Hung Fa Yi Wing Chun Public Workshop – Dayton, OH Oct 11th, 2008

[VTM]

Presented by Grand Master Garrett Gee, 8th Generation Inheritor
October 11th, 2008

Hung Fa Yi Wing Chun Long Bridge Fighting Methods

Even though Wing Chun is known for close-quarter fighting skills, every complete system must be able to deal with all ranges. This will be the first time Hung Fa Yi Wing Chun Long Range Fighting Techniques will be revealed to the public. There are hundreds of techniques to bridge the gap in the long range, but once you understand the key concepts – you’ll see there are really only three possibilities.

Through this workshop,
• You’ll know how Hung Fa Yi Wing Chun operates in long ranges.
• You’ll see how it is possible to handle long range attacks without learning separate martial arts.
• You’ll train how to enter an opponent’s bridge efficiently and safely.

Schedule of Events:
By-invitation only activities on Friday and Sunday
Saturday: Public Workshop 10a-5p with a dinner to follow

Cost
For the workshop: $150 for regular members, $350 for non-members
For dinner: $20 per person, must pre-register and pay in advance

Come to this historical workshop – and get a tour of the Ving Tsun Museum. We’ll take care of lodging for anyone coming in from out of town so you can save some $$$ on hotels.

Call 937-231-6485 M-F, after 5p EST to register.

[t_niehoff]

In precisely what way will it be a "historical workshop"?

historical
Adjective
1. occurring in the past
2. describing or representing situations or people that existed in the past: a historical novel
3. belonging to or typical of the study of history: historical perspective

[CFT]

I had thought it might have been the first public workshop on HFYWCK but a quick Google search suggests there have been previous ones. If it was the 1st ever public workshop I think it would qualify as historic within WCK circles - even for an event scheduled in the future.

[Xiao3 Meng4]

I've been to one of Garrett Gee's workshops before. From what I understand, he works hard to cover new material at every workshop. I guess his marketing people see this is an opportunity to label every workshop a "historic"[al] one. All I can say is, Garrett Gee is not his marketing machine.

I really enjoyed the workshop I went to. It seemed a bit pricey, especially considering I had to drive from Canada to get there, but the VTM was VERY courteous and accomodating, with Benny Meng and Richard Loewenhagen going out of their way to make my trip worthwhile, which in the end it really was, so the price was fair.

If you can go, I recommend it. If you DO go, I recommend going with an open mind, as a student rather than as an opponent. It's more fun, more rewarding, and maybe even a bit more enlightening. When I went, there were a bunch of other lineage practitioners who seemed intent on arguing every point that Garrett made. I still don't understand why they came to the workshop. Why pay a fee just to argue? Silly rabbits.

Also, if your current club has any hangups about you learning anything outside the club, and you want to keep training with them (though goodness knows why you'd want to,) make sure you don't mention that you're going or have gone to the workshop. It's because of one of these workshops that my relationship with my first club (my Sifu and Sigung in particular) came to an ugly end, with my Sigung actually walking out of the front of his Kwoon, facing Dayton Ohio, shaking his fist in the air and screaming "F@ck You, Benny Meng!" Just a warning.

One last opinion: Since Garrett Gee is a direct ancestor of the chinese philosopher Zhu Xi, I am of the opinion that Zhu Xi's philosophies play a major role in influencing Garrett Gee's methodologies. Not a big deal, really, since China as a whole was influenced by Zhu Xi, but the whole family connection might make Zhu Xi's teachings a bit more prominent in this case. Knowing what Zhu Xi was all about may actually help in understanding Garrett Gee's HFY methodology. Just my opinion, though.

[CFT]

It's because of one of these workshops that my relationship with my first club (my Sifu and Sigung in particular) came to an ugly end, with my Sigung actually walking out of the front of his Kwoon, facing Dayton Ohio, shaking his fist in the air and screaming "F@ck You, Benny Meng!" Just a warningWow, that sounds rather extreme!

[Xiao3 Meng4]

Wow, that sounds rather extreme!

It was an eye opener, to say the least.

[Lee Chiang Po]

Within the Martial Arts there is a culture. All of a certain mind set. Jealousy, greed for money or fame, or both seem to dominate. People that respond to things in that manner are not mature enough to be trusted with a serious MA skill and should not be teaching. In order to teach one should also be able to instill certain other concepts within the art. Tolerance, quite self confidence, such things as go to making a well rounded individual. If one does not possess these traits they can not hope to teach them. These are things that a teacher needs to scan for when talking with a potential student, not how much money he is able to pay for instruction. I am guessing that there are schools that will except anyone as long as they pay in advance. One should know the character of anyone that they give their WC to. Or sell it to if you will.
MA are a great big going business that brings in large sums of money to the top individuals.

Chiang

[LoneTiger108]

One should know the character of anyone that they give their WC to. Or sell it to if you will.

"People pay to learn. Teachers teach for the love of teaching. People do not learn from Teachers, 'students' do."

I have nothing against anyone out there who makes a living 'teaching/selling' their chosen Art. Each to their own.

BUT I agree with the idea that a teacher knows the character of a student prior to teaching 'certain things' to. By then, I guess the teacher would NOT be selling the art at all, as fme no fee for time is requested it's more of a personal 'investment'!?

I would welcome someone like Gee Sifu or HFY to London, as I have rarely had the opportunity to exchange ideas and training methods with other well known players. From what and who I have seen I find the HFY approach quite refreshing and similar to my own background.

I'ts always better to assess an individual when you meet in person. Especially in this internet driven information age!! And I've still to meet many 'famous' practitioners/sifus/masters!


One last opinion: Since Garrett Gee is a direct ancestor of the chinese philosopher Zhu Xi, I am of the opinion that Zhu Xi's philosophies play a major role in influencing Garrett Gee's methodologies.

imo ancestral links are great if you have truly studied with family. Otherwise, it's all potentially just marketing and promotions and something the western world is all too familiar with in Wing Chun circles. If this link is so evident in Gee Sifus teaching, then why name a system/style HFY? Would make more sense to be Gee Gar?

[Xiao3 Meng4]

imo ancestral links are great if you have truly studied with family. Otherwise, it's all potentially just marketing and promotions and something the western world is all too familiar with in Wing Chun circles. If this link is so evident in Gee Sifus teaching, then why name a system/style HFY? Would make more sense to be Gee Gar?

I'm referring to the way he talks about HFY content, not the content itself.
I could be completely wrong, anyway, since it's only my opinion. :)

Regardless, his workshop was worth it, and I had no idea who Zhu Xi was at the time.

CSP

[duende]

I've been to one of Garrett Gee's workshops before. From what I understand, he works hard to cover new material at every workshop. I guess his marketing people see this is an opportunity to label every workshop a "historic"[al] one. All I can say is, Garrett Gee is not his marketing machine.

I really enjoyed the workshop I went to. It seemed a bit pricey, especially considering I had to drive from Canada to get there, but the VTM was VERY courteous and accomodating, with Benny Meng and Richard Loewenhagen going out of their way to make my trip worthwhile, which in the end it really was, so the price was fair.

If you can go, I recommend it. If you DO go, I recommend going with an open mind, as a student rather than as an opponent. It's more fun, more rewarding, and maybe even a bit more enlightening. When I went, there were a bunch of other lineage practitioners who seemed intent on arguing every point that Garrett made. I still don't understand why they came to the workshop. Why pay a fee just to argue? Silly rabbits.

Also, if your current club has any hangups about you learning anything outside the club, and you want to keep training with them (though goodness knows why you'd want to,) make sure you don't mention that you're going or have gone to the workshop. It's because of one of these workshops that my relationship with my first club (my Sifu and Sigung in particular) came to an ugly end, with my Sigung actually walking out of the front of his Kwoon, facing Dayton Ohio, shaking his fist in the air and screaming "F@ck You, Benny Meng!" Just a warning.

One last opinion: Since Garrett Gee is a direct ancestor of the chinese philosopher Zhu Xi, I am of the opinion that Zhu Xi's philosophies play a major role in influencing Garrett Gee's methodologies. Not a big deal, really, since China as a whole was influenced by Zhu Xi, but the whole family connection might make Zhu Xi's teachings a bit more prominent in this case. Knowing what Zhu Xi was all about may actually help in understanding Garrett Gee's HFY methodology. Just my opinion, though.

Thank you for taking the time to share with us your experiences at the HFY Workshop you attended. I am very pleased to hear that you feel your time and money was well spent.

I am sorry you had such a bad run in with your 1st Sifu and Sigung. But I assure you, this is not always the case. Fortunately, there are many Sifu's out there with an open mind, who encourage learning where ever one may find it.

I feel students should be encouraged to be active in their learning. Both inside and outside their kwoon. Be it questioning the application or validity of the technique they are learning. Or going out to another school altogether to see what is out there.

Best to you, and maybe we shall see you in SF some time.

Alex

[duende]

I would welcome someone like Gee Sifu or HFY to London, as I have rarely had the opportunity to exchange ideas and training methods with other well known players. From what and who I have seen I find the HFY approach quite refreshing and similar to my own background.

I'ts always better to assess an individual when you meet in person. Especially in this internet driven information age!! And I've still to meet many 'famous' practitioners/sifus/masters!



imo ancestral links are great if you have truly studied with family. Otherwise, it's all potentially just marketing and promotions and something the western world is all too familiar with in Wing Chun circles. If this link is so evident in Gee Sifus teaching, then why name a system/style HFY? Would make more sense to be Gee Gar?

Lonetiger108,

Thanks for your kind words. I will make a note to let you know the next time GM Gee is in Ireland for a workshop. Who knows, perhaps he will make a stop in London to.

On the subject of Zhu Xi and his link to HFY.

HFY is HFY... no matter how you teach it or learn it, you can not change or personalize the system.

Otherwise you have not truly have learned/taught HFY, but instead an interpretation of HFY.

[CFT]

Hey Spencer, "Gee Gar" or "Chu Gar" has already been taken by the Southern Mantists! ;)

[Lee Chiang Po]

It may have sounded like I was talking down to those that teach for money, but I really wasn't. Time is valuable. I once had a friend that taught a form of Gung Fu, and he told me that he charged his students a great deal of money. I asked why, and he said that nothing free is given due respect. I suspect that this is only partly true however. But then if you hand out a fist full of dollars you will not fail to show up for training. Made sense to me at the time. I had a young man, son of a good friend, beg me for months to teach him some WC. He seemed to be very sincere. On agreeing to instruct him, I told him that no matter what, he must show up on time as my time had value. He agreed. But, he missed the first meeting because he had a date. I realized that his social life was far more important to him and sent him on his way. Two young brothers came to me and asked the same. I told them I could not take them as students as I had 2 jobs. They said that one night a week would be just fine and that they would do anything I asked of them. I told them I could give them things that they could work on together during every night of the week and when their time with me came I could give them something else to practice. They were so impatient that they bought a book and were trying to start in the middle somewhere as they felt what they were learning so far was not important. I sent them on their way.
As for Mr. Gee, I suspect that he and his organization are trying to standardize their form of WC. I think that this is not a bad idea either.

[LoneTiger108]

Lonetiger108,

Thanks for your kind words. I will make a note to let you know the next time GM Gee is in Ireland for a workshop. Who knows, perhaps he will make a stop in London to.

I'd be delighted to help out in any way with any Seminar, especially if Gee Sifu comes to London. The Academy is our coaching arm of our business at YYA where we do have some experience of hosting events like this too, albeit with non-wing chun and wing chun practitioners alike.


Hey Spencer, "Gee Gar" or "Chu Gar" has already been taken by the Southern Mantists!

Taken? That makes me laugh! Who can 'take' your surname away?? I had many discussions with my own Sifu about what constitutes an individuals interpretation of a style and in essence the family name was often used back in the day to 'declare your honesty!'

I've always referred to most WCK I see as Ip Gar, Wong Gar, Goh Gar etc as I feel this represents the truth. It just sounds wierd with English Surnames lol! That's why 'Lewis/Devine Wing Chun' became 'The Yum Yeurng Academy'!


It may have sounded like I was talking down to those that teach for money, but I really wasn't.

I for one didn't take it that way Chiang. I just felt your concerns as I too have wrestled with charging money in advance. Truth be told, renting space in London normally sucks up ALL if not MORE money than you receive from students so the Sifu is often out-of-pocket anyway! I've always leant towards the non-profit business models anyway, especially at the beginning.

Still, there is something to be said for high fees as it does (sometimes) instill a sense of seriousness in students. Seminars are a great medium to make a little profit and good luck to anyone who pursues that way forward imo. I wouldn't be a director of my own business if I thought otherwise.

Anyone wishing to 'work' with me are invited to view our 'business site' at www.y-y-a.co.uk where you can see from our archive the sort of events we have promoted since 2003...

[CFT]

Taken? That makes me laugh! Who can 'take' your surname away?? I had many discussions with my own Sifu about what constitutes an individuals interpretation of a style and in essence the family name was often used back in the day to 'declare your honesty!'

I've always referred to most WCK I see as Ip Gar, Wong Gar, Goh Gar etc as I feel this represents the truth. It just sounds weird with English Surnames lol! That's why 'Lewis/Devine Wing Chun' became 'The Yum Yeurng Academy'!I don't mean that it is proprietary! Just that most people would already associate Chu Gar with Southern Mantis.

In the same way that "Hung Lau Choy Lee Mok" is associated with the 5 Guangdong fist families. If someone came along and started calling their Wing Chun "Hung Gar" then people would naturally assume it is the other Hung Gar.

[Savi]

Greetings,

I would like to wish all the participants of GM Gee's upcoming workshop on Long Bridge Kiu Sau a long and fruitful weekend full of jam-packed training and learning. During GM Gee's last visit to AZ, we learned 6 months worth of information in 2.5 days.

I've no doubt that everyone will greatly benefit from this weekend's sessions. I can't wait to read the follow ups from the attendees!

Take care,
Savi.

[Ned]

Hello,

Below is a review from the Ohio work shop, copied from hfy108.com.

Ned


Hung Fa Yi Wing Chun Public Workshop
Dayton, OH
October 10-12, 2008

First, I would like to say thank you to Grand Master Gee for coming to Dayton in the Grand Master’s continued effort to share the treasure that is Hung Fa Yi Wing Chun. Grand Master Gee’s tireless efforts, dedication, and willingness to share are an example to all members and students in the Hung Fa Yi Wing Chun family of what it means to be a dedicated, life-long martial artist.

Second, I want to say thanks to everyone that traveled in from out of town: Michigan Instructor (Zach R.) and Michigan student (Abe O.), Rochester Instructor (Andy K.) and Rochester Student (Chad), Houston Instructor (Brad R.), Cincinnati Instructor (John L.), Centerville Instructors (Jeremy R and Melissa L.), and Richmond Student (Rose).

Congratulations to Leon D. and Abe O. on their acceptance into the HFY Instructor’s Program. Grand Master Gee interviewed a total of seven applicants: two were accepted and two are committed to join before next March.

Third, a brief overview of the workshop:

GM Gee arrived in Dayton ~10:30p on Thursday night. After a late dinner, we went to my home and continued to have Kung Fu life, discussing martial art history and culture (including secret societies), and finished with topics dealing with spiritual cultivation – all through the lens of HFYWC. We were up until 6a Friday morning.

The whole weekend was geared towards Instructor level material, focused on key details and communicating the system clearly to students.

Friday morning started at 9:30a with a brunch, and we continued the discussion from the previous night. Training started at 2:30p and concluded around 7p. The primary focus for this workshop was Cheung Kiu Saam Jin Kiu Sau, and Friday was primarily on training the Cheung Kiu on the Wooden Dummy. Significant time was put into everyone gaining actual, hands-on experience with the dummy and clarifying technical and conceptual details. After a dinner buffet, everyone came to my home for more discussion and personal interaction with the Grand Master and each other. During the course of the night, the Midwest HFY representatives discussed organizational matters among each other. Discussions continued until 3a.

Saturday, the workshop started ~9:30a and ran until 5~:30p. We had a full house of participants from Beginners to Instructors and Disciples. Personally, I have been through the Cheung Kiu Kiu Sau training several times in the past – but as I always say: GM Gee never repeats himself in the same way. New concepts and additional details were revealed throughout this weekend. Some of the new concepts included “One Method, Three Focus”; the connection from Inside/Outside the Box to Deui Ying/Jeui Ying to Heaven, Human, Earth; and the most significant: the four timeframes being introduced and the terms standardized. Saturday concluded with a dinner and an informal celebration of the 10th year of my meeting Grand Master Gee for the first time. I’m looking forward to many more 10 year anniversaries with the Hung Fa Yi family in the decades to come. After dinner, many of the seniors and regular students were invited back to my house and we discussed everything from politics to religion. The main topic GM Gee covered was how it’s possible for a Buddhist monk such as a Shaolin disciple practice the art of war, and the reality of martial art training. To summarize the discussion, “if I hurt someone or kill someone in the reality of combat, it’s not my intent or training or a personal agenda. It’s not “I” that kills, “it” kills.” Some members understood and some didn’t. The evening ended around 2a.

Sunday’s training started ~9:30a. GM Gee reviewed the Cheung Kiu Saam Jin Faat, using one technique to showcase the multi-faceted development and training format through four seasons. After a great, but quick lunch the Grand Master left for the airport at 4:30p.

It was a great weekend of literally non-stop training, discussion, and fellowship.

In conclusion, I would like to thank Tae H., Karen T., David and George. They put in their own time and effort to clean the school. And I would like to thank my beautiful, lovely wife for her hospitality at home – making sure all our guests including the Grand Master and out-of-town Instructors were comfortable and had everything they needed for a safe and happy visit.

Sincerely,
Benny Meng

PS – Best wishes for Grand Master Gee’s upcoming visit to China. There are plans to meet up with the Wing Chun community in China, and the future is looking very bright for the HFYWC family.


http://www.hfy108.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2639