I think 2 man forms suck!

[chusauli]

This is a pet peeve of mine:

They're choreographed, teach you to miss, teach you to have bad timing, and take too long to get to the darn point!

:)

[GreenCloudCLF]

But they are a huge hit at Christmas parties...

[lkfmdc]

This is a pet peeve of mine:

They're choreographed, teach you to miss, teach you to have bad timing, and take too long to get to the darn point!

:)


Precisely, and yet no one seems to realize this! The real applicaitons should result in damage in 2 to 3 moves max yet to extend and make the form flow, they actually teach you to make MISTAKES!

Imagine a real braodsword vs spear set, either I impale you on move 2 or you cut my fingers off... end of set, sorry :eek:

[TenTigers]

When my teacher taught me the Sam Bo Ging two-man set, he had already said it was counter-productive for me at the time,as I was already beyond it. For beginners, it is one thing to teach distance, timing, reactions, but the fact of the matter is, as soon as the guy launches his strike, you should shut him down immediately, thus negating the rest of the set.
However, it is a nice collection of different striking variations which can be extracted and used just like I said above-he strikes, you shut him down.

Two-man weapon sets teach innacuarcy. You shouldn't hear,"clack" "clack" "Clack", you should hear,"Clack-thud"-strikes aimed at the weapon holder's hand, or directly to target areas result in effective technique...but real short two-man sets!

"when using the gwun, don't expect two-sounds"
-Wing Chun Kuen Kuit

[lkfmdc]

wow, we all agree? SHUT THIS THREAD DOWN NOW! :D

[GreenCloudCLF]

But what are we going to do at the Christmas parties?!?!

[Paul T England]

I have to disagree.

They are useful up to a point. Once you can do a two man form well then its time to change partners or stop practicing that form. Unless its for demos :)



Paul

[GreenCloudCLF]

I have to disagree.

They are useful up to a point. Once you can do a two man form well then its time to change partners or stop practicing that form. Unless its for demos :)



Paul

What point is that?

[Paul T England]

The point where the student has the hand eye coordination and timing to break free from them.

[GreenCloudCLF]

The point where the student has the hand eye coordination and timing to break free from them.

So 2 man forms are for training hand-eye coordination and timing?

[Paul T England]

as well as distance, strategy, counters.....

[lkfmdc]

who needs focus mitts and Thai pads when you have 2 man forms :rolleyes:

[sanjuro_ronin]

who needs focus mitts and Thai pads when you have 2 man forms :rolleyes:

If by 2 man forms you mean 2 people beating the crap out of each other.

[TenTigers]

from what I hear of the sup bot dim two man set-it gets very furious. Two people are going at it at a fast pace, using specific techniques from their system,plus jumping off, so it becomes random, it becomes sparring. But that set, and its method is very unique in this respect. Perhaps if this method was applied to other two man sets (empty hand) they would have more value.
Sets in this respect are no different than a collection of diffferent drills, no different than working on any other specific drills. The difference is that the set is a textbook of the system which can be passed down.
I guess we should also say notebooks suck, textbooks suck, instructional dvd's suck....

[chusauli]

from what I hear of the sup bot dim two man set-it gets very furious. Two people are going at it at a fast pace, using specific techniques from their system,plus jumping off, so it becomes random, it becomes sparring. But that set, and its method is very unique in this respect. Perhaps if this method was applied to other two man sets (empty hand) they would have more value.
Sets in this respect are no different than a collection of diffferent drills, no different than working on any other specific drills. The difference is that the set is a textbook of the system which can be passed down.
I guess we should also say notebooks suck, textbooks suck, instructional dvd's suck....

Sounds like Chi Sao....but we all know Chi Sao sucks...:confused:

[sanjuro_ronin]

from what I hear of the sup bot dim two man set-it gets very furious. Two people are going at it at a fast pace, using specific techniques from their system,plus jumping off, so it becomes random, it becomes sparring. But that set, and its method is very unique in this respect. Perhaps if this method was applied to other two man sets (empty hand) they would have more value.
Sets in this respect are no different than a collection of diffferent drills, no different than working on any other specific drills. The difference is that the set is a textbook of the system which can be passed down.
I guess we should also say notebooks suck, textbooks suck, instructional dvd's suck....

In ITF TKD, in Kyokushin and almost all systems I have trained in, we have 2 man sets.
Be them 3 step, 2 step, 1 step, semi and free style step sparring.
They can get pretty wild, especially when you get to the free style step sparring with gear on.
Its a full fledged ***** house brawl at times !!