The Horse Stance

[Lokhopkuen]

I am curious what some of you practitioners of traditional Chinese Martial art and "you other people" :D have to say about the Horse Stance in training and application?
Is it valuable? Essential? Useless? How low should you go? What's the highest you'd want to stand? How long should you hold it? Should you hold it at all? What is the longest you personally have ever held it?

I've been meditating on the basics quite a bit and I have some thoughts to share.

Peace

[bawang]

hi d00d
stances are fundamental skills, but horse stance skill "pillar skill" takes a lot of hard work its one of the hardest skills to learn in kung fu. its to stop takedown
people ask why it no work its useless why it doenst work? its one of the hardest skills to learn


piece and chicken grease

[Lokhopkuen]

hi d00d
stances are fundamental skills, but horse stance skill "pillar skill" takes a lot of hard work its one of the hardest skills to learn in kung fu. its to stop takedown
people ask why it no work its useless why it doenst work? its one of the hardest skills to learn
piece and chicken grease

Excellent input! The Horse Stance is the place where many things begin and end.

[xcakid]

Stance training, helps build focus and discipline. Builds leg muscle. Aids in rooting concepts.

I was told toe fwd, thighs parallel to the ground is a good mah bu. I have never been able to do that. :o

The longest for me was 5mins. I started daydreaming about this chick also in mah bu in front of me. Then the instructor had as switch to gong bu. That totally ruined my fantasy. :o

[bawang]

if you just do horse stance you can never stand long

you also need to do squats and running
whenever you have free time go in horse stance when i wash dishes and eat i do horse stance
im in horse stance right now

[Judge Pen]

Our teachers are big on the horse stance training. The way they teach the stance training, the feet are five spread-hands apart and the thighs are parallel to the ground with back straight and toes pointing forward. They want you to hold it at that level a minimum of two minutes.

While I see the value in it, I personally hate holding a horse stance. but you do lots of things you hate because you see the value in it anyway.

[sanjuro_ronin]

If I just stand in a horse stance I can usually "last" about 3-4 min, BUT if I am doing other stuff, like hand form or rolling a metal bar or grip work, before I know it 10-15 min will pass.
Of course by that time the horse has left and ate all my carrots, that rat *******.

[GeneChing]

We just ran Traditional Shaolin Stance Training By Walter Gjergja in our 2009 January/February Shaolin Special (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/magazine/article.php?article=797), which is still on the newsstands for one more week.

Gives me one more chance to plug it. Thanks.

[Lokhopkuen]

We just ran Traditional Shaolin Stance Training By Walter Gjergja in our 2009 January/February Shaolin Special (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/magazine/article.php?article=797), which is still on the newsstands for one more week.

Gives me one more chance to plug it. Thanks.

Cool! Hey did you ever run that sword thing we talked about?

[Lokhopkuen]

Our teachers are big on the horse stance training. The way they teach the stance training, the feet are five spread-hands apart and the thighs are parallel to the ground with back straight and toes pointing forward. They want you to hold it at that level a minimum of two minutes.

While I see the value in it, I personally hate holding a horse stance. but you do lots of things you hate because you see the value in it anyway.

What you describe is the ideal horse stance or the box (seated root) which is second to the Up Right ready stance. The key transition between these two are Pigeon toe stance or female horse.

So after you've spent time developing the seated root and the transitions in and out of it, what can you do with it?

What should you do with it in your training, in life or death combat or at work humping around 50 lbs bags of corn and rice? I've had some interesting revelations about it in combat, but in my everyday life it has been a blessing.

Stepping wrong on an icy street, what could have resulted a broken bone or bruised ego only turned into sliding horse stance.

A combination of too much beer, soap suds, hot water, bad footing and a voluptuous woman in an all glass shower enclosure might have been a disaster for someone whom knows someone I know. I'm not mentioning any names but instead he ended in horse stance bruising his heal as he caught himself saving their collective sudsy a s ses. I hear she was very very greatful LOL!:rolleyes:

Lets talk more about this Horse Stance Thing.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Our teachers are big on the horse stance training. The way they teach the stance training, the feet are five spread-hands apart and the thighs are parallel to the ground with back straight and toes pointing forward. They want you to hold it at that level a minimum of two minutes.

While I see the value in it, I personally hate holding a horse stance. but you do lots of things you hate because you see the value in it anyway.

What part of the thighs parallel? I assume you mean the front(top) of the thighs.
Some people tend to do that back of the thighs parallel.

[David Jamieson]

let's talk more about naked wimmins in showers covered in suds and a little tipsy! :p

[sanjuro_ronin]

let's talk more about naked wimmins in showers covered in suds and a little tipsy! :p

Some people, we need to stick on the subject:

[Lucas]

Some people, we need to stick on the subject:

dude, stay on topic. that second pic is a BOW stance. this is about horse stance man....sheesh:rolleyes:


the basic form of the horse stance, ie: legs bent, weight dropped, ass tucked, etc. regardless of how high, or how your toes are pointed, is used in so many different aspects of combat.

of course i dont take one stance out from the rest, you have to practice them all. along with the strength training, muscular endurance/developent, flexability. you get to a point where all the stances are just connection points of movement.

to me the stances each have a large degree of variation, because i live in a world of movement. combat is not static, so your stances, when applied in combat will not be static either. however for some training purposes they will be.

take grappling for instance. in a grappling match, you will commonly see bow and horse stance of some variation, being moved into and out of on a continual basis. until the throw/takedown we are always in some stance unless we are standing upright and perfectly still.

many people will not agree with me, and will argue that there is only one way to do a stance. ive pointed to spots where guys are using a horse stance to keep their base as they pefrom, say a suplex, and had people tell me that its not a horse stance. ive always taken what i learn and see how it fits into the reality of violent action.

to me thats using your horsestance in a form of combat. whether you use the stance for a brief moment of transition to execute a throw or what have you. during that moment of time when you are using the stance, your entire being of combat is dependant on that stance holding up and being strong enough to do what you need it to do.

mind you i learned all my stances and foundational development in tcma. it is what i practice currently. i just like to keep in mind that combat is combat, regardless of what style i may prefer or like, the truth is always the truth.

i used to meditate in a low horse for around 30 minutes. now the only static stance training i do is what i learned from i-chuan. the rest of what i do is involved in movement.

as to the original question, if you view the horse stance from a similar angle as i do, not only is it usefull, it is an essential part of combat movment.

a rose by any other name would smell as sweet.

and now i have to go back to work:mad:

[GeneChing]

Lokhopkuen, I PMed you about the sword, et.al.

Once again, I gotta score this thread to sanjuro_ronin. He has one simple direct attack, but he almost always scores with it. Bow stance indeed. Like we really care... :p

[Lucas]

Lokhopkuen, I PMed you about the sword, et.al.

Once again, I gotta score this thread to sanjuro_ronin. He has one simple direct attack, but he almost always scores with it. Bow stance indeed. Like we really care... :p

lol, once again gene smothers me with his sagely wisdom ;)

[Lokhopkuen]

Some people, we need to stick on the subject:

Hayden,+Diana+-martial+arts.jpg (18.4 KB, 1 views)
Hips bellow the knees. Not good geometry but very sexy indeed.


kelly+hu+-sexy.jpg (13.0 KB, 1 views)
Heels are off the floor in her bow stance not good but once again very sexy indeed.

[Lokhopkuen]

dude, stay on topic. that second pic is a BOW stance. this is about horse stance man....sheesh:rolleyes:


the basic form of the horse stance, ie: legs bent, weight dropped, ass tucked, etc. regardless of how high, or how your toes are pointed, is used in so many different aspects of combat.

of course i dont take one stance out from the rest, you have to practice them all. along with the strength training, muscular endurance/developent, flexability. you get to a point where all the stances are just connection points of movement.

to me the stances each have a large degree of variation, because i live in a world of movement. combat is not static, so your stances, when applied in combat will not be static either. however for some training purposes they will be.

take grappling for instance. in a grappling match, you will commonly see bow and horse stance of some variation, being moved into and out of on a continual basis. until the throw/takedown we are always in some stance unless we are standing upright and perfectly still.

many people will not agree with me, and will argue that there is only one way to do a stance. ive pointed to spots where guys are using a horse stance to keep their base as they pefrom, say a suplex, and had people tell me that its not a horse stance. ive always taken what i learn and see how it fits into the reality of violent action.

to me thats using your horsestance in a form of combat. whether you use the stance for a brief moment of transition to execute a throw or what have you. during that moment of time when you are using the stance, your entire being of combat is dependant on that stance holding up and being strong enough to do what you need it to do.

mind you i learned all my stances and foundational development in tcma. it is what i practice currently. i just like to keep in mind that combat is combat, regardless of what style i may prefer or like, the truth is always the truth.

i used to meditate in a low horse for around 30 minutes. now the only static stance training i do is what i learned from i-chuan. the rest of what i do is involved in movement.

as to the original question, if you view the horse stance from a similar angle as i do, not only is it usefull, it is an essential part of combat movment.

a rose by any other name would smell as sweet.

and now i have to go back to work:mad:


Well said! This is the type of thing I was fishing for. More!

[GeneChing]

Can't see the forest for the trees.
Can't see the horse stance for the knees.

One of my shimei, the first got qi? girl (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16442) no less, once told me that you can't look sexy in a proper horse stance no matter how hard you try. She thought that was the main problem with kung fu.

[RickMatz]

I'm learning Wu Family Style Taijiquan. I've only been at it about a year and a half. I've been taught to hold a fairly high horse stance as a beginning form of zhan zhuang.

[wetwonder]

I'm new to Hung Gar, and I can add the following observations. The forms training involve four stances - deep horse, front stance, unicorn stance and cat stance. Every movement, whether mainly upper body or mainly lower body, are perfomed in one of the four stances. So when doing a series of movements, you will transition between one or two or three or all four of the stances. Your body is too remain very low, with possible exception of the cat stance, during the transitions. For eg., deep horse to front stance is a 90 degree spin of the heels along with a simultaneous straighteneing of the rear leg and bending of the foward leg. And then returning to horse is the reverse of that movement. So there are no partial transitions where you are in anything but one of the four stances. No standing straight up, no bending over, no combined stances. It's one to the next to the next, etc., with the body, for the most part, staying on the same plane. So I look at the horse as one component of the four in total that make up the "stances" in which all striking/parrying/blocking movements are carried out. It's really very remarkable.

[wetwonder]

. you get to a point where all the stances are just connection points of movement.

:

Kind of like this.

[bawang]

I'm learning Wu Family Style Taijiquan. I've only been at it about a year and a half. I've been taught to hold a fairly high horse stance as a beginning form of zhan zhuang.

high zhan zhuang is for the sick weak or elderly only

[sanjuro_ronin]

dude, stay on topic. that second pic is a BOW stance. this is about horse stance man....sheesh:rolleyes:


the basic form of the horse stance, ie: legs bent, weight dropped, ass tucked, etc. regardless of how high, or how your toes are pointed, is used in so many different aspects of combat.

of course i dont take one stance out from the rest, you have to practice them all. along with the strength training, muscular endurance/developent, flexability. you get to a point where all the stances are just connection points of movement.

to me the stances each have a large degree of variation, because i live in a world of movement. combat is not static, so your stances, when applied in combat will not be static either. however for some training purposes they will be.

take grappling for instance. in a grappling match, you will commonly see bow and horse stance of some variation, being moved into and out of on a continual basis. until the throw/takedown we are always in some stance unless we are standing upright and perfectly still.

many people will not agree with me, and will argue that there is only one way to do a stance. ive pointed to spots where guys are using a horse stance to keep their base as they pefrom, say a suplex, and had people tell me that its not a horse stance. ive always taken what i learn and see how it fits into the reality of violent action.

to me thats using your horsestance in a form of combat. whether you use the stance for a brief moment of transition to execute a throw or what have you. during that moment of time when you are using the stance, your entire being of combat is dependant on that stance holding up and being strong enough to do what you need it to do.

mind you i learned all my stances and foundational development in tcma. it is what i practice currently. i just like to keep in mind that combat is combat, regardless of what style i may prefer or like, the truth is always the truth.

i used to meditate in a low horse for around 30 minutes. now the only static stance training i do is what i learned from i-chuan. the rest of what i do is involved in movement.

as to the original question, if you view the horse stance from a similar angle as i do, not only is it usefull, it is an essential part of combat movment.

a rose by any other name would smell as sweet.

and now i have to go back to work:mad:

You obvisously are unaware of the relationship between the horse and the bow stance.
Observes the pictures again, notice the line of the thighs, especially the inner thigh, notice the silky smooth skin, the path leading to...
What where we talking about again ??

[sanjuro_ronin]

Lokhopkuen, I PMed you about the sword, et.al.

Once again, I gotta score this thread to sanjuro_ronin. He has one simple direct attack, but he almost always scores with it. Bow stance indeed. Like we really care... :p

I live but to serve My Liege !

[Judge Pen]

What part of the thighs parallel? I assume you mean the front(top) of the thighs.
Some people tend to do that back of the thighs parallel.

The top of the thighs. My teacher will often place a staff across your legs to see if it will balance and not roll off or toward your hips.

[GeneChing]

sanjuro_ronin, if only you were one of the girls you post. If only... :rolleyes:

[Lucas]

You obvisously are unaware of the relationship between the horse and the bow stance.
Observes the pictures again, notice the line of the thighs, especially the inner thigh, notice the silky smooth skin, the path leading to...
What where we talking about again ??

droooll....:)

[David Jamieson]

The top of the thighs. My teacher will often place a staff across your legs to see if it will balance and not roll off or toward your hips.

I guess it's not fair if you have huge spikes growing out of your quadreceps?

like this?spiky legs (http://www.metalmaidens.com/gwar8_gross.jpg)

[Lucas]

lol, is that a picture from a gwar concert?

[Judge Pen]

I guess it's not fair if you have huge spikes growing out of your quadreceps?

like this?spiky legs (http://www.metalmaidens.com/gwar8_gross.jpg)

That would make it easier wouldn't it?

[David Jamieson]

lol, is that a picture from a gwar concert?

no, no, it's a photo from one of our training sessions last week.

we had just finished summoning demons and one of these fell out of thin air.

we keep her in a great dane cage at the back of the school and feed her orphans now.

[Lucas]

you wash the orphans first right? or at least taser the dirt off them....

[Lokhopkuen]

You guys are smoking something huh? GOT ANY MORE?:D:D:D

[sha0lin1]

I would like to get a bra like that for my wife, and then smoke some of that stuff you guys are talking about.

[Shaolinlueb]

i do horse stance because the ladies love it, at least slimenstra hymen does ;)

[doug maverick]

i practice xing yi and we do the santi mostly, but i like to do lots of stance work its the key, to being rooted. i can last a whole ep of entourage in the hourse stance, thats about 25 minutes. mostly because im focused on the show and not the mind numbing pain.

[David Jamieson]

you wash the orphans first right? or at least taser the dirt off them....

oddly enough, she likes her waifs to be filthy.

me too for that matter. Makes em more pathetic.

[richard sloan]

im in horse stance right now

not sure why but I just thought that was hilarious. would make an epic sig tag.