Athleticism (too bad for u)

[Ray Pina]

It's become blazingly apparent to me that athleticism is a critical factor in victory. Yes, my technique and general dimensions of unarmed combat has and continues to improve, but my body is more up for the task.

Springyness. Density. Extraordinary cardiovascular. Coordination. Mindless flow.

The two, technical training and ability training, have to go hand and hand, and those with a natural athletic disposition will have an advantage in exploiting those unforeseeable opportunities that always arise in combat. The game is fixed for the quick of foot but a determined martial artist can achieve amazing victories.

[Ray Pina]

Meant to add, if you got ****ed at the "too bad for U" then you're on the right track... the vertical jumping, load bearing, sure of yourself because you train to be a super hero tough motherfu(ker.

[unkokusai]

LOL! A lot of dojo-darlings don't want to hear about athleticism.

[Mr Punch]

Meant to add, if you got ****ed at the "too bad for U" then you're on the right track... I didn't get ****ed off at that because I do train all that when I'm not ****ing injured. So I guess I'm on the right track, thanks!

[Ray Pina]

I didn't get ****ed off at that because I do train all that when I'm not ****ing injured.

Awesome!...............

[Lucas]

Fully.

alot of times when I picture fighters, or combat, I like to picture a tiger, leopard, wolf, bear, etc.

those animals are in prime physical condition, simply due to the lives they lead. Our lives should be lead in a manner that we can immulate the animalisitic qualities of our four legged brothers.

[Kevin Huang]

In terms of reality combat, NO.

One doesn't need to be a great athlete to walk away from a bad situation before it even happens.

Victory in reality combat is escaping a potentially bad situation UNSCATHED.

[Shaolinlueb]

i am the pwnzer fighter MMA PWNZ KUNG FU AND BJJ IS THE BEST!!! WOOOOOOOOOOOOO

[SimonM]

moving along..... :rolleyes:

[Merryprankster]

**** straight Ray.

Is it absolutely necessary? Nope. But it is one more weapon in the arsenal. If I can outwork you in a short time frame because I'm in better shape, then that's one more advantage.

If I have to run, and I can run faster, further than you, then that's one more advantage.

If I'm in better shape, my body handles adrenaline dump and can react quicker than yours, that's one more advantage.

So, hell yes, conditioning and athleticism matter. They can, under some circumstances, even be decisive!

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

you were stoned when you had that revalation werent you?

i aint hatin either ... just sayin ...

[SPJ]

athletic usually refering to fitness for a certain sports.

in CMA, there are 2 general MA related fitness programs.

1. Qi gong, it is related to cardiovascular, relaxation/stretching of tendon, muscle and joints.

2. conditioning, such as self hitting practice, you condition your palm, forearm, shoulder, chest and back etc by hitting on bags, pads etc with increased intensity over time. you practice your grabbing powers by grab 5 # flour bag tossed in the air---

these are how and why your moves would work.

one other important aspect not mentioned is actually daily chores or labors, cleaning, lifting a heavy bag of rice, ---

these all contribute to your general fitness and MA related fitness.

or gong.

if you only practice moves, but with no power or gong to deliver them.

everything is in vain or in the air.

Lian Quan Bu Lian Gong. Dao Lao Yi Chang Kong.

;)

[Becca]

Na, wasn't stoned. But it has bee a while since we've had an atta boy thread for Ray. I won't disagre, though. You can talk the talk, you can walk the walk. But every truely fantactic marial artist I've ever known was also in fantastic shape.

[SPJ]

or make a long story short, pick up a sport and do it for life along with your MA practice.

I pick swim and ping pong.

when I like to relax and endurance, I swim hours every day.

when I like to jump left and right, back and forth I play ping pong hours every day.

na, that was high school.

but nowadays I still swim and play ping pong on the weekend.

on weekdays, I am tired from work.

--

;)

[Kevin Huang]

Some of the toughest streetfighters I know aren't in great physical shape.

For example, Marc MacYoung is somebody that I e-mail with from time to time. I respect him as much as I do any great master, and I would NEVER want to fight him under any circumstances. MacYoung isn't the greatest physical specimen (by his own admission), and yet he scares me more than a lot of other guys who are in far better shape than he is.

In the streets, the faster and stronger guy often doesn't win. The SMARTER and LUCKIER guy does.

[Becca]

Some of the toughest streetfighters I know aren't in great physical shape. You don't need to be in the best of shape to be a meth head on a binge.

In the streets, the faster and stronger guy often doesn't win. The SMARTER and LUCKIER guy does.The "smarter" guys don't hang out in the streats because they know d2mn well the law of probability will catch up with them. Luck in a fight with meath heads doesn't make you a good fighter.

[Lucas]

just wondering, why do you assume everyone is a 'meth head'?

Not everyone 'on the street' is a 'meth head'

thats just close mindedness. sorry.

[Becca]

Why do you asume that I assmue that "everyone is a meth head"? I have every right to answer mindless over -geralized garbage with outragious over-generalized garbage. :cool:

[Judge Pen]

In terms of reality combat, NO.

One doesn't need to be a great athlete to walk away from a bad situation before it even happens.

Victory in reality combat is escaping a potentially bad situation UNSCATHED.

I'll agree with this. Surviving an altercation relatively unharmed is the best anyone can hope for if we ever have to defend ourselves.

[Kevin Huang]

Some people are forced to survive on the street because they have no way out.

That takes an intelligence of sorts, one that I respect highly.

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

Na, wasn't stoned. But it has bee a while since we've had an atta boy thread for Ray. I won't disagre, though. You can talk the talk, you can walk the walk. But every truely fantactic marial artist I've ever known was also in fantastic shape.

lol .. i meant ray was stoned when he had this revalation. not you.

[Vash]

lol .. i meant ray was stoned when he had this revalation. not you.

lol, kinda seems that way.

"Dude, maybe, martial arts is, like, and athletic endeavor, or something."

Just pokin', e-fist.

[Water Dragon]

In the streets, the faster and stronger guy often doesn't win. The SMARTER and LUCKIER guy does.

My money's on the guy with the gun.

[Black Jack II]

My money's on the guy with the gun.

I won't bet against that:D

[Kevin Huang]

Me neither.

Those who haven't experienced reality combat (and I'm not just talking mere brawling - I'm talking about all the "leadup" to violent encounters) will often look at some big brawny athletic specimen and assume "That guy is a tough streetfighter".

In truth, a truly tough streetfighter does not fit any preconceived mold of what the media (particularly the movies) would have us believe. Some of the dweebiest, skinniest, wimpiest looking guys are horribly tough streetfighters who know exactly how to wreak lethal damage on all sorts of foes.

Those who've experienced reality combat are aware that the wimpy looking guy standing in front of them might not look like a threat from an "athletic" perspective. Yet when he pulls out a gun or summons his friends, that wimpy looking guy becomes a very DANGEROUS opponent.

Even somebody as scary and experienced as like Kimbo Slice would not be able to stop a group of thugs from cornering him with guns and taking his money.

[Lucas]

Why do you asume that I assmue that "everyone is a meth head"? I have every right to answer mindless over -geralized garbage with outragious over-generalized garbage. :cool:

why do you assume that I assume that you assume that there are assumptiones about meth heads? :p

actually to give your angle a bit of weight, the last 'street fight' i got into was with a meth head.

luckily I had a skate board and hit him over the head and ran like hell before he could get what ever he had in his pocket out. i assume he had a knife, but I wasnt sticking around to find out.

on that note though he did try to punch me in the stomach, i was holding my board by the wheels with the grip facing him, by reflex i pulled down with the board and chopped his wrist. I think i was as suprised as he was. thats when he started fumbling in his pants pocket.

mind, this was about 6years ago, and it was my ego that got me into that situation. he wanted a ciggarette (back when I used to smoke, i quit right after that actually lol) and I told him no, he called me a dik, i flipped him off, he got mad, and I stopped to let him get in my face.

lucky for me he was drunk and stupid, and missing all his front teeth for that matter.

the funny thing is I saw him 3 days later at the train stop and his friend asked me for a cig... I dont think he recognized me though.

[Becca]

And to answer your question a bit more: I use meth heads as an example because Denver has 2 kinds of streat people, peaceful or meth head. There may be a few other types mixed in, but most of the time the ones picking fights, breaking and entering, ect are on meth. Maybe the crack heads are the violent one's elsewhere, but here the crack heads are peaceful, even mildly amusing.

[Lucas]

And to answer your question a bit more: I use meth heads as an example because Denver has 2 kinds of streat people, peaceful or meth head. There may be a few other types mixed in, but most of the time the ones picking fights, breaking and entering, ect are on meth. Maybe the crack heads are the violent one's elsewhere, but here the crack heads are peaceful, even mildly amusing.

no, i totally get you. im in oregon, we are something like the birth place of serious street meth heads. or at least darn close to it. its a freaking epidemic. the police all but ignore it.

for example. our china town....or what you might call china town except that its over run with meth heads, the police pushed them all out of down town and the other surrounding business areas, and pushed them all into china town. you can walk down the street and just watch deals go down. not one cop walking the street. cross burnside street and you see a cop walking every couple blocks. fuking sad police force BS if you ask me. they protect and serve, as long as you look right or are in the right neighborhood.

now you dont even really see many chinese people at all, just the meth heads. ive seen chinese business after chinese business close because of this and it makes me sick.

i wish i could go kick all the meth addicts out of china town. its barely even a china town anymore.

[Kevin Huang]

Oh well. Sorry about Meth-Chinatown. But hey, the cops have the right to do what they want in.

There are plenty of people who HATE the Chinese. I have to put up with them EVERY DAY. It used to be uncomfortable, but now I accept it as a fact of daily life.

That said, there's room in America for everybody. Here, we can live wherever we want and do whatever we want provided we stay within the law. I don't have to stick around to put up with anybody's racially motivated BS.

I get taunted on the street for being Chinese, and there are many establishments where I am not welcomed because of my skin color. I'm actually fine with all that, because the vast majority of Americans are accepting of all ethnicities. I'm proud to be American and have no desire to live anywhere else.

Personally, I don't have any problem with somebody disliking me because I'm Chinese. I'm not one of those politically correct types who gets offended at everything. It used to bother me when I was younger, but then I realized that a TINY minority of people were the ones making my life difficult. Everybody else was quite nice and fair, which is all I ever really wanted in life.

I've managed to avoid violent confrontation over the years, though it comes dangerously close on a regular basis. For me, my ability to walk away from a bad situation and/or "nice" my way out of a trap is far more important than my athletic conditioning (quite good) or my kung fu mechanics.

Also, being Chinese nowadays has a reverse effect. People automatically assume that you're some sort of wussy Jackie Chan fake martial artist, and so I'm not seen as threatening. In fact, people make Bruce Lee catcalls and call me Jackie Chan all the time - always at a distance, of course.

Meanwhile, I know some scary tough looking guys who are constantly being harassed by perps who are insecure about themselves and seek to prove themselves by taking on the tough guys. I'd rather have a bunch of guys calling me "Jackie" than have them getting in my face because they're trying to look tough to their equally scared buddies.

[Water Dragon]

I wanna wreak lethal damage of all sorts on foes! Where do I sign up?

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

i wonder who would win in a fight between mike tyson and mike phelps.

[Merryprankster]

In the water or on land?

[Vash]

i wonder who would win in a fight between mike tyson and mike phelps.

Chuck Norris.

[Kevin Huang]

How does one define "winning" in a streetfight?

Is it beating the other guy down - and then being hauled away by the cops and slapped with a civil suit after?

Is it crushing guys in the MMA cage - only to be robbed at gunpoint? That's what happened to Anderson Silva a few years ago, and that's one of the toughest men on the planet.

Is it walking away from a bar fight - and then you get smashed in the head by a bottle wielding combatant?

Is it taking a beating and getting robbed - but you LIVED to talk about it?

Is it not getting into a fight at all - and then others laugh at you because you're now perceived as a coward?

[SAAMAG]

How does one define "winning" in a streetfight?

Is it beating the other guy down - and then being hauled away by the cops and slapped with a civil suit after?

Is it crushing guys in the MMA cage - only to be robbed at gunpoint? That's what happened to Anderson Silva a few years ago, and that's one of the toughest men on the planet.

Is it walking away from a bar fight - and then you get smashed in the head by a bottle wielding combatant?

Is it taking a beating and getting robbed - but you LIVED to talk about it?

Is it not getting into a fight at all - and then others laugh at you because you're now perceived as a coward?

First, if you're in a fight out in public, there will be witnesses. If you were defending yourself and stopped when the opponent was no longer a threat, you're fine in the eyes of the law. If you were alone with no witnesses, and stayed there for the cops to come and haul you away, than you deserve to be in jail because you're stupid.

Don't want to get in a bar fight? Don't hang out in bars. Taking a beating and getting robbed (but living) has nothing to do with martial arts (or lack thereof) and is just pure chance that your attackers decided to let you live.

Not getting into a fight at all--well that's the typical mr miyagi answer and the best one of the bunch.

In modern days...you can't run around getting into fights because you'll just end up getting shot and killed.

[SAAMAG]

It's become blazingly apparent to me that athleticism is a critical factor in victory. Yes, my technique and general dimensions of unarmed combat has and continues to improve, but my body is more up for the task.

Springyness. Density. Extraordinary cardiovascular. Coordination. Mindless flow.

The two, technical training and ability training, have to go hand and hand, and those with a natural athletic disposition will have an advantage in exploiting those unforeseeable opportunities that always arise in combat. The game is fixed for the quick of foot but a determined martial artist can achieve amazing victories.

Funny that you had this revelation so late in the game! But nonetheless good. I agree completely...being in good shape is something all martial artists should strive for -- and being "fighters" one should be training like one.

It doesn't matter if the fight will only last 15 seconds...being in fight shape will only help. In the fight and in life. For example -- I can now go for ten 3-minute rounds because of my training, and on a side note my cholesterol levels dropped 37 points over the last few months because I've been training to "fight" again. Lot's of conditioning and cross training in addition to weights and my martial arts--it all helps.

Anyone that thinks you can be a martial artist and not be in shape in dillusional. Yes you might be able to "survive" or get out "unscathed" but why would you purposely forgo keeping yourself in shape when "self defense" includes proper living? There are more ways to die than being attacked by an opponent...heart disease is more of a killer than that mugger at 2a.m.

[Kevin Huang]

Vankuen, surely you're not another one of "those guys" that dares not hang out in bars because they're "too dangerous!"

I've been going to bars for most of my adult life, and I have never ever had a problem. C'mon Vankuen, of course you go to bars too like the rest of us guys here do. You know that bars are great places to hang out and meet hot chicks :D

One of my students trained JKD at a "hardcore" school for a while. The training was rough and brutal. When the group wanted to hang out at a restaurant, my student suggested a local sports bar. The guys flipped out, saying "We don't hang out at bars, they're DANGEROUS". My student couldn't believe what he was hearing, as he's a family man who's been going to bars for years. And I still can't stop laughing about it!

The most "dangerous" thing that happened to me was that this hot blond chick was rubbing up against me at a bar years ago! I was naive like I am now, and I had no idea what was happening. It felt GOOD, though!

[SAAMAG]

Vankuen, surely you're not another one of "those guys" that dares not hang out in bars because they're "too dangerous!"

I've been going to bars for most of my adult life, and I have never ever had a problem. C'mon Vankuen, of course you go to bars too like the rest of us guys here do. You know that bars are great places to hang out and meet hot chicks :D

One of my students trained JKD at a "hardcore" school for a while. The training was rough and brutal. When the group wanted to hang out at a restaurant, my student suggested a local sports bar. The guys flipped out, saying "We don't hang out at bars, they're DANGEROUS". My student couldn't believe what he was hearing, as he's a family man who's been going to bars for years. And I still can't stop laughing about it!

The most "dangerous" thing that happened to me was that this hot blond chick was rubbing up against me at a bar years ago! I was naive like I am now, and I had no idea what was happening. It felt GOOD, though!

I very very very rarely drink--and when I do drink it's 1-2 beers. That and I'm not single. No reason to go to a bar given those circumstances.

However that said, I do and have gone to bars once in a while because of a social gathering. That statement was a general one for those that complain about bar fights.

[Kevin Huang]

So if you feel it's OK for YOU to go to bars, why are you criticizing me for doing the same thing?

I posed the issue that bar fights happen - which they do. Yet you admonish me to not "complain" about them by advising me to "don't go to bars?"

Don't tell me you're one of those "other" people that has one set of bar rules for yourself and another set of bar rules for me. Because that's CRAZY LAME.

[SAAMAG]

Wow...you took that suggestion right in the butt didn't you? It's not a set of rules, it's a suggestion for those that don't want to fight in bars; a simple solution for a perceived problem.

Look...if I'm at a bar and a fight breaks out I'm not going to wine about it. If you're the type that does, than just don't friggin go to a bar. It's that simple.

Afterall, isn't part of the practice of martial arts simply the process of seeking solutions to problems? That's the easiest and most easily applied solution for you. What's with the crazy lame aggression?

Woof!

[Kevin Huang]

I don't whine as much about bars anywhere as much as you WOOF at me from a DISTANCE.

Just as you're continuing to advise to stay away from bars, I'll advise you to stay right where you are behind your keyboard. Your mouthboxing works best from your current vantage point.

Meanwhile, I'll continue to walk into bars and teach martial arts professionally. Woofers like you don't last long in either bars or professional martial arts.

[MightyB]

I wanna wreak lethal damage of all sorts on foes! Where do I sign up?

http://www.marines.com

[SimonM]

When I was going out to bars it seemed like fights avoided me. They happened but never where I was.

Just lucky I guess.

Now I'm married and busy and rarely (last night excluded) drink.

[SAAMAG]

I don't whine as much about bars anywhere as much as you WOOF at me from a DISTANCE.

Just as you're continuing to advise to stay away from bars, I'll advise you to stay right where you are behind your keyboard. Your mouthboxing works best from your current vantage point.

Meanwhile, I'll continue to walk into bars and teach martial arts professionally. Woofers like you don't last long in either bars or professional martial arts.

Ok so now is where I'm just going to make fun of you for the rest of your time here because you're reminding me a lot of some other recent moronic additions to the forum.

What you fail to realize is that my post was simply offering solutions to the situations you presented -- your superiority complex is inhibiting your cognitive abilities. The other thing you're failing to realize is that your offers to cross hands are just as "woofy" as the people's comments you get offended by--because you know **** well no one is going to take time off of work and pay for a plane ticket to fly to Arizona just to kick your ass because of an internet dispute. It's just as much of a bark as any other.

Just get off your high horse, understand that teaching doesn't make you a professional martial artist -- it makes you a professional teacher. Being a professional martial artist means you FIGHT for a living (not on the internet mind you). Not only that--but most of us here are also current instructors or past instructors.

[Kevin Huang]

That's not luck, SimonM.

That's the NORMAL experience of a lawbiding citizen. Good for you.

Most "tough guy" martial artists, particularly woofers, cannot understand this even if you explain it to them.

They're so INSECURE about their own abilities that they try to medicate away their abject inner fear by bullying others. As a result, their aggression draws in enemies the way light draws flies at night.

SimonM's bar experience mirrors mine perfectly. That's because I go out of my ways to respect others, not accusing them of "taking suggestions in the butt".

[SimonM]

**** straight. I can barely afford a trip to the barber; I'm not going to go all the way out to Arizona just to test some random internet guy who claims to have "teh d34d1y"

[SAAMAG]

That's not luck, SimonM.

That's the NORMAL experience of a lawbiding citizen. Good for you.

Most "tough guy" martial artists, particularly woofers, cannot understand this even if you explain it to them.

They're so INSECURE about their own abilities that they try to medicate away their abject inner fear by bullying others. As a result, their aggression draws in enemies the way light draws flies at night.

SimonM's bar experience mirrors mine perfectly. That's because I go out of my ways to respect others, not accusing them of "taking suggestions in the butt".

That's not all you probably take in the butt. But seriously now...most of what you're saying now doesn't make any dang sense. You think people are insecure bullies because they tell you to stay out of bars as a solution to bar fights?

Your status here is coming very close to that of other well known folks.

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

i think its someone's time of the month.

and by someone i mean huang. and by time of the month i mean a foul and putrid discharge of menstral blood. in chunks. chewy chunky menstral blood chunks.

[SimonM]

GDA you are some kind of poet or something.

I emphasize or something. ;)

[Becca]

Wow...you took that suggestion right in the butt didn't you? It's not a set of rules, it's a suggestion for those that don't want to fight in bars; a simple solution for a perceived problem.

!
He's a troll; ignore him.

[SimonM]

Awh Becca but it's more fun to tease him. :D

[Lucas]

chewy chunky menstral blood chunks.

I dont know if I've ever seen anything more quote worthy. Say it three times fast.

[Scott R. Brown]

**** straight. I can barely afford a trip to the barber; I'm not going to go all the way out to Arizona just to test some random internet guy who claims to have "teh d34d1y"

Wait til you have kids, you will go from no money to even less money, LOL!! Get all your training gear before you have kids!!;)

[unkokusai]

I don't whine as much about bars anywhere as much as you WOOF at me from a DISTANCE.

Just as you're continuing to advise to stay away from bars, I'll advise you to stay right where you are behind your keyboard. Your mouthboxing works best from your current vantage point.

Meanwhile, I'll continue to walk into bars and teach martial arts professionally. Woofers like you don't last long in either bars or professional martial arts.

Holy crap, what a clown.... :rolleyes:

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

GDA you are some kind of poet or something.

I emphasize or something. ;)

thanks man.

[SevenStar]

http://www.marines.com

Pansies. Real men join the navy.

[brucereiter]

How does one define "winning" in a streetfight?



my definition of "winning" a "street fight" is that i walk away uninjured and i did not have to hurt anyone.

if i were to need to hurt another person i would not like to think of that as winning. this is not to say that there is not a time and place to injure another person but that should be the very last resort if your safety or a innocent persons safety is in danger.

i like many other people have been in situations where my ego has not allowed me to walk away and i do regret it.

most of the time a "street fight" is ego driven. control/understand you ego and you will "win"