Korean Notes on Longfist

[Tainan Mantis]

In the latter quarter of the Ming dynasty (1368-1644) General Qi Jiguang wrote New Book on Effective Training Methods. Within it was the Canon of Boxing, a chapter containing his 32 postures of Song's Longfist.

This book is the first record of postures and moves of Longfist written in a martial manual

For those who are not familiar with this book here is an article from that book along with a picture of the pose. This is a description of one technique within Qi's original Longfist book

http://www.plumflowermantisboxing.com/Articles/Luan%20Zhou.htm

THE QUESTION

I came across a Korean connection to this book.
In it, there is the Korean version which apparently made its way to Korea lon long ago.

It contains elements not within the origianl book by Qi.

Such as how to perform the moves and their application.

Here is one of the more interesting quotes sounds like it came straight from a first translation

'First person uses his right hand to seize the second person's left shoulder, second person, using his right hand, moves under first person's right armpit and grab" seize over first person's neck. Follow with seizing first persons left shoulder, each of them using their back, hook left hand. First person carry second person on the back, lift up horizontal and throw invertedly (throw over). Second person spins like a spinning wheel, touches the ground and stand up in an instant. Second person carry first person and repeats first persons technique. '

Here is the link.

http://www.hwarangdo.dk/index.php?id=21

I wonder if anyone else is familiar with this Korean connection?

[Sal Canzonieri]

First of all, that site has the COMPLETELY wrong idea about the movement, because:

1 - they don't know how to do the Tai Zu Quan form that General Qi wrote about, nor have they even seen it done.

2- they don't know what the Chinese movements names are really about, because they don't have points of reference to those terms that General Qi had from Ba fan shan, Tai Zhu Chang Quan, and other sets.

3- they don't have Shaolin experience

4 - they never learned Lao Hong Quan that uses these movements, which preceded this set that Gen Qi was showing.


If you do know the above things, the Luan elbow is a simple concept, it is deflecting a blow by turning the whole body and using the bent elbow to knock the incoming strike away and then suddenly shifting from this position to "shoot an arrow".
This move is seen in the famous training set known as "Lian Bu" that many people here have learned.

it is NOT the same as left step coiling elbow (zuo bu pan zhou) in Mantis, coiling elbow comes from a different mantis root, it comes from Tong bei.

Also, the "Following Luan Elbow" is not what as is described on that page. Following Luan Elbow is when you follow by yielding to an incoming strike and then you turn in that same direction with such force that your whole point mass breaks the other person's arm using your bend arm/elbow to smash with.

[Sal Canzonieri]

THE QUESTION

I came across a Korean connection to this book.
In it, there is the Korean version which apparently made its way to Korea lon long ago.

It contains elements not within the origianl book by Qi.

Such as how to perform the moves and their application.

Here is one of the more interesting quotes sounds like it came straight from a first translation

'First person uses his right hand to seize the second person's left shoulder, second person, using his right hand, moves under first person's right armpit and grab" seize over first person's neck. Follow with seizing first persons left shoulder, each of them using their back, hook left hand. First person carry second person on the back, lift up horizontal and throw invertedly (throw over). Second person spins like a spinning wheel, touches the ground and stand up in an instant. Second person carry first person and repeats first persons technique. '

Here is the link.

http://www.hwarangdo.dk/index.php?id=21

I wonder if anyone else is familiar with this Korean connection?

Looking at that Korean page, they seem to be taking the postures in Gen Qi's book and creating two person martial exercises from them, to practice such things as using timing and distance when engaging with a partner, etc. They also are using the movements to create throws and such from them.
It's all guessing and creative thinking, since again they don't have the background about the form in Gen Qi's book to really know what to do.