacuous head
And all this time I fought that the ringing noise was you and your forum boyfriends schreeking in fear of being exposed as nothing more than glorified kickboxers and pseudo-kung fu-ists.;)



(say, actually, writing this way is kinda fun - now I understand why he likes to do it...)

Now, all you have to do is increase your BELOW AVERAGEINTELLIGENCE to a level where your irony makes sense and relates to the subject at hand. It shouldn't take you more than a dozen rencarnations!



LOL, sorry, whatever gerbil-related pass time you have been engaging in, don't go projecting it onto anyone else - maybe you are so sore-butted the whole time yourself that you think everyone must be that way?

Your sore-buttedness and those of your kickboxer colleagues has been proved once and for all in the fact that you have participated in this tasteless prank!

Stop trying to hide your shame!


you know, I have a friend who is a colo-rectal specialist (sorry, was that too jargony for you? he's a "sore butt doc")
Presumably he is the same guy who is treating your sore butt condition. You should have stuck to your treatment instead of trying to cure yourself by participating in this disgusting prank!


maybe he could translate your moronic ramblings for the rest of us,

I believe that he has his hands more than full with your sore-butt.


what it boils down to is that when you have been presented with a perspective contrary to your own that you can't address directly, you simply call the poster names, accuse them of "knuckleheadedness" and dismiss them as not having learned something real;

And this will happen everytime a person who claims to be practicing authentic kung fu denegrades the internals, forms training and other aspects that are part and parcel of traditional kung fu practice as designed by their respective grand masters (not kickboxers), because without these distinct aspects your kung fu is nothing more than GLORIFIED KICKBOXING!


hasn't it sunk in yet that all your posting generate the same types of responses?

Yes, from glorified kickboxers and the TCMA world is full of them!


do you honestly think that everyone on here is just completely clueless and that you are the only one with "authentic" kung fu knowledge?
If you act clueless, then I am going to call you clueless!


or that you are incapable of engaging in a discourse without condescending?
Well it is difficult to be otherwise with clueless individuals who don't know that they are clueless and at same time possess below average intelligence that proved by their participation in a TASTELESS PRANK!!!!

and then when people respond by substantiating their claims or call you on it, they are "di(k waving"
Because you do d1ck wave every time you use your technical jargon to hide the fact that you are CLUELESS!


or just can't "take a joke";
And you can't take joke and that is very ironic as you are a JOKE, intellectually speaking, that is.



but that's the troll in you - you just can't help yourself;
That is it call anyone who exposes you for what you are a troll! and you have your forum kickboxer boyfriends who will back you up on that one.:rolleyes:



LOL, don't worry, we all know that you have a big man-love crush on Unko, I won't try to steal him from you - but I think that you are maybe not his type, so why don't you run along and find some of your fellow kung-fu "classmates", maybe a unicorn, or a leprechaun...

My kung fu classmates are all redblooded heterosexuals just like me. Take your gay sexual fantasies somewhere else as this is a MA forum!

HardWork8
06-02-2008, 09:23 AM
You keep saying things like this as if you really don't understand how profoundly stupid you are. I suppose you keep saying "intellect" because you are rightly insecure about your lack of physical acumen, but there is no amount of typing that you can do that will convince anyone that you are anything more than a complete moron and every time you try to refer to "intellect" you only further reinforce the point.

In other words: STFU and stop digging, idiot.
:rolleyes:

lkfmdc
06-02-2008, 09:36 AM
This doesn't mean that we need people here using physics and chemistry jargons



complaining that people talk "too smart" is a sure sign that a person is insecure about their own lack of education and own mental shortcomings...

Which relates directly to




your BELOW AVERAGEINTELLIGENCE



a desperate attempt to convince others (and themselves) that they are the smart person here :rolleyes:

Hardwork's posts have demonstrated beyond a shadow of a doubt who the person of "below average intelligence" is :rolleyes:

Finally, anyone who uses "gloified kickboxing" over and over again is also really overcompansating for their own deficiency :rolleyes:

Back to the basement with you.....

HardWork8
06-02-2008, 09:39 AM
Note his "tone", people who point out he is wrong must be "intellectually challenged" :rolleyes:
Add instigating and participating in a tastless and disgusting prank!




Which system he REFUSES to say :rolleyes:

The system I practice is Siu Lam Wing Chun. It says so in my profile and it has been there for almost a year. Talk about intellectually challenged.:rolleyes:



TRANSLATION = when people who know more, have practiced longer, and have practical experience challenge his fantasy land he freaks out :rolleyes:

TRANSLATION = I have issues with glorified kickboxers who denegrade traditional kung fu that was designed and practiced by REAL kung fu grand masters.




Dude, sorry to burst your bubble,

The only thing burst here is your IDIOTIC AND TASTELESS PRANK! This has lost you the little credibility that you had left in these forums.



the people owning you all have WAY MORE EXPERIENCE and depth in their training than you can ever hope for

Yes and in KICKBOXING at that! LOL!


Basement boy, give it up, you're done here :rolleyes:

YOUR DISGUSTING PRANK HAS COLLAPSED AROUND YOUR EARS (LONG ONES SUCH AS THOSE OF A DONKEY, I PRESUME), AND YOU WANT ME TO GIVE UP?

I suggest you do something about your below average intelligence as well as your sore butt. I tell you what, why don't you see cjurakpt's "sore-butt" specialist friend. I am sure that he is an excellent healer, I mean thanks to me, he has had plenty of practice curing cjurakpt's forever-sore butt!

HardWork8
06-02-2008, 09:41 AM
complaining that people talk "too smart" is a sure sign that a person is insecure about their own lack of education and own mental shortcomings...

Which relates directly to



a desperate attempt to convince others (and themselves) that they are the smart person here :rolleyes:

Hardwork's posts have demonstrated beyond a shadow of a doubt who the person of "below average intelligence" is :rolleyes:

Finally, anyone who uses "gloified kickboxing" over and over again is also really overcompansating for their own deficiency :rolleyes:

Back to the basement with you.....



:rolleyes:

lkfmdc
06-02-2008, 09:47 AM
The system I practice is Siu Lam Wing Chun.



Do you think we forgot your other thread, where you talk about your second "deadly style" and it's "deadly master", but which you insist you must keep a secret :rolleyes:




TRANSLATION = I have issues with glorified kickboxers



TRANSLATION = after buying hook line and sinker your kung fu fantasy land (complere with DENIAL!) it sounds like a "glorified kickboxer" beat your "glorified ass :rolleyes:



I suggest you do something about your below average intelligence



LMFAO @ YOU

Do you think saying that is fooling anyone? You're a complete retard. Terribly insecure aren't we?

Time to move out of that basement. Have you ever kissed a girl?

HardWork8
06-02-2008, 09:55 AM
Lying is what he does best, he lied about his training, lied about who his teacher is, lied about his teachers teacher beating all sorts of people and bjj guys in real fights, DOCUMENTED fights that is, he lied about NOT training in a S&M basement with the gimp and lied about not knowing that she was a he in Thailand.

Lies, lies, lies...
:D

Yes, now to you. I have not lied about my teacher if you think that I have then please show me where? You can't can you and that is because you are the liar here!

Show me where he I said that he beat Bjj guys! You can't can you and that is because you are a liar!

You are nothing but a glorified kickboxer who has been "caught" pretending to actually know anything about kung fu. You are suffering from "Cjurakpt Sore-butt Syndrom".

You hear that Chris? You have got your wish and you are famous now. You have an anal disease named after you.LOL! Who would have known that our own Chris who is nothing more than borderline cognitively challenged kung fu wannabe would become so famous. Well I suppose that is the world we live in nowadays.;)

lkfmdc
06-02-2008, 10:02 AM
Let's summarize....

Hardwork8 is a LIAR, he doesn't want you to notice but he claimed (in addition to "Shaolin Wing Chun" :rolleyes: LOL) to do a secret kung fu style.

He claimed the master of that secret style had "documented" victories over famous BJJ and kickboxers

When called on the claim, he tucked tail and ran for the hills

Hardwork probably barely graudated highschool. His posts are rambling evidence of his inability to think clearly

His manic insistence on calling everyone "inferior" just demonstates his own insecurity and probably how large a failure he is in life

If he is indeed 45 as he claims, it's sad to think he still lives in mom's basement and has never even kissed a girl :rolleyes:

hardwork8's recently revealed picture (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=4642&d=1212348286)

HardWork8
06-02-2008, 10:05 AM
Do you think we forgot your other thread, where you talk about your second "deadly style" and it's "deadly master", but which you insist you must keep a secret :rolleyes:

Can you please provide the link where I talk about my second "deadly style" and it's "deadly master". And please make sure that the link you provide shows my actual post and not your version of it. Anyway you can't provide any direct links and that is because you are a LIAR!


TRANSLATION = after buying hook line and sinker your kung fu fantasy land (complere with DENIAL!) it sounds like a "glorified kickboxer" beat your "glorified ass :rolleyes:

It looks like you are the one fantasising now.:rolleyes:




LMFAO @ YOU

Do you think saying that is fooling anyone? You're a complete retard. Terribly insecure aren't we?

Becareful with use of the word "retard", because people like cjurakpt and unkokusai, being of such high moral character, as to participate in your idiotic prank, find it very offensive.


Time to move out of that basement. Have you ever kissed a girl?
I have kissed so many girls that the probability that one of them was your wife/girlfriend is much higher than that of you actually managing to win this discussion!

lkfmdc
06-02-2008, 10:12 AM
LMFAO....notice how he's degenerating here? Desperation setting in, he's throwing out what he hopes to be insults? LOL, not even clever insults.... "hey Chris you are alike an arse" (retarded laughter in the background)

:rolleyes:

"Shaolin Wing Chun" :rolleyes:

Basement boy, you haven't noticed the ENTIRE FORUM IS LAUGHING AT YOU? :rolleyes:

unkokusai
06-02-2008, 10:20 AM
I suggest you do something about your below average intelligence as well as your sore butt. I tell you what, why don't you see cjurakpt's "sore-butt" specialist friend. I am sure that he is an excellent healer, I mean thanks to me, he has had plenty of practice curing cjurakpt's forever-sore butt!


What are you, twelve years old? What the hell is wrong with you?

unkokusai
06-02-2008, 10:24 AM
That's it! This guy is not some unbelievably pathetic 45 year old, he is just a punk little kid trolling on the internet!

It all makes sense now!

lkfmdc
06-02-2008, 10:27 AM
Originally Posted by HardWork8
I suggest you do something about your below average intelligence as well as your sore butt. I tell you what, why don't you see cjurakpt's "sore-butt" specialist friend. I am sure that he is an excellent healer, I mean thanks to me, he has had plenty of practice curing cjurakpt's forever-sore butt!

What are you, twelve years old? What the hell is wrong with you?

LMFAO, but that's exactly the point, just read his posts and you can see a ranting raving lunatic going off the deep end

lkfmdc
06-02-2008, 10:28 AM
That's it! This guy is not some unbelievably pathetic 45 year old, he is just a punk little kid trolling on the internet!

It all makes sense now!

Unfortunately, chances are good that he is indeed 45 and indeed believes the crap he is posting :D

Equally good are the chances he lives in mom's basement and wacks to mom's catalogues

cjurakpt
06-02-2008, 10:50 AM
And all this time I fought that the ringing noise was you and your forum boyfriends schreeking in fear of being exposed as nothing more than glorified kickboxers and pseudo-kung fu-ists.;)
no, it's your tiny brain; but I wouldn't expect you to know that, especially with your sore-butt sending all those noisy afferent signals up your head


Stop trying to hide your shame!
now now, bringing up what your shrink says to you about your flashbacks of what the big boys did to you on the playground in front of all the other children isn't going to help anything; although it would explain your persistent fascination with the state of everyone else's butt...I think that your "trauma" on the playground has scared you so deeply, that all you can do is fantasize about my butt as way of mentally protecting yourself from the horrible shame that haunts you to this day;


Presumably he is the same guy who is treating your sore butt condition.
actually, I even asked my friend about your condition, since you keep bringing it up, and he said that as a student he had read all about your specific case in the "Journal of Advanced Colorectal Dysfunction" (in fact, he mentioned that it was the reason that they started the periodical, evidently your case was so far beyond anything that had ever been seen before!); now, the way he explained things was pretty "jargony", so I will translate it for you (since I do have a lot of experience working with the profoundly mentally challenged; I figure in your case all I need to change is talk even more slowly): evidently it took a team of 12 colorectal surgeons, psychiatrists and plumbers to reconstruct both your butt and the fragile ego that sits on top of it; he said it was landmark case, the first of its kind, but that there was little hope for full recovery, and that you would be plagued your entire life with diminished mental capacity and anal irritation; I must say, he was pretty excited to know that their predictions had held true, although he warned me that it would be a cold day in Hades before anything intelligent cam out of your mouth; he also suggested that you stop using the "implement" on yourself (?) and that you should give the scabs on your hands time to heal (???)

sanjuro_ronin
06-02-2008, 11:37 AM
actually, I even asked my friend about your condition, since you keep bringing it up, and he said that as a student he had read all about your specific case in the "Journal of Advanced Colorectal Dysfunction"...

Thanks a lot, I spew water all over my keyboard :mad:

cjurakpt
06-02-2008, 12:06 PM
You are suffering from "Cjurakpt Sore-butt Syndrom".
You hear that Chris? You have got your wish and you are famous now. You have an anal disease named after you.LOL! Who would have known that our own Chris who is nothing more than borderline cognitively challenged kung fu wannabe would become so famous. Well I suppose that is the world we live in nowadays.;)

this was to be expected; as my friend explained to me, at a recent symposium of colorectal surgeons, psychiatrists and plumbers, a presentation entitled "Hemorrhoids and Warts in Eight Rectaly Induced Psychotics" (a.k.a. HW8-RIP) was given in order to clarify the link between repeated anal trauma and the long-term psychological effects: essentially, when confronted by individuals who remind him of his own intellectual inadequacies, the patient will associate such individuals with his original violators in context of the symptoms he is experiencing; as such, the shattered ego attempts to deal with the unresolved trauma by actually ascribing his rectal disorder to the person who reminds him of his unmitigated shame and grief; as such, HW8 here has exhibited the classic coping phenomenon, resulting in transference of his own humiliation onto myself, since I obviously bring up his feelings of inadequacy and the inevitable loss of bowel/bladder control

I have actually recommended to my friend that he consider taking on HW8 as a charity case, although it would no doubt require clearing his schedule for the next several years in order to establish a facility large enough to house the vast number of specialists that doing so would require...

cjurakpt
06-02-2008, 12:10 PM
Thanks a lot, I spew water all over my keyboard :mad:

always happy to help :D

Drake
06-02-2008, 12:23 PM
Where do you all find the time to post this much? I mean, it jumped like 4 pages since I checked before work. That's a whole lot of time for a whole lot of stupid.

lkfmdc
06-02-2008, 12:24 PM
a presentation entitled "Hemorrhoids and Warts in Eight Rectaly Induced Psychotics" (a.k.a. HW8-RIP) was given in order to clarify the link between repeated anal trauma and the long-term psychological effects:



:D

precisely my diagnosis

cjurakpt
06-02-2008, 12:25 PM
Where do you all find the time to post this much? I mean, it jumped like 4 pages since I checked before work. That's a whole lot of time for a whole lot of stupid.

I'm on a Fulbright...

lkfmdc
06-02-2008, 12:26 PM
Where do you all find the time to post this much?



I don't actually post on here, it's just a bot programmed to do it for me

In fact, I don't even really exist! I am just a figment of your imagination

lkfmdc
06-02-2008, 12:26 PM
I'm on a Fulbright...

and right about now he's screaming "get off me"! :mad:

Drake
06-02-2008, 12:31 PM
I don't actually post on here, it's just a bot programmed to do it for me

In fact, I don't even really exist! I am just a figment of your imagination

I find that hypothesis to be highly probable. :D

cjurakpt
06-02-2008, 12:37 PM
and right about now he's screaming "get off me"! :mad:

ba-dump-bump!

HardWork8
06-02-2008, 08:33 PM
LMFAO....notice how he's degenerating here? Desperation setting in, he's throwing out what he hopes to be insults? LOL, not even clever insults.... "hey Chris you are alike an arse" (retarded laughter in the background)

:rolleyes:

"Shaolin Wing Chun" :rolleyes:

Basement boy, you haven't noticed the ENTIRE FORUM IS LAUGHING AT YOU? :rolleyes:

:rolleyes:

HardWork8
06-02-2008, 08:35 PM
Let's summarize....

Hardwork8 is a LIAR, he doesn't want you to notice but he claimed (in addition to "Shaolin Wing Chun" :rolleyes: LOL) to do a secret kung fu style.

He claimed the master of that secret style had "documented" victories over famous BJJ and kickboxers

When called on the claim, he tucked tail and ran for the hills

Hardwork probably barely graudated highschool. His posts are rambling evidence of his inability to think clearly

His manic insistence on calling everyone "inferior" just demonstates his own insecurity and probably how large a failure he is in life

If he is indeed 45 as he claims, it's sad to think he still lives in mom's basement and has never even kissed a girl :rolleyes:

hardwork8's recently revealed picture (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=4642&d=1212348286)

:rolleyes:

HardWork8
06-02-2008, 08:37 PM
What are you, twelve years old? What the hell is wrong with you?

:rolleyes:

HardWork8
06-02-2008, 08:39 PM
That's it! This guy is not some unbelievably pathetic 45 year old, he is just a punk little kid trolling on the internet!

It all makes sense now!

:rolleyes:

HardWork8
06-02-2008, 08:40 PM
LMFAO, but that's exactly the point, just read his posts and you can see a ranting raving lunatic going off the deep end

:rolleyes:

HardWork8
06-02-2008, 09:11 PM
no, it's your tiny brain; but I wouldn't expect you to know that, especially with your sore-butt sending all those noisy afferent signals up your head

RIGHT NOW, YOU ARE THE ONE WHO HAS BEEN EXPOSED AS A PARTICIPANT IN THAT TASTELESS PRANK! FOR WHICH YOU HAVE REFUSED TO APOLOGIZE.

So if you bother to sit down for a few seconds then you will see that it is your butt that is sore.


now now, bringing up what your shrink says to you about your flashbacks of what the big boys did to you on the playground in front of all the other children isn't going to help anything; although it would explain your persistent fascination with the state of everyone else's butt...I think that your "trauma" on the playground has scared you so deeply, that all you can do is fantasize about my butt as way of mentally protecting yourself from the horrible shame that haunts you to this day;

And for the last time, keep your gay fantasies for another forum as I have my hands full with your below average intelligence.



actually, I even asked my friend about your condition,

Christ, the man even has a friend. Your "friend" should be more choosey about who he lets into his life.


(since I do have a lot of experience working with the profoundly mentally challenged;
Well you seem to have TOO MUCH EXPERIENCE working with the mentally challenged as it seems to be rubbing off on you to an extent for you to have participated in that DISGUSTING PRANK!


I figure in your case all I need to change is talk even more slowly):

You can also change the retard pills that you are taking. Maybe their side effects were to blame for your participation in that hideous prank that managed to offend just about everybody here.


evidently it took a team of 12 colorectal surgeons,
So is that a new term you use to describe your boyfriends? Shame on them for doing what they do to you inspite of your sore butt. Don't they see your suffering?

And you Chris should be more assertive with them and just say NO! Tell them that you are suffering from "Cjurakpt's Syndrome" (Painfull sore-buttedness as a direct result of actions taken by the sufferer because of his below average intelligence), they'll understand for sure.


psychiatrists and plumbers to reconstruct both your butt and the fragile ego that sits on top of it; he said it was landmark case, the first of its kind, but that there was little hope for full recovery, and that you would be plagued your entire life with diminished mental capacity and anal irritation; I must say, he was pretty excited to know that their predictions had held true, although he warned me that it would be a cold day in Hades before anything intelligent cam out of your mouth; he also suggested that you stop using the "implement" on yourself (?) and that you should give the scabs on your hands time to heal (???)

I have said this before and I'll say it again, take it easy with those retard medication and for god's sake stop mixing them with your Cjurkpt's Syndrom medicine. You are all over the place on this last part.

All you need to do is come out and apologize for participating in that tasteless prank and it will all be fine.

HardWork8
06-02-2008, 09:41 PM
this was to be expected; as my friend explained to me,

That "friend" again! Chris, do you really have a friend outside internet land? Or is this another nasty prank?


at a recent symposium of colorectal surgeons, psychiatrists and plumbers,

"plumbers"? So you were there too. You show off.


a presentation entitled "Hemorrhoids and Warts in Eight Rectaly Induced Psychotics" (a.k.a. HW8-RIP) was given in order to clarify the link between repeated anal trauma and the long-term psychological effects:

Let me see,"repeated anal trauma and long-term psychological effects"! don't tell me you took with you, your twelve boyfriends, ahem, I mean your "colorectal surgeons";)

You old rascal, you were the subject of the presentation. Christ, I don't believe it, you are already capitalizing on your Cjurakpt Syndrom and you haven't sent me a dime in commisions. May I remind you that I am the cause of your sore-buttedness by repeatedly kicking your forum butt and not your 12 boyfriends doing whatever you people do to each other.

Now here is the deal, 15&#37; flat commision on all presentations and book deals otherwise you are going to hear from my lawyer.


essentially, when confronted by individuals who remind him of his own intellectual inadequacies, the patient will associate such individuals with his original violators in context of the symptoms he is experiencing; as such, the shattered ego attempts to deal with the unresolved trauma by actually ascribing his rectal disorder to the person who reminds him of his unmitigated shame and grief;

Christ, I couldn't have described you better! LOL!



I have actually recommended to my friend that he consider taking on HW8 as a charity case,
You mean he has given up on your sore-butt condition already. You mean there is no cure for Cjurakpt's Syndrom?

God, I feel so guilty! there you were, a "normal" person of below average intelligence, hopping along all over the place in the KF forums prentending to know about kung fu and hidding behind your medical jargon to come across as "intelligent" and fooling a lot of people I presume,as well.

And now look at you suffering chronically from your sore butt and all because of me. How am I going to live myself for the rest of my life having condemned a person, who was already a few cents short of a dollar; a person who was not the brightest star in the galaxy; a person who sees Unkokusai as a forum friend:confused:; a person who was dumb enough to participate in offensive childish pranks; a person one would not call for any intelligent conversation, even if you were the last person on the planet - condemned to suffer from a sore butt for the rest of your life.

DEAR GOD, WHAT HAVE I DONE?

HardWork8
06-02-2008, 10:36 PM
Cjurakpt:




PS. Listen, why don't you try some karate forums? There you can tell everyone that you "know" karate. I am sure that you can make some great friends like your belowed Unkokusai and you can have plenty of fun until someone exposes you for being a person of below average intelligence of questionable knowledge about anything martial.

Of course, then you can look for some Judo forums where you can tell eveyone that you "know" judo and so on.

cjurakpt
06-03-2008, 02:46 AM
DEAR GOD, WHAT HAVE I DONE?
not much, except regurgitate the same old lame material, predicate your entire "comeback" on simply repeating "no, you are talking about yourself, not me" :rolleyes: (BTW, if you are going to try to set up a mock, at least spell it correctly), and then double post it for some bizarre reason;

anyway, you are getting boring; when you come up w/something original or funny, let me know, we can continue this "exchange"

:cool:

HardWork8
06-03-2008, 03:10 AM
not much, except regurgitate the same old lame material, predicate your entire "comeback" on simply repeating "no, you are talking about yourself, not me" :rolleyes:

Don't blame me if your posts contain some Freudian Slips.



(BTW, if you are going to try to set up a mock, at least spell it correctly), and then double post it for some bizarre reason;
Eventhough double posting would be a good idea for anyone trying to explain anything for people of below average intelligence such as yourself, it was a genuine mistake so I have edited it and have only left the relevant bit for you and your "brain" to absorb.

I wish the both of you the best of luck with that.


anyway, you are getting boring;

I am sure that so is your "Cjurakpt's (Sore-butt) Syndrom". Do you see the connection?


when you come up w/something original or funny, let me know, we can continue this "exchange"


AND WHEN YOU DECIDE TO APOLOGIZE FOR HAVING PARTICIPATED IN THIS UGLY AND UNTASTEFUL PRANK(I mean the prank that made me out to be a Nazi racist and not the one about you pretending to know Kung Fu), YOU CAN LET ME KNOW!

:cool:

cjurakpt
06-03-2008, 04:33 AM
LOL, you just can't stand not having the last word, can you?

(go ahead, it's all yours :rolleyes:...)

HardWork8
06-03-2008, 04:53 AM
LOL, you just can't stand not having the last word, can you?

(go ahead, it's all yours :rolleyes:...)

Actually in this case the last word should be yours, WHEN YOU FINALLY DECIDE TO APOLOGIZE FOR PARTICIPATING IN Ikfmdc's UGLY AND DISGUSTING PRANK!

SHAME ON YOU!

cjurakpt
06-03-2008, 05:13 AM
Actually in this case the last word should be yours, WHEN YOU FINALLY DECIDE TO APOLOGIZE FOR PARTICIPATING IN Ikfmdc's UGLY AND DISGUSTING PRANK!

SHAME ON YOU!

LOL, predictable...

HardWork8
06-03-2008, 05:39 AM
LOL, predictable...

So was your downfall from your fantasy tower of kung fu knowledge!

Now, why don't you be a good boy and go to some karate forums and pretend to be a "karate expert", oh and don't forget to take your medical jargon with you, because you never know, they may just come handy when you need to hide your lack of knowledge and your below average intelligence from the other participants.

lkfmdc
06-03-2008, 06:41 AM
fantasy tower of kung fu knowledge!



oh, the irony! Basement living, 45 year old virgin la-la land boy talking about a "fantasy tower of kung fu knowledge" :rolleyes:

and still trying to convince people he has some intellect

BACK TO THE BASEMENT! DON'T YOU HEAR YOUR MOTHER CALLING?

Lama Pai Sifu
06-03-2008, 06:54 AM
Uh, I thought this was the CLF vs. MMA thread?? WTF happened here???

Drake
06-03-2008, 07:00 AM
Uh, I thought this was the CLF vs. MMA thread?? WTF happened here???

Hijacked, like every other thread on the website. I reckon your fan technique thread will be the next one to go.

SimonM
06-03-2008, 07:08 AM
Here is another conclusion, you have fallen for their tasteless antisemetic prank as was intended. Go and read the whole thread!

Right, I'm SO bored at work that I am going to go and read a trolling thread from beginning to end just to watch all the trolling. :rolleyes:

SimonM
06-03-2008, 07:12 AM
That may be because I have been exposed to the "merits" of glorified kickboxing rather than those of KUNG FU, by people such as yourself!


Out of curiosity, and remember that I say this as somebody who considers himself to be in the "traditionalist" camp in that I believe that the errors ascribed to "traditionalists" in their training regimen are actually introductions of the 20th century alone, what (precisely) in your eyes separates wu gong in it's multitudinous forms from a variety of "glorified kickboxing" schools?

Lama Pai Sifu
06-03-2008, 07:46 AM
Hijacked, like every other thread on the website. I reckon your fan technique thread will be the next one to go.

I'm sure. Why don't the mods do something about this??? It's almost like they act like they have some other kind of jobs or something....like moderating this forum is not their MAIN FOCUS IN LIFE, which of course it should be! PPFFSSSTTTT!

C'mon Mods, do your job here and help to bring some real life back to this forum (I'm serious about this part)

If you moderate it seriously, and don't give everyone so much lattitude, I think some good people will come back and that some of the people who are still here will fall back in line and act correctly.

Just a thought.

Peace

Drake
06-03-2008, 07:48 AM
I'm even more curious as to why they stepped in and locked Sifu Frank's thread. It was a silly argument, but at least it was CLF related! Yet the e-challenge threads continue...

Lama Pai Sifu
06-03-2008, 07:49 AM
I'm even more curious as to why they stepped in and locked Sifu Frank's thread. It was a silly argument, but at least it was CLF related! Yet the e-challenge threads continue...

No, Frank actually was going nuts about all other kind of things as well. He started attacking people personally and was unable to keep it only CLF related. When he was ganged up on by everyone (and quite justified) he began to panic and wig out.

lkfmdc
06-03-2008, 07:54 AM
unfortunately, it's predictable and a pretty standard formula here

one man's discussion is another man's argument, so arguing about techniques, training, lineage, titles etc is what this forum SHOULD be about

yet, inevitably, some people when they can't keep up with the topic at hand have to resort to name calling, bringing up personal info (often INCORRECT making it even more funny), people's wives, divorces, ethnic background, etc

"my clf if better" is fine IMHO

"didn't your mother tell you that you are ugly" is NOT

Drake
06-03-2008, 07:55 AM
No, Frank actually was going nuts about all other kind of things as well. He started attacking people personally and was unable to keep it only CLF related. When he was ganged up on by everyone (and quite justified) he began to panic and wig out.

Maybe CLF-based was a better word, then? Like... based on martial arts before everything went stupid?